PRR H10 - Who's built one, and what did you use?

[VonRyan]

My intent on suggesting the Kato Mikado + the GHQ kit was this:
Together, they will cost you around $200, maybe a little less or a little more depending on how lucky you are.

I know that is over your budget.
But finding somebody to build an engine for you, unless they are willing to almost "give away" their services,
is going to cost a lot more.

If it takes somebody 100 hours to build you the engine, $140 is $1.40/hour, PLUS the cost of the base engine and parts
required.   I don't think anybody would be willing to work for that.  And believe me, when you get into kitbashing a steam
loco, 100 hours isn't that uncommon.

I'm afraid Tony is right.  $140 just isn't nearly enough budget for a custom job.

So basically even if i provide the necessary shell(s), chassis, and decoder, i'm basically just fooling myself? 
I thought there might be someone that had done one of these type locomotives before and who wouldn't mind doing another one even though they aren't exactly making a true "profit" on it.

Is that basically what everyone has been getting at? or is there some other factor that i'm not seeing yet?

-Cody F.

[Zox]

or is there some other factor that i'm not seeing yet?

There are things that one will do for oneself, as a labor of love, that aren't in the least appealing as a "contract job" for someone else.

It's also more fun doing something the first time, and learning the skills involved in doing it, than it is to crank out additional copies. As stated in John Armstrong's Model Railroading Rule #1, posted over the stairs leading down to the great man's layout--"If at first you DO succeed, DON'T try it again!"

As a person who shares your perfectionism in regards to his own work--all I ever see are my mistakes, even when nobody else notices them--I can tell you this. Even if it takes years; even if in the end it's not perfect: if you stretch yourself to your limits to make something the best you can possibly make it, it will be infinitely more satisfying than anything you could possibly pay someone else to do.

(Besides, by the time you hit your late 40s it'll be hard to find people twice your age to hang out with...)

[Chris333]

Most of us here kitbash because we have to and love the locomotive we are trying to make. I have stuff that was started years ago and it sits in a box waiting for me to finish. I just work on it when the mood strikes. When it's done, it's done. I don't think about how much it is worth or my work was worth.

I spent a few months making an Atlas 2-6-0 into a logging type 2-6-2. It was back before I had a lathe, or milling machine, or knew how to etch brass. I just got the bug one day, flipped through a few magazines and found drawings of a locomotive that would work out great with the Atlas loco as a start. When it was all done I sat it up on a shelf and didn't touch it for a couple years. I ended up selling it just to get it off of my shelf...   If someone wanted that same loco now I really just wouldn't have any motivation to get it going.

I've done stuff for other people before and all I want to do is walk passed it and work on my own stuff. There is "model railroading time" and that really doesn't change so if I'm doing something else during that time there ends up being less time.

On the other hand I bet most people here would be more than willing to help you figure out a problem you might run into if you were building it yourself. I know you say you don't have the tools and stuff like that, but maybe that would be something better to spend your money on right now?

If Model Railroading became my job it might no longer be fun 

I can scan those H10 drawings, size them to N scale and e-mail to you if that will help.

[Dave V]

Cody,

As I indicated, it took me several months of evenings for my H10sb kitbash  These were non-consecutive months, too.  I started on the boiler while stationed in Florida the first time, and finished it at a later assignment.  Its a non-trivial prospect of time and patience.  Tinkering with someone's loco with no expectation of a specific deadline; that I might be able to do.  It's been done for me.  Parts donation?  Sure.  Decoder install?  Sure, although usually even then folks around here expect a nominal fee for such services.  Kitbashing steam, however, is for most a lengthy process.  Difficult?  No, not necessarily, which is why I am trying to encourage you to give it a shot.  I spent much less time building an entire charity raffle N scale layout with a crew of 4 other guys than a typical steam bash might take me to get right.  As others have indicated, it stops being a "favor" after a few days' work and starts becoming significant work.  It's not about "profit" at that point; it's about many tens of hours of missed work on one's own layout or projects, which for most of us already competes with long work hours, family, other extracurricular commitments, etc.

You are sounding hung-up on this idea that someone who'd done one before would be able to do it again rather quickly.  No.  Milling and fitting, fitting and milling, balancing and wiring, testing and re-testing...  These processes are iterative and cannot be rushed, no matter how many times one has done this.  Might I shave a few hours off having learned a few don'ts last go around?  Perhaps, but not a significant amount relative to the project as a whole.  Again, it's not overwhelmingly hard, it's just very precise, and so patience is the most overwhelmingly necessary skill.

The box of K4 castings should be in the mail tomorrow, so between that and the decoder, you have someplace to start.  I did scan eBay and noted there aren't as many blow-out deals on those Spectrum 2-8-0s as there once were, now that the Bachmann Soviet-decoder-equipped version is out.  That said, check the Trading Post here and the 'bay; they're bound to turn up.

[Lemosteam]

Dave, and others, well said.

Per you original request, here's my H10.

VonRyan, even though I took a very different approach from Dave on my H10 as I built mine from a shortened Minitrix Decapod, I spent many, many hours making, photographing and vidoegraphing my model below.  The miniature detailing I did and the countless hours of trying to find and staring at photos of the road number I decided to model to try to get close (yes this is the correct tender for this road number!!!), is priceless to me as is the model.

THAT is the true joy of kitbashing to me.  Making something from something else, like so many others here have.  I still encourage you to try, and even though you may think you have failed when complete (as you suggest your disorder may cause), the sense of accomplishment may very well overcome that.

 

I really do not want you to become discouraged; and because of your age, I think you may be a bit niave to think that we are all benevolent givers here.  That statement is not meant to be taken as a put-down, however, it just means that you have not experienced life and work to the point where time for others is not necessarily free and is very limited (speaking as a parent, husband and employee).

I'll tell you what- I'll make you a deal.  If you give making your own H10 a heartfelt try and document it here so others can help and constructively criticize your work with you and if you still feel that you have failed, I will sell you mine for a price that will not put you over budget.  I will even include two Bachmann tender trucks, and a leftover TCS M1 decoder that I used for experimentation.  If someone here is willing to install the decoder (I am TERRIBLE at it) and the trucks for improved pickup, I will send it to them first for subsequent shipping to you (volunteers?).

So my challenge to you is above.  Give it a try using Dave's spares, and a chassis of your choice (I don't recommend my method compared to Dave's and others, as it is much more work with the drivetrain and frame) and give yourself the chance to experience what so many others have tried (and sometimes failed, I can admit that! ).  It may just send you on an N Scale journey you will hopefully never outgrow!

[VonRyan]

Ok, Since i'm also a headstrong and stubborn bloke who doesn't like being challenged by others (but sees turning it down as the cowards way out  ), i accept the challenge that has been set before me.

I'll even add to said wager in that if i do complete it without there being some obvious problem and the 2/3rds majority are that its a success, i'll re-try handlaying turnouts (if i can find someone to properly teach me).

Now before i try and find the deed to my house... I'll end on a note of caution...
For those of you playing along at home, betting on the outcome of this project is risky at best. Do so at your own risk. 

I'll take the first picture of the project tonight... A blank space on my workbench...
(plus i'll try to take a picture of my on-going restoration of a 60+ year old Clark & Gibby Inc. desk that is destined to be my new workbench, er... desk...)

-Cody F.

[Lemosteam]

VonRyan, We have a deal for a price to be disclosed at a later date.  BTW it was not a challenge to your manhood, just an appeal to your abilities.

Go for it and you may end up with two H10's to doublehead (yes they did that!).

Looking forward to seeing your progress!

[mmagliaro]

Okay, NOW your're talkin', man!
I'm "all in".   As you progress on this, if you get stuck or need parts, post here and I will join the others who will dig through my bins
to help you out.

[VonRyan]

VonRyan, We have a deal for a price to be disclosed at a later date.  BTW it was not a challenge to your manhood, just an appeal to your abilities.

Go for it and you may end up with two H10's to doublehead (yes they did that!).

Looking forward to seeing your progress!

  Manhood? IIRC 17 still means that legally i'm a kid... which basically means almost nothing but oh well. 

I just meant that its a general challenge (albeit an interesting on at that), not some egg eating challenge straight out of "Cool Hand Luke"... no i won't eat 60 eggs. 

so once the Vollmer Special arrives via the not-so-friendly postman, it shall begin. The search for a suitable 2-8-0 chassis is already underway, but not exactly very fruitful as of yet. Perhaps at the next few train shows I attend i'll find something more cost efficient.

Soon enough i'll start a progress topic for all to follow.

-Cody F.

[pennsyfan1361]

Cody, glad to see you are going to build the H10sa. We all want to see you be successful in building your locomotive. I live in N.J. and model the Pennsy if you get stuck on modeling your engine I will try to help you.          Rich

[Dave V]

So just so you're prepared, the boiler shells will be in various states of usability.  Between them all you should have enough plus spares if you screw one up.  What I didn't send was an appropriate cab.  Those come from a Minitrix B6, and I have but one on hand for the mega-H10 I plan to do one of these years.

IF I had an unlimited budget, here's what I'd do:

1.  Spectrum 2-8-0, non-DCC.
2.  K4 boiler
3.  B6 cab
4.  GHQ Pennsy tender shell (for an L1s, sold by Republic Locomotive Works, RLW, but matches the one on the surviving H10sb #7688)
5.  GHQ tender steps and detailing kit from RLW
6.  GHQ L1s detailing set from RLW
7.  Soundtrax Mirco-Tsunami sound decoder
8.  Micro Scale Pennsy hood diesel decal set (trust me)

Mad Max Magliaro taught me a trick for the headlight.  Take some fiber optic and heat the end with a soldering iron to form a lens.  Drill into the headlight casting and create a pathway down into the smokebox.  Insert the fiber optic such that the lens is flush in the headlight and the other end of the fiber optic contacts the LED inside the smokebox.  Voila!  Instant lit headlight.

[Lemosteam]

so once the Vollmer Special arrives via the not-so-friendly postman, it shall begin. The search for a suitable 2-8-0 chassis is already underway, but not exactly very fruitful as of yet. Perhaps at the next few train shows I attend i'll find something more cost efficient.

-Cody F.

Guys help me out here.  Train world has them for 59.99 for some of the less popular lines.  Is that the good model or not (been thinking about one for myself...).

I have a spare B6 cab.  PM your address to me and I will send it to you.

[VonRyan]

Ok, so far we've collectively assembled the following resources.
>K4 Shells     -Dave V.
>B6 Cab        -John (Lemosteam)
>Decoder      -Myself
>Workspace  -Myself

In terms of the tender, what is the most effective option that isn't going to be hard to find and also be relatively cheap.
There is a good amount of Bachmann tenders on ebay right now, its just a matter of determining which one i need if it is one of them.
If not, who what where and how? 

-Cody F.

[Lemosteam]

VonRyan, try this for the mech... $59.99

http://www.trainworldonline.com/catalog/bachmann/spectrum-n-scale-dcc-ready-baldwin-2-8-0-consolidation-rock-island-2118-81172

I agree with Dave on the tender shell from the l1s kit $20:

https://www.republiclocomotiveworks.com/show_item.php?ID=843

[Dave V]

Hey, for my tender, I just used the stock Bachmann with K4 tender steps and marker lamps (sorry, can't help you there) and I fashioned a new slope sheet to match a more Pennsy profile.  I then hid the slope sheet splice in the coal pile.

Not ideal, but also not offensive.  The rivet pattern is more of a giveaway that it's not true Pennsy than the overall size and shape.  Almost all Pennsy tenders had a sloping rivet line marking the slope sheet profile.