Question about hooking up a Lionel transformer

[peteski]

There is a Lionel Flying Yankee train set at the place where we vacation. It is an old set (probably from the '40s or '50s).  The mechanism seems to be ok (I can push the train by hand and the motor spins). I like to try to get it running.  I bought some track and found an inexpensive transformer which I refurbished.

The transformer is a Type RW. Compared to N scale power packs/throttles, this thing is confusing.  All those terminals in the back, and different combinations for all sorts of different voltages.  Why are so many different voltages needed?

I did figure out that the variable track voltage comes from terminals A, B, and U.
The question is: which is the proper voltage for that Flying Yankee?   A-U (19V) or B-U (15V).
Also,does it matter which terminal goes to the center rail?  The info I found in the Internet is not very clear.  This set has no whistle, so I suspect (since it is AC voltage) the polarity does not matter, but I want to make sure.

[Point353]

https://www.trains.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/01/wiring-Handbook-for-Toy-Trains.pdf

[peteski]

That basically covers everything.  Found the info I needed - thanks!
Basically try the lower voltage terminal first, and polarity is irrelevant.

[brokemoto]

I have a similar question.  Here is a Lionel Flying Yankee from 1938.  I just acquired it from my father whom we buried Thursday.  He received it as a gift in 1938 when he was a child.  The roof of the locomotive came painted black, but my father told me that he painted it blue as the prototype had a blue roof when he saw it.  I do remember the paint job's being pretty good.  Even as a child, my father took care to do a good job.  I do remember its running.  He had to send it to New York some time in the mid-1960s to have it repaired.  I remember its running again.  It has been sitting in a wood box in the basement of his house since 1982 or so.  His house is in Ipswich, Massachusetts and on a pond, if that had an effect.

Similar to what Original Poster asked, my question is this:  Is it safe to apply current from a modern Lionel transformer to something so old?  I am going to have to have it restored, obviously, as the photographs show, it is in pretty rough shape.  I did spin the wheels on the power unit.  They do spin.  There are two other locomotives, both the Standard 2-4-2 wheel arrangement.  One is from 1938.  I remember its running.  Dad never did have to have that one repaired.  The wheels are locked up on that one.  It is in even worse shape than his Flying Yankee.  There is another one that dates to sometime from the mid-1950s to the early 1960s.  I seem to recall my father's buying it at a Goodwill or a rummage sale in the early 1960s.  It was for me and my brother to run, as he did not want small children to touch his pre-World War II Lionel.

The Flying Yankee:

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[peteski]

I did get the one I was asking for going.  I needed to service the reversing unit (the contacts were mangled by someone who tried to service it, but did not know what they were doing).  The light bulbs in the set were rated for 18V, so I used the lower voltage terminals (B-U) on my RW transformer and the train ran well.  But the curves I have are too tight for that train. I'll need to find broader curve tracks.

These old models look to be very robust, and quite basic.  While I can't say for sure (I'm not an experienced Lionel modeler), I doubt a more modern transformer can damage them.

I found a good set of specs for older Lionel transformers at https://www.tandem-associates.com/lionel/lioneltransformers.htm. I know it is not much help to you, but I figured I would post the info here for future reference.

[brokemoto]

But the curves I have are too tight for that train. I'll need to find broader curve tracks.

That is curious.  You mentioned that your set was from the late 1940s or the 1950s.  Is there a difference between the sets of the 1930s and later sets?  My father's will go around a twenty seven inch radius curve.  The twenty seven inch curves are all that he ever had and, I do remember this thing's running.

These old models look to be very robust, and quite basic. 

They are both.  Technology was limited in that era.  Still, like anything else mechanical, when they sit, they tend to deteriorate.

[peteski]

That is curious.  You mentioned that your set was from the late 1940s or the 1950s.  Is there a difference between the sets of the 1930s and later sets?  My father's will go around a twenty seven inch radius curve.  The twenty seven inch curves are all that he ever had and, I do remember this thing's running.

I just guessed at its age.  But even if that set was produced for many years, I doubt that the design has changed.  I had had no clue about 3-rail Lionel track, so I just bought some long straight pieces, and a full circle of curve sections to make an oval.  I bought some track on eBay and some at a train show.

After I got all the track together I realized that there are 2 different types and they are not compatible.  I assume the older track has higher profile and the railhead diameter is larger.  That is the one with black ties. Then there is another 3-rail track with tan colored ties.  The rail ls lower and the railhead is smaller diameter.  Those 2 types of track cannot be interconnected.  I did some research online and the black-tie track I believe is "K-line", while the tan colored tie track has "LIONEL" embossed on the ties.

The curved track I found has black ties (K-line), and the curve is so tight that the articulating sections of the Yankee jam together.  If not going too fast, the train will not derail, but it slows down, and I can see the wheels on the inside of the curve slightly coming up of the track.  I need to find larger radius curves, which doesn't seem to be easy as the sellers on eBay don't seem to list any details of the curved track (like radius).

[brokemoto]

I just guessed at its age.  But even if that set was produced for many years, I doubt that the design has changed.

From the posts that came in response to a cross post of this one on another forum, it appears that Lionel offered the Flying Yankee from 1938-1942.  The 1942 offerings were the relatively few sets that were in the pipeline when the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbour.  They came in various colours:  gunmetal grey front of the power car, gunmetal grey roof only, red roof on the power car.  It appears that there also were some intermediate coaches with double doors, only, some with single doors, only, some with both single and double doors.  As anyone can see from the photographs my father's set was the one with both single and double doors and a gunmetal grey roof only with a chrome front on the power car.

Lionel did re-issue this one, recently.  It is the gunmetal grey on the entire front of the power car with double doors only intermediate coaches.  Lionel listed it for six hundred bananas.  Lionel issued a Zephyr as well, beginning in 1936.  My father told me that he received the set in 1938.

  I had had no clue about 3-rail Lionel track, so I just bought some long straight pieces, and a full circle of curve sections to make an oval.  I bought some track on eBay and some at a train show.

After I got all the track together I realized that there are 2 different types and they are not compatible.  I assume the older track has higher profile and the railhead diameter is larger.  That is the one with black ties. Then there is another 3-rail track with tan colored ties.  The rail ls lower and the railhead is smaller diameter.  Those 2 types of track cannot be interconnected.  I did some research online and the black-tie track I believe is "K-line", while the tan colored tie track has "LIONEL" embossed on the ties.

Thank you for the "heads up".  The pre-war Lionel track does have the black ties.  The Tweety Bird Set that girlfriend bought for me just before the Warner Brothers store closed has track and a power supply.  She paid seventy five bananas for it.  I never have run it.  I did take out the locomotive and power supply to make sure that the locomotive ran, then put everything back as it was.  I might buy a different power supply and some other track, but I will be sure to buy Lionel.  Lionel did sell track in thirty one inch radius curves as well as some even more broad than that

The curved track I found has black ties (K-line), and the curve is so tight that the articulating sections of the Yankee jam together.  If not going too fast, the train will not derail, but it slows down, and I can see the wheels on the inside of the curve slightly coming up of the track.  I need to find larger radius curves, which doesn't seem to be easy as the sellers on eBay don't seem to list any details of the curved track (like radius).

If they still have that Greenberg show in Massachusetts, you might have to go there.  I forget where they have it, but I do know that it is nowhere near Essex County.  If that fails, you might have to "ask seller a question" and ask what the radius is.  Thirty one inch radius likely will work better.

When the Busted and Mined launched the Flying Yankee it ran on the Salem-Newburyport (North Shore) branch of the North-South Main.  Later, Busted and Mangled moved it to the Haverhill (Inland) branch of the North-South Main.

[Point353]

The curved track I found has black ties (K-line), and the curve is so tight that the articulating sections of the Yankee jam together.  If not going too fast, the train will not derail, but it slows down, and I can see the wheels on the inside of the curve slightly coming up of the track.  I need to find larger radius curves, which doesn't seem to be easy as the sellers on eBay don't seem to list any details of the curved track (like radius).

Go to this store (in your general area): https://charlesro.com/

[peteski]

Thanks for the info!


Here is the train set.  The ends are brown, and rest of it is chrome plated.

Thanks for the info about the show. I'm very familiar with the Greenberg shows in Wilmington MA.  I participate in those shows (twice a year) with my NTRAK club.  I live probably about 5 miles from the Shriner's Auditorium that hosts the show. 

Actually that is where I picked up some of the straight track, but the dealers don't seem to have good selection of track.  I'll see if I get lucky at the November show.  I also need some middle rail pickups for the bogies between cars.

[peteski]

Go to this store (in your general area): https://charlesro.com/

Thanks, I'm also quite familiar with Charles Ro, but didn't think about them.  Silly, since they specialize in the larger scale trains.  It was actually the first place where I started buying N scale trains, but I have not visited there for few years.  I also rather pickup some second-hand track since the train set is not really mine; It belongs to the owner of the place where we vacation in Maine.  I suppose I could visit them just to get some info or advice.

[brokemoto]

The ends are brown, and rest of it is chrome plated.

Yours is pre-war.  It is somewhat different from Dad's on the power car and that the intermediate cars have only single doors.  On the re-issue, the paint scheme on the power car is the same as yours but the intermediate coaches have double doors only.

I'm very familiar with the Greenberg shows in Wilmington MA. 

It is in Wilmington?  That puts it in Middlesex County, which is next door.  I had thought that it was in Holbrook, Wilbraham or somewhere else; anywhere BUT Wilmington.

[peteski]

Yes, Wilmington, MA.  Right off I-93.  Here is the show schedule: https://www.trainshow.com/show-schedule