More exciting news about Bachmann K4

[Dave V]

(((((((((((((YAWN))))))))))))))


Long live the midwest RR's,, yeah so what they are gone,,but still better than pennsy.


wyt

Except that Pennsy was as much a Midwestern road as an Eastern one...   

K4s could be found on the head end of trains in Ohio, Indiana, Illinois, Michigan, and into St Louis and Chicago.  So there's that...

[Dave V]

Yeah right, 

I assume it was me that got the thread locked, since I was the one scolded for being "non-constructive". So my apologies to those involved with the thread, I had no intent on getting the thread locked.  All I did was re-tweet and echo the sentiment of the moderator and mimic Bachmann's attitude of disdain. Whatever..., no worries, at the end of the day we're only talking about toys, expensive toys, but toys nonetheless. Ah, first world problems. 

Glad to hear that the engine ran well, there is hope. 

 

OK, so here's the deal...  I expressed disappointment in the answer the rep gave Eric.

You then said:

If this engine turns out to be a good runner it will be by shear dumb luck,  , like a blind squirrel finding a nut. Ugh!!

Not sure how you view that as echoing my sentiment...or how the choice of whistles impacts running performance...or why we need to compare the manufacturer to a blind squirrel.  I hope this makes sense.  That's the sort of negativity, not just toward Bachmann, but toward almost all of our manufacturers, that we're trying to reduce.  For the record, I didn't lock the thread.

I think in general I'm just extremely disappointed that this engine, which I've been wanting since my switch to N in 2002, and for which so many other Pennsy N scalers have waited for so much longer than that, is met with so much hostility.  Now, if we have it in hand and it turns out to be a turd, I won't stand in anyone's way for expressing that.  But the fact is, all we have is a video (which shows smooth running but an incorrect whistle) and testimony from the one non-Bachmann person to run it (who also said it's a smooth runner).  All this suggests to me it deserves a fair chance, Pennsy or not, Bachmann or not.

Now back to constructive discussion...

[victor miranda]

I created this post after someone asked about the as delivered scheme.

I didn't get the chance to post because I was distracted.

the photo shows a lot of stripes, I'll grant that.
I noticed a few details are different because this is a version of the K4s I like.



I think of this as 'as delivered.'  square headlamp, piston rod covers, wood pilot, and low tender riding on dolphin trucks.

[towl1996]

Now back to constructive discussion...

Yep, 'nuff said. Time to move on. 

[Mark5]

Victor, I imagine that you know that 1737 was the prototype built in 1914.

I'm guessin the tender and other details changed by the time they went into production in 1917.

Mark

[victor miranda]

as delivered...

From all I know and that is something I consider limited,
this loco may be a unique build. 

and from the same knowledge base I think the paint scheme was just as unique.

I have a recollection that the loco was not unique in it features
the piston rod covers were common until 1924.
and the tenders as pictured were used until the same time frame.

one reason I think the loco pictured was unique is the paint pictured.
from the photos it does not seem on the other locos with other features.
... the round headlamp locos do not seem to have that paint.

If I get the time to night I'll poke through my PRR book.

victor

[eric220]

Here's a couple of production models from the late '20s.  First, 5475 from 1926:



Next, 5495 from 1928, one of the last built.



The pinstripes on the wheels and tires are clearly visible, as is the keystone number plate.

And I'll see you all when the models come out.

[Dave V]

Remember, Pennsy built or bought 425 of these over a 14-year period, so there were differences even among the as-built configurations and paint.

[victor miranda]

and I'll see you all when the models come out ?


the pinstripes version is single on the tender and that is what I remember.
the whitewall version with, it looks like triple stripes, is also what I remember.

and they are both different from the first k4....

In my search of the 'net for photos most are from the '30s and later.

the dolphin tender trucks are what I am looking to find.
as I recall they came off the k4s along with the piston rod covers.
I once read that k4s were given a heavy shopping every 5 years

so by 1922 all the early versions would have been... standardized.

in n-scale it is ALL details.

victor

[victor miranda]

well....
here is a picture.
square headlamp, slat pilot, piston rod covers and a low tender with dolphin trucks.

can't tell the road number, and the photo is labeled k45154
if you can see pin stripes you are doing better than me...

photo
http://prrsteam.pennsyrr.com/images/k45154.jpg

[peteski]

Dr. Dave:  I think (that possibly due to your bias towards PRR and K4) you might not be seeing things clearly.  The negativity you see is not really directed towards the new and exciting K4 - it is towards Bachmann and their product design and quality in general.  I would bet you dollars to donuts that you would see the same negativity shown in a thread for any new Bachmann-made N scale steam loco.

I have a poor opinion about Bachmann's steam locos in general (when compared to other manufacturer's models), but I have no stake in the K4.  But Victor is a good example of what I'm talking about.  He is a big fan of PRR and it seems that he would like to get at least one K4.  He is also highly regarded tinkerer, and analyst and evaluator of N scale steam mechanism design.  If you look at his K4-related posts in the locked thread, he clearly shows his disdain for Bachmann and their design and production methods. I don't think he is being negative - he is stating proven facts and he is just being a realist.


Oh, Ernie told me that the Bachmann video was taken about 3 weeks ago.  That would be in the beginning of August.

[Ed Kapuscinski]

Pete, we know you're not a Bachmann fan, but you keep beating the same dead horse.

I think what Dave was saying was to give it a rest. The excessive dead horse beating that happens around here (you're not the only person, and I know I am guilty myself at times) is what gets this place a reputation for being a bunch of assholes.

I love The Railwire. I've made some wonderful friends through it. And I hate it being known as "that forum full of assholes".

I'm working hard to not "be that guy" myself, so I'm hoping that you (and everyone else, because you and I are far from the only culprits) would take a minute before firing off posts that simply rehash the same criticisms that have already been leveled and think if they really add anything to the conversation.

[peteski]

Pete, we know you're not a Bachmann fan, but you keep beating the same dead horse.

I think what Dave was saying was to give it a rest. The excessive dead horse beating that happens around here (you're not the only person, and I know I am guilty myself at times) is what gets this place a reputation for being a bunch of assholes.

Well Ed, I'm in a recovering stage - as you can see I started this thread myself, on a very positive note. 

[eric220]

and I'll see you all when the models come out ?

Allow me to rephrase. My patience for the nonsense related this subject has run out. (Mostly from other forums.) I'm bowing out until I have one on my layout.

[victor miranda]

Hi eric220,

now that you said it a different way, your sentence makes perfect sense. (interesting....)

Hi peteski,

I appreciate the kind words.  thanks.

when emotions are rashified ( like poision ivy...)
things take a long time to calm down.

if my reading of Mr. Kapuscinski is correct, he and the other moderators
want that we keep the discourse out of ... bashing or vicious or hateful range.

I am not able to see the line he describes...
so I offer the advice that for a few days(weeks, months, years)
try to steer clear of the debateable ideas.

I see as a problem that such a thread will become and advertisement for the product under discussion
as opposed to what a debate might be.

If you want to chase some fun while we wait for the loco to arrive.
we can find photos of the PRR k4s and get to know how they look.

I find it easy to see where the k4s and the E6s share many many parts.

victor