Rapido Canadian: rollability fix!!

[peteski]

You will have to also isolate the left-side pickup of one truck and the right-side pickup of the other from the circuit, or else you will get shorts from one truck to the other.

Good point!  I didn't think this through.  But that should not be too difficult.  Add an anti-flicker circuit and the lights will be nice and steady (on DCC of course).

[nickelplate759]

Good point!  I didn't think this through.  But that should not be too difficult.  Add an anti-flicker circuit and the lights will be nice and steady (on DCC of course).

Some of us didn't think it through and tried it - once - anyway   - now I know.

[Dwight in Toronto]

I am one of those who a) eagerly embraced Rapido’s production and delivery of Canada’s most iconic passenger train, and b) absolutely adores the museum-quality detail of the final product, and c) was hugely disappointed by the on-layout performance.  As such, it was interesting to see discussion renewed here on The Railwire.

For me, an alternative wheelset that prohibits coach lighting is not a viable alternative.  Granted, the lighting design is inexcusably atrocious (relentless flickering, marker lights and drumhead that not only default to “off”, but do so at every flicker - things that a few pennies worth of capacitance installed by the factory could have prevented).  Regardless, the LED’s are in there, and I like to see them “do their thing” (or, at least, try their best to do so). 

As far as substandard rollability is concerned, Rapido reworked my coaches under warranty.  They came back better than they were, but remain noticeably inferior to, say, my Kato Morning Daylight 12-car consist (which, by the way, I lighted as a diy project, to wonderful effect, with nary a flicker).

My opinion … considering the price-point, rollability of the 10-car set is still unacceptable.  For me, it has ended up being tolerable, only because I also have two Rapido FP9A’s and one Intermountain B unit configured as a very nice-looking ABA consist that can effortlessly pull all 10 coaches, all day long. 

I suppose my single biggest irritant is, to reiterate, the whole price-point thing.  My expectation was that I would get what I paid for … performance comparable to best-in-class appearance.  Unfortunately, that wasn’t the case, but I’ve come to realize that where I’m at with my ‘Canadian’ is as good as it’s going to get, and I now accept that as being good enough. 

[simsuper80]

I am one of those who a) eagerly embraced Rapido’s production and delivery of Canada’s most iconic passenger train, and b) absolutely adores the museum-quality detail of the final product, and c) was hugely disappointed by the on-layout performance.  As such, it was interesting to see discussion renewed here on The Railwire.

For me, an alternative wheelset that prohibits coach lighting is not a viable alternative.  Granted, the lighting design is inexcusably atrocious (relentless flickering, marker lights and drumhead that not only default to “off”, but do so at every flicker - things that a few pennies worth of capacitance installed by the factory could have prevented).  Regardless, the LED’s are in there, and I like to see them “do their thing” (or, at least, try their best to do so). 

As far as substandard rollability is concerned, Rapido reworked my coaches under warranty.  They came back better than they were, but remain noticeably inferior to, say, my Kato Morning Daylight 12-car consist (which, by the way, I lighted as a diy project, to wonderful effect, with nary a flicker).

My opinion … considering the price-point, rollability of the 10-car set is still unacceptable.  For me, it has ended up being tolerable, only because I also have two Rapido FP9A’s and one Intermountain B unit configured as a very nice-looking ABA consist that can effortlessly pull all 10 coaches, all day long. 

I suppose my single biggest irritant is, to reiterate, the whole price-point thing.  My expectation was that I would get what I paid for … performance comparable to best-in-class appearance.  Unfortunately, that wasn’t the case, but I’ve come to realize that where I’m at with my ‘Canadian’ is as good as it’s going to get, and I now accept that as being good enough.

I was able to get my cars to roll as well as any kato car, which reduces the tension on the cars up front by a lot when going around corners. As for the renewed discussion, I got mine to roll so well that I had to come on here and spread the word, but as for lighting, I wonder if a battery powered lighting kit is a viable option.

[bbussey]

If the axle length was consistent across all Rapido passenger equipment, it would be worth at least exploring a split-axle solution. But the market for even one standard length would be small, and the development/production cost of the axle insulator might be prohibitive regardless. Adding a new length for solid axles involves no development costs, with the only impediment being the minimum production quantity. The insulation bushing is constant across all axle lengths and wheel diameters, and that tooling cost already has been amortized. And there’s no operational or aesthetic reason to upgrade Kato split-axle wheels, so that market share is non-existent.

I think the best available option may be to experiment with Kato split-axle passenger wheelsets to see if there is a fit.

[simsuper80]

I might experiment with kato wheelsets and see if they can roll just as well

[simsuper80]

Welp.....

Not sure if I recommended doing this anymore because the ESM wheelsets gave me CONSTANT de-railments. I will experiment with kato wheel sets to see if things improve.  If not, I seriously might sell my entire set

[simsuper80]

Update.

So i just realized that the wheelsets are available in 2 different axle lengths.  .540 and .553

I happen to chose the .540 wheels and they were slightly too narrow compared to the rapido wheels. I'm going to try the .553 axle lengths and see what happens

[peteski]

Your initial post seemed to imply that the train ran really well after the wheel replacement.  What happened?

[simsuper80]

It ran well at home, rolling even better than my kato superliners, but on a modular club layout, the flanges of the ESM wheels pick on the tiniest imperfections in the track and de-rail very easily. In places where the train had issues, other cars had no problems.

So I will Continue to experiment with the different ESM axle length, as well as with tangent and Intermountain wheels.

[nkalanaga]

That sounds like a track problem, but since you can't fix the track, slightly deeper flanges are probably the only solution.

Kato has used deeper flanges on their earlier passenger cars.  You might still be able to find some of those, if necessary.

[Dwight in Toronto]

Simsuper80, your persistence is admirable, and I wish you well.   I can’t help but think back on the deplorable rollability of those N scale Athearn Bombardier bi-level coaches several years back, and some of the truly extraordinary investigations that some folks here on TRW pursued (and did so for quite some time). 

I just can’t help reiterating that the fundamental annoyance and disappointment is that none of us should be having to undertake ANY of these corrective pursuits, considering what we paid for these otherwise perfect models. 

Worst-in-class rollability and coach lighting performance should have been readily recognized during preliminary factory QC investigation - how & why Rapido let this slip by is beyond me.

[bbussey]

That sounds like a track problem...

Definitely a track problem. The ESM axles are shouldered, so it’s nearly impossible for the wheels to be out of gauge. Fully impossible for the wheel gauge to be too narrow, and too wide would result in derailments elsewhere as well.

[simsuper80]

Definitely a track problem. The ESM axles are shouldered, so it’s nearly impossible for the wheels to be out of gauge. Fully impossible for the wheel gauge to be too narrow, and too wide would result in derailments elsewhere as well.

Hmm. In my experience so far with kato unitrack, the esm wheels will try to grab on to the end of the piece of rail that connects to the other piece of track. None of the other cars/wheels I have do this. I can even hear a clicking sound when the cars run on them, only on a modular layout, they just de-rail.

[oakcreekco]

Simsuper80, your persistence is admirable, and I wish you well.   I can’t help but think back on the deplorable rollability of those N scale Athearn Bombardier bi-level coaches several years back, and some of the truly extraordinary investigations that some folks here on TRW pursued (and did so for quite some time). 

I just can’t help reiterating that the fundamental annoyance and disappointment is that none of us should be having to undertake ANY of these corrective pursuits, considering what we paid for these otherwise perfect models. 

Worst-in-class rollability and coach lighting performance should have been readily recognized during preliminary factory QC investigation - how & why Rapido let this slip by is beyond me.

Lack of good engineering, production control, and testing.