Early intermodal NYC and Milw Flexi-Van now out

[Sokramiketes]

Hey Mike,

Do you know whether these ran on the Copper Country Limited north of Milwaukee? Various issues of the The Milwaukee Railroader had consist lists from the 1960s, and I remember some Flexi-Vans in the CCL having arrived in Milwaukee from Chicago. Wondering whether these were routinely switched out in Milwaukee or if they headed north. 

Best wishes, Dave

I'm going to guess not, only because I don't remember any reference to an unloading facility up north. 

[prbharris]

I don't remember any reference to an unloading facility up north.

One of the advantages that Milw and NYC quote was that they did not need major facilities for unloading- just a siding and a hard standing for the tractor units to back onto the trailer vans. Pictures of NYC loading shows no facility at all around the siding! Whether they ran north is another question, though.

Peter

Peter Harris
N Scale Kits
www.nscalekits.com

[jagged ben]

Anyone know if these cars were later rebuilt to VTTX flats for Trailer Train?

http://www.railcarphotos.com/Search.php?SearchAARType=P982&Search=Search

If so, I might get a car, but won't need any decals.

Wow, I've seen pictures of converted flexi-van cars from the '70s and '80s, but 2004?    I had no idea.

[randgust]

I posted another reply over on Trainboard, but essentially here's what you need to know - ATSF had 30 of them, both in original configuration and rebuilt without the turntables on them in 1972 for conventional container service.

http://www.qstation.org/SFTU_204378/

There's also four good pictures of them if you search for ATSF Ft-65 flatcars, including one shot done in 1981.

These cars showed up a LOT in the Super C; so did the Flexi-van containers with the side doors.   

[Dave Schneider]

I understand the issue of not needing a major unloading facility, but there must have been some locations that were a focus for use. The containers still needed (specialized?) trailers, and unlike today where container trailers are stacked everywhere like cordwood, that was not the case when these were developed. It seems likely that these were at least initially used on specific routes wherein allowances for unloading would be planned. Anybody have details on how these were used? It seems like mail service might be a natural, with containers hauled on the flats to regional centers, and then dispatched by truck to smaller towns/cities. Just speculating and I would be interested if anyone had info on how the Milwaukee Road used theirs.

Best wishes, Dave

[Sokramiketes]

I understand the issue of not needing a major unloading facility, but there must have been some locations that were a focus for use. The containers still needed (specialized?) trailers, and unlike today where container trailers are stacked everywhere like cordwood, that was not the case when these were developed. It seems likely that these were at least initially used on specific routes wherein allowances for unloading would be planned. Anybody have details on how these were used? It seems like mail service might be a natural, with containers hauled on the flats to regional centers, and then dispatched by truck to smaller towns/cities. Just speculating and I would be interested if anyone had info on how the Milwaukee Road used theirs.

Best wishes, Dave

Correct, while the facility didn't have to be much more than a flat surface by the tracks, it still had to be stocked with enough wheel bogies to attach to the trailer bodies when the cars arrived at the destination.  And that's what I meant, is I hadn't heard of Milwaukee stocking any locations with bogies up north.

Mail service was the primary use.

[Big4Man]

Ordered my first dozen! 

Now if I can find those Microscale decals I purchased for these about....... SEVEN YEARS AGO!! 

Thanks for finally bringing these out of the vapor mist Peter! 

[milw156]

Peter, I'm trying real hard to give you some money, but I still don't get a button to order the Milwaukee kits. Such a tease....Did my wife put you up to this???
Rick

[nkalanaga]

Baronjutter:  Most pre-doublestack containers moved on standard flatcars, usually with fixed or moveable pedestals on the deck.  If you have one of the MT 89 ft cars, those odd grooves along the sides of the deck, with the squarish sections at the ends, are the pedestal tracks.  The pedestals folded into the deck, where the "squarish marks" are, and could be raised and slid along the tracks.  They locked into the cross grooves, and the container sat on the pedestals.  Some had a raised side and end to form a bracket, other used the interbox connector holes in the container, but the idea was the same.  Dedicated container cars often had fixed pedestals, as they didn't need to clear trailer tires, but that also limited the sizes of containers they could carry.

Many people tend to think of the 89 ft flat as being either a piggyback or container car, but as long as it has both hitches and pedestals, there's no reason you can't have both a trailer and a container on the same car.  In the 70s that was an uncommon, but not unheard of, sight.

[prbharris]

These cars showed up a LOT in the Super C; so did the Flexi-van containers with the side doors.

Many thanks for that, Randy - as a result of interest and inquiries, we are going to have decals fior the Santa Fe Flexi-Van trailers too. However, it would be really helpful to have some numbers of possible contenders for the 'red' or the light blue Santa Fe color schemes.

You can see the SFTU 204378 from Randy's link. However two questions:

Is the red scheme the one to go with - or was the light blue scheme more common?
Can someone provide some additional running numbers for the trailers?

We should be able to post a page for the various trailer decals next week [we have decals for the early and later NYC, Milw, IC, Sou, States Marine and P&LE trailers - and now SF too!] If you want more info please PM or or contact me via the website.

Peter

Peter Harris
N Scale Kits
www.nscalekits.com

[prbharris]

I'm trying real hard to give you some money, but I still don't get a button to order the Milwaukee kits. Such a tease....Did my wife put you up to this?

I am desperate to prevent marital disharmony - apologies, Rick! The button is not clear, and I am sorry about this - I am trying to get a better layout.

The lower button is for  the Milw cars [but you also get PL&E and ISEX decals on the same sheet- hence the lack of calrity]

Peter

Peter Harris
N Scale Kits
www.nscalekits.com

[randgust]

You can see the SFTU 204378 from Randy's link. However two questions:

Is the red scheme the one to go with - or was the light blue scheme more common?
Can someone provide some additional running numbers for the trailers?

We should be able to post a page for the various trailer decals next week [we have decals for the early and later NYC, Milw, IC, Sou, States Marine and P&LE trailers - and now SF too!] If you want more info please PM or or contact me via the website.

Peter

Peter Harris
N Scale Kits
www.nscalekits.com

Microscale has the decals - not that you can't do them.   The red scheme was the standard up until about.... 1970 or so.  The small 'flying herald' with the wings was the next scheme in the early 70's, but I've never seen it on a side-door flexivan.

Microscale set is 60-291.   That's easy.  Getting a good side shot of the car for lettering is proving interesting.
http://www.microscale.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=MD&Product_Code=60-291&Product_Count=&Category_Code=

The Super C train era I'm modeling ('72) is about 40% PC/NYC Flexivan trailers, 50% ATSF trailers (about 50/50 between the two schemes, and 10% everything else.   Trainworx also has the right trailers but not in the right Flexivan/NYC scheme, not sure if I'm going to wait them out or start painting again.  http://www.train-worx.com/trailers-SantaFe.htm  (scroll to the bottom for the Flexivans).  They are pretty well done.

The Flexivans are really a signature of the early 70's Super C in any photos.  You look for the side doors down the side of the train and they are very noticeable.   Hopefully someday I'll find the story of 'why' the side doors and 'why' those were used so much, it must be something to do with the loading/unloading mail facilities and one or both ends.

The Super C was primarily a trailer operation, not a container train, but there's more than a few shots with the container flats in there, and those that are there are about 70% of that fleet of Flexivan flats.  So for me, this is just great news.

[milw156]

Thanks for the clarification Peter, I am in! Thanks for seeing this project thru! Skibbe just had his third child!!!!
Rick

[TrainCat2]

I thought Bob (Traincat) was doing those.



Jason

Still doing the -III and -IV Jason, but as fully RTR with TrainWorx Trailers.

[FrankCampagna]

Still doing the -III and -IV Jason, but as fully RTR with TrainWorx Trailers.

Ouch!!! (in a good way). Who needs to retire, anyway?