subroadbed sounding boards

[basementcalling]

Lots of guys talk about trying to find products like Micore or Homasote  and cork to quiet the trains. I know that track laid directly on foam with nothing to insulate creates a sounding hard of sorts from my firsst N Traktor  module. Woops.

Now I am wondering if deliberately building a noisier subroadbed in a hidden section of track is a viable solution to throttle creep? Could hearing the train keep operators from speeding up a Trai  in a long hidden section? I will have one hidden loop with 405 degrees of curve to gain elevation, so over one full circle of 18 inch curve will be hidden from view. I'm wondering about using foam, specifically the Woodland Scenics risers under the hidden portion of the loop so the train is audible to the engineer. An as yet to be numbered operating rule for this tunnel will be to keep a crew member  standing at the portal of entrance until the lead unit exits or the last car enters.

Other thoughts on avoiding throttle creep? On a 2% grade it could be a serious issue.

[glakedylan]

I do not think that I have seen a well designed and produced helix with anything under the track but the helix itself, be that 1/4" plywood or hardboard (Masonite). even when it is flex--or kato and other sectional pieces--it is the track laid directly on the wood or board.
fwiw....
sincerely

[peteski]

Creeping train (due to its very slow speed) won't make very much noise, even on a a sub-base which carries sound really well.  Instead of trying to depend on natural acoustics how about installing a simple detector with either visual or audio alert?  This can be a very simple photo sensor with either an LED or a buzzer hooked up to its output.

[GaryHinshaw]

Operators hate hidden track.  Can you arrange to put a window in your fascia so they can see it instead?  And make the roadbed out of something solid for g-d's sake. 

[basementcalling]

Operators hate hidden track.  Can you arrange to put a window in your fascia so they can see it instead?  And make the roadbed out of something solid for g-d's sake. 

G-D isn't allowed to operate on my layout. I can put a window in the fascia, Gary. That's in the works, well, once I get to the fascia stage. 

I have a set of Woodland Scenics 2% risers I am looking to use. Part of the first loop (herniated) will be on a Micro Engineering trestle set. That transitions to ????? for the hidden portion of the loop. Then as it crosses under the skyboards it emerges into the paper mill scene on my center peninsula. The WS riser section would be the hidden track.

I have rotated the loop counter clockwise some to extend the length of visible track on the outside (top most) scene, which puts the "bridge" much closer to the backdrop.

The industrial tracks that penetrate the skyboard have been rerouted not to do so. Too complicated.

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It's messy cutting that much plywood in the layout room and with the wind chill set to stay at 10 below for a few days, cutting outside is chilly.

[GaryHinshaw]

G-D isn't allowed to operate on my layout.

Touché. 

I think the risers will work fine, but I wouldn't rely on the sound to be a very useful cue to your operators, especially if there is chatter in the room, or perhaps radio traffic with the dispatcher.  Visual contact is much more reassuring.

One semi-related item to be thinking about: the clearance between the mill tracks and the helix track half a turn below it will be very tight.  You'll probably have to use thin plywood there and figure out a way to support it that doesn't cross the track below.  Is there a reason the track level on either side of the backdrop is so different?  Could you level out both sides and do away with the helix turn?

[basementcalling]

Touché. 

I think the risers will work fine, but I wouldn't rely on the sound to be a very useful cue to your operators, especially if there is chatter in the room, or perhaps radio traffic with the dispatcher.  Visual contact is much more reassuring.

One semi-related item to be thinking about: the clearance between the mill tracks and the helix track half a turn below it will be very tight.  You'll probably have to use thin plywood there and figure out a way to support it that doesn't cross the track below.  Is there a reason the track level on either side of the backdrop is so different?  Could you level out both sides and do away with the helix turn?

Gary, heights are pretty set at this point, or where the layout has 2 decks (only 1/2 of my plan actually has tracks on two levels directly over each other.) won't have adequate vertical spacing and I am playing with minimums as it is. Most double decked scenes have 10 to 12 inches railhead to railhead.

The vertical clearance is an issue under the mill spurs, which is solved with a short gap in the plywood, well braced, and a thin 1 inch wide piece of Masonite the same height as the cork roadbed. Remember I am not running double stacks, though I will plan clearances as if I am , just in case the IB  gains such business in the future.

Mockup is ongoing this morning. Photos to follow.

[basementcalling]

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Overall shot of easy side. Base flat surface elevation 53 inches. Level sits where short ME trestle ends. 2% grade here.

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Here is paper mill side at the entrance. Track on paper plan will be visible and 1 loop higher than track behind on WS riser. Using UniTrak for mock up. After the thread on a helix from it I might use pieces here, but that would require lower supports, which is easy to do.

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Here is where clearance now tightens. Far end of the auto rack is touching the bottom of plywood. As I said, lowering  height needed.

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This is where clearance plan requires no plywood overhead.

Finally, a look from on hignore at space for mill. Atlas curved turnout is the track rising into this scene on last of the outside loop. Grade will transition and level out about where inner curved sectional track ends.

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[glakedylan]

why the G-D dis?

 
G-D is the engineer
I am the conductor
 

just yanking your chain, not meaning other than humor and a bit of ribbing