Flux and Solder question

[wazzou]

I'm in the very early stages of looking at building a layout once again and planning to build my own turnouts.
I know that @robert3985 and others have recommended Superior Supersafe #30 Gel Flux and 96/4 tin/silver solder.
Can anyone point to some place that would offer both perhaps and if there is a preferred brand for the solder?

[peteski]

I got my Supersafe flux from the source Robert mentioned (it was few years ago, so I don't remember the details). As for solder I prefer the 63/37 (Sn/Pb) electronic solder because of its eutectic property.  It is much easier to get good solder joint when the solder goes immediately from liquid to solid state (no period of it being semi hardened). But this solder is likely not as hard as the one Robert recommends.  I get my solder from various electronic surplus dealers.

[Steveruger45]

I use Kester brand solder.  They make it in various recipes and it’s a quality product.

[reinhardtjh]

I ordered my Supersafe flux and supplies from:

H&N Electronics at https://www.hnflux.com/  They have both the silver solder and the flux.

The site is a mess of amateur web publishing but you can get through it eventually.

Interestingly, I found my invoice from 2014 and the silver solder is cheaper now than back then by a couple dollars.

The flux is manufactured here: https://superiorflux.com
List of distributors: https://superiorflux.com/purchase-from-a-distributor/

H&N seems to be the place that has both.  But there are several makes of suitable solder.  Kester is always a good brand and it is available on Amazon and many other places.

[wazzou]

Yeah @peteski , that's why I suggested a couple of weeks ago that an amalgamation of those helpful handlaying threads could be made a "Best of".
It's difficult to go back and find the right thread with the right info.
I looked on Superior's site at the #30 and the description said nothing about a gel.
Is there only one variant of the Supersafe #30?
I know you (Pete) do more electronics soldering than soldering to rail.  Do you think the 63/37 solder you mention would be adequate for soldering PCB/rail joints?

[peteski]

Yeah @peteski , that's why I suggested a couple of weeks ago that an amalgamation of those helpful handlaying threads could be made a "Best of".
It's difficult to go back and find the right thread with the right info.
I looked on Superior's site at the #30 and the description said nothing about a gel.
Is there only one variant of the Supersafe #30?
I know you (Pete) do more electronics soldering than soldering to rail.  Do you think the 63/37 solder you mention would be adequate for soldering PCB/rail joints?

I bought the gel version and it turned into liquid fairly quickly (that is specifically mentioned on the bottle label).  Hopefully Robert will chine in with more details on the Supersafe fluxes.

As far whether 63/37 solder produces a strong joint of rail and the copper cladding on PCB ties, I have no info - I have not done enough of those joints to give a meaningful opinion.  But I think that if the rail and copper cladding are properly cleaned before soldering, then the copper foil's epoxy adhesive will probably let go before the solder will. But that is just my opinion.

[wazzou]

I ordered my Supersafe flux and supplies from:

H&N Electronics at https://www.hnflux.com/  They have both the silver solder and the flux.

H&N seems to be the place that has both.  But there are several makes of suitable solder.  Kester is always a good brand and it is available on Amazon and many other places.

H&N is the place.  Thank you.

[Mark5]

because of its eutectic property.

I learned a new word today! 

[robert3985]

I'm in the very early stages of looking at building a layout once again and planning to build my own turnouts.
I know that @robert3985 and others have recommended Superior Supersafe #30 Gel Flux and 96/4 tin/silver solder.
Can anyone point to some place that would offer both perhaps and if there is a preferred brand for the solder?

As has been already posted, I buy mine from H & N Electronics...both Superior Supersafe No. 30 Gel, and their 96/04 Tin/Silver solder. 

My "gel" flux only stays a "gel" for about a year, then it turns into a slightly thicker than water flux.  Still works excellently. H& N also sells flux applicators and I'd make sure I bought three or four. 

For hand-building turnouts, the 96/04 Tin/Silver solder is the very best, particularly because it is FIVE TIMES AS STRONG AS 60/40 Tin/Lead...and because it doesn't contain lead.

I also use it for most of my soldering on scratch-built brass and NS projects.  The combination of the No. 30 flux and the silver-bearing solder is ideal and also really strong.  As for clean soldering, I don't see how it could get any cleaner.

I didn't use any special soldering iron for decades building my turnouts...just my Realistic 35W iron with a wedge tip, that I always kept clean and tinned on every solder joint.

I also swipe the rails I'm using on my turnouts before construction begins with a microfiber cloth dampened with Bestine (top and bottom), and buff the surface of my PCB ties with a pencil eraser to get the oxidation off. Doing these two things and using my No. 30 Supersafe flux along with the silver-bearing solder makes precise soldering very easy. 

To assist you in not applying too much solder, I recommend flattening the solder you're using with a wide-tipped smooth surfaced plier, then slitting the flattened part with a sharp Xacto knife or scalpel...then use the two tines of the fork you've just created for precise solder application.

As an anti-flux, just mark on the PCB ties with a #2 pencil, and the solder won't go past the mark, or fill in entire areas with pencil markings which will both repel solder and act as a lubricant.

If you have a lot of turnouts to build for your layout, I would highly recommend buying an American Beauty 250W Resistance Soldering Station.  It's expensive, but being able to hold your track in position while applying near instantaneous heat at the same time...then holding it in position while the solder cools and hardens greatly enhances both speed and accuracy.  I still use my old 35W Radio Shack iron for some operations...like tinning, but, for 95% of my turnout building, I use the resistance soldering station with the tweezers.

Of course, with Fast Tracks fixtures, the fixture holds the track in place, but for building turnouts on paper templates like I do, the tweezers and the resistance soldering station make a HUGE positive difference.

Cheerio!
Bob Gilmore

[pedro]

If you have a lot of turnouts to build for your layout, I would highly recommend buying an American Beauty 250W Resistance Soldering Station.  It's expensive, but being able to hold your track in position while applying near instantaneous heat at the same time...then holding it in position while the solder cools and hardens greatly enhances both speed and accuracy.  I still use my old 35W Radio Shack iron for some operations...like tinning, but, for 95% of my turnout building, I use the resistance soldering station with the tweezers.

Of course, with Fast Tracks fixtures, the fixture holds the track in place, but for building turnouts on paper templates like I do, the tweezers and the resistance soldering station make a HUGE positive difference.

Cheerio!
Bob Gilmore

Bob, I have an AB resistance soldering unit, had it for many years, but it’s the 125W model. Do you think that’s adequate or is that going to be underpowered for hand laying code 40? Do you use the 250W unit at full power? Also, I’d be curious to see how you have yours set up. I have various different hand pieces, was always a bit unsure of the right way to set it all up.

[davefoxx]

I have a tin of paste flux from Radio Shack that is pushing thirty years old.  I never imagined that it would turn out to be a lifetime supply, but, since it's not even close to being used up or going bad, here we are! 

DFF

[peteski]

I have a tin of paste flux from Radio Shack that is pushing thirty years old.  I never imagined that it would turn out to be a lifetime supply, but, since it's not even close to being used up or going bad, here we are! 

DFF

A li'l dab will do ya! 

Hopefully it is the "electronic" resin type flux, not the caustic stuff containing zinc chloride.

[robert3985]

Bob, I have an AB resistance soldering unit, had it for many years, but it’s the 125W model. Do you think that’s adequate or is that going to be underpowered for hand laying code 40? Do you use the 250W unit at full power? Also, I’d be curious to see how you have yours set up. I have various different hand pieces, was always a bit unsure of the right way to set it all up.

@pedro  The 100W American Beauty Resistance Soldering station will be just fine for hand laying C40 trackage and making turnouts.  It's also fine for C55 and C70...but, for attaching brass castings to locomotive boilers and other heavy soldering projects, the 250W is what you would need.

I don't have mine set up in any special way.  I use the tweezer attachment about 90% of the time and I've bent some of my extra tweezer tips for a couple of special applications such as soldering my 22AWG solid copper feeders to the bottom of the rail foot so they're invisible (both a good and bad thing!) and for soldering gussets onto some unsupported I-beams for some bridge models I've made.

I also use the single electrode often when I'm doing soldering operations on bridges, signals, cabooses and engines.

Most of the time, my rheostat is turned up only a few notches on my older AB station.  250 watts is pretty powerful and it's easy to vaporize .006" grabs if I'm not careful, so I turn the power down to where it takes about a second for the metal parts to heat up and melt the solder...and not flash into white-hot smoke!

One of the best things I bought to assist in holding small parts while they're being soldered is this:  https://www.micromark.com/Grounding-Vise-For-Resistance-Soldering-Unit

Also, MicroMark is having a 15% off any single purchase promotion right now.  I saw their ad in the latest Model Railroader, so if anybody is thinking about getting a resistance soldering station, now would be a good time to do it.

Cheerio!
Bob Gilmore

[nkalanaga]

Peteski:  I agree.  I have more trouble with the copper coming loose than the solder joints, and I'm using a roll of decades-old Radio Shack solder.

Part of the problem is that N scale ties are so narrow there's very little PC board, or glue, to hold the copper.

[peteski]

Peteski:  I agree.  I have more trouble with the copper coming loose than the solder joints, and I'm using a roll of decades-old Radio Shack solder.

Part of the problem is that N scale ties are so narrow there's very little PC board, or glue, to hold the copper.

True, but it might also be possible that your soldering iron is too hot, and it is overheating the copper adhesive, weakening it somewhat.