Author Topic: CNJ coach help  (Read 569 times)

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JoeD

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CNJ coach help
« on: November 27, 2023, 05:47:55 PM »
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Howdy.  I just got the new book on SP in San Francisco by Signor and thers a shot of a line of CNJ coaches.  Seems during the war SP leased CNJ coaches to operate on their peninsular commute service.  They remained in their CNJ green  but had a note in the center about being Leased to SP, or return to sender.  I don't have my book here.  Anyway, the cars they had pictures of were 800 and 821 series...looking for more info on this leasing numbers and any photos you might have access to.  Seems a worthy project for SP fans here.  Thanks for your help.

Joe

in my civvies here.  I only represent my grandmothers home made Mac and Cheese on Railwire.

JoeD

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Re: CNJ coach help
« Reply #1 on: December 04, 2023, 03:34:58 PM »
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No one?   you guys are my last hope. :) 
in my civvies here.  I only represent my grandmothers home made Mac and Cheese on Railwire.


JoeD

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Re: CNJ coach help
« Reply #3 on: December 05, 2023, 06:33:27 PM »
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in my civvies here.  I only represent my grandmothers home made Mac and Cheese on Railwire.

chessie system fan

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Re: CNJ coach help
« Reply #4 on: December 05, 2023, 07:45:50 PM »
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Luckily for you, that's the Atlas Trainman coach.  Or if not exact, it's very close.  I see they did CNJ in the later blue scheme, but haven't done the earlier Roman lettering scheme yet.
Aaron Bearden

dem34

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Re: CNJ coach help
« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2023, 12:19:54 AM »
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Luckily for you, that's the Atlas Trainman coach.  Or if not exact, it's very close.  I see they did CNJ in the later blue scheme, but haven't done the earlier Roman lettering scheme yet.

While I am not an expert. The 60' coaches were a bit later around the 60s as an early investment by NJDOT and B&O when CNJ started to really slump. These would be in the earlier 1913 to 1927 series of Heavyweights.


Whippany has a write up on the more upscale furnished ones for commuter clubs.
https://whippanyrailwaymuseum.net/equipment/jersey-coast-club-car/

And a writeup of the more standard variety
https://whippanyrailwaymuseum.net/equipment/cnj-coach-1001/

But as a CNJ modeller by convenience that nugget of info about the wartime use of these cars is interesting. Makes the fact that a lot of the SP's Peninsula commuter equipment ending up with NJT seem a bit more planned as a reciprocation of a past arrangement more than just pure chance. Jersey builder set when?  :trollface:
-Al

thomasjmdavis

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Re: CNJ coach help
« Reply #6 on: December 06, 2023, 09:27:04 AM »
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@ MTLJoe - Is this a modeling question or an (MTL) manufacturing question? If the latter, then assuming you aren't going to tool a suburban coach, I'd go with CNJ lettering on the single window coach. But if a modeling question-

The easiest way to approximate it would be to take a MTL single window coach and cut out a 2-window section. That might leave it a scale foot too long, but the appearance would be very close. My recollection from my HO days 50 years ago is that the Athearn coach out of the box is pretty close, at least in length. Maybe get out the shrink ray?

One difficulty in passenger car modeling is the confusion over car length caused, to a degree, by how the railroads themselves denoted car length. For instance, a 78' coach on many railroads is the exact same length as a 70' coach on the AT&SF- because AT&SF measured the inside length of the passenger compartment WITHOUT diaphragms (70'), while the other railroad might measure the car over the diaphragms (78'). Even worse, you might assume that an ATSF 70' coach and 70' baggage car were the same size, but no. Since the baggage car had no diaphragms, it is about 6' shorter.

The Atlas coach is 11' too short (60' over diaphragms vs 63' interior dimension PLUS 2 diaphragms, or about 71' overall).  The 60' overall length car done by Atlas (and Bachmann before them, the Bachmann scaling more like 58') was almost specific to the Chicago & Northwestern. For a longer paired window car, you could lengthen the Atlas by adding one or two window sections, to get closer to paired window suburban cars. There might also be a way to utilize their observation but chopping 2 of them to yield a single window car, but I don't have one to examine. The issue with the Atlas is that with the one piece casting, it can be difficult to get the seams where you want them on both the side and the roof,

 Perhaps more common at a similar length were the PRR P-54, which ended up on several PRR subsidiaries, and a few were sold (used) to the Chicago and Western Indiana (before they picked up used Erie Stillwells).

The common 68-72' length suburban coach is unfortunately something unavailable in N scale out of the box (AFAIK), but can often be approximated by chopping a section out of a single or paired window coach as appropriate.


« Last Edit: December 06, 2023, 09:37:08 AM by thomasjmdavis »
Tom D.

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