Kato annouces early version sd40-2

[daniel_leavitt2000]

Well, looks like I'm safe here. It looks like there is no updated tooling on these, not even to commonize the chassis with the mid production.

Both BLI and early Kato run really well. Mid-production Kato with those fragile trucks probably run smoother, but not as reliable. IM and ST run as well as any modern Atlas engine but maybe not quite as smooth as Kato. The flip side is that they run much closer to scale speed on DC.

[OldEastRR]

But who would've ever thought a Kato model would be the "bargain option"?

Quite amazing. But the US market is only a sideline for KATO. What's the quality and detail like today on their Japanese/foreign railroad locos?

[peteski]

I'm not yet convinced I like the dip switches for selecting lighting options. My opinion is that it'd have been better to do that through the decoder.

When I first saw the switches I thought the same thing, but then the proverbial  bulb light lit up over my head. I understood why they did it.

The PC same PC boards and decoders are used for multiple loco version: Single and dual headlights, with or without Gyralite.  When the unit is a single headlight the decoder's front headlight function output should control the upper (and the only) light.  When they have dual headlight, the upper one now becomes Gyralite and lower headlight becomes standard headlight.  That is what those switches are for.  Could this be done in the decoder programming? Sure, but now you have different sound files for every variant of the headlight arrangement.  Manual switches (which are set from the factory and modeler doesn't even have to touch) seem like simpler solution.

[jagged ben]

If you don't mind saying, what issues are you finding with the recent IM F units?  I've been considering buying one for the chassis (I have an extra shell).

I'll tell you my issues with IM SD40-2s.

Coupler height too high, that awful Atlas three-axle truck design they're still using which makes them not reliable runners, complete lack of underframe detail exposing the contact strips, and headlight leak as in all IM hood units.  I also had to get a replacement shell for one which came from the factory just all distorted, they were gracious in sending to me, but still.

Sound is decent. 

[jagged ben]

Honestly, not favorably.

These were good models when they came out. And will likely run amazingly, but I almost can't run my Kato SDs (that I had loved before) mixed up with my ScaleTrains or even Intermountain ones. They just look so dated (wide hoods, squinty number boards, the sill thing, lack of underframe detail) compared to the new stuff. And that's ignoring all of the lame paint things (like they're STILL not even offering them with the proper safety paint), road specific details (like the MILW fuel tanks), or old school tooling (cast on grab irons and lift rings).

If you just want a pair of BN SDs to reliably lug a coal train around an NTRAK layout, these are probably perfect for you.

But if you want a state of the art model in 2024, I'm sorry to say, they're just not.

Yeah.

We could debate (again) whether grab irons and lift rings need to be separate but not including sunshades even as a separately applied part is falling behind litterally everyone else nowadays.  Sunshades being for me probably the #1 item that shifts the look out of toy train territory and into a scale model for me.  Not to mention road specific air conditioners, antennas and beacons, etc..  Don't get me wrong, I've enjoyed adding those details to my Katos in the past.  But I still have a bunch to do, and if I'm going to add to my loco collection I don't exactly need more on that to do list.

[learmoia]

Does it bother anyone else that Kato sits on this tooling for Years and Years, and when another mfg announces a similar model, all of a sudden they quickly fire off a release to scoop the potential sales of the new model..
Then the tooling sits until the next mfg decides to enter their territory..

Had they consistently released good quality SD40-2s each year for the last 25 years.. The market would be saturated and Kato would have made ALL the money..

~Ian

[basementcalling]

Does it bother anyone else that Kato sits on this tooling for Years and Years, and when another mfg announces a similar model, all of a sudden they quickly fire off a release to scoop the potential sales of the new model..
Then the tooling sits until the next mfg decides to enter their territory..

Had they consistently released good quality SD40-2s each year for the last 25 years.. The market would be saturated and Kato would have made ALL the money..

~Ian

I don't think their production schedule is that nimble. Probably Kato NA has to wait for production slots behind their domestic Japanese production, which is still the majority of their business.

I like having engines at multiple price point options. Yes, ST, BLI, and IM, have surpassed Kato in detail level, but as far as reliability, Kato still sets the standard for least amount of fuss to just take it out of the box and let it run. Has Kato had an operational dud, ever, going all the way back to the made for Con Cor PAs? Maybe their switcher, but if it says Kato, it will run right out of the box.

[jagged ben]

... Has Kato had an operational dud, ever, going all the way back to the made for Con Cor PAs? Maybe their switcher, but if it says Kato, it will run right out of the box.

The screwless 'shock absorber' design with the sprung middle axle has had some issues.  People made too much of the trucks popping out in shipment (just pop 'em back in) but the fragile wheel wiper and the finer tooth gears are not as durable. 

BTW has anyone else noticed (okay I bet peteski has) that those pieces are copper on Kato and brass on Atlas and Intermountain?  Probably another reason Kato runs better.

[nscaler711]

Im just going to say it.
Modeling portion of Model railroading is dying. Just go look for detail parts.
As much as I like the ST locomotives I have, I firmly believe all of my Katos will out live them.
If and when I want to take super close shots I'll use nicer locomotives for pictures, but for running for a long time, well it'll be my Katos and Atlas. They're meant to be handled and ran, not sit on a shelf or a siding.

Also want to point out that Kato isnt for everyone, especially not the rivet counter types. They've always been about a quality product, that will handle the roughness of people that use them. They also don't necessarily cater to North America. Kato Japan is what controls what Kato USA gets or does not get.

As far as the budget friendly comment I saw, Yes Kato has always been the budget friendly option, just take a look at their Japanese line, Tomix too. If you want better detailed options for japanese trains, Greenmax, Microace, Tenshodo (brass mind you) and guess what, detail parts.

If I want better looking trains I'll buy them or update them. 2' away is not the best trying to look at all the extra details when its moving. I mean go ahead and go rail fan and try to see all the details when a train is blowing past you at 40+ I promise you will miss things. Railroads dont make money idling.
[/rant]

[milw156]

At least ST and IM got the fuel tank size correct. They will be the usual Kato quality but the only ones I've been eyeing are the MILW units and those - should I purchase them - will be ST. No IM for me for a while; the last batch of IM F units were not satisfactory.  I purchased the NP Loewy scheme and have been regretting it.

Scale Trains also got the end railings and lack of drop step correct, though not as obvious as the fuel tank issue. I have shortened the fuel tank on more than a dozen Kato Milwaukee units, and I'd have to say, I'm DONE with that. I have 2 of the IM units, and other than replacing the 5 gallon bucket of a beacon on the roof, and adding the Keystone details underframe detail kit, they are great as is. I'd be getting more if Scale trains hadn't announced theirs.   
 BLI had offered only the 4000 gallon fuel tank vs the 3200 gallon, plus, IIRC, the Milwaukee unit had ditch lights, which did not get applied until after the Soo line had Bandit-ized them.

[milw156]

Well, looks like I'm safe here. It looks like there is no updated tooling on these, not even to commonize the chassis with the mid production.

The chassis (or the wheelbase) on the Mid version is a fraction of a mm shorter than the Early version. Discovered this when I got an F40C shell from Shapeways. The trucks hit the back of the coupler box on the shell when using the early, but not the mid

[Chris333]

BTW has anyone else noticed (okay I bet peteski has) that those pieces are copper on Kato and brass on Atlas and Intermountain?  Probably another reason Kato runs better.

I thought they were both Phosphor Bronze.

[Ed Kapuscinski]

Modeling portion of Model railroading is dying. Just go look for detail parts.

No amount of add on details will fix the hood width, too deep sills, or squinty number boards.

It's one thing to add road specific details.
But to fix the ways these fall short of their modern competition requires a complete rebuild.

[GM50 4164]

Don't forget about the wildly popular Bachmann SD40-2 with sound!

[daniel_leavitt2000]

Don't forget about the wildly popular Bachmann SD40-2 with sound!

These looked really good in Springfield.
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Obviously they don't have road specific details. In fact 3 out of 4 of the numbers are incorrect for the phase used. But it looks good. Details seem to be about the same level as Kato. I have one on pre-order for the article.