Author Topic: Weekend Update 8/7/22  (Read 6568 times)

0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

Maletrain

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 3548
  • Respect: +607
Re: Weekend Update 8/7/22
« Reply #60 on: August 08, 2022, 10:03:26 AM »
+1
Never mind the economics, or demographics, how do you run a train from Denver, CO to Green River, UT at 220 mph?  A 200-mile long tunnel? 

Outside the major corridors, my opinion is that we should try for an average speed (not top speed, average speed) of about 75 mph.  That's as fast as one can legally drive in most states, and would be competitive with driving.  No need to stop for the night, and less stressful.  Obviously, some places one can't do that (Marias Pass, MT?), but there are a lot of places where 100 mph would be practical (most of eastern Montana and North Dakota?), so it would work for long-distance trains.

A 100-mph passenger train wouldn't mix well with slow coal drags, but would do fine on the same track as 70+mph freights, not uncommon on the western routes.

I don't think trains will ever compete with planes for long-distance business travel, because time is the driving factor for businesses.  But, I think that auto-trains could compete well for leisure travel, where cost, convenience and the ability to take along a carload of stuff is a big advantage, especially when traveling with kids.

If I could pack my 4WD with gear, put it on a train for Livingston, MT, and then travel around Yellowstone, Glacier, etc. then get it and me back on the train and head home, I would greatly prefer that to flying and renting or driving 2000 miles each way (again).

Ed Kapuscinski

  • Global Moderator
  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 24767
  • Head Kino
  • Respect: +9285
    • Conrail 1285
Re: Weekend Update 8/7/22
« Reply #61 on: August 08, 2022, 10:18:19 AM »
+1
Pretty much finished up the body of Chicago North Shore and Milwaukee car #154.  Shapeways body on a Tomytec TM-21 mech.  Need to add lights and perhaps an encoder at some point.  This is based on a photograph of 154 when it ran at the Ohio Railway Museum in Worthington, Oh in the 1970's.  Tamiya paints (NATO black for the roof), MTL Z couplers.  Need to trim off the air hoses.   Greeting card protective plastic for windows.  Spent many hours in this car.  Right off the south end of the Ohio State Rt 161 bridge, the motorman would kick it and in a few seconds it would be doing 50-60 mph.




That's beautiful Bob!

Ed Kapuscinski

  • Global Moderator
  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 24767
  • Head Kino
  • Respect: +9285
    • Conrail 1285
Re: Weekend Update 8/7/22
« Reply #62 on: August 08, 2022, 10:30:01 AM »
+4
I don't think trains will ever compete with planes for long-distance business travel, because time is the driving factor for businesses.  But, I think that auto-trains could compete well for leisure travel, where cost, convenience and the ability to take along a carload of stuff is a big advantage, especially when traveling with kids.

I don't know when it comes to business travel. Sure, time is one factor, but it's not just time between places. It's also "time that can be spent working". It's one of the reasons why we used to take the train to DC from Baltimore even though we could drive "cheaper". When you're driving, you're driving, even if you're a passenger. There's no down time. No focus time. Just driving.

Flying is even worse.

Lets say you need to go from DC to Albany NY. Sure, that'd be a nice quick hour (or so) long flight. Right?

But it's full of time you can't be doing anything other than traveling.
1 hour to the airport  - Driving, parking, shuttles, etc...
2 hours inside the airport  - TSA, getting to the gate, finding a seat at the departure lounge, lining up to board, boarding, etc...)
1 hour flight time - No time to get your laptop out and do anything productive on such a short flight
1 hour at the destination airport - Getting from the gate to transportation, renting your car, etc...

All of a sudden, that 1 hour flight is actually five hours dedicated to JUST traveling.

Meanwhile, I think it was a five hour train ride.
.75 hour to the station and onto the train - no TSA, no huge airport terminal, no parking issues
5 hours of productive work time on the train
.25 from the more convenient station to your destination

I'd tell my people to take the train every time.

ednadolski

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 4816
  • Respect: +1759
Re: Weekend Update 8/7/22
« Reply #63 on: August 08, 2022, 11:30:52 AM »
+1
All of a sudden, that 1 hour flight is actually five hours dedicated to JUST traveling.

And that is for a direct flight with no connections and no delays.  It can become an all-day thing, and leaves you wiped out by the time you get to your destination.

That's a key reason why whenever my wife & I travel for a cruise, we plan to fly/arrive the day before the ship departs.


5 hours of productive work time on the train

It's great if you can be productive; still tho that's a long time to be stuck in a seat.   My back would not be very happy coming out of that.

Ed

Ed Kapuscinski

  • Global Moderator
  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 24767
  • Head Kino
  • Respect: +9285
    • Conrail 1285
Re: Weekend Update 8/7/22
« Reply #64 on: August 08, 2022, 11:53:26 AM »
+2
It's great if you can be productive; still tho that's a long time to be stuck in a seat.   My back would not be very happy coming out of that.

Oh yeah, definitely.

But that's ANOTHER great thing about business rail travel: you can get up and walk around. Grab some coffee, use an actual full size bathroom that doesn't charge you for TP, etc...

LIRR

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 1285
  • Respect: +1806
Re: Weekend Update 8/7/22
« Reply #65 on: August 08, 2022, 12:32:44 PM »
+4
I recently rode Amtrak. The 5-hour ride would have been a 4-1/2 hour drive. Flying wasn't an option. Didn't need a car when I got there, if I did then driving would've been the way to go. What I liked about the train vis-a-vis flying was no TSA security theatre and the seat was much wider and I had twice the leg room.


Pomperaugrr

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 1454
  • Respect: +1199
Re: Weekend Update 8/7/22
« Reply #66 on: August 08, 2022, 12:35:55 PM »
+13
I finally made some time to add some color and road markings to the New Milford area this weekend.

There are a few more shots in my Layout Engineering Report.   https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?topic=54066.msg747962#msg747962

[ Guests cannot view attachments ] [ Guests cannot view attachments ]

chuck geiger

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 3261
  • Gender: Male
  • Las Piedras Railroad - Destination Desert
  • Respect: +2876
Re: Weekend Update 8/7/22
« Reply #67 on: August 08, 2022, 01:06:15 PM »
+1
I don't know when it comes to business travel. Sure, time is one factor, but it's not just time between places. It's also "time that can be spent working". It's one of the reasons why we used to take the train to DC from Baltimore even though we could drive "cheaper". When you're driving, you're driving, even if you're a passenger. There's no down time. No focus time. Just driving.

Flying is even worse.

Lets say you need to go from DC to Albany NY. Sure, that'd be a nice quick hour (or so) long flight. Right?

But it's full of time you can't be doing anything other than traveling.
1 hour to the airport  - Driving, parking, shuttles, etc...
2 hours inside the airport  - TSA, getting to the gate, finding a seat at the departure lounge, lining up to board, boarding, etc...)
1 hour flight time - No time to get your laptop out and do anything productive on such a short flight
1 hour at the destination airport - Getting from the gate to transportation, renting your car, etc...

All of a sudden, that 1 hour flight is actually five hours dedicated to JUST traveling.

Meanwhile, I think it was a five hour train ride.
.75 hour to the station and onto the train - no TSA, no huge airport terminal, no parking issues
5 hours of productive work time on the train
.25 from the more convenient station to your destination

I'd tell my people to take the train every time.

Mythbusters did a BUSTER about flying or driving from Oakland To Hollywood Burbank. Driving was actually
15 minutes earlier than flight due to all of the airport hassle.
Chuck Geiger
provencountrypd@gmail.com



nickelplate759

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 3343
  • Respect: +1041
Re: Weekend Update 8/7/22
« Reply #68 on: August 08, 2022, 02:03:29 PM »
+2
in the early 1990s my job required me to travel several days a week, usually day-trips across the midwestern US.  I quickly learned that any trip that could be done in 4 hours or less on the ground (whether by rail or by car) was not worth going to the airport.  That was when you could arrive at the airport 30 minutes before your flight and comfortably make your flight.
George
NKPH&TS #3628

I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that.

MK

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 4072
  • Respect: +777
Re: Weekend Update 8/7/22
« Reply #69 on: August 08, 2022, 03:49:46 PM »
+2
I don't know when it comes to business travel. Sure, time is one factor, but it's not just time between places. It's also "time that can be spent working". It's one of the reasons why we used to take the train to DC from Baltimore even though we could drive "cheaper". When you're driving, you're driving, even if you're a passenger. There's no down time. No focus time. Just driving.

Flying is even worse.

Lets say you need to go from DC to Albany NY. Sure, that'd be a nice quick hour (or so) long flight. Right?

But it's full of time you can't be doing anything other than traveling.
1 hour to the airport  - Driving, parking, shuttles, etc...
2 hours inside the airport  - TSA, getting to the gate, finding a seat at the departure lounge, lining up to board, boarding, etc...)
1 hour flight time - No time to get your laptop out and do anything productive on such a short flight
1 hour at the destination airport - Getting from the gate to transportation, renting your car, etc...

All of a sudden, that 1 hour flight is actually five hours dedicated to JUST traveling.

Meanwhile, I think it was a five hour train ride.
.75 hour to the station and onto the train - no TSA, no huge airport terminal, no parking issues
5 hours of productive work time on the train
.25 from the more convenient station to your destination

I'd tell my people to take the train every time.

AND...if you are a consultant like I was for a few years, if you're not working, you're not billing.  So in Ed's scenario above, I can only bill 1 hour if flying and 5 hours if training.  Traveling is on your time as a consultant.

TiogaTracks

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 153
  • Respect: +422
Re: Weekend Update 8/7/22
« Reply #70 on: August 08, 2022, 03:50:07 PM »
0
Spent many hours in this car.  Right off the south end of the Ohio State Rt 161 bridge, the motorman would kick it and in a few seconds it would be doing 50-60 mph.



Great work in that beautiful North Shore car, Bob!  And thanks for sharing the memory of the real thing.  Electric railways sure leave strong memories.

I’m so glad to see N-scale traction modeling grow.  The lack of good and easy to build trolleys and interurbans helped push me over to G-scale, but with the rise of 3D printing, I think the tables have finally turned.

-Steven
Wellsville Addison & Galeton RR in 1:29
Still dabbling in N scale
Restoring a full size 1951 Brill bus

Ed Kapuscinski

  • Global Moderator
  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 24767
  • Head Kino
  • Respect: +9285
    • Conrail 1285
Re: Weekend Update 8/7/22
« Reply #71 on: August 08, 2022, 04:21:07 PM »
+1
AND...if you are a consultant like I was for a few years, if you're not working, you're not billing.  So in Ed's scenario above, I can only bill 1 hour if flying and 5 hours if training.  Traveling is on your time as a consultant.

Yeah. Well. Kinda. It depends on the contract... but yes, exactly.

sd45elect2000

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 1101
  • Respect: +452
Re: Weekend Update 8/7/22
« Reply #72 on: August 08, 2022, 04:28:06 PM »
+11
[ Guests cannot view attachments ]

This is the 757 this is the first interurban car I rode on and later operated at East Troy Wisconsin. I love them !

Randy

ncbqguy

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 624
  • Gender: Male
  • Respect: +386
Re: Weekend Update 8/7/22
« Reply #73 on: August 08, 2022, 05:54:19 PM »
+2
I went to eighth grade and high school in Delafield, Wis.   I could get a weekend at home in Brookfield, Ill. as long as my grades were good.  I’d bum a ride after classes on Friday from one of the instructors to Waukesha where I could catch a bus into Milwaukee.   
North Shore to Chicago….frequent 90 minute service.   If I was lucky I could catch an Electroliner and enjoy an Electroburger as well!   Arrival near the Greyhound Terminal where I could catch a Bluebird Coach Lines bus to less than a 100 feet from my house.  Total travel time…less than five hours….during “rush hour”.   Driving time…about the same (but no car).  Flight time today…same but $$$ limo to and from the airports.
Pre-1940 I could have walked to the interurban in Delafield and cut another hour off the trip.
We’ll spend millions on high speed rail and still not recreate the door to door times that were commonplace with 1910 technology!
Charlie Vlk

sd45elect2000

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 1101
  • Respect: +452
Re: Weekend Update 8/7/22
« Reply #74 on: August 08, 2022, 06:36:42 PM »
+9
The special trains from St. John’s military academy was served from Chicago via the North Shore line with one seat service to Delafield

[ Guests cannot view attachments ]

This could be a Chicago-Delafield train