MTL heavyweight baggage car

[Upstate Gator]

Bruce--
I took a look at Mark's page on trucks after reading your note about changing them out. He has notes that may be helpful.
http://www.spookshow.net/trucks/trucks.php

What are you doing about the C-channel? (I've ordered several Painted-Undecs.)
Ben

[thomasjmdavis]

Bruce,

The truck nomenclature is (I hope, this is subject to correction by those more expert than myself) 242A for the one included with the baggage car (at least the Erie and ATSF ones I have).  They started showing up under cars in the late 1920s- you would find them under an ATSF 3050 or 3060 chair car, a lot of rebuilt Pullmans, and many of the later heavyweights.
http://varnish.pennsyrr.com/PRRTrucks/DGS_PRR_PTrucks_P32.htm

The truck reference on the pennsyrr site includes just about every truck ever used under a PRR car, which would include almost all those used by anyone else, plus a couple dozen designs unique to the PRR.
http://varnish.pennsyrr.com/PRRTrucks/DGS_PRR_PTrucks.htm

Tom D

[arbomambo]

Bruce--
I took a look at Mark's page on trucks after reading your note about changing them out. He has notes that may be helpful.
http://www.spookshow.net/trucks/trucks.php

What are you doing about the C-channel? (I've ordered several Painted-Undecs.)
Ben

Spookshow's site doesn't list these yet...
right now, I believe I'm going to be using sheet styrene, glued behind the car side, to produce the channel 'sill', I'm removing the plastic lip from the bottom of the micro trains car (I'll post pics of this step), this should give me plenty of room to glue sheet styrene that will form the channel sill, and still leave room to possibly use the MT end step assembly (preferred)

Bruce,

The truck nomenclature is (I hope, this is subject to correction by those more expert than myself) 242A for the one included with the baggage car (at least the Erie and ATSF ones I have).  They started showing up under cars in the late 1920s- you would find them under an ATSF 3050 or 3060 chair car, a lot of rebuilt Pullmans, and many of the later heavyweights.
http://varnish.pennsyrr.com/PRRTrucks/DGS_PRR_PTrucks_P32.htm

The truck reference on the pennsyrr site includes just about every truck ever used under a PRR car, which would include almost all those used by anyone else, plus a couple dozen designs unique to the PRR.
http://varnish.pennsyrr.com/PRRTrucks/DGS_PRR_PTrucks.htm

Tom D

Thomas,
Those trucks look close, but still don't quite represent the trucks as modeled by MT (the MT version is more 'spartan'), perhaps the MT trucks are the '242' as opposed to the '242A'
I'm replacing them with the PS heavyweight trucks from MT, but would love to use them where applicable...I'll have to search pics of ATSF 3000 coaches...
Bruce

[arbomambo]

the only info I can find concerns the Walthers HO car

http://www.atsfrr.com/Reviews/HO/Passenger/Walthers/HwtCoach/Index.htm

Bruce

[thomasjmdavis]

Bruce,

You have a point- I may be mis-identifying the truck as a 242 (or A).  Comparing it to a PRB truck on my one brass 3060 series chair car, it is clunkier, and does not have that (anti-sway?) bracket in the center.  I think the "clunkier" may be more a matter of modelers (or manufacturer's) license than anything else.

Here is a photo of an Erie car- http://rr-fallenflags.org/el/pax/erie-be590bjh.jpg  in which the truck framework seems lighter weight than the appearance of the model (although I am thinking that a little flat paint might help a lot).  I note that on the MT website description of the car, they refer to the truck as a "commonwealth" (which, unfortunately, seems a generic description for any truck one doesn't know the name of), but perhaps it is an Erie version of the straight equalized truck. Or, perhaps that extra bracket was an added feature for passenger carrying equipment, as it seems not present on baggage cars as a rule.

Here is an ATSF car (3031) with a straight equalized truck-
http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/singleitem/collection/p15330coll22/id/55054 (note the zoom in feature on denver library site- you can get a real close look)

Several ATSF baggage and mail-baggage cars built in the late 20s (or rebuilt from cars original to the late 20s) also had a truck very similar to the MT truck (ie- like a 242 but without the center bracket)
http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/atsf2041.jpg
http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/singleitem/collection/p15330coll22/id/55044 

Lots more photos in the SFRHMS reference book on Head End cars (Ellington/Shine)

So.... I hereby apologize to Joe and the folks at MT for thinking (and probably saying) they had put the wrong truck under their cars lettered for ATSF.  They forgot the side sill, but the truck is correct, or at least close, for a baggage car built after about 1927. But in my own defense, the number (1809) is for a car built in 1917, with the other trucks.  This is academic for me, since I intend to put M&R sides on them anyway, and then whichever trucks are closest to the cars I am modeling.

(PS- I found the photo links on Jerry's site, http://passcarphotos.info ).

These are still great looking cars, number vs. trucks issues notwithstanding- very useful both as is and as fodder for kit-bashes and new sides.  I think I will hold off on any rebuilding until the undecorateds arrive, if only so I can get a pic of all 8 together, to prove to Joe and MT that I was good to my word when I said I would buy that many.  Do I get a discount if I go over 10?

[Cajonpassfan]

Tom, Bruce,
without getting into the obscure history and nomenclature, I believe the difference between the new MT truck and the ATSF straight equalized truck is the outside vs. inside bearing; see pics below: maybe the new MT trucks can be modified?
Walthers has bothe versions, in HO.
Regards, Otto K.

[thomasjmdavis]

I would think you are correct Otto. Thank you for the pictures as they do explain the difference. However, I note that on ATSF head end cars, the truck used was (usually) the inside bearing truck, whereas on the chair cars, it was the outside bearing truck (the "bearing" being what I was referring to as a "bracket"). 

Meanwhile, regardless of trucks, I need to figure out how to cast all the SE AC parts.  By the time I actually have a model finished, somebody will be marketing the trucks, no doubt.

This was so much easier in the old days- if you wanted a HW baggage car, you bought a Rivarossi, because it was the only one.  Saved a lot of mental anguish and research time.