Which Pennsylvania Caboose is Correct?

[CBQ Fan]

I have a set of Kato PA/PB units.  I like distinctive cabooses and I need to fill out an order. Which one of the in stock Bowser cabooses would be the most realistic match for the motive power?

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[Lemosteam]

Small lettering, with trainphone (wire and stanchions on roof).  No Keystone or Shadow Keystone.

Most wer assigned to regions, so if that does not matter any above will do.

[brokemoto]

Did the Penn use PAs on freight?  I guess that it might have happened if no freight power were available or perhaps it was trying to find grunge work for them toward the end of their careers.

Those with the antennae are the most correct, although you can buy the kit separately and install the antenna yourself.  It is not a difficult task.

Your link went to HO freight cars, but I looked up the Penn cabooses that MBK had. 

Almost anything with the Roman font numbers will work.  The early schemes (without the Keystone herald) will work as there were many still in that paint scheme in 1949 when the PAs first arrived.

The shadow Keystone first appeared 1955/56/57, I forget exactly what year.  The PAs lasted until the early 1960s on most roads (SP and D&H were exceptions).  The shadow Keystone scheme should be acceptable.

I would shy from the Gothic/sans serif numbers, the later scheme.  That appeared early or mid 1960s.  I do not kn ow how long Penn kept its PAs, but none did make it to PC.  If any were around in 1966, they never were re-numbered.  NYCS had retired its PAs by the early 1960s  Penn's could not have been far behind that.

[Dave V]

I have a set of Kato PA/PB units.  I like distinctive cabooses and I need to fill out an order. Which one of the in stock Bowser cabooses would be the most realistic match for the motive power?

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OK, so either the N5 or N5C cabin cars will work.  The schemes you want will be the ones without a keystone to match the Kato paint scheme.  I'd get one with the Trainphone antenna (distinctive and accurate).  In the late 40s, the PRR used DGLE (Brunswick Green) with 5 stripes on its passenger equipment (like the Kato scheme).  By the time the so-called Shadow Keystone scheme (easily identified by the keystone with the shadow!) was introduced in 1954, passenger units had mostly been repainted into Tuscan red.  From 1954 afterward most passenger units were not only Tuscan but lost their five pin stripes in favor of one wide single stripe.  In 1960, the "Plain Keystone" scheme came along with--you guessed it--a shadowless keystone and plain, sans-serif lettering.

One caveat to all of this.  Alco PAs did end up in freight service on the PRR, but not until after most ended up in Tuscan paint.  Some where found working the coal mine branches out of Cresson.  That said, if you're doing a PA downrated to freight service you could probably get away with one of the shadow keystone cabin cars (that's how we say "caboose" in Pennsy).  With a system as huge as Pennsy we never say never, and while it was the self-anointed "Standard Railroad of the World," exceptions did occur with alarming frequency, and an Also PA set could have remained DGLE quite well into the 50s.


Hope this helps!

[CBQ Fan]

OK, so either the N5 or N5C cabin cars will work.  The schemes you want will be the ones without a keystone to match the Kato paint scheme.  I'd get one with the Trainphone antenna (distinctive and accurate).  In the late 40s, the PRR used DGLE (Brunswick Green) with 5 stripes on its passenger equipment (like the Kato scheme).  By the time the so-called Shadow Keystone scheme (easily identified by the keystone with the shadow!) was introduced in 1954, passenger units had mostly been repainted into Tuscan red.  From 1954 afterward most passenger units were not only Tuscan but lost their five pin stripes in favor of one wide single stripe.  In 1960, the "Plain Keystone" scheme came along with--you guessed it--a shadowless keystone and plain, sans-serif lettering.

One caveat to all of this.  Alco PAs did end up in freight service on the PRR, but not until after most ended up in Tuscan paint.  Some where found working the coal mine branches out of Cresson.  That said, if you're doing a PA downrated to freight service you could probably get away with one of the shadow keystone cabin cars (that's how we say "caboose" in Pennsy).  With a system as huge as Pennsy we never say never, and while it was the self-anointed "Standard Railroad of the World," exceptions did occur with alarming frequency, and an Also PA set could have remained DGLE quite well into the 50s.


Hope this helps!

Great information Dave!  Thank you.  I had to translate waycar into caboose, Q vernacular!  Lol. I had thought the PA units went to freight sooner than later and most retailed the DGLE scheme, but it appears I was a bit off. I now wonder if the Broadway Limited passenger cars would be a better fit for the locos?

[Dave V]

I’m not at home right now but later I can check my Pennsy Diesel Years books.  Some of those PAs may have gone to freight service in DGLE. Also, I want to say that the ones that were repainted into Tuscan retained the 5 pinstripes.  I don’t recall seeing a PA in Tuscan with a single wide stripe.  Single narrow (line the freight scheme) maybe…. I’ll have to check. Now I’m confused myself!

[CBQ Fan]

Any info you can share will be helpful!  I have this loco set from way back in the day pulling Kato 4 packs of Budd passenger cars and then the first BL run. With the last run I picked up the 4 car expansion pack and the appropriate E8’s to pull it. T would be cool to have something close to pull behind them. Other than my half dozen ATSF PA’s these are the only other PA’s I have.

[Point353]

OK, so either the N5 or N5C cabin cars will work.  The schemes you want will be the ones without a keystone to match the Kato paint scheme.  I'd get one with the Trainphone antenna (distinctive and accurate).  In the late 40s, the PRR used DGLE (Brunswick Green) with 5 stripes on its passenger equipment (like the Kato scheme).  By the time the so-called Shadow Keystone scheme (easily identified by the keystone with the shadow!) was introduced in 1954, passenger units had mostly been repainted into Tuscan red.  From 1954 afterward most passenger units were not only Tuscan but lost their five pin stripes in favor of one wide single stripe.  In 1960, the "Plain Keystone" scheme came along with--you guessed it--a shadowless keystone and plain, sans-serif lettering.

One caveat to all of this.  Alco PAs did end up in freight service on the PRR, but not until after most ended up in Tuscan paint.  Some where found working the coal mine branches out of Cresson.  That said, if you're doing a PA downrated to freight service you could probably get away with one of the shadow keystone cabin cars (that's how we say "caboose" in Pennsy).  With a system as huge as Pennsy we never say never, and while it was the self-anointed "Standard Railroad of the World," exceptions did occur with alarming frequency, and an Also PA set could have remained DGLE quite well into the 50s.

While still in DGLE paint, might the PAs have been assigned to mail and express trains, and would such trains have had a caboose/cabin car?

[CBQ Fan]

One of the Bowser cabooses is labeled for REA interestingly enough.

[dougnelson]

PA's converted to freight service were generally repainted DGLE single stripe freight scheme, however, I have seen photos of PA's in fading Tuscan 5-stripe, sometimes teamed with a DGLE single stripe unit.  On the PRR there are no cabooses, only cabin cars.  Most PA's in freight service occurred mid-1950s to early 1960s.  Any Bowser cabin car (N5 or N5c) with Shadow Keystone or later schemes (simple keystone) could be plausible with PA's in freight service.  PA's in freight service were often seen around Philadelphia, so one lettered for Philadelphia Region could also be appropriate.

[CBQ Fan]

PA's converted to freight service were generally repainted DGLE single stripe freight scheme, however, I have seen photos of PA's in fading Tuscan 5-stripe, sometimes teamed with a DGLE single stripe unit.  On the PRR there are no cabooses, only cabin cars.  Most PA's in freight service occurred mid-1950s to early 1960s.  Any Bowser cabin car (N5 or N5c) with Shadow Keystone or later schemes (simple keystone) could be plausible with PA's in freight service.  PA's in freight service were often seen around Philadelphia, so one lettered for Philadelphia Region could also be appropriate.

More great information!  I will have to stretch it with the 5 stripe DGLE but I would like a cabin car that doesn’t blow the whole thing out of the water.

[CBQ Fan]

What is up with the yellow cupola?

[Ed Kapuscinski]

What is up with the yellow cupola?

It indicated "east west pool service".

This is more than you probably wanted to know, but:
https://jbritton.pennsyrr.com/index.php/tpm/latest-articles-blog/115-steel-cabin-car-painting-lettering

It looks cool but you probably don't want one.

Oh, also, this is subjective, but I feel that the Bowser N5 is a better looking model than the N5C. There's something about the N5C cupola that just doesn't look "right" to me (it's been the subject of extensive discussion, and I forget the final outcome).

[Point353]

Any info you can share will be helpful!  I have this loco set from way back in the day pulling Kato 4 packs of Budd passenger cars and then the first BL run. With the last run I picked up the 4 car expansion pack and the appropriate E8’s to pull it. T would be cool to have something close to pull behind them.

As for other passenger cars, there are the various MTL heavyweight cars, the BLI P70 coaches, and the old IM/Centralia P85 coaches.

[Ed Kapuscinski]

As for other passenger cars, there are the various MTL heavyweight cars, the BLI P70 coaches, and the old IM/Centralia P85 coaches.

In fact... if you don't care about being super accurate and just want something close:
https://micro-trains.com/index.php?route=product/product&search=mail&description=true&product_id=4002