Glue metal rail to ABS printed plastic ties

[MILWcoastdiv]

I have been experimenting with 3D printed ties with very small notches kind of like Central Valley tie strips that hold the rail to gauge with promising results.  I would like to minimize the every 8 or so PCB ties because of cost.  Is there a glue that would bond the code 40 rail to ABS ties?  I'm thinking MEK or Acetone

Thanks,
Mario

[Sumner]

I've switched from Pliobond to CA  ( HERE ) for gluing to wood ties on turnouts but still have the PCB ties to hold things together so don't know if you would gain much from trying it.  I do also use CA for gluing my 3D printed prints.

If you don't want PCB ties that look exactly like each other (the real ones don't) you can make them dirt cheap.  I make all of mine for my turnouts....

.... more info here ....

https://1fatgmc.com/RailRoad/Trackwork/page-4.html

Sumner

[nkalanaga]

I doubt that MEK or acetone would have any effect at all on metal rail. 

[garethashenden]

I doubt MEK or Acetone would effect either of them. I've been using pliobond, its kinda a pain but it works. I have only been using pcb ties on sleepers. The ties I've been using were drawn by Ed N and come in a set of four. What I do is make a piece of flex track by lining up a bunch of ties and attaching the rail to one side. Once this is done for the whole 18" of rail, I'll lay it on the layout and then attach the other rail. Its slow going, but I like how its looking. It will be even better once its painted, weathered, and ballasted.

[MILWcoastdiv]

Sumner, thanks I have had your website booked marked for years.  I do make my own PCB ties on occasion but find it too time consuming.  I do like the Fast Tracks regular ties that are pre gapped but just gets expensive.


Garethashenden, yeah that does look pretty darn good.  I assume the ties are resin printed, can you share a link to Ed N?



Thanks,
Mario

[garethashenden]

Garethashenden, yeah that does look pretty darn good.  I assume the ties are resin printed, can you share a link to Ed N?
Thanks,
Mario

This post: https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?topic=55440.msg766707#msg766707

The ties are 1:1, you'll need to reduce them to 1:160 in the slicer. I've had really good results with Anycubic ABS like resin.

[Chris333]

What do you guys find wrong with Pliobond?

[garethashenden]

What do you guys find wrong with Pliobond?

Its stringy and smelly. Its the best option I've found, but that doesn't mean I like using it.

[Chris333]

But the smell is soooooooo good     Yeah it is stringy though.


I use those pin point applicator tips so it is easy to spread under the rail.

[Maletrain]

How about epoxy?

I have used G/flex epoxy to glue stainless steel to plexiglass on my sailboat, and it has held-up on things like instrument cover door to hinge attachments that get lots of handling, sun, water, vibration and freezing.  This particular epoxy remains slightly flexible.

You would need to do the technique that garethashenden posted about putting one rail on a strip of ties before putting it on the layout and then putting the second rail onto the ties with them already in their final orientations on the roadbed.

Of course, it is not going to be easy to get the rail off the ties later, if that is what you decide to do.  I still have the test piece of plexiglass with a piece of stainless G/flexed to it that I can't get loose, much less apart, with substantial effort - more force would probably just break the plexiglass.

[Chris333]

I have some of this flexible super glue, but haven't tried it yet to give an opinion
https://www.michtoy.com/item-VMS-CM10-BK-VMS_Flexy_5K_CA_for_Photo_etched_BLACK_Type.html

[peteski]

Is there a glue that would bond the code 40 rail to ABS ties?  I'm thinking MEK or Acetone

MEK and Acetone work by dissolving the plastic to literally weld the surfaces together.  Since metal doesn't melt by using solvents, this will not work. You need an actual adhesive which will bond to the metal. Adhesives which bond dissimilar materials will work. Some have been mentioned already.

[Sumner]

Didn't like the Pliobond mess.  CA all the way for me now.  Quicker and easier.



    I haven't been real happy using Pliobond so started using Starbond Super Fast Thin CA glue (try both and see what you like best). I put the ties in a fixture and work with one section of the turnout at a time. I'll be careful to put just a drop of CA where the tie meets the rail on one end of the tie. Too much and it can run down into the fixture. I'll do that quickly for all the ties in that section. Then I'll dip the wooden food pic in the accelerator and run it along the side of the rail. It will flow down into the CA and set it.

    I'll turn the turnout/tie fixture around (have it on a piece of paper to make that easier) and then repeat with the other end of the ties. Next I'll use the X-acto knife (if needed) to pry the turnout and ties out of the fixture and move onto the next section.

    You want the CA to grab fast. Using it in one of the small bottles with the applicator tip on it is the way to go. I tried the slower CA's and didn't like them but give them a try if you want. The fast sets up faster. Using it and the accelerator I could move to the next section about as fast as I could put the CA and accelerator on.

    If you don't like the CA next I'll show how I was using Pliobond before switching to CA but really prefer the CA now as I can put the ties on so much faster.

https://1fatgmc.com/RailRoad/Trackwork/page-31.html

Sumner

[peteski]

Then I'll dip the wooden food pic in the accelerator and run it along the side of the rail. It will flow down into the CA and set it.

MicroBrushes (yellow or white) are ideal for this type of accelerator application.  And if the fuzzy end gets clogged up with some errant CA, just toss the MicroBrush.

To me those home-made needle applicators are also more controllable than a squeeze bottle. Size of the eye of the needle determines the amount of CA deposited.



I deposit some thin CA into a tiny (disposable) cup made from Al foil, and dip the neeedle applicator in the cup to load it up with glue, then touch the applicator to the glued surface to deposit the glue drop.    When the needel clogs up, I just scrape the glue (when it is still fairly soft) using a hobby knife.  Some people just burn it off, but I prefer scraping.

[MILWcoastdiv]

Peteski, by now you can probably tell when I'm working on my layout with my usual coinciding posts on another forum about nuked Lok Sound decoders, UHG.

I did pick up some MEK (nasty stuff and not cheap)  and thinned down the pliobond and it and took care of the messiness quite a bit.  I have to find an applicator tip and see if i can get a small enough bead on the underside of code 40.  In this case I used a tooth pick to apply but will want a faster way.  I'm making yard tracks and not really looking for anything too detailed.  Why not use ME code 40?  I don't think it looks good, formed spikes way too big.

I posted a picture of the gauge notches, nothing fancy but seems to work good at preventing the use of the 3pt gauge which is a pain.

I like to build my turnouts in place looking for the flowing feel using full length sections.  I want to use PCB ties and solder only in critical areas like under the frog and where the points hit the stock rails, again just to speed up the process. I also want to make sure the glue will be solid enough to survive track cleaning.   Again like the Central Valley tie strips both turnout and cross ties from my HO days but 'free'

I'll definitely try CA while i'm in the experimentation process. 

Thanks!!