Anyone see the IM SD40-2s at the show

[unittrain]

Seen the decorated models on their Facebook page just wondering if anyone had seen them at the show?

[drgw0579]

None of us apparently could get weekend passes away.  But Model Railroad Hobbyist has perhaps the best set of photos of stuff, including the SD40-2.
http://model-railroad-hobbyist.com/node/23530

Bill Kepner

[daniel_leavitt2000]

Except the goofy Atlas HT-C trucks, they look GOOOD

[Ed Kapuscinski]

Except the goofy Atlas HT-C trucks, they look GOOOD

And the holes in the cab. And the misaligned DB blisters (with huge gaps around them). And the slots in the front porch walkway. And the texture-less walkways. And the jacked up handrails. And the horns. And the radiator grills don't look tall enough to my eye (but I might be wrong about that). And I think the something about the cab looks "wrong" too although I can't put my finger on it. Where's @Robbman when you need him? 

They look like exactly what I was expecting, and what they are: the people who made the SD45-2s decided to make an SD40-2.

I'm hoping some of the issues (the assembly issues) are because they're pre-production, but those are exactly the same issues I saw on the SD45-2s and the tunnel motors, and nothing was ever done about those, either.

Don't get me wrong. I don't think they look horrible. And, in fact, I'll probably end up with a fleet of them, but I wouldn't call them GOOOD.

[w neal]

I'm worried they'll be just as light too.

Hope I'm wrong.

[mcjaco]

These pics could have been taken a couple of days into the show, where they'd been manhandled by patrons.  I thought I also read that the models were damaged in transit. 

Getting tired of the bashing when looking at pre-production. 

[Kisatchie]

Getting tired of the bashing when looking at pre-production.

Damn right!


Hmm... Kiz used a
vulgarity...

[Denver Road Doug]

I'm worried they'll be just as light too.

One thing I will say...I spoke to an Intermountain rep at the OKC show this past year and he said one focus of this model is they have been working to cram as much weight in as possible.   And this info was unsolicited...I didn't specifically ask about that, he just went right into it when I asked about the SD40-2.   He said that is why they were taking so long. (and proceeded to tell me they would be here in June, so....)    But anyway....if they get here "light" I would be shocked given his almost freakish devotion to pushing that feature.

Shocked, but not surprised.   

[Dave V]

These pics could have been taken a couple of days into the show, where they'd been manhandled by patrons.  I thought I also read that the models were damaged in transit. 

Getting tired of the bashing when looking at pre-production.

Much of what I saw in those pics looked like damage and not production flaws.  I can't speak to the overall dimensions or performance, but I see where cab window shades have been sheared off, handrails bent or broken, and handrails popped out of the cab walls...consistent with damage.  The DB blister gap probably isn't damage, but IM isn't the only company that seems to have this problem from time to time.

As I've been drowning in 1956-era Pennsy awesomeness I've not paid Conrail much attention lately, so these are not on my radar right now.  Unfortunately, as with all things IMRC, they'll be very limited run, so I may miss out altogether.  We'll see.

[basementcalling]

All I think I should say is that I was not impressed by the photos from the NTS, even allowing for the high probability that some of the things that stood out to me were likely handling damage.

The trucks aren't a handling issue, nor is the DB blister issue. The handrails could also just look funny in the camera angles used, but handrail durability was a past issue on their models, so the jury is still out in my mind on that.

Until I see one operate and can give it a once over in person, I'll hold off on reserving a unit. I hope when I get the oppportunity to see one in person I am blown away and want to buy them.

[Puddington]

Take this to the bank; within ten minutes of a show opening your sample models are not for for photographing.... even the most experienced modellers who are careful and trusted will end up causing "damage" to show models; they are standing, usually in a crowd, are being bumped and jostled, they are usually rushing because the next guy wants to see the model and they are turning the model over, around and about..... give the model half a show and you're lucky if it's in one piece. In fact I told a magazine photographer I happened to meet just before doors ope at Springfield two years ago that if he didn't come over and shoot the GMD-1 now, before the public got to it, I couldn't let him shoot ti at all because of the condition it would be in and how that would reflect on the model.

Pre production models do not always assemble as well as production; that's because they are PRE PRODUCTION... we're still developing them. Parts are being altered, form and fit testing hasn't been completed, the material the part is made of might not even be what the production model will use... they are part of the approval process... not to be "judged" as final at all...

I know this next comment will piss some guys off but I stand by it; If I owned a model train company, and based on the experience I have had and witnessed, I wouldn't show pre production models to the public. The instant and sometimes very damaging commentary that gets made based on pre production models not only can far outweigh the benefits of having knowledgable people find legitimate flaws and can adversely affect future sales. Some companys don't regularily show pre production models, Kato for example, and I would follow that practice.

I have no idea how good IM's new SD40-2's will be but I know I wouldn't put much stock in what a photo from a train show shows.... it's like judging how well groomed you are after a 5 mile run in the driving rain......

[w neal]

One thing I will say...I spoke to an Intermountain rep at the OKC show this past year and he said one focus of this model is they have been working to cram as much weight in as possible.   And this info was unsolicited...I didn't specifically ask about that, he just went right into it when I asked about the SD40-2.   He said that is why they were taking so long. (and proceeded to tell me they would be here in June, so....)    But anyway....if they get here "light" I would be shocked given his almost freakish devotion to pushing that feature.

Shocked, but not surprised.   

Sweet!

I take it back then.

[basementcalling]

I know this next comment will piss some guys off but I stand by it; If I owned a model train company, and based on the experience I have had and witnessed, I wouldn't show pre production models to the public. The instant and sometimes very damaging commentary that gets made based on pre production models not only can far outweigh the benefits of having smart people find legitimate flaws and can adversely affect future sales. Some companies don't regularily show pre production models, Kato for example, and I would follow that practice.

I have no idea how good IM's new SD40-2's will be but I know I wouldn't put much stock in what a photo from a train show shows.... it's like judging how well groomed you are after a 5 mile run in the driving rain......

I dunno, I've seen some pretty hot ladies who still look damn fine after that rainy five miler. 

I think your last paragraph though is pretty much what I was saying in my post. I want to see one in person first. Nothing I saw on MRH swayed me one way or the other.

 Why not put the models in a displace case or not let folks touch them then? Athearn had a great displace at the WGH show when it came to VA, and by putting their models on shelves along a "wall" people naturally tended to look but not touch. Pictures or video on a good tablet or monitor screen would help too. Everyone should think about how best to feature their products.

Kinda defeats the purpose of a show like WGH or NTS if you generate the wrong kind of buzz about a new product. Showing photos of "pre production" models that haven't been manhandled would be better too, I guess.

This might piss off a few folks, but my wallet can't control their reaction. As long as the standard business model in our hobby is limited runs spaced out over time, some of which are delayed or cancelled for lack of reservations, companies should be happy modelers are excited enough about announced new products to want to see them. Anticipation is a powerful force, and needed if you are asking the consumer to pre reserve, sight unseen, a new model that will cost around a C note, or significantly more for sound and DCC.

Maybe the entertainment maxim of there is no such thing as bad publicity doesn't apply to model railroad products.

[mcjaco]

Kinda defeats the purpose of a show like WGH or NTS if you generate the wrong kind of buzz about a new product. Showing photos of "pre production" models that haven't been manhandled would be better too, I guess.

Except these photos may have been taken toward the end of the show.  They may have looked fine on Thursday.  I thought they looked like they had been manhandled (missing sunshades, bent in hand rails, etc).  Typical stuff from heavy mitted "modelers."

[Philip H]

Like the K-4 threads, everyone was (and a few still are) all hot and bothered about this loco because of the company making them, and its reputation for hit and miss production.  Sometimes pre-production photos clarify or address those concerns - the fidelity of the Bachmann steamer is no longer in question, and its running ability is documented in video - though its not a production issue.  So while we all wait for those locos to arrive at our favorite pushers, we can at least debate the K-4 on what appears to be the merits.

The problems with the post-modler manhandled pre-production locos is it reinforces - for many people - the hit or miss reputation of the producing company.  sure, i think these look at least as good as Kato, but I have to look at the same photos others do - when those  others find these wanting.  And given that no footage of these running from the NTS exists (as does footage for the K-4) the issues with running quality from previous releases remain unresolved.

so here's my modest proposal - lets take Puddy's guidance on what likely caused the damage, and hold the rest of our condemnation until we see production samples.  Sound good to the collective?