I really don't know what I'm doing with designing a switching/siding layout

[voldemort]

I'm about to start the second stage of my railway.  The first sits off to the left of this diagram- its on a door layout.  On the right there will be, as yet unconceived, basically door sized layout above the double crossover.  Making a u shaped layout with the switching yard in the center of the u. 

I have never done a switching operation.   I would like to try building up trains as I've seen on youtube.  I do need storage for my trains on the track.  There is some on my door layout but nothing longer than about 2 feet.   The door also has a turntable in it and is designed as a continuously running layout allowing two trains to not intersect as they run

I'd welcome any and all advice on this.  As I said, I don't know what I'm doing.

[nkalanaga]

"Switching" as in classification yard switching?  I don't know that I've ever seen anyone concentrate on that, but I can give a few suggestions.  My father worked in the Pasco hump yard, NP/BN, and I assume you want a flat yard, but the ideas are much the same.

For some ideas, I'd suggest starting here:  https://fobnr.org/bn/bn-1970-yard-maps/.  Pasco is there, but also a lot of smaller yards.  You might find one that will work.

Basically, you have a very small yard.  A "good" classification yard should be able to hold a train's worth of cars on one classification track.  A usable yard should be able to build a train from no more than two or three tracks.  If you plan on running short trains, yours might work.

You need at least one switch lead at one end.  Leads at both ends are nice, if the yard is big enough,and busy enough, to need more than one switch engine.  Two leads at the same end will basically result in two yards, because you can't switch the same track, or group of tracks, with two crews at the same time!  The Pasco yard had one hump, and multiple hump leads.  An incoming train would be pulled to a hump lead, then, when its turn came, shoved over the hump.  For a small yard, one lead is enough, just pull the trains from the "receiving yard" as needed.

Which is the second requirement:  the receiving yard.  This is where arriving trains are parked, the engines and caboose/FRED removed, and, in the case of the Pasco yard, the brakes "bled off".   Left to sit a while, any car leaks air, and the brakes will set on their own.  Very inconvenient for humping!  That's what the "bleed rod" on the underside of the car is for. 

At Pasco, the receiving yard was along the west side of the north-south yard, which won't work for your yard.  For a limited space, it would probably be best to use it as the switch leads, although that would be inconvenient.  You'd have to have a way for engines to get out of the receiving yard, to the engine terminal, in both directions, without going through the classification yard.  That would require extra switches, and space, but could be done.  On the prototype, with plenty of length available, it wouldn't be that hard.  In your case, with an existing layout to the left, I don't know where you'd put it.  Your yard map doesn't have any tracks long enough for a good sized train, so you can't combine the receiving and classification yards.

The last thing needed is the departure yard.   It probably should be at the other end, but, with enough switches, could be next to the receiving yard.  Cuts would be pulled from the classification yard to there, assembled into a train, and the engine/caboose added.  Like the receiving yard, it needs access to both the engine terminal and the mainline. 

Now, if you want to model a "marshaling yard", that would be a little different.  There you'd have locals bringing cars in, a few at a time, and the yard would combine them into trains going to a classification yard.  That might work with your yard.  You'd also, probably, have through trains, or a transfer run, dropping off blocks of cars from the classification yard, to be sent out with the locals.  After all, you can't send cars out if you don't have any coming in!  This type of yard was common in the coal fields of Appalachia.  It wasn't common in the Midwest and Northwest, as the traffic flow wasn't as steady.  Coal runs year-round, wheat and other farm products are seasonal, and the yard would be idle much of the year.

[Maletrain]

It would help a lot for you to provide a diagram of the already created door layout that you say is to the left of this diagram, plus at least some idea of of the yet-to-be-planned extension to the top of the right side of this diagram.  I am not able to envision how the tracks on the three pieces mentioned fit into a "U" shape, without some more specific description.

The diagram shown has the problem that there is no visible "lead" track for the loco to pull cars from one siding far enough to clear a turnout so that they can be pushed into another siding.  Perhaps the lead(s) are intended to be on the layout pieces not yet shown?  But, it is hard to give any useful advice until we know how trains will enter the yard and leave the yard in both directions.

For one thing, it would be helpful to know if the trains that are made up and broken down come from and go out to only one direction.  If so, then it might be reasonable to make the sidings single ended, except for one or a couple that are "arrival/departure tracks" that need to allow locos (and cabooses?) to be removed from the ends of the car strings.  That would allow for a lot more siding length for cars in the yard if it could be single ended.

And, are you using cabooses?  If so, there would need to be some place to keep them when they are not attached to a train.

And please give us an idea of how long you want your trains to be.

[thomasjmdavis]

My advice would be to get hold of a copy of John Armstrong's "Track Planning for Realistic Operation"- a short book (100 pages) with a ton of information on yards, industrial switching, and service trackage.  I've found it invaluable for the last three layouts I built.  I don't know if this is still available new from Kalmbach, but they had multiple printings of each of several editions since the book was originally written in the 1960s- and many of the various printings/editions are available on the used market.  Mine is 5th printing of the 2nd edition (1988).

[NtheBasement]

As mentioned above you lack a dedicated lead track, and Armstrong's book is the best investment I ever made in model railroading.

Additionally, a double-ended yard is great if you have 20 feet or more to work with, but for your area two ladders rob too much length from the yard tracks.  I'd go with stub tracks and a runaround.  And you may want a wye or turntable to turn locos.

[johnb]

here are some in progress pictures of my switching layout, first is the yard...


note that there is room for a steam loco and tender after the switch on the main...

the yard with the junction....there is going to be a single staging track


Here is the middle of the layout

and the other end


The main two things for a switching layout is to give yourself room to work, and have a run-around track. It is meant to be a relaxing hobby, switching puzzles do just the opposite.

[Ed Kapuscinski]

My advice would be to get hold of a copy of John Armstrong's "Track Planning for Realistic Operation"- a short book (100 pages) with a ton of information on yards, industrial switching, and service trackage.  I've found it invaluable for the last three layouts I built.  I don't know if this is still available new from Kalmbach, but they had multiple printings of each of several editions since the book was originally written in the 1960s- and many of the various printings/editions are available on the used market.  Mine is 5th printing of the 2nd edition (1988).

In addition to this, there are a few other books worth checking out:
https://kalmbachhobbystore.com/product/digital-download/mrpdf035
https://www.walthers.com/book-the-model-railroader-s-guide-to-freight-yards

[peteski]

"Switching" as in classification yard switching?  I don't know that I've ever seen anyone concentrate on that, but I can give a few suggestions.  My father worked in the Pasco hump yard, NP/BN, and I assume you want a flat yard, but the ideas are much the same.

Seeing his giant RR yard design I understand why you would thing he wants to concentrate on a classification yard switching.  And here I thought I was the one always taking things too literally. 

I suspect by "switching/siding" layout he means a typical layout designed for OPS, where there is/are RR yard(s), main line, and multiple sidings serving industries (and possibly even some off-layout destinations).  Basically a layout imitating 1:1 scale railroad operation.

[nkalanaga]

Peteski:  That's possible, and I did consider that.   On the other hand, he said "I would like to try building up trains as I've seen on youtube.", which sounds like yard work.

For industrial switching, two doors will give plenty of space.  One can pack quite an industrial area in that, and the only yard needed would be some interchange tracks, with room to run around cars as needed to match the turnout directions.

[Ed Kapuscinski]

"Switching" as in classification yard switching?  I don't know that I've ever seen anyone concentrate on that, but I can give a few suggestions.

Cough https://conrail1285.com/tag/ncr-windsor-st-yard-in-york-layout/ cough. 

[davefoxx]

Cough https://conrail1285.com/tag/ncr-windsor-st-yard-in-york-layout/ cough. 

. . . and Lee’s Ridgely Yard before that communal yard was built.

DFF

[Maletrain]

When/if voldemort ever gets back with some more info about how this fits into the rest of his layout, there are several S curves that are worth addressing.

[voldemort]

Sorry- I tried to do this this morning.  THEN I discovered I'd booked air tickets for Dec 27th 2022, not next week

I have taken some pictures.  I tried to put it all into one panorama, but it wouldn't make  it

The layout is complicated with the different layers.  The part on the left- it comes about a foot out from a turnout on the main loop.  It will connect to the bottom of my ladder.

On the right is what is currently a siding.  I will put the curve onto it to attach to the upper part of the ladder

With regards to the part on the right- its a yet to be determined.  It will be at least a loop connecting both parts of the double crossover.  I'll get to that when I get to it.

What am I going to do with it?  In the beginning, store some ready to go trains.  Then I hope to learn how to basically do the classification yard thing (ie, make trains as they do 'real' trains.

Thank you

[voldemort]

A couple of more pictures- the curve comes off of the bottom of layout- where the SP loco is, but taking the curved arm of the turnout

[nkalanaga]

Ed and DFF:  I'm sure it's been done, and probably more often than I realize, but I don't think I've ever SEEN, in print, online, or in person, a layout consisting primarily of a classification yard.  Someone in the 70s built a working hump yard in HO, and it was mentioned several times in the magazines, but even then I don't remember seeing an article on it.

Layouts WITH such yards, yes, and many of them had assigned crews during operating sessions.  But they weren't the main focus of the layout, just an important part of it.

Looking at Voldemort's pictures, it looks like that may be the case here as well, as he seems to have a fairly well developed layout.