Author Topic: Horizon and Comet Cars in N & HO - Plus a lot more!  (Read 28220 times)

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kscessandriver

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Re: Horizon and Comet Cars in N & HO - Plus a lot more!
« Reply #150 on: October 20, 2021, 12:39:46 PM »
0


 :?

Didn't they use actual roller berrings in these?
:) ~Ian

Sorry, I didn't think about putting a wheel gauge on them. I put them on the track and they worked out of the box, I'm not one to go looking for problems if I don't find one.

daniel_leavitt2000

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Re: Horizon and Comet Cars in N & HO - Plus a lot more!
« Reply #151 on: October 20, 2021, 12:46:20 PM »
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Mine just arrived. Can confirm some sort of roller bearing mechanism. Weels look a bit small and have larger flanges then I expected but haven't had a good chance to look yet.
There's a shyness found in reason
Apprehensive influence swallow away
You seem to feel abysmal take it
Then you're careful grace for sure
Kinda like the way you're breathing
Kinda like the way you keep looking away

learmoia

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Re: Horizon and Comet Cars in N & HO - Plus a lot more!
« Reply #152 on: October 20, 2021, 01:57:37 PM »
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Sorry, I didn't think about putting a wheel gauge on them. I put them on the track and they worked out of the box, I'm not one to go looking for problems if I don't find one.

The initial post was a callback to the gauge issues discussed on the F units a few weeks ago....

kscessandriver

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Re: Horizon and Comet Cars in N & HO - Plus a lot more!
« Reply #153 on: October 20, 2021, 03:46:54 PM »
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The initial post was a callback to the gauge issues discussed on the F units a few weeks ago....

Yup, I picked up on that. I had a bunch of other boxes I got all at once with various rolling stock. Had it crossed my mind, I'd have checked for sure. I'm out of town again, but I'll check when I get home, and when my 2nd order comes in.

peteski

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Re: Horizon and Comet Cars in N & HO - Plus a lot more!
« Reply #154 on: October 20, 2021, 04:59:06 PM »
+3
I received my cars 2 days ago.  I'm both very happy, and somewhat disappointed.
I'm very happy that these models were produced, but disappointed in execution of some of their features.




First the trucks.  They feature an unusual design (not a bad thing in itself).  They snap onto the kingpin.  Notice on the lower left bearing that the contact strip is not located properly. While it still contacts the brass I'm going to fix it.  This is not the only car with that misalignment - other cars I bought also have the same problem.



Top view of the truck with one wheelset removed.  The electric contacts are a sandwich of a thinner piece (which contacts the bearings) and thicker part (which goes up into the contact strips in the floor.  Interesting how Rapido chose to have the contacts close to the center of the truck, where Kato and some other manufactures have the contacts closer to the outside of the cars.  I do like the open see-through design of the frame.

The wheelset/bearing assembly simply snaps in and out of the truck frame.



The details of the wheelset.  The stepped half-axle design assures that the wheels do not get tight in gauge.  The end part of the axle is 1mm in diameter, the thicker part (which rides in the bearing) is and oddball 1.28mm (1.3mm ?) in diameter.  The bearing is just standard "friction" bearing machined from brass. I'm actually glad they did not use tiny ball bearings - I predicts lots of problems with those once some debris get inside.



The fit between the axle and the bearing is very loose.  Here you see how much empty space exists between the axle and the hole in the bearing.
While I haven't done any testing, the trucks are in fact quite free-rolling.  But (and a big "but") is that the bearings are dry - no lubrication whatsoever.  Any lubricant added there would negatively affect the rolling quality.  Is it ok to run a metal-on-metal bearings unlubricated?  Only time will tell.



Next, the wheels.  Here is a photo comparing Rapido (bottom) and Kato Amfleet wheelset.  This is one of the disappointments.  Kato has upgraded their wheels to be narrower and have lower flanges.  This brand new model has a thread that is quite wide, and the flanges that are high and also quite "fat" or thick.  Very surprising that a new model has wheels which look like that, especially considering that Rapido's Osgood Bradley cars have much better looking wheels.

Also, with the oddball 1.28mm diameter axle, retrofitting better looking wheels would be difficult.



Another comparison of Kato and Rapido wheels. This shows the difference in flange depth.  I'm also not too impressed with the wheel face profile.  It is ok, but it could be better.  But I'm also not a fan of the Kato's wheel face.  The best inside-bearing truck wheels were IMO Bachmann Amfleets (the most recent release).


The other disappointment is the paint.  As soon as I took the car out of the box I noticed that the very bright silver paint was shimmering like it had lots of sparkles in it.   I first thought that this was due to very fine crazing of the model's surface (as if they used paint that is too "hot" for plastic), but after giving it a closer look, it might just be the rough texture of the paint itself (large metallic particles?). Either way, the surface is not smooth. 

Paint on the real Comet cars is a dull silver color.  Sure, you can say that I can spray some Dullcote over the silver.  Well, with masking involved it is a pain, and I should not have to do this to a brand new $50 model!

The fancy light features I feel are also not very well done.  There is a 220uF cap on the circuit board, but it doesn't really offer any keep-alive for the lights.  If one turned on the EOT lights in the car or turns off the interior lights, even short interruption will reset the circuit to the default setting.

Also, the couplers are copy of MTL couplers with stiffer spring.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2021, 12:20:33 AM by peteski »
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brill27mcb

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Re: Horizon and Comet Cars in N & HO - Plus a lot more!
« Reply #155 on: October 20, 2021, 08:28:40 PM »
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There is no paint on real Comet cars. The surface is brushed aluminum.

Rich K.
Tomix / EasyTrolley Modelers' Website
www.trainweb.org/tomix
N-Gauge Model Trolleys and Their History
www.trainweb.org/n-trolleys

peteski

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Re: Horizon and Comet Cars in N & HO - Plus a lot more!
« Reply #156 on: October 20, 2021, 08:48:09 PM »
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There is no paint on real Comet cars. The surface is brushed aluminum.

Rich K.

Sure, but the model is plastic. There are plenty of dull-silver paints available out there.  My point was that the model's body is not decorated accurately.
. . . 42 . . .

daniel_leavitt2000

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Re: Horizon and Comet Cars in N & HO - Plus a lot more!
« Reply #157 on: October 21, 2021, 02:02:43 AM »
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I will post photos when I have a chance. My mom entered the ICU today for blood clots in her lungs and a stroke. It's been - a day.

The cars look pretty close to the prototype and roll better than any other inside bearing truck I am aware of. I just wish the wheels looked a little prettier. Still the detail and electrical qualities make me think these would be good under the Bachmann Amfleet cars and I hope they make them available separately.

Looking at the cab car, I can't quite figure out what era it represents. The mini snow plow (included under the clam shell) and lack of roof lift rings make me think they modeled the original Comet II and not any of the subsequent orders placed with Bombardier. BUT the cars have ditch lights. By the time the ditch lights rolled around, these cars had been rebuilt with lift rings and diaphragms on the cab end to allow them to be used as mid-train cars. Also of note is the lack of a vandal cage on the cab window or wide yellow end stripes which would be correct for the original order into the 80's.

More annoyingly, the decal sheet does not supply me enough car numbers for all the ones I bought. Admittedly, I doubt many bought three entire trains worth. And there are no extra large car numbers for the roof. Luckily these are available from Microscale.

My planned upgrades will include a modified Atlas B23-7 low profile snow plow and vandal screens, new rubber diaphragms on the cabs, as well as lift rings.

As for the paint, Pete is right. It does come off as a bit grainy when looked at up close. Since none of the cars I have ever painted in MBTA were any better, I'm going to give them a pass for this. I'll need to hit them with matte finish anyway after applying the decals. The purple paint is dead on.

Overall, I'd give these cars a solid B+ or A-. The things they got wrong are minor details only an MBTA nerd would find. I'm OK with that. The wheels are a bit clunky, but not so bad they ruin the model. And man do these things roll well. That means I can run a realistic 5 car set with one Kato F40PH. That was my biggest worry before receiving them.

If you can find them in stock, get them.
There's a shyness found in reason
Apprehensive influence swallow away
You seem to feel abysmal take it
Then you're careful grace for sure
Kinda like the way you're breathing
Kinda like the way you keep looking away

MK

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Re: Horizon and Comet Cars in N & HO - Plus a lot more!
« Reply #158 on: October 21, 2021, 07:23:29 AM »
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I'm sorry to hear about your mom Daniel.  My best wishes to her to pull through this and for a speedy recovery.

Dwight in Toronto

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Re: Horizon and Comet Cars in N & HO - Plus a lot more!
« Reply #159 on: October 21, 2021, 04:02:11 PM »
-1
Sheesh … if it’s true that misery loves company, those of us who had a lot of disappointments with Rapido’s The Canadian should be feeling more content, knowing that expectations seem to not have been met in this camp as well.  Pity.

brill27mcb

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Re: Horizon and Comet Cars in N & HO - Plus a lot more!
« Reply #160 on: October 21, 2021, 09:58:34 PM »
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I received my cars 2 days ago.  I'm both very happy, and somewhat disappointed.
I'm very happy that these models were produced, but disappointed in execution of some of their features.
[...]
Paint on the real Comet cars is a dull silver color. 
[...]

I rest my case, and agree with you that the paint on the model does not look correct, based on your detailed photo.

Rich K.
Tomix / EasyTrolley Modelers' Website
www.trainweb.org/tomix
N-Gauge Model Trolleys and Their History
www.trainweb.org/n-trolleys

ski

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Re: Horizon and Comet Cars in N & HO - Plus a lot more!
« Reply #161 on: October 21, 2021, 10:06:25 PM »
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Daniel, I am praying for your mom to get better soon!

spookshow

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Re: Horizon and Comet Cars in N & HO - Plus a lot more!
« Reply #162 on: October 23, 2021, 06:34:28 AM »
+1
How about some pictures? As usual, RT hasn't updated their website with pictures of the finished product.

Thanks!
-Mark

daniel_leavitt2000

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Re: Horizon and Comet Cars in N & HO - Plus a lot more!
« Reply #163 on: October 24, 2021, 03:54:40 PM »
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One more annoyance - the wheels are 32-33" wide, not 36". I thought they looked a little small.
There's a shyness found in reason
Apprehensive influence swallow away
You seem to feel abysmal take it
Then you're careful grace for sure
Kinda like the way you're breathing
Kinda like the way you keep looking away

wcfn100

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Re: Horizon and Comet Cars in N & HO - Plus a lot more!
« Reply #164 on: October 24, 2021, 06:46:46 PM »
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One more annoyance - the wheels are 32-33" wide, not 36". I thought they looked a little small.

Probably scanned the wheels.  :ashat:

Jason