NEW Kato FEF announcement?

[robert3985]

So, this will be a 3rd run of this model? Good to see it do so well - it is a very well engineered model which introduced some innovative designs.

But it appears that all the different versions so far are strictly decorative (paint schemes). I wonder, if those sell well, whether Kato will tool up some new shells to produce some older variants of this locomotive?

"Older" variations that do not require a "new shell" would be what Kato is doing now, but with a back-dated oil hatch & simplified vent on the tender...then give us all ten of the FEF-3 numbers

To turn this model into an FEF-2, all that needs to be done is the above, plus a new pilot which was bolted together vs cleanly cast as is the FEF-3 pilot.  Everything else is the same. Kato then should produce all 15 of these numbers.

Proper Two-Tone-Gray FEF's in both FEF-2's and FEF-3's would need a new boiler and smokebox shell as well as the parts that hang below the foot boards on the sides.  This would get rid of the late Worthington SA feedwater heater along with all the associated piping and other parts, and shorten the smokebox by 18 scale inches.  Late TTG scheme had a darker smokebox and "white" (light gray) striping, with smoke deflectors, and the early TTG scheme had a silvery smokebox with Armour Yellow stripes & lettering, both with and without smoke deflectors. Proper passenger cars in TTG, Pullman Green and Armour Yellow could be made representing several trains & periods. 

Early FEF-2's and FEF-3's were initially coal-fired, with the FEF-2's having single stacks vs the FEF-3's heavy, cast double or triple stack.  Tenders would also need to be backdated, the Worthington SA feedwater heater equipment removed, smokebox shortened by 18 scale inches and ash pans attached to the bottoms of the firebox.  These came in black only with aluminum lettering.  Kato could number and sell 10 of the 3's and 15 of the 2's along with trains comprised of Pullman Green and TTG cars.

FEF-1's would need to be a totally new engine as the wheelbase was shorter, the drivers smaller, the cylinders smaller and the tender was totally different.  However, the above mentioned paint and equipment schemes apply to these engines also and there were twenty numbers of FEF-1's.

My train buddy Nate Goodman (Nato) and I had a discussion about how Kato is limiting itself in its inimitable, conservative way to only one new number and paint scheme, improperly dubbed "freight"....which should be shiny black as these engines, along with ALL UP steam engines were painted shiny.  During the FEF's last major shopping when they received the Worthington SA feedwater heaters, they were still in passenger service, but all (at least that's the general consensus) were repainted shiny black retiring TTG and retained their shiny black paint until the end, when they were relegated from '57 - '59 to fast freight and MOW service in non-mountainous eastern regions of the U.P. mainly in Nebraska, occasionally still filling in for ailing diesels and/or helping passenger trains when needed.  Gotta remember these engines were fast, powerful, reliable and smooth, fully capable of official speeds of over 100mph with a 15 to 20 car passenger train, with many undocumented runs of over 135mph...which would make them the fastest steam engines in the world.

I think there's definitely a good chance Kato will renumber these...maybe eventually all ten FEF-3 numbers.

I doubt they will ever do a new shell representing the original non-Worthington SA feedwater heater variations.

I doubt they'll do a proper coal version with the above mod along with ash pans and a new tender coal bunker.

I also doubt they'll do a bolted-together pilot to make this model into a perfect late FEF-2, either oil or coal.

Retro tender oil-bunker tops would be GREAT, but I also doubt they'll do it.

I think the possibility of Kato choosing to make an FEF-1 is very remote.

I think that if Kato does any of the above, they'd increase sales significantly and make a healthy profit...but I think it'd be too much effort for conservative Kato management.

Cheerio!
Bob Gilmore

[Cajonpassfan]

Agreed, calling this model a "freight version" is a bit if a misnomer and an injustice.
These 100mph, 80" drivered engines were passenger machines first and foremost, regardless of the paint scheme used over the years, and they were used in passenger service even after their return to black. The fact they were also used in freight service (as well as secondary passenger power, helper service etc.) at the very end of their careers to run out their boiler lives doesn't make the loco a freight "version".
Sorry about the rant, but I get irritated when misleading or plain wrong information gets foisted on often unsuspecting masses, thus becoming "fact", especially when steam engines are involved
Otto K.,
Crawling back under the layout...

[Ngineer]

I hope for you guys that these black locos don't get cancelled like the black Southern Pacific GS-4 a few years ago.

    Javier

[robert3985]

I hope for you guys that these black locos don't get cancelled like the black Southern Pacific GS-4 a few years ago.

    Javier

I have several "black" Kato GS-4's on the layout pulling my son's SP trains along with Daylight GS-4's, so whaddya talkin' about???  The problem Kato had with their canceled last run of "black" GS-4 War Babies was that their production runs were based on pre-orders at the time and they had already done previous "black" runs.

Kato's sales policies have changed, and they do not base a run of models on pre-orders any longer according to the Kato rep I talked to before the FEF's were officially announced.

Kato could still make a goodly profit off of their GS-4 tooling if they'd do an un-skirted version, and a proper GS-3.  But, that would involve too much thinking about it for conservative Kato management.

Just sayin'....

Cheerio!
Bob Gilmore

[robert3985]

Agreed, calling this model a "freight version" is a bit if a misnomer and an injustice.
These 100mph, 80" drivered engines were passenger machines first and foremost, regardless of the paint scheme used over the years, and they were used in passenger service even after their return to black. The fact they were also used in freight service (as well as secondary passenger power, helper service etc.) at the very end of their careers to run out their boiler lives doesn't make the loco a freight "version".
Sorry about the rant, but I get irritated when misleading or plain wrong information gets foisted on often unsuspecting masses, thus becoming "fact", especially when steam engines are involved
Otto K.,
Crawling back under the layout...

@Cajonpassfan  Otto... +1 

Also, last time I saw the 844 and took photos, she was solid, glossy black...no white striping or wheel rims...with a darker smokebox color...looking massive and powerful.  The solid glossy black paint really shows off the large size and power of this engine. 

Kato claiming this engine in black is a "freight" version is kicking itself by implying it did not pull passenger trains (which Kato sells) when in black livery.  By purposely painting it "flat black" and choosing another number than 844, it is also self-limiting sales to exclude the latest solid, shiny black excursion livery of this engine, which would pull exactly the same equipment as it did when gussied up with white striping and wheel rims.

C'mon Kato...become informed...and increase sales of your passenger equipment rather than limiting sales with erroneous information.

Photo (1) - FEF-3 844 in its all-glossy-black excursion livery:


Photo (2) - FEF-3 844 all-glossy-black excursion livery:


Note that the aluminum paint on wheel journals is not decorative, but indicates roller bearings and that no waste oil should be applied as was done during regular servicing with "friction bearings"

Cheerio!
Bob Gilmore

[wcfn100]

  The problem Kato had with their canceled last run of "black" GS-4 War Babies was that their production runs were based on pre-orders at the time and they had already done previous "black" runs.

Kato cancelled 'Wartime Black' with the large lettering.  War Babies are GS-6's, not GS-4's.

Jason

[sundowner]

@Cajonpassfan  Otto... +1 

Also, last time I saw the 844 and took photos, she was solid, glossy black...no white striping or wheel rims...with a darker smokebox color...looking massive and powerful.  The solid glossy black paint really shows off the large size and power of this engine. 


Cheerio!
Bob Gilmore

That's one sexy machine.

Interesting that they pick 838. Hopefully they do an excursion car add on set to go with this release, Kato got plenty of names they could do with there current tooling.

[robert3985]

Went to the Kato USA site for a look-around, and happened upon the hi-res photos of the new FEF-3 "freight" release.

"Hmmmmm....something isn't right here..."  I thought to myself, and upon closer inspection, one of the photos is NOT an FEF-3, but an FEF-2 without the Worthington Feedwater Heater and associated equipment and plumbing...take a look....

Photo (1) - Photo of UP FEF-2 w/o Worthington Feedwater Heater purported by Kato USA to be an example of their upcoming "freight" release...


Probably a mistake, but wouldn't it be GREAT if this was actually what they're going to produce????   YEAH!! 

Cheerio!
Bob Gilmore

[up1950s]

Yes , but why don't they have a shot of 838 .

[SP-Wolf]

Kato cancelled 'Wartime Black' with the large lettering.  War Babies are GS-6's, not GS-4's.

Jason

Jason,

You are right on. I might as well add to the pet peeve thing on miss labeling. As Jason stated- black GS-4's are not "war babies". As they were built and delivered just prior to the war (All in Daylight paint - along with the two full roller bearing equipped GS-5's). GS-6's were ordered and built during the war. SP almost didn't get them. 6 were sent to the Western Pacific. OK, rant over, -- back on topic -- The UP FEF class locomotives.

Enjoy,
Wolf

[basementcalling]

Went to the Kato USA site for a look-around, and happened upon the hi-res photos of the new FEF-3 "freight" release.

"Hmmmmm....something isn't right here..."  I thought to myself, and upon closer inspection, one of the photos is NOT an FEF-3, but an FEF-2 without the Worthington Feedwater Heater and associated equipment and plumbing...take a look....

Photo (1) - Photo of UP FEF-2 w/o Worthington Feedwater Heater purported by Kato USA to be an example of their upcoming "freight" release...


Probably a mistake, but wouldn't it be GREAT if this was actually what they're going to produce????   YEAH!! 

Cheerio!
Bob Gilmore

Not to admit my ignorance, but I cannot see a difference between the photo and the shots of 844 in the thread above other than road number.

[Cajonpassfan]

Hint: start with the pilots... cast one piece on the FEF-3's
Otto

[Mike C]

Probably similar to This one.

Checked with my favorite pusher today . My price would be 360.00 . Not too bad , I said I'd make a decision after I pay for the M1.  Don't know how much that on is going to be yet ......

[robert3985]

Went to the Kato USA site for a look-around, and happened upon the hi-res photos of the new FEF-3 "freight" release.

"Hmmmmm....something isn't right here..."  I thought to myself, and upon closer inspection, one of the photos is NOT an FEF-3, but an FEF-2 without the Worthington Feedwater Heater and associated equipment and plumbing...take a look....

Photo (1) - Photo of UP FEF-2 w/o Worthington Feedwater Heater purported by Kato USA to be an example of their upcoming "freight" release...


Probably a mistake, but wouldn't it be GREAT if this was actually what they're going to produce????   YEAH!! 

Cheerio!
Bob Gilmore

Not to admit my ignorance, but I cannot see a difference between the photo and the shots of 844 in the thread above other than road number.

Hint: start with the pilots... cast one piece on the FEF-3's
Otto

Yup...then go straight up and the smokebox is 18" shorter than the Worthington Feedwater Heater equipped FEF-3...go up some more...and there's no "box" in front of the double stack...go directly back and notice the double stack is fabricated out of sheet metal as opposed to the massive, cast unit on the FEF-3....then go down below the walkways on the side of the boiler and notice there's no feedwater heater equipment hanging there with its associated piping both under and on top of the walkway.

Other than those things, including the bolted-on pilot with its drop-coupler instead of the FEF-3's smooth, cast pilot with its easily accessed swing-coupler...they're the same.

Cheerio!
Bob Gilmore