BLI USRA Pacifics on the delivery schedule for May

[prr7161]

Well, it happened, but the announcement so far is pretty stealthy (just on the delivery schedule for May 2021):

https://www.broadway-limited.com/paragon3usraheavyandlightpacific4-6-2.aspx

Like with the Mikes, as-built headlights, trailing trucks, and tenders, plus some foob schemes.

[prr7161]

Some questions for Erie heavy and B&O light Pacifics:

Looks like the Erie heavies all got Elesco FW heaters and new tenders, but some retained the original trailing truck.  How close in size are the small Erie tenders with built-up coal bunkers to a typical USRA tender?  Any sources out there for the tender trucks?






B&O looks like they retained the original trailing trucks and tenders to the end, with some built-up coal bunkers.  When did the B&O switch over from a number plate to a Capitol Dome casting on the smokebox?





Thanks for any help!

[Point353]

Given that the C&O historical society is having Micro-Trains make (a second run of) a model of the George Washington passenger train, you'd think that there might be some interest in a C&O 4-6-2.
It wouldn't have the pumps mounted on the front of the smokebox and a Vanderbilt style tender, but at least it would be something to pull the train.

[SkipGear]

Just wish they had high headlights. That is the hardest detail to fix. B&O P5's with high headlights would cost me a lot of money. As is, I have already have enough Pacifics with the wrong front end. The Heavies are a stand in, P7's were B&O built, also had Delta trailing trucks, not the "usra" truck.

http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/bo5210s.jpg

[SkipGear]

Just found this article posted about the USRA designs by the ASME from the 70's.

https://www.asme.org/wwwasmeorg/media/resourcefiles/aboutasme/who%20we%20are/engineering%20history/landmarks/147-baltimore-ohio-4500-freight-usra-2-8-2a.pdf

[Maletrain]

Tony, when you get your B&O "Cincinnatian", the I-5 cabooses and the C-15 express cars done, how about replacement shells for some 4-6-2 and 2-8-2 mechanisms to make some B&O P7s, P5s (and 6s), and my real desire, a P1d.   Plus the Q-4 mikados.

Maybe the ones that were really just shop changes from the standard USRA designs could be done well enough with just new smoke box fronts with high headlights and maybe new cabs.  But, others would require whole boilers, like my P1d.

[williek]

BLI did the HO version of the SP 4-6-0 with a cylindrical tender. The MP N scale Pacifics with Vandy tenders (UP, SP, SP semi-streamlined) were very popular. I wonder if BLI found that they couldn't get acceptable sound from a small cylindrical tender. I think I've seen photos of SP semi-cylindrical tenders that were roughly the same size/volume as the standard tenders.

https://www.broadway-limited.com/5910heavypacific4-6-2sp2485daylightschemeparagon3sounddcdcchonp.aspx

[PiperguyUMD]

I’m curious to see the construction of these. I’m hoping to 3D print a shell to replace the stock shell. Hoping that these are a better candidate for this process than the MP Pacifics

[prr7161]

Hoping that these are a better candidate for this process than the MP Pacifics

Also hoping these are decent kitbash fodder.  I can use one or two of the offered roadnames but there are several other USRA-ish Pacifics I hope to complete down the road.

[jargonlet]

Looks like the Erie heavies all got Elesco FW heaters and new tenders, but some retained the original trailing truck.  How close in size are the small Erie tenders with built-up coal bunkers to a typical USRA tender?

That would all depend on the year. I have the book on the heavy Pacifics the ELHS released. The Erie never bought any newer passenger power because they kept rebuilding the Pacifics. If I counted right they were rebuilt as a group five times. Thus there are many different versions of them depending on the year. They even went as far as to rebuild them with a cast steel frame.

They all did have the elesco, I believe that it said that they all received them in 1929 with the acceptation of the one that was delivered with it. They spent the majority of their life with the 10,000 gal. tender with coal bunk extensions. One of the rebuilds is listed as 1940-47. This was the rebuild that they received the larger tenders. If I remember right, this was the rebuild that they got the boxpox drivers. It depended on the loco. Some got all of the drivers changed to boxpox and some got none. It might be just the pictures I've seen but it seems to me that the most common arrangement was just the center drivers being changed to boxpox.

As to answering your question, from the drawings bli posted, it looks like the same tender as on the mikado. If so, it would be a good starting point for the 10,00 gal tender.

[SkipGear]

Tony, when you get your B&O "Cincinnatian", the I-5 cabooses and the C-15 express cars done, how about replacement shells for some 4-6-2 and 2-8-2 mechanisms to make some B&O P7s, P5s (and 6s), and my real desire, a P1d.   Plus the Q-4 mikados.

Maybe the ones that were really just shop changes from the standard USRA designs could be done well enough with just new smoke box fronts with high headlights and maybe new cabs.  But, others would require whole boilers, like my P1d.

SHHH, already tinkering around with an E-27 conversion for the Bachmann 2-8-0.

[jargonlet]

Something else that I found interesting was that the Erie had some other classes of Pacifics that were assigned to freight service and some in duel service. Once the K5 heavy Pacifics were bumped into secondary service by the f3, they were kept around for a while for standby power. Some of them got assigned to Marion, OH. This is a quote from the book Erie USRA Heavy Pacifics by D.G. Biernacki: "From the spring of 1947 through 1950 the diesels on no. 7 were cut off at Huntington, Indiana to be serviced and return east on no. 8 that same day. Earlier in the day a K5 would be dispatched from Marion on a local freight to Huntington where it would drop its train and wait for no. 7 to arrive. The pacific would then run no. 7 to Chicago and return east on no. 8 the next day to Huntington and complete the cycle. This arrangement required two engines in a pool to cover no. 7 and 8 west of Huntington. The delivery of the E8s in January of 1951 brought this operation to an end."

For those who might not need more passenger locos, this may be a good excuse to run them in freight service.

[asarge]

Given that the C&O historical society is having Micro-Trains make (a second run of) a model of the George Washington passenger train, you'd think that there might be some interest in a C&O 4-6-2.
It wouldn't have the pumps mounted on the front of the smokebox and a Vanderbilt style tender, but at least it would be something to pull the train.

Well, the F-15 class didn't have the flying pumps or the Vandy Tenders until some were rebuilt into other classes in the 1940's. I don't think they were USRA's though. So, if they are doing Foobs, you might could make it work. I don't have access to my C&O Power or materials from the Cincinnati Subdivision but even though I would rather have the F-17's, I could do with a stand-in.

[Chris333]

Yeah those replaced frames on the Erie locos included integrated cylinder saddles for fix cracked frames.

[prr7161]

Thanks, @jargonlet , that's great info!  I could definitely use a K5 for shared through runs with the P&LE, so hoping to plausibly keep the modifications to some added detail.