Author Topic: Cisco Bridges: a new layout concept  (Read 140462 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Scottl

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 4848
  • Respect: +1520
Re: Cisco Bridges: a new layout concept
« Reply #75 on: December 30, 2013, 03:51:45 PM »
0
Thanks!  I'm not sure why ballasted bridges are used either.  My thinking has been that it imparts some stability to the track and fire resistance, but I don't know for sure.  It probably lasts longer than wooden ties as well, so it might save on maintenance.

Scottl

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 4848
  • Respect: +1520
Re: Cisco Bridges: a new layout concept
« Reply #76 on: January 01, 2014, 08:31:54 AM »
0
I read the source you provided, which had a nice cross section of a ballasted steel deck as well:

"Ballasted Decks 

A ballasted deck (Figure 8-7) provides a better riding track. The track modulus is consistent on the dumps of the bridge as well as across the bridge. Thus, one is unlikely to have surface runoff problems on the bridge dumps. Surfacing and lining operations can continue across the bridge unimpeded. However, care must be exercised to maintain a permanent grade line in the vicinity of and over a ballasted deck bridge to be certain that excessive quantities of ballast are not accumulated on the bridge structure through track raises during successive reballasting operations.

Ballasted decks (Figure 8-8), irrespective of the type of bridge floor, afford a considerable measure of protection to the steel floor system against damage from derailed car wheels traveling across the bridge. Over roadways, vehicles and the public are protected from dropping ballast and material off of the cars."

Interesting read and a great source of information.  Thanks for posting the link.

Scottl

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 4848
  • Respect: +1520
Re: Cisco Bridges: a new layout concept
« Reply #77 on: January 01, 2014, 02:00:14 PM »
0
I'm working away at the maintenance walkways on the bridge.  These are 22-24" long on my version and are kind of historical leftovers as I cannot find evidence that there is ladder access to either side after 2011.  There was a ladder present on one side after the 1990 derailment, but that seems to have been removed.  Still, they are a key visual detail and I'm all for the details right now. 

The problem is those tiny little GMM industrial walkway parts that need to be mounted into long lengths.   I came up with a simple magnetic jig to hold these while I glue the parts together and to a 0.020 X 0.060" side sill.  To keep things square and accurate, I resorted to what else but Lego. The magnets I have for my containers fit perfectly into the little holes in the blocks, which conveniently have shallow inset shelves to hold them flush.  I mounted some 0.020 X 0040" strips to position the brass walkway 2/3 of the way down the side sill, but experiments showed I could glue a perfect flush right angle as well.



You can see here how it lines up the two ends and allows me to secure them and hold until the glue cures.



With this in place, work went fast and here is the final result



I'm pretty pleased with what a few bits of Lego could do to make this job easier!

Scottl

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 4848
  • Respect: +1520
Re: Cisco Bridges: a new layout concept
« Reply #78 on: January 05, 2014, 10:02:23 AM »
0
Waiting on etches now to finish the bridge, so I have turned my attention to the Cisco scene and trying to make the most of my limited space.   The layout design that emerged in Nov 2012 looks something like this, and I am focusing on building a 2'X4' mount for the bridge so that it is secure and can be moved later if the layout needs to be dismantled.  Ignore the 2.5' X 5' HCD outline, it is too big to be practical given I have limited space to work and store this module until it finds it's home in the new benchwork.




I started with a sheet of baltic birch plywood and started to build up a topographic layer cake with 0.75" foam.  It is all very rough and messy, but reveals some shortcomings in my original plan I need to deal with.



The elevations are essentially accurate here, the canyon and water level of the river are 10.5" below the rail level.   The scene is prototypically this tight and vertical, and the river is only marginally compressed.  As planned, the bridge crosses the river at a sharper angle, and this presents some issues for the scene, particularly the interaction with the CPR mainline.  The latter is cosmetic in this layout but I want it to be convincing and to be suitable as a photo prop on occasion.

Several issues have emerged:

1.  The cutoff that connects the CN and CP lines would have a grade of about 7% if completed as per the layout.  I'm not sure I want the cosmetics of this- again, I'm not worried about operation on the cutoff.
2.  The space where the CP line cuts under the high bridge is not geometrically correct.  Mocked up like this, it does not seem right to me.  I have put some scraps of track in there to give the elevation of the line but you will see in the original plan this was meant to extend the length of the 2 X 4 module.
3.  There is very little room in the layout for the bank of the river with the CPR mainline and the cutoff, so the ability to scenic behind it is limited.  I want to deal with this compromise as best I can.
4.  I'm really unhappy about the river configuration in the bottom left of the module.  It narrows the river too much and makes the long bridge seem rather unrealistically placed to my eye. 

Solutions?  I'm open to comments and ideas.  A few things I am contemplating are illustrated in the photograph.

A.  I'm contemplating having the CPR line and cutoff exit the scene earlier, ultimately minimizing the visual impact of this by strategically placed topography and trees (which I plan to be scale height).  The scraps of track give a sense of this configuration for the CPR line.  It would allow the crossing of the two lines to be at a more normal angle which is closer to the prototype.

B.  I'm thinking of widening the river in the bottom left of the module, as crudely illustrated by the orange painted board.  This would give the scene and the layout a more faithful rendition of the river and canyon up valley, at the expense of the CPR and cutoff lines.

C.  Following with B., I think I need to bring the left bank (true east) out more to give additional space for the approach bridge and the CPR line.  The area where this would happen is located in the photograph where I have a piece of paper at river level.  It could probably come out about 6" resulting in a sharper bend in the river in the larger layout, which is also more prototypical.

Comments are welcome.  It is a big scene that I want to get right, and the reality of the topography and making it work has me rethinking many aspects of this.

I think it will look pretty amazing if I get it right, but details, details, details  :)


Scottl

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 4848
  • Respect: +1520
Re: Cisco Bridges: a new layout concept
« Reply #79 on: January 11, 2014, 04:46:31 PM »
0
Shaping the landscape to make the scene work.  The plan view:



Looking up river:



From the CPR line across.  Still need to cut back more to make room for rock castings and the very short approach bridge on the far (west) bank:



Passing below on a raft  :D




Scottl

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 4848
  • Respect: +1520
Re: Cisco Bridges: a new layout concept
« Reply #80 on: January 19, 2014, 06:43:35 PM »
0
My glacial pace continues, but some progress on the bridge.  I was able to cut the foundation blocks from wood and begin work on shaping some foam board to make the prominent erosion protection structures on the river bank.  It is coming together nicely I think.  I also raised the topography above track level on the west bank in preparation of some rock work.  I pulled my collection of molds out and found some in rough shape.  Unfortunately, the masters are buried by half a meter of snow in my back yard, so I'll have to work with them.  I need to figure out a tinting formula for the dark rock at the site as well.

The wood foundation posts will be cut into two narrow pillars.  I had to glue two pieces together to get the complex shape of the prototype.



The east bank with erosion protection mostly fitted.  This area will be the main visual compromise as the geometry is different than the prototype slope.  Still fine tuning this.



The west bank, mostly all correct now, but the topography above the track seems a bit high.  Easier to cut away than add...



Sorry for the murky photos.  The lighting in the room is not great and I'm using my phone these days.  Thanks for following.

Scottl

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 4848
  • Respect: +1520
Re: Cisco Bridges: a new layout concept
« Reply #81 on: February 12, 2014, 08:12:39 PM »
0
More etching hawtness arrived from the UK including upgraded beam lacing with rivets, the custom bridge shoes and gusset plates.  There are even some communications conduit hangers that turned out nicely..  Now I can build the pillars on the approach bridge!  I'm starting to really enjoy scratch building.


Chris333

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 18398
  • Respect: +5671
Re: Cisco Bridges: a new layout concept
« Reply #82 on: February 12, 2014, 09:32:06 PM »
0
That is hot!  :drool:

Baronjutter

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 509
  • Respect: +11
Re: Cisco Bridges: a new layout concept
« Reply #83 on: February 12, 2014, 09:33:50 PM »
0
I've been thinking about trying to do photo-etching my self or look into getting a company to do it.  What are the costs like and who do you get to do it?  I assume there's a reason for ordering out of the UK ?

Scottl

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 4848
  • Respect: +1520
Re: Cisco Bridges: a new layout concept
« Reply #84 on: February 12, 2014, 09:44:16 PM »
0
I use http://www.ppdltd.com/page_1_intro.html on the recommendation of several people here.  The cost is quite reasonable, about $75 for a letter-sized brass and the service is very good.

M.C. Fujiwara

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 1344
  • I'm my own personal train-er.
  • Respect: +84
Re: Cisco Bridges: a new layout concept
« Reply #85 on: February 12, 2014, 09:46:26 PM »
0
Don't have the mad brass skillz meself yet, but I remember Chris333 saying something about PPD Ltd in Scotland, IIRM.
http://www.ppdltd.com/

They do things in A4 sheets.
M.C. Fujiwara
Silicon Valley Free-moN
http://sv-free-mon.org/

Chris333

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 18398
  • Respect: +5671
Re: Cisco Bridges: a new layout concept
« Reply #86 on: February 12, 2014, 10:03:18 PM »
0
They will do something postage stamp size if you want. Most places have a 12x24" min sheet. The advantage with them is no minimum. The more you make of your sheet the cheaper it is as well.

GaryHinshaw

  • Global Moderator
  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 6346
  • Respect: +1869
Re: Cisco Bridges: a new layout concept
« Reply #87 on: February 13, 2014, 09:14:39 AM »
0
I just saw a concert by a band called Fretless over the weekend.  Now I know where their frets are.   :D  :facepalm:

Looks really good Scott!

Scottl

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 4848
  • Respect: +1520
Re: Cisco Bridges: a new layout concept
« Reply #88 on: February 15, 2014, 03:58:31 PM »
0
Some progress- the short pillar mostly out of brass parts and a significant amount of CA.



I won't say putting this together was easy, but I am happy how it turned out.  The etched rivets really pop in person.

If I were to do another bridge, I now have a list of things not to do  :facepalm:.  Probably enough for an article, but everyone knows you can't publish negative results!

GaryHinshaw

  • Global Moderator
  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 6346
  • Respect: +1869
Re: Cisco Bridges: a new layout concept
« Reply #89 on: February 15, 2014, 06:18:34 PM »
0
So publish them here.  Tabs and slots?  Looks really sharp in any case!