Ideas for making a N scale nyc 4-8-4 s1b niagara

[Bjams87]

I know pecos river made a brass nyc 4-8-4 a long time ago but I never had luck winning a ebay bid for one on the rare occasion one pops up soo decided to find a way to kit bash one or find someone to 3d print or resin cast a boiler and tender shell. But for a starting point was wondering if a kato fef3 would be a close enough running mech and tender frame to start with.

My name is Ryan by the way I hobby in n scale and like collecting nyc and prr locos and rollingstock

[nkalanaga]

I can't help you, but welcome to The Railwire!

[learmoia]

I know pecos river made a brass nyc 4-8-4 a long time ago but I never had luck winning a ebay bid for one on the rare occasion one pops up soo decided to find a way to kit bash one or find someone to 3d print or resin cast a boiler and tender shell. But for a starting point was wondering if a kato fef3 would be a close enough running mech and tender frame to start with.

My name is Ryan by the way I hobby in n scale and like collecting nyc and prr locos and rollingstock

Welcome..
It depends on how accurate you want to get..

I have my Grandfathers 'Niagara' that he built from a Bachmann Northern... no where close to correct but more sentimental value than anything.

... You could take a Kato FEF and modify the smoke lifters and get something that resembles a Niagara....

Someone on TRW @superturbine ?  made a resin casting of a Niagara that was really nice and I think fit the FEF, but beyond my modeling skills, I sold the shell a while back.

I've got the Pecos River model, but the factory lettering is 'SO-SO'... If someone offered me a fair price, I may be persuaded to sell it.

I'm holding out hope that it is on the TO DO list from Bachmann or BLI, where I would buy at least 2 or 3....

~Ian

[craigolio1]

Welcome Ryan!

Craig

[learmoia]

Working with a Kato line drawing, you could end up with something like this with minimal body work...
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Modifications I made.
Modify Smoke Lifter.
Remove Bell and Number boards from the nose.
Modify Smoke stack to single and lower.
Remove railings from tender (and add coal load.)

~Ian

[btrain]

That’s not a bad compromise @learmoia, I really like the look of it. I’ll throw my hat in the ring to buy a shell and put it on a Kato mechanism, if anybody makes it. I’m surprised that with the Bachman Hudson, that no one has made a NYC PT tender 3D print.

[Bjams87]

I know even a tender casting or 3d prints would be cool. I'd buy 3 or for right away to convert a few of my con cor hudsons to pt tenders

[learmoia]

Here is the previous thread discussing the Niagara and PT Castings (at the time using the GS4 and an Athearn or Con-Cor tender, but new adaptable to an FEF . 

https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?topic=42493.msg535910#msg535910

[learmoia]

I realized my Kato mockup had a mis aligned smoke stack.
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Now I'm looking at Kato FEFs on Ebay...   

[PJPickard]

I'm working on the tender print...but don't expect anything soon.

[kiwi_al]

Not being an NYC Modeller and not knowing more specifics but I am an ardent Kitbashing Fan I would start with this:

https://www.broadway-limited.com/7409DelawareandHudson4-8-4CentennialLocomotive302Paragon4Sound/DC.aspx

This gives you a 4-8-4, elephant ears to modify , you would also have to modify the walkways and as This is cast in metal it'll be more difficult than plastic. You would then need a FEF-3 tender to modify. Just some thoughts hopefully helpful
The Reading T1 should be available around the US summer 2023. If you want it now then possibly the FEF-3 is your option.

[Bjams87]

I love the creative help and responses I think iam try for a brass version first if that fails I'll go for the kit bash fef. But still hope some manages a cast resin or 3d print pt tender for converting other n scal hudsons to pt tenders..

So not to start a debate but just wondering why no company other than oecos river ever made a nyc 4-8-4 in n scale. I know up 4-8-4 and sp and at&sf versions were preserved but from what I understand from great grandpa when he was still alive(he lived and worked on railroad in East coast) that the nyc niagaras surpassed even the up's 4-8-4's in efficiency and running...could be wrong I've never talked to a up or sp egngineer

[learmoia]

I love the creative help and responses I think iam try for a brass version first if that fails I'll go for the kit bash fef. But still hope some manages a cast resin or 3d print pt tender for converting other n scal hudsons to pt tenders..

So not to start a debate but just wondering why no company other than oecos river ever made a nyc 4-8-4 in n scale. I know up 4-8-4 and sp and at&sf versions were preserved but from what I understand from great grandpa when he was still alive(he lived and worked on railroad in East coast) that the nyc niagaras surpassed even the up's 4-8-4's in efficiency and running...could be wrong I've never talked to a up or sp egngineer

But from a Model Mfg view an ATSF Northern or SP Daylight beat an NYC Niagara in model sales ...
(And the NYC Hudson and PRR K4 were better known to the public)

Going back in N scale History, The only semi-prototype main line steam in N scale was:
ATSF 4-8-4 Northern from Bachmann
NYC 4-6-4 Hudson from Con-Cor (Kato)
NKP 4-6-2 Berkshire from Rowa
NW 2-8-8-2 Y6B from Rowa
PRR 4-6-2 K4 from Minitrix
Sorta PRR 2-10-2 from Minitrix
USRA 2-8-2 from Atlas
USRA 4-6-2 from Atlas
And various 2-6-2/0-6-0/0-4-0 switchers..

I think in the 1970s/early 80s we got:
4-8-8-4 and 4-6-6-4s from Rivarossi.

This was pretty much it until the mid-80s when Bachmann added more generic stuff like.
Generic 2-8-2 with Vandy tender.
Generic 4-8-4 i.e. Santa Fe Northern but with Vandy tender
The American 4-4-0s
ect.
(In the same time frame I believe they produced a Niagara and GS-4 and Texas in HO Scale)

We didn't get a GS-4 until Con-Cor in the early 2000s.
We didn't get an FEF until Kato
We didn't get a Cab Forward until Intermountain
Bachmann did a B&O 2-8-8-2? for some reason..

We get upgraded versious of previously produced models, but rarely do we got 'new stuff'

Once BLI finally pushed the M1 out the door, things have gotten much MUCH better!...
We now have 4 versions of a Big Boy!!! 

Hopefully the excitement and sales of the upgraded NYC Hudson will push Bachmann to expand the line with an ESE and 20th Century version..

And eventually a Niagara (and Mohawk).

Oddly enough, I vividly recall that my 1990s era copy of the Micro-Trains coupler conversion guide lists a Bachmann Niagara and GS-4 along with the ATSF Northern.  But I have never found evidence that they were produced.

~Ian

[Bjams87]

Iam surprised kato didn't do the hudson before bachman the did the ones for con cor and what amazing runners they were I have 4...still hope to snag the 3rd chinese version with scullin disc drivers someday...but I bet kato would made a hell of a hudson

[peteski]

Well, back in 2019 Kato had a poll about N scale steam locos.  As you can see NYC Dreyfus Hudson was up there as far as votes go, but they went for the Big Boy. Although at that time they probably were already working on the Big Boy design.

And they did release the 20th Century Ltd. set, but a later version with F7 diesels.  How I wish they did the 1938 version of that train.  The light gray with dark gray stripe livery was even prettier than the later version Kato did.  Plus it would have been pulled by a beautifully streamlined steam loco.