Crazy Idea time! N scale Caboose FPV?

[delamaize]

Board at work, and surfing youtube, I came across this video:

This got me thinking, the whole setup they made there is pretty damn small. I wonder if it would be possible to fit something like this into a cupola of a caboose? This would be pretty cool for train shows, and open houses. I have not read into it to the specs too much, but I wonder if the track power from DCC could be used, or maybe even wire it into a decoder, and just have the throttle to be set to 5 volts on step 1 though Full throttle....

Discuss?

EDIT: something I am discovering is the receivers are a little harder to match to the transmitter than what I would think.

[up1950s]

I am working on too many things , one of which is an RC pan tilt video car . TX RX matches are easy if you buy them as a set . What's a big PIA is the size and type of connectors used on the RX , servos , BEC , LIPO's , and what else you may add to the mix , especially with the smaller size stuff . Then not all polarity and colors matches each type of connector .

[SandyEggoJake]

I've been experimenting on the lighting package (marker lights) for an N scale 80' observation car  and toying with the idea of stuffing something like this in it as well.  Such a car would allow far more room to hide the electronics than a 34' caboose. 

[peteski]

No pan or tilt, but I have been stuffing a concealed cameras in N scale locos since 2005.    For my first install see Peter Wisniewski's album at http://www.katousa.com/gallery/albums.php?set_albumListPage=6

While I'm sure that the video quality of my setup is inferior to what is out there now, i really like the fact that the fairly wide angle lens on the camera I'm uing is only 0.020" in diameter. That makes it really easy to conceal. When I run this setup at model train shows I enjoy seeing the surprised look on spectator's faces when they realize that the camera is installed in a regular-looking locomotive.

[delamaize]

I really want to try this, the problem I keep running into is a receiver that isn't a headset, or and cost less than an arm and leg.

The site that has the camera on it has various lenses available, My plan was to put it together, then see how things look, if it needs some help, then I'll put a different lens on it.

I have seen several locomotive cameras before, and cameras that are pushed by a train, I have never seen a cupola view camera car though, I thought it might be an interesting change.

[peteski]

I have seen several locomotive cameras before, and cameras that are pushed by a train, I have never seen a cupola view camera car though, I thought it might be an interesting change.

Even with the tiny cameras discussed here, to make it truly hidden in the cupola you would have to place the upwards-pointing camera in the center of the cupola and have a rotating mirror placed at 45 degrees to get the images from the cupola's window. Otherwise the camera will stick up way above the original cupola roof.  Unless you are simply contemplating removal of the model's cupola and replacing it with a rotating camera.

[delamaize]

Even with the tiny cameras discussed here, to make it truly hidden in the cupola you would have to place the upwards-pointing camera in the center of the cupola and have a rotating mirror placed at 45 degrees to get the images from the cupola's window. Otherwise the camera will stick up way above the original cupola roof.  Unless you are simply contemplating removal of the model's cupola and replacing it with a rotating camera.

I was going to look into a 45 degree mirror, if that didn't work, then it would be back to the drawing board. I got a few ideas. The big problem is all the ideas I have will end up with a bigger than normal cupola. I may end up buying just one of the cameras, since they are not too expensive and experiment...

Looks like the camera dimensions are 9mm x 9mm x 11mm.
http://fpvhobby.com/83-1-gram-nano-camera.html
I did some rough measurements, it's CLOSE to fitting into an old bachmann offset cupola, I might have to check some other cabooses.....

[peteski]

Looks like the camera dimensions are 9mm x 9mm x 11mm.

Yes, and since the lens is roughly in the center of the camera that will place it in the caboose body (not high up in the cupola). Unless you do the mirror trick.

[SandyEggoJake]

Love that cupola camera crummy car concept (forever more, the "5C"?) but some of these right angle spy mirrors have CRAZY pricing.  (http://www.intertest.com/accessories/10060-ishot-right-angle-adapter-for-7mm-od-micro-cameras) $400 even without a pan motor?  But there's a guy on fleabay selling a bundle of 9 of these 7mm right angle adapters for $50 ... shall we collude?  I'd take one.

But how would you do the pan motor without it costing a fortune?  Ream the ID of the spy attachment so that it slides free of its upshot camera lens mount, and then on the OD of the lower third of the adapter,  affix gearing that meshes with a worm and motor?  Controlled by what, a cheapo four function DCC?



 

[delamaize]

Love that cupola camera crummy car concept (forever more, the "5C"?) but some of these right angle spy mirrors have CRAZY pricing.  (http://www.intertest.com/accessories/10060-ishot-right-angle-adapter-for-7mm-od-micro-cameras) $400 even without a pan motor?  But there's a guy on fleabay selling a bundle of 9 of these 7mm right angle adapters for $50 ... shall we collude?  I'd take one.

But how would you do the pan motor without it costing a fortune?  Ream the ID of the spy attachment so that it slides free of its upshot camera lens mount, and then on the OD of the lower third of the adapter,  affix gearing that meshes with a worm and motor?  Controlled by what, a cheapo four function DCC?

That's a pretty damn good idea. I'll probably be in. I'm trying to source a Camera in stock right now, and still trying to find a Tx/Rx set that isn't $400+

I think I'm going to give this a shot, just might be some time in the works......

[SandyEggoJake]

For the Tx/Rx we wouldn't need anything as robust as the RC guys, give the much shorter distance. 

As for pan - if even needed - I've been rethinking it some.  Not sure what I proposed before would result in an acceptable image or fix.  Now thinking best to have spy adapter fixed to the cam as designed, and the cam + adapter swivel.  Cam on shock absorbing mat centered on turn table.  Table's edge toothed and its hub affixed to the crummy weight - which would work well for an MTL car as the floor is the metal weight.  Then use a cheapo servo pointed down to drive the table gear, with servo also mounted firm to the floor weight.  I suspect this solution would be much easier to stuff, as the alignment and fixing of a version 1 motor+worm to geared adapter would be a challenge if not impossible without a universal. 

Honestly, I think pan is optional, and I'd only try it after stuffing all essential components. 

Any who... I've never done any FPV on my trains so not much more I can add.  But if you snag that fleabay spy mirror package and work out a cost effective DIY solution for the Tx/Rx, PM me and I'd be up to doing this build with you.





 

[peteski]

If money is the object, you could always use the older 2.4GHz setup I have used in several models.  The one I mentioned earlier in this thread.  It is a low-power unit so there are sometimes dropouts when it is traveling around the layout.  But it also comes with a receiver and a really advanced power supply (which works with a wide range of DC/AC/DCC voltages and which also has a small NiCad battery which provided uninterrupted power when the track power is cut or fluctuating.  The power supply was really what impressed me the most about that camera setup.

The only possible negatives are the non-HD video and that only NTSC composite video output is available from the receiver.

The complete setup (including shipping from Japan) will come in at less than $300.

[sirenwerks]

OMG, Peter Wisniewski's P42 idea would work so well in the nose of an F or E unit with 2 headlights, using the lower outlet for the camera lens.

[nscaler711]

Wow @peteski I never realized that you did that! 
I still how ever feel bad for that P42... 
But it was pretty cool when I was poking around their site when I was a teen, I always wanted to make something similar without butchering (using this term loosely) one of my favorite locos.... I was thinking more along the lines of a older LL loco and having the lens pointed out the engineers side window but could never figure it out...

[peteski]

Yeah guys, I'm the crazy guy who butchered a Kato P42! 

As far as E and F units go, I've done that too.

The view angle of the lens is so wide that I had to slightly enlarge the lower headlight opening and painted black to prevent glare.
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I had to trim the camera housing to fit in the nose.  The LED on top is for the upper headlight.
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Chassis with the power supply.
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Camera in the nose.
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I have also mounted one of these babies in a modern loco.

Eric220 also installed one of this on one of his PRR locos.