So is there a fix out there to improve the Walthers Berkshire anemic pulling?

[Lemosteam]

This thing can't pull the six car Polar Express, only carrying some kids, marionettes, and a vat of Hot chocolate. 

Is there a simple mechanical fix or do I resort to BF Snot?

Rise is 2" over 68" of run for a 2.9% grade. 

I suspect it will be fine on flat nTrak layouts, but anything with a grade and its screwed.

[glakedylan]

unfortunately the Heritage locomotives are not great pullers, but some have traction tires
I cannot recall if the Berkshire does or not
nonetheless, my Berkshire pulled the 13 MTL Xmas train without any problem but it was all level
bullfrogsnot might be the solution
sincerely

[nickelplate759]

If it only pulls 6 cars on the level then something is wrong.  Mine (1st-run, unmodified) will pull at least 15 (which is still not enough, but...)  I do recall that they pulled much worse when new - after a couple of hours their traction improved for some reason.

George

[victor miranda]

count your six blessings?

mine went one lap and then I think I heard the motor snap.
no go.

I have a memory that some one cut a tt tire groove.

I'd go with bfs if I only needed a little more traction.

victor

[mmagliaro]

I was the someone who cut the groove.  And I was crazy, but I got lucky and it worked.
I just flipped it on its back, ran it in a cradle, and ran a Dremel cutoff disk against the wheel
tread on the rear driver.  Miraculously, it did not shred the wheel, tear anything apart, and even more amazing,
it didn't make an egg-shaped groove.   I put a real TT in it, and it did pull much better after that.

If you're not that crazy (and I really wouldn't recommend it), you could try the snot, although that didn't add much for me.  If you are only interested in how much it can pull on level track, I think the Bullfrog Snot may help
enough.  My impression is that it improves pulling more on a level, but not enough for me when climbing hills.

How are the drivers made in that thing?  If they are securely pressed on a steel axle, maybe you could chuck it in a latch and cut a tire groove.

[Chris333]

I have one with a groove, but hasn't been back together yet to test pulling.

[loyalton]

First off, how long has this been run? Steam often needs several hours of run-in time to break in the gear train and such. That's when you get your maximum pulling power. The 1:1 USRA Heavy Mikados could pull 20-25 freight cars at speed on level ground; typical 1:1 Berkshires then could probably pull a bit more. So don't expect huge amounts of pulling power from the equivalent models.

Your grades are the main problem. IIRC the NTRAK steam book showed that you lose something like a third of the number of cars pulled for every 1% of grade. Throw in curves and it's worse. A suggestion is to doublehead like the 1:1 railroads. They'd also use pushers for any grade approaching yours. The transition from flat to maximum grade makes a difference also, the longer the better.

BFS would be a help. Yeah, you get somewhat more traction from a traction tire, but those things blow out sooner than later. BFS used to fill in the tire groove will last much, much longer, with no waiting for replacements or finding your hoard of tires has dried out.

Adding weight may or may not help. The LL 2-8-8-2s have room enough for extra weight but the side rods are such mild steel that they wear out quickly under any extra load. Are the Berkshire rods made of the same stuff? Now distribution of weight could make a difference on the transition to those grades. You'll have to experiment.

[Rasputen]

I cut a groove with a parting tool in mine:


A Kato 2-8-2 traction tire will stretch over the larger driver:

[sizemore]

The S.

[jdcolombo]

Bullfrog snot will help, but I think there is an easier way.

I use "Tape Traction Tires".

Get yourself some Scotch double-sided tape - not the thick foam tape, but the thin stuff used for photo mounting.  It comes in a yellow and black dispenser:



Now get yourself a steel or aluminum straightedge, a flat glass or porcelain or polished tile, or polished granite or quartz or similar surface (I use a an old Corelle dinner plate) and a hobby knife with a fresh #11 blade.  You will also need a way to invert your engine and apply power to it inverted - I use a couple of "alligator clip jumpers" - two small alligator clips (available at Radio Shack) with some 24-gauge stranded wire connecting them (you need two of these, one for each rail).

Cut off about a 2" piece of the double-sided tape, and stick it lightly on the center of your flat polished surface.   Now take your straightedge and knife and slice off about a 1.5mm-wide strip of the tape from the long side.   Use the tip of the knife to lift one end of the cut strip, and some tweezers to pull it off the plate.

Invert the engine.  Apply one end of the tape to one of the #3 drivers on the Berk.  Let the end of the tape trail back from the driver.  Apply power so that the drivers turn at the very slowest speed possible, and feed the tape around the driver until it meets the original end.  Take the very tip of your knife, and cut the rest of the tape off.   You DO NOT want the tape to overlap - you want to cut it so that the two ends just meet on the driver (a tiny "notch" won't make any difference, so don't obsess about this).   Now repeat the process for the other #3 driver.   Turn the engine over, and run it slowly forward and backward for about 10' to "set" the tape on the driver.

You now have a very effective traction tire.   No, the tape won't leave any residue on the track.  Just the opposite - what will happen is that as you run the engine around the track, the tape will pick up dust and dirt, and turn black.  Just fine - it's even more effective dirty.  I've used this method on all my Berks, and they will now pull 30 cars plus a caboose on level track; I don't have any grades, so I don't know what your results would be, but I suspect six passenger cars upgrade would be easily within the tape-traction-tired Berk.

Here's a video of one of my Berks pulling a 25-car train on my (admittedly flat) layout:

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One of the downsides of this process is that you will lose some electrical pickup from the engine, and will be relying more on the tender to deliver electrical pickup.  If you experience stalling, it is almost certainly because the wires on the drawbar aren't making good contact with either the post on the engine or with the phosphor-bronze "tabs" on the tender.  Bend the wires as necessary to get good contact.

Eventually, the tape will wear out (it lasts about 20 hours of running in my experience).  No problem - just remove the old tape remnants, and put on a new tape traction tire.

I tested the tape against Bullfrog Snot on one of my Berks.   A "snotted" Berk pulled 18 cars on level track; my tape traction tire Berk pulled 30.   I don't know exactly why this is - maybe I didn't get the Snot even around the drivers; maybe it simply has to do with the relative "slipperyness" of the tape vs. the snot.   But the tape worked better.

In any event, you might want to at least try this before investing in Bullfrog Snot.  It's cheap and effective.

John C.

[u18b]

I learned from this thread that this is a common problem....

And I learned that Max is crazy.   hmmmmmm.   

[delamaize]

Call me nuts, but what about filing the other axle bearing slots, or slightly filing one side of the square bearings to allow them to float a little in the frame, and increase the weight carried on the geared axle? I'm not talking much here, like .001 or .002, just enough to to make the geared driver the "low" one. Or maybe adding a shim to the geared axle. again, a very thin one. And adding a traction tire? I shimmed the driver on my B-man Lt mt. and it made a difference.

[glakedylan]

are the Heritage mallets' drivers the same size?
I believe, if IIRCC, the mallets came with a set of drivers that had traction tire already provided.
would a swap with this driver be possible?
just wondering...got rid of my mallet so I do not have one in hand to see if possible
sincerely

[mmagliaro]

Gary, I've wondered that myself... if there were some other engine that had the same size driver with a TT on it that would drop in.  I just don't know.

Mike, shimming a driver or filing the pockets really only helps if you are getting more pressure on a traction tired
driver.  It's possible that the bulk of the engine's weight happens to be located over a driver that floats too much, and that letting that driver make more solid contact, even with a plain metal driver, would improve pulling, but I wouldn't count on that.

Here's the link to the old Atlas forum thread where I did this
http://forum.atlasrr.com/forum/topic.asp?ARCHIVE=true&TOPIC_ID=52372&whichpage=1

Rasputen:
Can you show more detail of how that wheel is being held in your lathe?  You have some sort of
pin through the center of the wheel, chucked in the collet.  What's the big brass piece on
the outside of the wheel that keeps it in?  Did you turn that specifically to hold this wheel?

I don't know the machinist ins and outs of setting that up, and I'd like to see.

[Lemosteam]

I bought the loco used an there is definite track wear.  I did forget to mention that the locomotive runs flawlessly.

The tape idea is interesting, but I assume that Sizemores video is advocating BFS. I could not listen, only watch. I think I counted 54 cars on that...

I also forgot to mention that 40" of that rise is about a 12" 180 deg curve... And that the loco slips just prior to the crest.  I can get the four Lighted PE cars up the hill but not the other with the old Rivarossi truck.  Maybe I should swap the RR trucks with the Kato...