what happens when you place DC locomotive on DCC programming track???

[glakedylan]

OK...I have discovered how challenged I can be 
I placed GHB L1 on programming track with PR3 and JMRI
thinking it had a decoder in it [mis-read and got confused
doing research and following threads incorrectly] 
What happened?
Thinking it was a DZ125, I changed the CV for direction
and it actually worked....somewhat 
The locomotive now runs in the correct direction as to the
direction control of power pack (MRC), but the headlight
is now NOT lighting
The weirdest of things is that the headlight and tender light
both light up on the programming track but not while
running on my ovals
OK...so I tried to program the decoder that is NOT there
"again" using the restore default on JMRI, but to no
avail...still runs in correct direction [with no change in the
locomotive wiring] but no lights on either loco head or
tender
Any suggestions on how to get the lights back on even if
it means running in reverse direction?
I know...what was I thinking!
Thankfully
Gary

[peteski]

Gary, that makes no sense to me.  If there is no decoder, it cannot be programmed - it is as simple as that.   DC locos have their motor leads hardwired to the track.  No "decoder brain" in there to be programmed.

Put any other DC loco (which you are certain is DC-only) on the programming track and tried. You won't blow up anything but it should error out when you try to do any programming.

What you describe is a loco which seems to have a decoder. installed.  Direction is stored in a standard CV register which is present in all the brands of the decoder.  If you can, try to read out the value of CV8 then we can look up that number to see who made the decoder. Here is one of such listings: https://ncedcc.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/200545039-Manufacturer-ID-listing

[glakedylan]

thanks @peteski for replying
yes...you are 100% correct
but, then, that is what is so confusion

out of box GHB L1 ran backwards
programmed (I thought) a reverse of direction value

back on track
it runs forward

yet, the headlight and tender light do not function

back on program track
getting errors that would indicate no decoder
no CV 8 value
but on the programming track
lights both work

and I cannot undo what has been done
something has changed causing
direction to be correct, without wiring change
and lights out at the same time

makes no sense even to a DCC "just getting my feet wet"
kind of guy

thanks, nonetheless, it is appreciated!
sincerely--
Gary

[peteski]

That is weird.  Refresh my memory please:  You do not have a DCC full DCC system  - only the programmer which works in programming mode?  So you can't try running the model using DCC and you are using analog (DC) throttle?

[glakedylan]

@peteski

only bought the PR3Xtra
to change whistle on the Bachmann K4
which I was able to do without any problems
converted both K4s to whistle CV 115 to 1 from 0

then, not knowing what I was thinking other than
being an idiot I was going to change the L1 direction
thinking it had a decoder and reversing the direction
control

doing that actually seems to change something
because:
1. the L1 is running in the correct direction without making any hardwire changes or other changes to the locomotive
2. while it runs the headlight and tender light do not work in either direction

there is no reading any CVs as there is no decoder
yet when it is on the programming track the headlight and tender light both are on together when the PR3
with JMRI is trying to get info from the locomotive

very weird!

thanks again
Gary

[peteski]

I guess at this point it would make sense to identify the decoder.  It is probably in the tender.  I wonder if @Lemosteam has taken his loco's tender apart yet?

[Lemosteam]

Scott Lupia and Chris Broughton have dug into their tenders quite extensively and found that the wiring is all messed up in these, to the point where both simply replaced everything and hard-wired a decoder in.  I nthink that Gary has seen all of this on facebook as well. 

While the DCC programming might be able to make the Loco's directions change, the lighting will not work properly likely because of the way the LED's are wired.

@peteski, I have only gauged some of the wheels so far on my L1.  I have been too busy installing my own DCC system...

[peteski]

LOL!  The question was whether this model has a factory installed decoder or is it strictly DC?

If it does not have a decoder inside then there is no way any sort of DCC programming would have made difference in the direction the model travels.  I'll ask this question on the original GHB L1 thread.

[peteski]

Gary, please check this post . I can't possibly explain how you managed to do what you did.   Maybe you could take the tender apart to see whether there is a decoder installed in there?  I have my doubts though.

The only logical explanation I can think of is that maybe you were confused about the travel direction.  How did you initially determine that your model was running in reverse? Did you simply trust the description of the problems as documented by GHB, or did you put it on the track with another DC model and saw that they were running in opposite directions?

This one is a head-scratcher for sure.

[glakedylan]

thanks @peteski

yes, have been following here, and on facebook
and I agree...if no decoder there should not be a reason
why anything has changed, but it has
mystery!

I suppose opening up the tender and rewiring is the best
solution...your help has been very appreciated!

sincerely--
Gary

[Lemosteam]

There is no decoder in there @peteski and @glakedylan.  Just a messed up NMRA plug.

[peteski]

Thanks for the confirmation John.

[glakedylan]

@Lemosteam

thanks for confirming
I will have to rewire

sincerely
Gary