N Scale Railroading Magazine - subscription refund? PART 2

[T-2_Snoot]

[C855B]

I strongly disagree with this sentiment.

Kirk has been a valuable resource to the N scale community for many, many years. A printed, slick-paper, color periodical is an incredible amount of work; I should know, I used to be in the business. Overall changes in the hobby, especially the loss of local hobby shops as a sales vehicle undoubtedly hurt his business model beyond recovery. I consider my unrequited subscription to be a contribution in support of a a job well done. If it helped cover outstanding bills which let him continue with an online version, so much the better.

[bbussey]

I agree with @C855B, enthusiastically.

[learmoia]

This justified another thread for the same topic?

[ai5629]

I agree with @C855B, enthusiastically.

+2

[MVW]

I also spent a couple decades in newspaper and magazine publishing, and agree with @C855B wholeheartedly. A little empathy would go a long way here.

As someone whose hobby budget is limited (did I say I spent a couple decades in newspapers?   ), I appreciate the frustration of being out a few dollars. But it's highly likely the publisher in question has lost a hell of a lot more.

Some battles are worth fighting. This one isn't.

Jim

[jereising]

I'm another on Mike's (@C855B) side. 
The scary thing is he's down to only 42 pages this last issue.
I'd hate to see us lose this valuable resource.

[SecretWeapon]

I think you guys are reading this post wrong. The 1st sentence says it all. Mike totally disagrees with the statement below. I'm guessing he wants a refund of what's left of he's subscription.
 I know Kirk is working on getting refunds out, I personally don't care if I get a refund or not. Back in 2004 when I first got sick, I emailed him & ordered a bunch of magazines I didn't have. He charged me for 3 back orders, sent me like 10 & didn't charge me shipping. It really helped the time in the hospital pass quicker.
 When I met him in Portland in 2009, I couldn't thank him enough for helping me get through one of the toughest time in my life up to that point.
 

[Rossford Yard]

Put me 2X in the "don't care about my refund" category.  I signed up for 3 years, just months before they announced the change.  Kirk did talk about refunds initially, but I even emailed him saying to just keep it.  I have met Kirk, like him and know he is only trying to do N Scale good, love the mag, as it's the more professional (IMHO) of the two N Scale specific mags (or at least just seems to capture my interests better, and for the record, I do subscribe to both).

I am just not outraged at the "injustice of it all" as some tend to be.

First, I know that even if it went to small claims court or something, it would go nowhere.

Second, even at 3 years and over $100, that just isn't a lot of money to me.  I figure I would pop for that at nearly any LHS trip, or for a new loco I really don't need, in a heartbeat, so it's not that much money to me if I look at it realistically.  (I know we often don't want to do that!)  I know there are some who have much smaller MR budgets than me, and I feel for them, but the $36 per year just didn't dent my hobby enjoyment as much as no publication would have.  And, while not trying to be harsh, I bet there would be some way to cut that $36 if you really needed to, as you obviously have done so in the past to keep in the hobby you love.

If that donation kept his magazine alive - online or otherwise - I was glad to do it.  It's sort of like the proto roads buying locos from both mfgs, or us buying from the LHS.  IF we want them there, we sometimes need to do a bit more than the minimum to help them.

Third, technically speaking, it's not like I stopped getting his product.  I have to read on my computer or download and print using already paid for net browsers and printer, and about a penny a sheet in printing (and I can choose to only print the articles I really want to read) so that cost is nill.  How many times have you bought something which went on sale a week later, and paid more than the next guy?  Unfair, maybe, but it happens.

Lastly, unlike some, I figure all our N Scale suppliers run on tight profit margins and given the move away from print media, which applies to magazines, they may have it even worse than Mfgs.  I always check the subscriptions in the January issue.  IIRC, the peak for both N magazines was just 11,000, and I think they were down to 7,000 last year.  At $3 average sale for them (50% of rack rate) they were only making $21,000 from subscriptions, with the rest from advertising.  Basically, Kirk was probably forced to give up about a third of his operating costs to stay afloat and eliminating printing and mailing got him back on keel (no inside knowledge, just my thoughts) and allowed him to provide his very valuable service to N scalers.  Actually, if you think of articles, etc. as intellectual property and not as magazines, we haven't lost a thing, which IMHO is what we ought to be most concerned about.

Not trying to cause any outrage here, or even get anyone to agree with me.  Just sharing my thinking.

[learmoia]

Is it me, or has anyone else noticed a few of the newest members have been a bit more toxic than usual right out of the gate.. (Intentional or unintentional..)

I forsee another "Why is my score -##???" thread...

[Sokramiketes]

How much are you out?  $20?  Can I pay it on Kirk's behalf?

[cgw]

Several. years ago I was involved with hosting the NMRA convention in Detroit.   I had the honor to work with several of the publications in the hobby.  All the publishers were to notch honorable folks dedicated to the hobby.   The things that I learned from them was very simple.   These are a labor of love not a business to retire from to the beaches of the south shores..... All of them operated on a shoe string tight budget.       Today several of the publishers have either sold their publication or have ceased to exist.    Think of mainline modeler, prototype modeler, rail model journal, railroad modeler.... there are several other that ceased to exist.   Yea I had lost a couple of bucks on subscriptions but so what.  The publishing industry is undergoing a seismic shift chasing a few remaining readers.    The transition from print to digital has been a very tough for all those who are involved and employed in it.  You are getting the magazine now free on line. (as long as his business model holds out).   The number one complaint of most of the publishers has always been.... we need more articles by authors in the hobby,   submit them.    So with that said. "suck it up buddy,  count your blessings and get out there and do something in your hobby by promoting it, writing an article, join a local club etc." 

[learmoia]

I had honestly forgotten about this magazine until this thread.. (even though its free...)..

I'll circle back and bookmark it as one of the places to check periodically..

In looking at the digital issues, it is refreshing to see 'plywood' (unfinished scenes) on the cover.. (which I rarely see on print magazines.... unless MR is recycling thier model railroading for dummies series or articles on a new NOT N scale layout.

The digital format gives them freedom to not be dependent on newsstand sales.. so flashy cover photos are less important.. and (at least for me).. feel more accessible for average modelers to get featured in the magazine.

I wasn't a regular subscriber.. but I guess take comfort that your funds are furthering the on line publication..

~Ian

[delamaize]

Is it me, or has anyone else noticed a few of the newest members have been a bit more toxic than usual right out of the gate.. (Intentional or unintentional..)

I forsee another "Why is my score -##???" thread...

Unfortunately, I agree....

[learmoia]

@tom mann needs to install a Toxic filter for the 'new member 3TomBot'