How Good Are Walthers Cornerstone Kits?

[Rossford Yard]

Biggest problem I can see with the Cornerstone kits is that they don't carry over more of the HO kits to N scale even though they know there is a large market for them.

And we know this better than model railroad industry folks because..........?

We know from some posts over the years by smaller mfgs who can say such things that N scale structures and the like sell no more than 25-40% of what sells in HO.  (Rolling stock, like IM covered hoppers sell almost equally, due to N Trak and longer unit trains)

So, if HO sells just above the breakeven point, how can they justify making it in N, even with some design savings?

So, while I agree with you that there were some great HO Cornerstone kits that I would have made use of in N, I am not prepared to say the market in N is there for them.  If pressed, I would probably strongly agree with Walthers in any decision they made vs. production or not in N.  I mean, they haven't stayed in biz since what 1940? by being dumb about their industry.

Sorry to have turned a simple question into another Walthers bash by trying to do just the opposite! (Yes, I should have seen it coming....)

Back on topic - yeah the oil rigs were hard to build, the nature of a lot of extra little detail parts.  4 walls is always easier.  On the other hand, it was way easier than the old Plastruct Oil Refinery, so its hard to call it hard to build.

[Denver Road Doug]

I too appreciate what Walthers has brought to the table.   I've only built a couple of their kits but the experience was mostly good.

My tip would be on the doubletrack bridge.   The deck beams go together via a series of slots cut into the beams.   MAKE SURE you file those slots to the point where they fit together fairly loosely, else the bridge will bow terribly.   I would also assemble the deck and then make sure it is good and flat and really weight it down for a bit, then glue it and weight it down again while it dries, and I mean like overnight or longer both times.  It is a nice looking bridge but that bow really makes it a challenge to use.

[Rich_S]

I heard that about the Medusa Cement plant kit. Looks like I'll avoid that one.

Take your time building the kits. A little patients and care are all that are needed.

Vulcan MFG.



Medusa Cement.



ADM Grain Elevator has some seam issues.



New River Mining.

[Dave Schneider]

Kiz,

One thing to note about the availability of Walther's kits. The majority of them go out of stock over time, but most have have multiple reruns. Some never seem to see the light of day (like the large oil tanks). They also do some weird stuff like deeply discount the kits soon after resupply. I remember a time when the Superior Paper kit was out of stock for a long time, and eBay bids were close to $100. They came back into stock, and very shortly they  had them on clearance for half price. Kinda kills the shops who sell at MSRP, but that is a different topic and let's not go there.

Best wishes, Dave

[Catt]

I'm not bashing Walthers,but it seems rather dumb not to do the kits in both scales when there are a lot of N scalers  that would buy these kits if they were made.

[Dave V]

This is what I got out of the grain elevator with a lot of work...  Nothing too stellar...



But, once on the layout, it did okay.



I second the farm supply kit being awesome.  I loved it.  I may use it again in another incarnation if I do Huntingdon.

[peteski]

I'm not bashing Walthers,but it seems rather dumb not to do the kits in both scales when there are a lot of N scalers  that would buy these kits if they were made.

As shown time and time again, Walthers management seems to disagree with your assessment. 

[peteski]

I'm surprised that Medusa Cement is being dissed here. Until it was reissued couple of years ago, that kit used to fetch ridiculously high prices on eBay!

While maybe not the easiest to assemble (the silos), it is a very decent kit.  Here is one assembled by my friend. I did the ladder and other railings (in brass).  The ladder and pipes hide the vertical seams on the silos.

[PAL_Houston]

I generally concur with the prior positive comments.  I built (part of) the paper mill, making some modifications along the way, to pass for my substitute Kable Printing plant:



I strongly recommend reinforcing the corners, especially if you kit-bash.  This will help your structures better withstand periodically handling them as you work to improve your layout, (or if you need to move them in order to re-rail those cars you accidentally knocked off the tracks because you forgot you left them inside for loading.  Don't ask me how I know these things.  )

[Roger Holmes]

Walthers HO Pier kitbashed into N scale.





N scale Blast furnace with scenery in progress.



Sunrise Mill converted to a Dairy.



A combination of N scale hoist and walls from an HO kit yield the Rolling Mill.  Vulcan (now Canul) in the foreground and Brach's and Geo Roberts Printing in the background on the right.





Finally, not kitbashing but Kit-smashing

[LV LOU]

 I've built a pile of them,I've even done 3-4 of the HO blast furnaces for friends/clubs.The bigger structures are tougher to put together,especially ones with large,cylindrical shapes,but that's to be expected..If you take your time,they're certainly no worse than any other kits,and all in all, eventually fit perfectly if you put the time into them....

[Rossford Yard]

I'm not bashing Walthers,but it seems rather dumb not to do the kits in both scales when there are a lot of N scalers  that would buy these kits if they were made.

Well, see my post above. I have no trouble believing that the economics of only 25-40% sales ratio of N to HO might make some of those projects infeasible in N.

A bit time LHS owner, who should know, once told me that Walthers re-ran their structure kits when 300 back orders had piled up.  Now, I don't know that they don't then run 5-600 or even 1,000 at that point, but given the percentage of layouts that reach the detailed scenery stage is less than 10%, its a low volume product compared to locos and cars.  (IM has sold 225K N scale covered hoppers, for instance, vs. 250K in HO, according to Frank at many presentations, probably due to NTrak unit trains being very, very long)

And, by some accounts, while a few of us here might have huge N scale layouts that can make use of multiple large industries kit bashed together, industry stats (and mfgs who come here) actually show that the large majority of N scalers use the smaller size of N scale to build...well, smaller layouts.  If there are only a third of HO scale in N, and they build ultra small layouts (3 x 6 or 18 SF) or NTrak modules at 8-12 SF, whereas there are more "serious" HO guys with large layouts, then N scale structures probably doesn't translate very well from HO sales. 

I wouldn't be surprised if Walthers actually were in the structures biz just to support the hobby and their customers (ie, the loco and rolling stock makers, among others) As mfg. and distributor, they do have a stake in layouts getting built, and one built in advantage of getting 60% of MSRP over just 45-50% as mfg.  Even so, allow 1,000 structures at .6 of MSRP of $70 - a total take of $42K, and maybe $4-8K of profit.

With numbers so small, and design/production costs of a new structure so comparatively large, I can see a slow selling HO structure being nixed in N pretty quickly if they upside is $8K!  Call me crazy, but I get the impression they know exactly what they are doing.  Maybe not always, as I am sure those discount pricing sales occur when somehow they get optimistic about what will sell, and need to get rid of stock.

[Rossford Yard]

Shorter version of above - I am glad to have the great numbers of Walthers N scale structures we do have, and have bought one or more of almost all of them over 25 years in N.......Would I like the 5-10 more that they could have made in N as well as HO?  I have always had big, urban themed N scale layouts (250 SF and up) and I am not sure I could have fit many more structures or industries on them!  So, even I might not have bought them.....

BTW, I wonder how the trend towards photo realistic backdrops will affect the structures side of the biz?  Obviously, we all will need a few 3D structures, but such great strides have been made, I can see the numbers in all scales going down, in favor of the photo backdrops......

[John]

I buy them, and use them for kitbashing

[mmagliaro]

Love them.

At one time or another, I've made use of the Freight Terminal, Red Wing Milling, Brach's Candy, Hardwood Furniture, G. Roberts Printing,
American Hardware, Union Station,  all with good results.  Easy to build and easy to kitbash into other buildings.
When cut down, they make great backdrop flat buildings.

The blast furnace took some work due to the cylinders and their seams, as other have mentioned.
The trick there is to glue up the cylinders really well with liquid cement, and then use strips of sandpaper to sand back and forth,
around the tank, to really get those seams clean, smooth, and invisible.  Yes, it can be done.  Then they look good.