Atlas 60' Passenger Cars- Body Mount Couplers- Lighting

[narrowminded]

Has anybody added body mount couplers or lighting to their 60' passenger cars? 

I ask about body mounts because I don't really like the distance between cars.  Atlas provided longer diaphragms but they don't make up the distance that exists either.  One problem I see if I do get them close coupled, with the diaphragms, is access to the couplers for an uncoupling pick.  That'll be a decision I have to make but I suspect it'll be OK as I'm not likely to want to break up the train, just uncouple from a loco.  I think the coupler at the loco end will be accessible.  If any have done this do you have any recommendations for coupler model, length, height or any install issues?  It looks like there are two closely spaced holes provided under the body end that could be tapped for body mounts.

Also, has anybody taken one of these apart?  Lighting is what's being considered and maybe populating them with a few passengers.  Experiences welcome.

[davefoxx]

Mark,

I take it that you don't use magnets in/under the track to uncouple your cars.  As you know, neither do I.  So, if uncoupling from your engine is your main concern, as long as the coupler on the passenger car just peeks out from under the diaphragm, you should still be able to get your pick in there to uncouple the consist IF there's no diaphragm on the locomotive.

If it were me (and I haven't really been in N scale since you left my house in 2017), I'd use MT 1015 couplers and mount the coupler, so that the pulling face of the coupler is just beyond the diaphragm.  If that's too close to allow the cars to run reliably on your layout, you'll have to experiment until you can find the sweet spot between as-close-coupling-as-you-can-get versus reliable running.

Hope this helps,
DFF

[Maletrain]

I have been thinking about this, but haven't gotten around to doing anything.  One issue with diaphragms closing the whole space between cars is lack of access from above for the uncoupling pick. Another issue is whether there is actually clearance to lift one car away from another if the diaphragms want to expand a little when there is no abutting diaphragm to push back.  If there is not enough vertical space above the coupler for another coupler above it to still be below the bottom of the diaphragm, then lifting one car to uncouple would not work very well.  And there does not seem to be that much space between the couplers and the bottom of the Atlas diaohragms.

I have been thinking about making a portable magnetic uncoupler that looks like a tuning fork held points-down.  Straddling the couplers of a pair of joined cars with a magnetic horseshoe should be at least as good as using a fixed magnet that doesn't rise above track level.

[thomasjmdavis]

I haven't actually converted couplers yet on my Atlas cars, but I do have one apart for painting.  The underframe has a pilot hole near the end of the car that I have assumed is to provide a center to drill out for a 1015.  It appears to be in the right place. 

My cars - 2 baggage and an RPO, all came with 2 sets of diaphragms in different sizes - the smaller, I assume, for closer coupling.  It's probably also possible to substitute a ALM heavyweight diaphragm. 

[Maletrain]

I see that the Atlas site does not have an exploded view of these shorty passenger cars in its parts section.  I am going to call Atlas tomorrow and see if I can get one to share, here.  Unless somebody else here already has found one.

Thomasjdavis, were there any particular tricks to getting these cars apart?

[narrowminded]

I see that the Atlas site does not have an exploded view of these shorty passenger cars in its parts section.  I am going to call Atlas tomorrow and see if I can get one to share, here.  Unless somebody else here already has found one.

Thomasjdavis, were there any particular tricks to getting these cars apart?

I have already requested that as well as a couple of couplers that don't like to stay coupled in reverse on a curve.  The rest of eight  do fine.  I may not even wind up using them if I go with body mounting.

If nobody has anything specific I'll go ahead and figure it out but was thinking that there might be somebody who's already been there.  Maybe that's going to be me.   I may try Z couplers.  Any reason not to?

[narrowminded]

... but I do have one apart for painting.  The underframe has a pilot hole near the end of the car that I have assumed is to provide a center to drill out for a 1015.  It appears to be in the right place. 

My cars - 2 baggage and an RPO, all came with 2 sets of diaphragms in different sizes - the smaller, I assume, for closer coupling.  It's probably also possible to substitute a ALM heavyweight diaphragm.

Anything to be aware of or warnings in the disassembly?  Mine came with the extra diaphragms, too.  Even if they're going to be helpful they aren't enough to close up the gap with the coupling rig that they came with so I'll try to get that sorted first then possibly mix and match diaphragms.

[narrowminded]

Mark,

I take it that you don't use magnets in/under the track to uncouple your cars. 

DFF

Thanks Dave,
Your old layout is still chugging along.   I haven't used magnets but this application has me thinking about a possible topside affair that can be installed and removed with little to no permanence.  Possibly something that can be disguised as a small platform, maybe some trackside debris or loose ties, something like that.  Easily installed and easily removed.  I'm going to experiment with some simple magnets in the next day or so to see if I can get the functions needed and then worry about disguising it if the experiments work.  I have an assortment of magnet sizes and shapes to play with and suspect I can get the needed function from some combination of them.

[thomasjmdavis]

I see that the Atlas site does not have an exploded view of these shorty passenger cars in its parts section.  I am going to call Atlas tomorrow and see if I can get one to share, here.  Unless somebody else here already has found one.

Thomasjdavis, were there any particular tricks to getting these cars apart?

The floor/underframe pops out if you gently pry the sides away a little (put a toothpick in the hold it, ala a Kato loco, and then gently pry out the floor with a small screwdriver.  THE PROBLEM I had was that I broke most of the steps off the  baggage and RPOs which are a brittle plastic rather than the delrin ones used on a MTL car.

The roof, sides and end are all one part.  I could not get the weight out of the roof.  Yeah, you read that right, the weight is in the roof. 

I was successful in mounting the 1015s using the pilot hole in the underframe.  However, part 2 of my plan is to replace the trucks (2 out of the 3 cars essentially don't roll worth a sh**.  The one that does is from the second batch, so maybe they have addressed it) with MTL six wheel (the Atlas has a similar offset).  The problem I see is that between the body mounted truck, and the MTL trucks being a bit larger than the Atlas, the coupler limits the swing of the trucks.  It seems to manage it's way through a #4 turnout, but I would predict it fouling on a lot of layout curves.

The axle length on the Atlas wheelsets is .568 according to my trusty calipers- so I don't think replacing the axles is a viable solution.  Which is too bad, since the Altas truck is modeled after an earlier, lighter, design than the MTL- and appropriate for earlier or lighter cars.

[thomasjmdavis]

narrowminded-

I don't see any reason why a Z scale coupler wouldn't work. You might need to shim a bit in order to get it to proper height from the rail.

[Maletrain]

Thanks Dave,
Your old layout is still chugging along.   I haven't used magnets but this application has me thinking about a possible topside affair that can be installed and removed with little to no permanence.  Possibly something that can be disguised as a small platform, maybe some trackside debris or loose ties, something like that.  Easily installed and easily removed.  I'm going to experiment with some simple magnets in the next day or so to see if I can get the functions needed and then worry about disguising it if the experiments work.  I have an assortment of magnet sizes and shapes to play with and suspect I can get the needed function from some combination of them.

I have found that that Bachmann magnets that go under the track work much better than the narrower magnets that fit on the ties between the rails.  The real difference seems to be how far the magnets pull the trip pins to the side - wider magnets just work better.  But, those Bachmann versions are hard to remove from under the track.

That is why I am thinking the most flexible approach is to put a small strong magnet on each side of the car couplers, with something like a 2-pronged fork holding them at the right spacing and bottoming on the roadbed to get the right height.  Using that instead of a pick seems like it has the benefit of the pick that it doesn't uncouple when unintended, and it has the benefit of the magnet that makes it unnecessary to get the point of the pick into exactly the right place to uncouple the cars.  While using a pick sometimes works like magic, I always seem to find a pair of cars that just fight back for far too long - even when I am using one of those dental brush picks.

[nkalanaga]

The biggest problem with a Z scale coupler, at least the MT 903, would be swing on curves.  The longest cars I've tried are 53 scale feet (4 actual inches) over pulling faces, and those will go around a 10 inch radius.  They don't necessarily LIKE it, but they work, and stay on the track.

[bbussey]

I have only the RPO, so I don't have any advice on illuminating the interior.  But for the couplers, I drilled/tapped the existing dimple and installed 1015s.  I kept the existing trucks/wheelsets.

[newt749]

I've been thinking of purchasing some of these 60' passenger cars from Atlas as they would fit nicely into my layout theme. I appreciate the info that you guys have provided on the couplers and diaphragms. I wasn't aware that Atlas included diaphragms with the cars.

With respect to uncoupling, would it be possible to disguise an uncoupler under the rails as a small culvert. In order to uncouple, one would insert a magnet into the culvert, locate the "sweet" spot for uncoupling and voila. I know that this might be difficult for some layouts that are already completed and finding the right magnet to insert isn't going to be easy, but it might work.

Rob

[thomasjmdavis]

I was just answering a PM about this subject, and came to a realization.

For my own modeling purposes, I would have been better off if Atlas had just released these cars as body-shells.  The tooling is very good and a huge improvement (correct length, better rivets, vastly better paint and lettering) over the old Bachmann shorties.  But for the rest, I could have chopped the body off a MTL RPO and modified the chassis to take the Atlas body, and ended up with a car that was properly weighted (in the floor, not the roof), rolled better, and had MTL body mounted couplers- for the same cost as the Atlas that needs so much work.  And I probably could also figure out a way to use the MTL delrin stirrups.  As I mentioned in an earlier post, I have been unsuccessful in keeping Atlas stirrups attached to the bodies when disassembling to paint, or just in regular handling.

Some years ago, I wrote a suggestion that MTL should consider doing a bodyshell to convert their RPO to a mail-baggage or baggage car (as many railroads did with older or obsolete full RPOs).  These would also make good candidates for resin casting or 3d printed projects along the lines of shells Skytop used to produce to fit troop cars.