What is happening to our hobby?

[DirtyD79]

Funny thing is that the dealers at the local train shows around here want ridiculous prices even for garbage.  Like old  Bachmann cabooses (not new run) with rapido couplers for $15! Some even still have the original $5 price tags! You would think they have gold for sale.  Yes, there are sometimes few bargains to be found, but those are rare.  Our shows are sort of what eBay has become - everybody *DOES* want to get rich selling crappy models.

But thems is vintage, man. They were the finest model trains from JC's Pennies back in 1981. Seriously though, it's like I said in another thread. Everybody thinks their old crap is worth a fortune these days because of shows like American Pickers. They think they're one Big Mouth Billy Bass or one Tae Bo tape away from the jackpot or they're gonna finance their dream house with a fistful of Tyco.

[Ed Kapuscinski]

Regarding the "repeat o-vendors"...   

I'm convinced that a lot of those guys just enjoy the train show atmosphere.  If they make nothing then the cost of the table is just their entertainment.  Most of us pay x amount of money to do things we enjoy, so I don't think it's that different.

Granted that doesn't make for a very exciting train show from the attendee perspective if everyone was like that.   But fortunately there's usually some decent percentage of new blood too.

I think you're really onto a core aspect of it.
And generally, it's no harm, no foul, but it IS really annoying having these tables "spamming" shows and making it harder to actually find the good stuff.

But that's kinda the fun of it, I suppose.

[JoeD]

From my vantage point at the last show here in Medford I watched how things really work.  One vendor goes to another vender, buys a bunch of stuff and the puts it on his table with few pennies added to the cost.  Minutes later another vendor visits his table and spirits off with a few boxes of stock...it gets a few pennies added to the cost.  and on and on.     I watched a bunch of really old tyco cabeese migrate pretty much completely around the showroom in two days and apparently gained considerable value during the process.    I wonder if there's a category for that at Guiness?   lol 

Joe

[thomasjmdavis]

From my vantage point at the last show here in Medford I watched how things really work.  One vendor goes to another vender, buys a bunch of stuff and the puts it on his table with few pennies added to the cost.  Minutes later another vendor visits his table and spirits off with a few boxes of stock...it gets a few pennies added to the cost.  and on and on.     I watched a bunch of really old tyco cabeese migrate pretty much completely around the showroom in two days and apparently gained considerable value during the process.    I wonder if there's a category for that at Guiness?   lol 

Joe

LOL...this sounds like a tax scam.  If you go to a dozen shows, and never sell anything, sooner or later, the IRS will rule that you aren't a going concern.  But, the round-about sales allows each of them to have sales of $500 (or whatever the box of cars costs) during the show, and also purchase $500 in "new" inventory (assuming the last in the chain sells the stuff back to the first in the chain, as they are packing up to go home). Doing business there makes the entry fees, milage, hotel all tax deductible- an offset for whatever they make on online sales of the stuff the rest of the year.  So, the show and travel are free for them-

[Dwight in Toronto]

I’m surprised to hear that many of the US-based train shows charge such high admissions, along with paid parking. 

There are roughly 15 or 20 train shows throughout southern Ontario each year, of which I attend maybe 5 or 6.  None have paid parking.  Admissions are typically $5 to $8 for adults. 

The highest admission I’ve seen is one event where it’s $10 for ‘early bird’ enthusiasts who don’t mind paying more to get first crack at the tables, without the throngs, between 9:30 and 11:00 am.   The price drops to $8 from 11:00 until 1:00 pm or so, and then drops again from say, 1:00 until 4:00 closing.

I suspect most of these shows might be smaller than their American counterparts (and it sounds like you guys have some BIG ones - eg - Amherst), but my wild guess is that our various shows might have anywhere from 50 to maybe 75 vendors.

Fwiw, there are many vendors with that old “vintage” stuff as mentioned, but in my experience, the table-renters are anxious to leave with a lot less than they brought.   For example, old Aurora Postage Stamp and other similar Bachmann and LifeLike and Model Power etc with clunky rapido couplers are usually priced at $10, but most will sell ‘em for $5, and even better if you offer to take 5 or more pieces off their hands.   

It’s always a crap-shoot, but there are usually enough genuine bargains to be found which make the drive-time, fuel, admission, and even the need for followup MT truck-&-coupler upgrades, all worthwhile.  And you can’t put a price on the all-round fun quotient!

[crrcoal]

Regarding the taxes; if Joes Train Shop has a table at Timonium, he must collect MD sales tax. What about random modeler Joe Smith who decided to got to Timonium to sell some of his stuff because he changed scales, does he have to charge tax too?

[peteski]

This is why I've mostly given up on train shows. Been seeing tables full of the exact same junk for the past 20 years and it's usually around $30 just to get in the door ($15 to park and $15 for entry). Do these people travel all over the country hauling around those same, cheap junker HO cabooses year after year after year???

Being a member of the local NTRAK club has its perks.  I get into all the shows for free if we have layout set up.  Basically those are the only shows I attend. Some shows actually pay us for displaying the layout.   Plus I can get in at the same time dealers get in for setup, and check what they have for sale.  Most of the shows have free parking (but the huge Amherst show does charge for parking).

[Ed Kapuscinski]

Regarding the taxes; if Joes Train Shop has a table at Timonium, he must collect MD sales tax. What about random modeler Joe Smith who decided to got to Timonium to sell some of his stuff because he changed scales, does he have to charge tax too?

Yes. In fact, many shows ask for proof of tax stuff when signing up as a vendor.
But I know many states also have somewhat easy processes for this type of thing too, knowing it's a widespread occurrence.

[Rossford Yard]

I have never noted the same merch on several tables, even year to year, but have seen vendors that bring the same stuff year after year on their own tables.

As for hunting bargains, at least around here, we wait until Sunday, especially if traffic is slow because the Cowboys are on TV, making attendance low and slow.  As mentioned pricing gets very realistic near the end of the show with those types of vendors because they hate to haul the same amount of "treasure" as they brought with them.

I am friends with and have supplied some of my no longer essential stuff to a few local train show only vendors.  Even though they still do it, they note that the attendance and buying at these train shows is lower than 20 years ago, much like I presume LHS traffic is generally down.  That might explain parking and entry fees being required.  I mean, if vendors aren't selling as much, it is probably hard to raise the rates for tables.

I am guessing that the typical modeler really prefers new stuff, at the more highly discounted retail operations that also go to train shows.  And, in general, it is nice to see new vendors, like Yankee Dabbler, Spring Creek, and Challenger N scale.  When mfgs' come to shows there is an added level of interest at least to my little crowd.  But, as noted, finding deals at shows and on EBay is a reality for some, maybe most, in continuing to pursue the hobby.  But the real deals mean missing the Cowboys......which in these parts often lose out.

[Ed Kapuscinski]

As for hunting bargains, at least around here, we wait until Sunday, especially if traffic is slow because the Cowboys are on TV, making attendance low and slow.  As mentioned pricing gets very realistic near the end of the show with those types of vendors because they hate to haul the same amount of "treasure" as they brought with them.

It's funny, the two best times to score real deals are when the show first opens and right before it closes. The first because "I don't want to sit on this all weekend" and the second "I don't want to have to take this home with me".

[squirrelhunter]

It's funny, the two best times to score real deals are when the show first opens and right before it closes. The first because "I don't want to sit on this all weekend" and the second "I don't want to have to take this home with me".

Actually it's less that folks who can get in before the public get better deals and more thry get to pick through the bettsr stuff!

[Scottl]

I can't help but notice the contrast between this thread and another where people are falling over themselves to buy $250 rivet counter locomotives. https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?topic=56798.0;topicseen

[John]

Actually it's less that folks who can get in before the public get better deals and more thry get to pick through the bettsr stuff!

I always take a tour of the venue before opening and occasionally grab a deal ..  its a perk of setting up our layout for the public to see ..

[Englewood]

I can't help but notice the contrast between this thread and another where people are falling over themselves to buy $250 rivet counter locomotives. https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?topic=56798.0;topicseen

This.

[squirrelhunter]

I always take a tour of the venue before opening and occasionally grab a deal ..  its a perk of setting up our layout for the public to see ..

Agreed!