North West Great Northern Layout

[NorthWestGN]

Hi Guys,

I've been lurking on the Railwire for a while now, but just began posting recently...Now that I'm up to 25 posts I'll post some pics of where my layout is at...

Though I've modelled for a number of years, besides an N-trak Prairie themed double module build with John W. I've never built or had my own layout. I started off in HO and was scratch building structures then started painting and detailing locomotives. The local hobby shop at that time time, Pacific Scale Rail, though all scales, was owned and staffed by N Scale modelers and when I saw the improvements in the locomotives and rolling stock back in the 90's, I traded in and sold my HO gear for N scale. I painted and detailed in all scales for a few years and turned a lot of that income into N scale locomotives, rolling stock, structures and track but never got my s*&t together to start a layout. I drifted off into Hotwheels Redline restorations for a few years, recently selling some off for a good profit, found all my stored N scale gear and decided what I should really do is finally get a layout started.

Then I planned and changed and planned and changed when my brother Dale just told me to get off my A$$ and just build something, anything!

So here we are today, about a year later, with a 3 x 6' open grid frame with a cookie cutter plywood roadbed folded loop with a train length passing siding, two sidings and a soon to be 3 or 4 track stub end yard. The mainline is code 70 Shinohara flex, Peco insulfrogs and Peco code 55 sidings. Hot wheels money got me a Great Northern BLI Mikado and NW2 and Santa left me with a Digitrax Zephyr for control. The immediate objective was to get to the running stage which is where I'm at now, with the exception of the yard..

I need to get my wiring in order, right now I'm using the Peco turnouts to route power, need to cut some gaps and wire for blocks and a programming track. There's always weathering, structure building and locomotive detailing to fill in when I have short blocks of time available.

For now I'm happy to be JFRTM and showing off the sound system to anyone who seems even remotely interested...

Brent

[John]

Welcome to the layout threads .. great start ..

One comment -- would you have any room for a 3 track staging yard outside of the confines of the main layout? Would improve your play fun some

[NorthWestGN]

Hi John,

Thanks for the suggestion, I've been thinking about how to get some functional connection to the rest of the world for this. Right now the whole thing's on casters so that the complete layout can be rolled over top of my workbench on a different wall to save space in the basement rec room. I've been thinking of a removable or hinged yard or at least a single interchange track so I keep the portability aspect but add that connection to the outside world.

If I can come up with a design that can be attached with a few screws or bolts and an electrical connector, I'll be good to go.

Brent

[GaryHinshaw]

Looks like a good start on a classic plan.  Nice execution on the bench work.  Keep going with your build and see what aspects of the process you enjoy the most.  You'll learn a lot in the process.

[NorthWestGN]

I've been thinking about John's comment about adding a staging yard long before he brought it up and I think I have a solution that will offer the possibilities for some realistic point to point operation on this folded loop as well as the choice of continuous operation.

The layout is currently built on a 1 x 3 open frame grid that measures 37 x 72 overall. This is then attached with 4 screws to a frame of 4 -2 x 2" legs reinforced with 1 x 3" and 1 x 4" bracing on 3 sides. I inserted casters in the bottom of each of the 4 legs which allows me to roll the whole layout over top of my workbench to save space in the Rec Room.

The folded loop although great for continuous running doesn't offer a lot of operational capacity so adding a staging yard is a good idea but what about 2 x 2 tracks? Then this could be run as a point to point layout with connections to the rest of the world on both ends. It forced me to do a little research in my own library, which was convenient, and because I'm interested in the Great Northern operating in British Columbia I primarily referenced a publication I bought in a local hobby shop years ago...Railways of the West Kootenay by Gerry & Corwin Doekson. It details the operations and equipment of the Great Northern north of Northport Washington and connecting with the Canadian Pacific in Nelson BC. This gave me a timetable, route map and the inspiration to adapt my existing track plan to incorporate what will be a hinged staging track addition representing the portions of the line South from the US border at Waneta BC and North beyond Salmo BC toward Nelson BC and the interchange with CP.

It's funny that when I looked into freelancing an extension of the GN into BC one of the hardest things I found was coming up with plausible place names and a basic plan for operation. This short single track mainline and connection with the CP solved all of my conceptual shortcomings and I like the scenery too....




The Timetable gives me Place names, distances, siding lengths and train numbers...



With that information, and rough dimensions for a hinged 36" extension here's a revised track plan and point to point schematic...



A little more online research brought up this scenery inspiration from the early 70's along the line when the Burlington Northern was operating...



And a print of that same photo provided the backdrop for a scenery test section I did years ago and took a photo of this past weekend....



Looks like I have a plan!

[packers#1]

I like it a lot, and isn’t it great when the real world matches up with what you think should be there? 

One question I have from your design, why keep the two tracks separate instead of having a wye connection to a 4 track yard? That way you can have the switches in a bit closer for scenery, but then you also don’t need to restage the trains after an ops session since any train can take any track? I’ve never wired a wye myself but I know they make auto reversers etc that make them easy to set up.

[NorthWestGN]

Thanks for the suggestion Sawyer , I could use it as the wye that did exist at Troup Junction just before Nelson and eliminate the 0-5-0 switcher....

I'll have to figure out how to wire it, but that's also on the punch list right now as I currently have two sets of feeders into the loop and am relying on the Peco turnouts to switch sidings on and off. I'll break it into blocks and will wire it for dual cab control so I can choose either DC or DCC for each block.

Brent

[nkalanaga]

Wiring a dead-end wye is easy, even with DC, as long as one only runs one train at a time, or all three legs are one block.  The wye tail is an electrical oddity, as both stock rails are the same polarity, and the frog is the opposite polarity. 

Instead of reversing the frog when the switch is thrown, the two stock rails, and the wye tail, need to be reversed.  Gap the stock rails just past the guard rails (no need to cut them), and install a DPDT switch on whatever is used to throw the switch.  Use that as a reversing switch for the wye tail.

It sounds complicated, but a simple pen-and-paper diagram will show what I mean.  I did that years ago for a wye in a closet in our old house.  It was a simple, 18-inch, stub end tail, for turning the loco at the end of an around the walls layout.  I used a rotary switch, with a plastic arm added, carpet thread, and weights to move the points and reverse the electricity.

[Cory Rothlisberger]

With that information, and rough dimensions for a hinged 36" extension here's a revised track plan and point to point schematic...

I'm really into this track plan! For me, I would have done a point-to-point when I started my recent layout, but I have kids, and kids want to watch trains run and now I really wish I went with something like this...

[mcjaco]

Thanks for the suggestion Sawyer , I could use it as the wye that did exist at Troup Junction just before Nelson and eliminate the 0-5-0 switcher....

I'll have to figure out how to wire it, but that's also on the punch list right now as I currently have two sets of feeders into the loop and am relying on the Peco turnouts to switch sidings on and off. I'll break it into blocks and will wire it for dual cab control so I can choose either DC or DCC for each block.

Brent

As someone that did the separate yards as you have with my Dad's HO layout, he and I both wish we had made it one larger yard with a wye.  We could have still done point to point, but also turned trains/locos without sticking our mitts all over them. 

I love this layout!  It's a great start with a lot of possibilites!

[Scottl]

Love this prototype, I have the same book.  Great layout plan to run trains!

[Rasputen]

I see an S curve at your present Waneta staging turnout.  If you keep this plan, be sure to keep a good distance between the curve in the siding and the turnout.  I can't remember off hand what the recommendation is but I think it is at least one of your longest car, which looks like a 65 foot coach.

[NorthWestGN]

Thanks for the suggestions everyone, just have to build it....

Brent

[ATSF_Ron]

Northwest GN, this is a great small layout plan!  I'll be watching with interest.  It's funny you mention the Hot Wheels money funding the train purchases.  When helping my mom move out of her residence of 50 years, I found all my old Hot Wheels from the late 60s/early 70s.  All Red Line stuff and mostly in great condition.  Sold all of it and bought a lot of my present N scale collection.

My first "real" layout used open grid construction like yours.  I'm a fan of the flexibility in tweaking grades with this type of construction.  Great job so far!

[NorthWestGN]

Thanks Ron, it’s a pretty simple adaptation to the simple folded loop that I hope will give me some operating enjoyment and the chance to run it like a real railroad…round and round even with sound gets boring after a few minutes.

The open grid did allow me to tweak few grades once I was able to get some track down. I’ve got what I think I need to create the frame for the hinged staging yard and have played around with a pretty simple track plan using the turnouts I have on hand from years ago. Now I’m thinking about how I can use those staging tracks to add a few more industries that will tie in with the prototype.

So the last few days have been mainly planning but took some time to weather a double door box car that will soon be in lumber product service…

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Thanks for catching up!
Brent