One guy's trials and tribulation

[randgust]

Track soldering really isn't necessary until you start ballasting, and painting track. It will work pretty well up until then.   But if you haven't put in feeders instead of relying on the rail joiners, you'll sure wish you had.  A lot of things will work just fine until you start working with wet substances around track and roadbed.  That's why all my subroadbed gets painted.

I'd heard a great one once from an HO guy and never forgot it.    "you really notice that attention to fine detail when you're rerailing the cars' and that was during the 60's when RP25 was coming in.

One of the things that I have regretted is indiscriminately mixing solid and stranded wire to my control panels, which hinge and tip down for access.   I do seem to break wires, always solid.  The other thing that IS failing now, after about 40 years, are the Radio Shack subminiature DPDT's with internal contact failure.   They've become rather erratic and I've been replacing more of those than I ever thought I would.   Some of the older clunky ones are closer to 50 years old, and they still work fine.

We've got a running HO display layout in our company street level window (just for fun) that that's been a torture track for HO stuff to watch it fail, on a 5x9 layout that was built relatively poorly and has had to be extensively reconstructed.   It gets run so hard that it wears flanges off of locomotives.  WAY less reliable than my N scale!

[Dave V]

Track soldering really isn't necessary until you start ballasting, and painting track. It will work pretty well up until then. 

I feel like it's necessary for mechanical connections for flex track in any situation where the joint is on a curve, regardless of how gentle. Otherwise a kink will develop and grow with time.

[peteski]

The last thing I wonder about:  what is acid solder flux for if not electronics?  In my early experiences, it was sold for that purpose.  Now I use acid-free flux but my many uses of rosin core flux for electronics and trackwork in the past have not led to any noticable failures.  It is all rather mysterious to a casual user of a soldering iron.

Acid flux is *NEVER* sold for electronic soldering. 

Scott, acid-based flux is for *ANYTHING* that does not involve electricity.  Acid solution is electrically conductive (guess what is in your car battery) and also corrosive if not completely removed from the item being soldered.  So you have the galvanic effect and also corrosion. Deadly combination for soldering track or wiring conducting electricity, and it will also eat traces on PC Boards if used for solderer electronic components.  This is usually slow process, so if things start misbehaving 5 or 10 years after you soldered them you will not even think that the acid flux was the cause.

Acid flux is quite active (caustic) so it makes soldering metals like steel or iron easier than if you used mild rosin flux. Like Mike mentioned, it is also helpful for heavier soldering jobs like stained glass.

[Scottl]

Thanks for the clarification.  As I said, I'm a casual solderer and for decades had no awareness of what flux I was using.  I was mostly using rosin-core so probably why I have not had any issues.

[wm3798]

Copper plumbing.

[CRL]

I’ve always used rosin flux for soldering. Never the acid flux. Also, Peco code 55 track is bulletproof as long as you use Liquid Nails for Projects (latex based) to bond the track to the sub roadbed. Ditto for the Peco turnouts with the snap action for manual turnout control. Interesting his comments about servos. Wonder if he bought the really cheap big bags of Chinese servos. Agree with his hidden track comments… looks good on paper but a real potential for nightmares.

[mark.hinds]

(text removed)

He also relied on track nails... that's right, track nails, to secure the flex to the roadbed, and in some instances the turnouts.  On close inspection, you'll find holes poked in the ties of many of the turnouts.  I'm not sure how he applied the nails, whether they were gently pressed in with a nail set, or if he used a 5 bound maul.  But I can tell you, I had pictures where you could see the alignment was less than perfect, with the rails moving back and forth with the nails being the apparent culprit. 

Regardless of how the nails were applied, those turnouts are tightly engineered and pretty fragile.  Whaling away on nails in or around them is going to jostle some things loose.

(text removed)
Lee

FWIW, the old MR Clinchfield layout (per their book) used flat-head nails (plus glue) on the cork, and track nails (plus ballast) on the track.  This technique is reliable, if you do it carefully, as my implementation of this has worked well since the mid-80s.  I pre-drill all the holes in the ties to be very slightly less than the diameter of the nails, and carefully finish each nail with a nail set.  Curves are easy to adjust (per their book) by sighting along the rails, and if necessary gently pushing the nails in the desired direction with the nail set.  I have expansion joints, and feeders to each section of track, plus to selected portions of the switches.  I can still run trains at full speed in reverse through any of this trackwork.  Admittedly, track and switches are code 70 Shinohara (sometimes modified), and perhaps code 55 would behave differently. 

The only potential issue I see is that I have not yet ballasted the track, after which, when the ballast is dry, I intended to clip off the tops of the track nails to make them flush.  Still, I would expect that the remaining part of the nail, plus the glued ballast would hold the track.  I guess I will find out. 

MH

[shark_jj]

I was impressed by the very calm, analytical approach that this fellow Canadian modeller took to what clearly had to be a very frustrating experience.  It was good to see that he recognized that most of the problems were caused by decisions he made or techniques that he used and that it wasn't deterring him from continuing in N Scale.  A number of you have commented on Jerry Britton's layout and along with my buddy Justin I too was able to visit with Jerry and see the layout back in the early 2000's sometime.  I must admit I was somewhat surprised at how some of the track was laid and not surprised that it was causing numerous derailments.  Jerry had a bad habit of starting a curve right out of a turnout without any transition and without soldering the connection causing some real kinks.  You can get away without one or the other, but rarely both. 

I too have Atlas Code 55 and I have often complained about how fragile they are.  In reflection however, these turnouts have stood up through 3 layouts and somewhere just north of 15 years or so.  I originally bought 105 of them, 10 were defective out the box and Atlas replaced them, and subsequently I have had about half a dozen or so fail and have either used PCB board to fix them or in the case of rivet fails, a little caulk in the hole then putting the rivet back in solves the problem.  That being said, if I was starting over, I would see Peco Code 55 in my future, more robust.

With respect to hidden trackage, the best decision I made was to cut shadow box holes in my fascia so that the little bit of hidden trackage I have is now quite visible and easily cleaned, plus you get the bonus of seeing the train. 

As I listened to him, my first thought was that could have been me if I didn't have the support and help of my little group of N Scale peers.  We all have different skill sets and are always up for helping each other out.    I too have decided to subscribe to his Channel and follow his story.

[TinyTurner]

I was really taken by how excellent his dystopia builds are.  Missile silos, Xenomorphs and resident evil sets could all be snuck in on even the finest layouts.  Is there an NMRA category for monster building 

Adding video game themes like fallout to the correct era would be cheeky.  Would anyone notice?

More seriously, his very low relief hotel and card backdrop is excellent. I like it a lot.  I might go for something similar for a layout idea I have.

[OldEastRR]

Everybody hates Homasote for track base but I've used it on all my layouts and, tho the layouts weren't built well and eventually were dismantled, had have had none of the problems others seem to have with it. Glued to plywood with both cut out to only wide enough for  the trackage, with cork roadbed glued down and TRACK NAILS, the only problems I've had is with not putting the track down in alignment or proper easements (both horizontal and vertical).
However, in my first use of it I just figured it's solid, it's self-supporting, like plywood. But it's actually paper. So the switch lead I had running on it soon developed sags between the roadbed supports - up down up down up.  Since then, I use plywood as the support.
I don't think Homasote is available any more, it's been replaced as an insulation by foam board. Which I use for all the landforms around the trackwork. And yes, making "portable" scenes built on slabs of foam means you can build, detail, and scenic them at the workbench, then insert the finished piece (permanently if you like) on the layout w/o much hassle.

Hidden track -- yikes. On the same layout I started using Homasote I decided I'd have hidden staging yards, too  -- and I built one about 2" under the large main exposed yard. Ah, yes -- using a yardstick to sweep out any derailed trains, car by car. And this was that '70s not so reliable track and locomotives.
Iron rule: no hidden track over 3' (total on layout). And lift-off scenery over it mandatory.
Helixi? Obscenities.  In hell, model RRers are forced to run trains up a 40000 coil helix -- and then at the top, back it down again. For eternity.

[dem34]

Theres a reason my "big Layout" design is just a 7'x8' horseshoe, with debate on whether to do a nolix accessed Unitrak staging or just have the layout be a somewhat prototypicaly operated noodled dogbone. I've done enough non starter layouts to know what I have the patience for.

But that said.
I also think he might have learned some of the wrong lessons in places. As in, it seems he puts a lot of blame on Code 55 track in general, and extrapolates that just using Code 80 would fix a lot of it. Which, I dunno, I've been using Peco 55 for a while now withought any issue once I've started adding wheel drop shims and fixing some kinks incurred by younger me rushing the process. I warned him early on he was going to have some issues trying to do push pull operations through #5 turnouts, (Which we know Atlas #5s are more like #4.5s) 

[kiwi_bnsf]

Thanks for highlighting this video – I found it quite refreshing to hear about someone going through a major model railroad re-think, and discussing failures honestly.

Construction on my own home layout room has stalled out twice now, and despite telling myself that it was a busy life getting in the way, in reality it was due to overly complex design for a given space, and all the consequences that this entails.

I've learned a lot from my mistakes, and I have come to some similar design choices for my re-think:
 - single deck
 - no hidden trackage (all staging open)
 - no helixes
 - no grades >2%
 - modular construction (even though it's a home layout)
 - higher quality birch plywood benchwork painted to resist moisture changes
 - wider aisles and easier access

All of this greatly reduces the amount of run that I can fit in my layout room, but it just makes things so much less stressful (and therefore a lot less prone to design paralysis).

The only things I would disagree on is that handlaid Code 55 is a problem. I've produced around forty turnouts with FastTracks jigs, and these all run beautifully and have held up well under some pretty extreme temperature and humidity changes. I think the key is to pay really close attention to track gauge and clearances when handling, and to build more stable roadbed (track glued to cork) and benchwork (painted birch ply).

I find the Kester Acid paste flux is perfect for building turnouts (and it is recommended by FastTracks), but is definitely not suitable for any wiring. I've had no problems with corrosion or joint failures on my turnouts, but I do thoroughly wash them in dishwashing liquid and hot water before I install them.

Cheers

[peteski]

I find the Kester Acid paste flux is perfect for building turnouts (and it is recommended by FastTracks), but is definitely not suitable for any wiring. I've had no problems with corrosion or joint failures on my turnouts, but I do thoroughly wash them in dishwashing liquid and hot water before I install them.

Cheers

That is perfectly acceptable, because you thoroughly wash the acidic flux off before installing the turnouts on the layout. Acid flux does make soldering easier bur to how much more active it is compared to rosin flux. The problem is when acid flux is used to solder rail joiners to the track already installed on the layout.  There is not good way to thoroughly clean off the flux, and of course same applies to wiring. 

[Bill H]

The only things I would disagree on is that handlaid Code 55 is a problem. I've produced around forty turnouts with FastTracks jigs, and these all run beautifully and have held up well under some pretty extreme temperature and humidity changes. I think the key is to pay really close attention to track gauge and clearances when handling, and to build more stable roadbed (track glued to cork) and benchwork (painted birch ply).

I have to agree with Tim. In fact, I only use code 40 turnouts, some built from FastTracks, some on paper templates for special uses, and some are over 20 years old and still in use with either Tortoises or slide switches. Zero issues.

Kind regards,
Bill

[robert3985]

"Flux"  Did I hear "flux"????

When I got started hand-laying my own turnouts back in the mid-1970's, getting good and cosmetically acceptable solder joints was a problem for me.  I'd been soldering electrically since my dad, who was an electrical engineer and loved to build Heathkit projects, taught me how to solder, but I didn't have a lot of experience soldering metal models together.

So, I experimented...and came upon some flux called "Plumber's Honey"...for soldering copper pipes, and MAN!...did it work (!) on my Code70 turnouts I made for my first Ntrak set of modules!!  I made sure I washed them thoroughly in a water/baking soda solution to get rid of (I thought) any acidity problems. 

However, after about a year and a half, the ballast, wooden ties and cork roadbed started deteriorating badly...so badly that after another six months, I had to remove the also deteriorating turnouts and completely re-do my trackwork.  Luckily on half of the two module dedicated setup, I only had turnouts on one of the modules, and had not completed the complicated industrial complex that would be the Ideal Concrete factory at Devil's Slide I was planning.

So it was that before I got started rebuilding my acid-eaten turnouts, track and roadbed, I discovered Superior No. 30 Supersafe Soldering Flux, which is self-neutralizing (from heat) and VASTLY increased my soldering success as well as exponentially improving both soldering speed and the way my joints appeared (clean, shiny, with very little "globbing").

At this time, I also started using 96/4 Tin/Silver Silver-bearing solid-core solder, which is 5 to 6 times stronger than ordinary electronics solders, and was perfect for N-scale trackwork, being also more conductive than ordinary electronics solders.

Since I started using this flux and silver-bearing solder for ALL of my metal model projects as well as all of my track laying and turnout building, I have been highly recommending this combination because it revolutionized my turnout building/model making results, and over the decades that I've had many of my Code55 and Code40 trackwork and hand-laid turnouts in place and operational, I am highly impressed with their robustness and total lack of any performance degrading or visible oxidation, and I am totally convinced that this combination of flux and solder is, by far, the VERY BEST for N-scale trackwork, and making it exponentially easier to build your hand-laid turnouts.

Cheerio!
Bob Gilmore