color help on future release at MTL

[MichaelWinicki]

Perhaps MTL needs to consider a change in business model, more like Bussey's and Craig's, or as a distributor, capitalizing on its distribution powers. Companies do change business models, and it's easier for smaller companies to do so than larger ones.

Without seeing MT's numbers and such, you really can't say that their business model does need changing.

[Ed Kapuscinski]

Indeed. And guys, I've got to say, this was unnecessary.

Joe came here trying to find some help, and instead, a few of you folks showed no self-restraint and decided to find every way you could to tell him he sucks.

Not cool. Not cool at all.

[John]

Indeed. And guys, I've got to say, this was unnecessary.

Joe came here trying to find some help, and instead, a few of you folks showed no self-restraint and decided to find every way you could to tell him he sucks.

Not cool. Not cool at all.

I agree .. Joe doesn't control what his employers business model is .. we should not be bashing him for it .. personally, I get really fed up with these hidden agendas .. stick to modeling, or take it some where else.

[Sokramiketes]

Constructive #1:  Don't use that photo as a color sample.  Poke around the photo archives for other photos of freshly repainted BNSF rolling stock.  I'd start with some of the patched double stack cars, since you'll see old mineral red (brown) versus the fresh, almost maroon, mineral red BNSF is using on equipment.

Constructive #2:  Ok, tell us how we can help.  Is it just that MTL doesn't know what prototype schemes are available for their cars as molded?  The members here could probably help in that regard.

Lets use another example.  The BNSF covered hoppers released a few months back.  Flashy BNSF swoop scheme and all, really nice paint job, eye-catching for the newbies, etc.  Except they were numbered as Trinity 5161's instead of the ACF cars that BNSF also has and that match the MTL model.  Other than the research, there was no reason the choice made by MTL was somehow making more money, keeping food on American's plates, etc. etc. etc. 

I bet that in BNSF's fleet there is at least one swoosh logo boxcar that matches an MTL car.  Now who's going to find it? 

My "agenda", which I probably don't hide well enough, is that prototype schemes should come before foobies.   

[wm3798]

Personally, I'm glad that Joe and the several other manufacturers choose to drop by here on occasion.  We hear regularly from Joe, as well as BLMA, Intermountain, Bluford, ESM, and dare I say it... even Atlas.

While I don't contribute much to these types of conversations, it's apparent that the Railwire represents something of a think tank.  That said, when the thinking goes into the tank, the value of everyone's input here is diminished.

Joe's job is to walk the fine line between getting the models right and selling the models to the unwashed masses.  No matter how you slice it there are going to be compromises.  It's been said a million times here and elsewhere.  If the foobies provide the cashflow to underwrite a new series of heavyweights (for instance) then let the foobies roll!

Lee

[DKS]

Joe came here trying to find some help, and instead, a few of you folks showed no self-restraint and decided to find every way you could to tell him he sucks.

I get really fed up with these hidden agendas .. stick to modeling, or take it some where else.

+1 +1

Joe did not come here asking how MTL's business model should be altered, or how other MTL products are wrong. Can we please somehow avoid all of the unnecessary bashing?

[mcjaco]

I bet that in BNSF's fleet there is at least one swoosh logo boxcar that matches an MTL car.  Now who's going to find it? 

Will you give out a prize? 

[daniel_leavitt2000]

I wish we had an accurate Berwick box. Its one of the few major modern boxes that have not been done accurately yet. The car is too new for me but I appreciate you asking.

[Denver Road Doug]

Wow, Railwire puts on the kid gloves.   

"We're gonna need a bigger boat."

 

[up1950s]

This 2010 shot looks like it has some of that new paint on it in places . Reminds me of WC boxcar color .

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=2255465

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1463564

[JoeD]

Sure looks like that WC color...  I have some AZL Z hoppers in this scheme with the swoosh markings and it looks almost purple.  Interesting how confusing one color can be.  We have someone at BNSF looking into it for us.  I'll let you know what we come up with.  Be interesting to see if there are any hobby mixes that match too.

Joe

This 2010 shot looks like it has some of that new paint on it in places . Reminds me of WC boxcar color .

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=2255465

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1463564

[DKS]

Beg to differ. Assuming the images are reasonably well color-balanced, the reds are pretty far apart when you put them side-by-side. The WC box is much warmer.
 

[sirenwerks]

Joe came here trying to find some help, and instead, a few of you folks showed no self-restraint and decided to find every way you could to tell him he sucks.

Not to sound flip (really) but for my part I never made this personal to Joe, but referred to MTL. If I wanted to tell someone personally that he or she sucked, I'd say something more akin to "Ed, you suck".

Mike's point about consciously and carefully doing schemes that fit the model is an honorable one and fits the reality of the 'we have to work with what we have' situation. I know I personally was pretty miffed when I found out so much of the early equipment I bought wasn't correct (numerous KD/MTL cars in that group) and were, in effect, wasted purchases. Had I paid today's prices I might be convinced all manufacturers were besmirched and drop the hobby - bad hobby-wide PR I'm sure the NMRA would frown upon.

Atlas manages a respectable product development. Take for instance the 1932 AAR box, the offset twin and fishbelly hoppers, the 3 wood-side AAR box versions... it has numerous models it could be dousing with foob schemes and yet it restrains itself to a business practice of, essentially, less paint schemes on more body styles. Apples and oranges, but fodder for thought.

[DKS]

Not to sound flip (really) but for my part I never made this personal to Joe, but referred to MTL. If I wanted to tell someone personally that he or she sucked, I'd say something more akin to "Ed, you suck".

Mike's point about consciously and carefully doing schemes that fit the model is an honorable one and fits the reality of the 'we have to work with what we have' situation. I know I personally was pretty miffed when I found out so much of the early equipment I bought wasn't correct (numerous KD/MTL cars in that group) and were, in effect, wasted purchases. Had I paid today's prices I might be convinced all manufacturers were besmirched and drop the hobby - bad hobby-wide PR I'm sure the NMRA would frown upon.

Atlas manages a respectable product development. Take for instance the 1932 AAR box, the offset twin and fishbelly hoppers, the 3 wood-side AAR box versions... it has numerous models it could be dousing with foob schemes and yet it restrains itself to a business practice of, essentially, less paint schemes on more body styles. Apples and oranges, but fodder for thought.

Point taken. However, the larger point is that Joe asked a specific question about color, and look what happened--a (sadly predictable) "let's all bash MTL" free-for-all ensued. Whether or not anyone was personally bashing Joe is irrelevant; it wasn't the topic.

Back on topic, I think ModelFlex Lehigh Valley Cornell Red seems to be a decent match for the boxcar in Bob's post.
 

[up1950s]

You are correct , that LV looks closer to it than the WC .