Kato N scale FEF TCS DCC problem

[jdcolombo]

In case this hasn't been brought up yet, here is the response I got from TCS tech support.

"Hello Steve,

We are aware of the issue and are very close to a solution. Unfortunately it will require the decoder be sent in to us for reprogramming. Our motor control has always been known for our slow speed control with almost any DC motor including coreless motors but the tinny size of the coreless motor in the FEF has found a chink in the armor. We apologize for this inconvenience.

This will be covered under our TCS Goof Proof Warranty. Please go to the Warranty Page of our website at:http://www.tcsdcc.com/Customer_Content/Customer_Info/Warranty/warranty.html and fill out the online Warranty registration. Then send the decoder to us. Filling out this online registration will help us to expedite the return of your Warranty replacement."

Kudos to TCS - for both admitting that there is a problem (instead of the "it must be your loco that's the issue" response) and for coming up with a solution at no cost to the customer and relatively minor inconvenience.

John C.

[peteski]

Hmm. Didn't I say this a couple o' weeks ago?

https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?topic=34879.msg406202#msg406202

(Seriously... I sent an e-mail to TCS with a link to this thread. Appears it paid off.)

You did. But having the manufacturer actually be willing to do that is surprising (at least to me).  Especially with such a quick response.  Plus, sometimes the manufacturers "lock" their microcontroller's firmware so there is no way to reprogram them. Or sometimes the microcontrollers are programmed before being soldered onto circuit board. Reprogramming those would be pretty much too much hassle.

[C855B]

I'm pretty sure there are chip clips to do exactly that - firmware loading on populated boards. I used similar tools in the olden days of 14-pin DIPs. With memory as dense as it is now there's no reason not to keep the bootloader routines in the microcontroller for field reloads.

It's great they're stepping up on this.  After I'm done here I will head over to the TCS warranty page and get it registered, put it in an envelope and post it for tomorrow's mail.

[C855B]

We have an "oops". The TCS warranty page doesn't have a drop-down for the K6D4, so you can't "submit" to get to the next page. I could select another Kato board, but don't want to foul their paperwork. I've sent a note about it, and we'll see where it goes.

[TrinityJayOne]

Good to know TCS are doing the fix, but I wonder if it applies to the factory-installed ones or not? If so, what happens if 2mths later your FEF fails for an unrelated reason and you need to return the loco to Kato under warranty?

[Mark W]

Great to hear.  My desire for the perfect "creep" on my FEF was currently offset by other projects, but I had planned to eventually try the Zimo.  Given that we've concluded this is an isolated issue between the new coreless motor and first run board, I had no grudge with TCS over this either (it certainly would not have made me hesitate to continue my preference of TCS decoders either).  However now that they're offering a fix (assuming it works), I'm locked in with even more loyalty and happy that I will not have to hack the DC board. 

Good to know TCS are doing the fix, but I wonder if it applies to the factory-installed ones or not? If so, what happens if 2mths later your FEF fails for an unrelated reason and you need to return the loco to Kato under warranty?

The decoder installation/removal is extremely EASY.  Lift the cab, unscrew one screw, lift the boiler shell (there is no resistance), slide out the board.  I swapped my DC board with the TCS in all of 30 seconds on first try.  Of course I don't speak for Kato, but I'm certain if you remove the TCS board and send it in, it will have no affect on your warranty. If you have enough hand coordination to rail the locomotive on the track, you have enough to remove/install the decoder.

[C855B]

The kind folks at TCS responded to my inquiry with instructions to return the decoder, and that they would fix the web page. So... as of this morning, the TCS warranty return page has the K6D4 listed.

Fingers crossed!

[Roger Holmes]

Any update from TCS.  I'm waiting to buy one.

[C855B]

No update as yet. Still waiting for mine to return from the warranty repair/swap. I would allow that they might still be working on bugs.

[C855B]

Just received notice that my updated TCS board was shipped. I would expect it Monday or Tuesday, so I will update then.

[RBrodzinsky]

Mike,

Looking forward to your report. I've put off sending mine in, waiting for news on how well the fix works

Rick

[bobdobbs]

Hi just got my reprogrammed decoder back from TCS, installed, set Address to 844, put on layout runs like a boss!  Super slow, super smooth, like any TCS equipped unit.  All default settings except for address.  Runs like all of the videos of FEF's with other decoder installs....

TCS took care of 'bidness, very happy must go to sleep goodnight.

[C855B]

OOOOOO! Thanks for the update, Bob. My updated decoder should arrive tomorrow. I will run, not walk, to the workbench and install it forthwith!

[Paradise275]

OK, so how do you go about ordering one that you don't have to send back to be reporgrammed? Did they recall all their decoders from distributors and send them updated ones?

Rick

[C855B]

OK, so how do you go about ordering one that you don't have to send back to be reporgrammed? Did they recall all their decoders from distributors and send them updated ones?

Legit question. Plus I don't know how they're identifying the reprogrammed decoders - packaging or otherwise - since I never took mine out of the package... just sent it to TCS unopened when it was clear from knowledgeable folks here that there was a problem.

Anyway, I just installed the revised-firmware version received this morning, and confirming what Bob reported, it runs great on DCC. Smooth, quiet, creeping slow speeds. Very nice. Yes, it runs great on DCC.

[pregnant pause]

Not so much on the DC from my old standby Tech II - jackrabbit starts and stops. Pretty bad, too. Very much unlike other TCS decoders of my experience, which are smooth(er) runners on DC. You will not be doing much switching with this revised FEF decoder on DC, that's for sure. This problem doesn't happen to give me heartburn since I don't envision any settings where I'll be running this loco on straight DC other than the test bench, but in the interest of full disclosure I need to alert the group to the issue.