Plan for Southern Pacific El Centro Branch 1982

[AlkemScaleModels]

When I was living in Yuma, AZ - I went to El Centro and fell in love all over again with The
El Centro Branch of The Southern Pacific. Last year I had to abandon my layout projects
for a move to AZ. Well - It didn't work out and I moved back to Fresno. Been arm chair
modeling for a few months. I took some shots for the LDE and need a door layout plan
to test it for a bigger layout later. My daughter's new home in Sanger, CA (outside of Fresno)
has this wonderful room and shop as part of a massive three car garage and perfect for
Grandpa's trains.


Looking for a door track plan with scenic divider to start and need some input. The
branch is basically a straight line from the "wye" at the interchange in El Centro
through Seely, where it's all agri-business, over the New River then the desert
starts. US 80 and the line run through Plaster City (U.S. Gypsum) with some spurs
and sidings and an interchange with plants narrow gauge line. It winds to Ocotillo
Wells with a siding there and begins the climb up the mountains over Goat Canyon
and Carizzo Gorge. Only modeling El Centro to Ocotillo Wells.

Is this the rail line that is visible from the interstate highway between Yuma and San Diego? (I-10 IRRC?)  I always wondered about that in my trips down there.

[C855B]

Yes, but the Interstate you're thinking of is I-8. The line has a fairly checkered history. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Diego_and_Arizona_Eastern_Railway

[TiVoPrince]

Worked
on this a bit today.  Left Kerman reversed so the industries would be located close to the aisle and the "pretty" side of the tracks could be the backdrop.  Black tracks represent the SP main and yard while the green tracks are a reasonable facsimilie of the the real thing.  Mendota was pushed over to Kerman to make room for some classic valley scenery around Biola.

Concepted the SP to run all the way around the building providing a break in track and a contrast to the "laid back" branch line operations.  SP could be graded to sink below the scenery (offstage) and being mostly out of the way of scenery.  Potentially even a short backdrop to hide the trains on the SP line could work if you plan on building higher than 48inches to the bottom of the benchwork. 

Most of the structures need to be scratchbuilt ot extensive kitbashes, but you knew that already.  Suggesting the Cal-Fame packing plant for Mendota as a highly detailed focal point.  http://www.thenarch.com/ and scroll down the page aways...



Higher resolution image: http://www.technologywrangler.com/images/SP_SJV_LDE.pdf

[chuck geiger]

Just screamin' awesome J.J. - Thank you kindly - I love it - Now to convince the
better-half of 33 years that an outbuilding would be a great addition to the
family. Let me digest.

[Philip H]

Just screamin' awesome J.J. - Thank you kindly - I love it - Now to convince the
better-half of 33 years that an outbuilding would be a great addition to the
family. Let me digest.

Chuck,
If you point out all the room in the house you will "Free up" by not having trains there - and then build such space to suit her hobby tastes - you may have a winner.

[TiVoPrince]

Certainly
not a loop on a door.  Glad you like it, hope you get to build it...

[chuck geiger]

Worked
on this a bit today.  Left Kerman reversed so the industries would be located close to the aisle and the "pretty" side of the tracks could be the backdrop.  Black tracks represent the SP main and yard while the green tracks are a reasonable facsimilie of the the real thing.  Mendota was pushed over to Kerman to make room for some classic valley scenery around Biola.

Concepted the SP to run all the way around the building providing a break in track and a contrast to the "laid back" branch line operations.  SP could be graded to sink below the scenery (offstage) and being mostly out of the way of scenery.  Potentially even a short backdrop to hide the trains on the SP line could work if you plan on building higher than 48inches to the bottom of the benchwork.  

Most of the structures need to be scratchbuilt ot extensive kitbashes, but you knew that already.  Suggesting the Cal-Fame packing plant for Mendota as a highly detailed focal point.  http://www.thenarch.com/ and scroll down the page aways...

Some thoughts, Biola was taken out of the picture in the 70's, SP closed  the Biola to Kerman line. We could replace Biola with Mendota. I can even do Downtown Fresno as a backdrop along the left or west wall where the removable section is. Thorne Ave actually crosses the WYE tracks about 40 feet from the WYE. I ride my motor scooter on the way to work everyday at the newspaper. We are never going to get the selective compression right to add the "quonset hut" and long agri-buldings that lie within the WYE. So the sidings moved up look great. Permission granted to change the name to S. Pacific Ave. I won't have anough room to model Hill Seed and Grain, which is a large structure located near the canal and the top of the WYE. It could be modeled on the backdrop.

[TiVoPrince]

Something
that appealed to me would be to slide Kerman down a little to open up the spacing from Fresno.  This is similar to the original plan.  A lot of the feel is in the going to the 'country' from Fresno.  A little family farm desolation between towns and the step down in town size gives the impression of 'going somewhere'.  Turning Mendota 180* and creating a runaround track within the 'Biola Junction' area to use as drill track to serve it as a 'turn job' that does not interfere with the SP Valley Line.  Placing the runaround track there lets you extend the run and work entirely seperate from Kerman tracks.  This could open up another siding at Medota for something generic like a concrete batch plant or lumberyard.  Unfortunately this does adverely affect the SP Fresno Yard capacity.  Computer is busy for awhile transcoding some video files so I will work on the plan when the box is free.  Not a problem to continue talking about changes without a redraw...

[chuck geiger]

The Brass Hat has told me we can enclose the front deck of the mobile home, I built the deck three
years ago. It measures 5x20' - But could go 5x15'. Can we knock out a foot across if we pick up three
feet in length? - Looks like the outbuilding was veto'ed. It would take up too much space on the
patio. So I actually like this idea better, connected to the home and my office (the old train room)
has a window to it. So revision from 6' to 5' and pickup 12' to 15' on two sides, same plan.

[chuck geiger]

Something
that appealed to me would be to slide Kerman down a little to open up the spacing from Fresno.  This is similar to the original plan.  A lot of the feel is in the going to the 'country' from Fresno.  A little family farm desolation between towns and the step down in town size gives the impression of 'going somewhere'.  Turning Mendota 180* and creating a runaround track within the 'Biola Junction' area to use as drill track to serve it as a 'turn job' that does not interfere with the SP Valley Line.  Placing the runaround track there lets you extend the run and work entirely seperate from Kerman tracks.  This could open up another siding at Medota for something generic like a concrete batch plant or lumberyard.  Unfortunately this does adverely affect the SP Fresno Yard capacity.  Computer is busy for awhile transcoding some video files so I will work on the plan when the box is free.  Not a problem to continue talking about changes without a redraw...

I do the like the Fresno - Kerman spacing idea I'm going to have to get use to the fact I can't model everything around that WYE. Maybe a few cotton warehouses and quonset buildings, we push Kerman down the length to the right and use the space to represent open fields, grape vineyards and almond groves. We could loose Mendota and add Ingle which is the real junction with the Southbound West Side Line out side of Kerman. Move Mendota to where Biola is? Thanks for your help, please take your time, no rush and again thanks.

Here's some shots from my LDE planning of the WYE and related:

Right leg of WYE towards Fresno (industries in center and right)

Just ahead of the WYE switch looking at Thorne Ave.

Quonset hut type buildings to the right of the Fresno track from the WYE

Rail America switching just past Dakota, about 1-2 miles from WYE

[TiVoPrince]

Got
any door/window interference?  Possibility that I should draw 5x15 and indicate where 'expansion joints' exist in case the full 5x20 were to become available.  Generally the Fresno area could be bent to a steeper angle and not change too much.  Kerman becomes centered and I think I need better diagrams for the proto track arrangements for Mendota and Ingle.  Google maps only takes me so far.  While I drove up and down the valley more than a few times the details tend to escape me.

Fresno should feel crowded around the wye.  It needs a 'presence' that supports the branch and identifies the valley main.  Maybe not shoehorned like many eastern layouts crossing a downtown area but close together by valley standards.  Lots of chain link fences, oddly parked pickup trucks and buildings with a variety of interesting additions.  That should get a nice local feel.  Certainly we could add several more rail served industries but that may become too contrived.  It may be happier to just use a runaround track at Ingle to turn and return on the branch.  Perhaps adding something in the tight bend of the wye that is scenically Fresno but operationally many miles away at Ingle.

One of my favourite structures from a previous layout was a derilict warehouse that extended 'into the aisle.  All the signage that you could read was 'East Ba', and that could be East Bay Co. or East Bayonne Navigation, Provisions, and Tranportation.  The aisle side was just a blank flat black styrene panel.  It sort of encouraged your eye to something more interesting elsewhere.  Lots of details like old shopping carts, trash and litter nearby kept your interest.  Helena Chemical could be such a candidate, as would be many of the ancillary builings in Fresno.  Real buildings tend to dwarf trains in real life and our layouts should reflect that.  Also trains roll through starkly beautiful scenery that is so simple that it is difficult to do well...

[chuck geiger]

JJ - It's 5x20 but need to have 5' buffer up-front - no windows or door problems....a big rectangle 5'x'15'. Helena Chemical in Kerman is a fairly modern facility and looks like a Pikestuff building, which I bought to model it.

[TiVoPrince]

After
some thought this week I have come up with a somewhat different plan.  With five feet across it is difficult to get the SP main line loop in the space along with anything else and still have room in the "operating pit" for even one person.  After scoping out the other locations I decided to follow prototype and wandered down the SP main looking for towns that had industries on the west side of the main and hoping for an industry that would support a lot of traffic.  This led me to Shafter. 

The GAF plant eats scores of boxcars and covered hoppers along with a lot of truck traffic making it a nice contrast to the few cars out and back that the Fresno/Kerman branch will be doing.  The GAF plant could be built around the sneaky track that passes through fields from Kerman to conceal the roundy-round nature of the layout.  Shafter has a lot going for it: Highway overpass to conceal the SP main dead end, large plants that can support a lot of varied rail traffic and still has a nice valley feeling. 

Fresno got angled and twisted to fit in the 5 foot width.  I'm a little concerned how to scenic the area between Fresno and Kerman.  I tried various ways of including the Hwy 99 overpass bit did not care for the result.  Since almost every mile of track is paralled by roads I added the continuation of California Street and called it a day.  If you have a better suggestion I'm open for comment.  If you think you can handle a deep duckunder you could fill in the triangle with a lot more buildings and such. I think the surrounded by layout will be a good immersive view for visitors and would leave it this way, but it's only a matter of opinion and my opinion doesn't matter.  Because the Fresno Wye is now going to be the highlight (and all that most visitors will see because the operating area is really too thought for two) special care will be needed to engage non-model railroaders.  Getting this layout really close to eye level will be important as will building thin benchwork.  If the benchwork will clear your shoulders it will be like having another foot of width.  Of course you will probably hit your nose/chin on benchwork rather than a shoulder, Don't for get that you will need to provide a bench or stool for kids to see anything.  Some acrylic panels across the "viewing portal" are recommended as you will not be in range to inoculate for WHS (wandering hand syndrome) in real time from the pit.

Putting unique things visitors may have seen in Fresno or substituting common and mundane stuff they see everywhere will certainly help.  Part of your challenge will be making structures that are big enough to be plausible getting rail service yet not hiding the trains from your guests.  In Fresno/Kerman I have spaced the tracks like the prototype exists "today" since the number of industries warrants less trackage than was originally laid down by SP.  Since the middle tracks of a yard are usually abandoned to maintain the clam to the entire right of way this is modeled and leaving the space will help "sell" the overall scenes as something you can go see today. 

Animation like crossing signals at each street (use a Digitrax DS64 and BD4 occupancy detector) and a lot of details close the the "viewing portal" will get a lot of interest.  The SP main seemed to always parallel Golden State Road (G Street in Fresno) everywhere in the valley.  While the yard may be an operational concession I would challenge you to build without it and see if you like it.  The SP main dead ends could hold a lot of cars and the purity of the scenery would be hard to argue with. 

You probably need to befriend someone at a large format printer shop.  Photo stitching together backdrops for this layout would be a very cool way to dress it up.

Anyway, on the the diagram...



And the annotated Acrobat version
http://www.technologywrangler.com/images/SP_SJV3_LDE.pdf

[chuck geiger]

Again JJ Nice job...love how you incorporated the line all the way to Lerdo Hwy and 99 - Shafter. I always wanted to model one of the large Agri-Industries off of 99. So the line out of Kerman is the "invisible" line to San Joaquin/Tranquility on the West Side Line and to Shafter is the SP main through the Valley, disappearing around GAF/Lerdo Hwy to Los Angeles. Digesting more of it....

[TiVoPrince]

So the line out of Kerman is the "invisible" line to San Joaquin/Tranquility on the West Side Line

Personally
I would have concepted the line from Kerman to be mostly a scenic exercise to place things for photography and reinforce the valley feeling.  Operationally I'm thinking that with a shed across the back of GAF disguising the big hole in the structure a little parking a couple of boxcars there representing the S.Madera and Church warehouse or a different Mendota/Biola/Tranquility agricultural business supplied with covered hoppers.  The big hole in the drawing left side of the building won't be seen since its at the dead end of the layout.  I would consider constructing 'filler walls' for photography purposes just to be safe.

One of the more exciting possibilites would be placing a highly detailed but non operational (Hallmark Brass?) tunnel motor on the Northbound main with headlight/numberboards/stepwells/gyralights ablaze.  Just turn off the lights and look straight down the main for a great railfan experience.  SP signals along the main (set by turnout positions) and a faint glow from Golden State Road streetlights and car/truck headlights.  Build it, and I may show up at your door some fine Saturday afternoon with a 'Kernan Turn' in my suitcase. 

Wait!  I'm not certain that such a statement would make you more or less likely to build it...