Atlas SD45's shipping

[jagged ben]

Yeah, it looks like the model was designed and manufactured by the same factory that makes BLI diesel locos.  Not my favorite design (I prefer the Kato-style low-friction axle point design).

Well, time will tell, but I'm glad they're not using the SD50/60 truck tower (which IM also used on their tunnel motors), because that particular truck is an axle-hopping gear grinder.  So far the SD45 seems like a much smoother runner than some of those others.  Which, I think, proves that there is a lot more to good truck design than the pickups.

[peteski]

Well, time will tell, but I'm glad they're not using the SD50/60 truck tower (which IM also used on their tunnel motors), because that particular truck is an axle-hopping gear grinder.  So far the SD45 seems like a much smoother runner than some of those others.  Which, I think, proves that there is a lot more to good truck design than the pickups.

None of the Kato's 3-axle trucks that I have dealt with had hopping axles.  Maybe in the older Atlas trucks the axles were too loose in the bearings cups? And it is not just about pickups.  If you compared rolling quality of the pointy axle based truck to the ones with the blunt axles suspended in holes, you would see the difference.  But it is what it is.

[jagged ben]

None of the Kato's 3-axle trucks that I have dealt with had hopping axles.  Maybe in the older Atlas trucks the axles were too loose in the bearings cups? And it is not just about pickups.  If you compared rolling quality of the pointy axle based truck to the ones with the blunt axles suspended in holes, you would see the difference.  But it is what it is.

Oh I've compared lots of trucks, and pointy axles with axle cups are far from the best predictor that they will roll well.  The best predictor is that they are made by Kato, with the exception of the 'shock absorber' designs.  Most pointy axle Atlas, IM, Lifelike, etc don't roll well, or don't roll freely at all.  Don't get me wrong, I think pointy axles and axle cups are the best design.  But they can't make up for imprecise gear design and placement.  (At least that's my best estimation of the difference.)  Kato trucks seem to be designed with more play between the gear teeth.  Or maybe it's the axles being too loose in the others, or too tight, like you suggest.  Some of it is apparently QC as well, as I have encountered a few SD50/60 trucks that roll well, although the vast majority don't.  Anyway, I stick to my point that there must be a lot more to designing a nice free rolling N scale truck than just choosing pointy axles and axle cup pickups.  One might say pointy axles are necessary but not sufficient.

[tehachapifan]

Pretty sure the loksound nano 5 next 18 at 9.5mm wide the same size as the soundtrax next18 at 9.5mm.

Does this model have a Next18 interface? The product info says "NMRA 21-pin plug for DCC (Decoder-ready)". Is a Next18 interface a 21-pin plug?

[mu26aeh]

Does this model have a Next18 interface? The product info says "NMRA 21-pin plug for DCC (Decoder-ready)". Is a Next18 interface a 21-pin plug?

No, it was probably a copy and paste from HO listing

[peteski]

Oh I've compared lots of trucks, and pointy axles with axle cups are far from the best predictor that they will roll well.  The best predictor is that they are made by Kato, with the exception of the 'shock absorber' designs.  Most pointy axle Atlas, IM, Lifelike, etc don't roll well, or don't roll freely at all.  Don't get me wrong, I think pointy axles and axle cups are the best design.  But they can't make up for imprecise gear design and placement.  (At least that's my best estimation of the difference.)  Kato trucks seem to be designed with more play between the gear teeth.  Or maybe it's the axles being too loose in the others, or too tight, like you suggest.  Some of it is apparently QC as well, as I have encountered a few SD50/60 trucks that roll well, although the vast majority don't.  Anyway, I stick to my point that there must be a lot more to designing a nice free rolling N scale truck than just choosing pointy axles and axle cup pickups.  One might say pointy axles are necessary but not sufficient.

Yes, we are in agreement on this. Kato design and execution are above the rest, but I don't find the other brands of Kato clones to be as bad as you describe, even though the mechanical tolerances seem looser than Kato's.  If they are lubricated (usually overlubricated) with is true with most of those, they don't roll well (lubricant creates resistance), but if you clean all the lubricant, they roll quite well.  Lubricant is not needed since the gears are molded from a slippery plastic. If one wants, a very light application of lube will go a long way without increasing the roiling resistance too much

[peteski]

No, it was probably a copy and paste from HO listing

Yes, 21-pin connector (and the attached decoder) are too wide to fit in N scale narrow hoods.

[chessie system fan]

One thing that stands out to me is the mechanism doesn't look designed to be used under an SD40.  It'd be too long to fit.

 

[jwaldo]

Despite all the (many) apparent warts, it's a huge step up to see an N model that even attempts an SP light/detail configuration. Sure there's no bell, but I'm used to there being no ANYTHING.

That said, unpainted translucent truck sideframes are LONG overdue to die off. If a schmuck like me can successfully paint Delrin with common paints and primers, the actual manufacturers ought to have it locked down by now.

[jagged ben]

Here's some crappy pics of the decoder connector if you guys want to try to figure out what it is.

[C855B]

Here's some crappy pics of the decoder connector if you guys want to try to figure out what it is.

As @skytop35 confirmed last Friday in another thread, Next18.

[peteski]

That said, unpainted translucent truck sideframes are LONG overdue to die off. If a schmuck like me can successfully paint Delrin with common paints and primers, the actual manufacturers ought to have it locked down by now.

When I bought the Scale Trains UP Big Blow turbine sat it had nicely painted silver trucks. So did the Standard turbine I bough t later. But the most recently bought Standard Turbine loco had crappy looking (compared to the painted trucks) bare silver plastic trucks.  Crazy!

[jagged ben]

Okay, here is my review so far of the SP version.  I wish the frustrations weren't so major, but I'm going to try to appreciate the good stuff.

Here's the good stuff:
-Accurate light placement (if not wiring, we'll get to that)
-Accurate L-Window
-Prototypical front and rear plows
-The lights have great luminosity for each feature (except the inside-the-cab light).  Although I complained about the LED color above, the placement behind the light tubes is excellent and I appreciate this because it's something that a lot of N scale locomotives have failed at.
- No light leaks!  Even between the front numberboard and upper headlights (although I'm trepidatious about getting that part back together properly now that I've take it apart, see below.) 
- Separate numberboard lighting.

Okay here's the cons:
- Biggest one for SP fans is that the nose light (headlight!) and upper headlight (gyralight!) are wired together.      It really sucks to require surgery to fix this, and it could have been avoided.  (Just wire them together on the DC plug board, and make them separate functions on the decoder.)  And the ideal surgery to fix it - wiring it to an unused decoder function - appears to be not worth the time to figure out.  What I'm likely to end up doing is sacrificing the unnecessary and too bright inside-the-cab lighting and wiring that to the upper headlight.  Fortunately this can be done on the little circuit board that goes in the top of the cab and contains the upper headlight, numberboard and cab lighting LEDs.  It will be tricky, though, to get that board back in now that I've taken it out.
- You have to unsolder the trucks to fully disassemble the model.  Everything else can be disassembled without a soldering iron, why do this?  It's anti-modeler.  FFS.
- when I bought an Atlas locomotive I really didn't think I was buying a BLI locomotive.  But oh well.  At least it doesn't come with a BLI decoder.

Incidentally if you are in JMRI and want to disable the whole start delay thing it's called 'Engine RPM Interlock' and you can disable it.  I also enabled Autostart so I can immediately tell if the engine is working when the track has power.  And for SP fans, you can change the horn to Nathan P3 (although it's not as good as the LokSound version, but maybe it will be better after covering over the hole in the bottom of the fuel tank and tweaking the equalizer.)   I can try to track down CVs if anyone needs them. 

[sd75i]

Kato is a little heavier.  Atlas looks pretty good!

[sd75i]

2nd pic