Ultimate Layout lighting.

[Smike]

Just ran across the new "Hue" line of lighting from Phillips.  Fully color and intensity controlled LED lighting. It can be controlled via an app if you want to mimic day and night ops over time. (even allowing low early morning warm light (sunrise) transition to midday bright white light then back to gradual low warm light for sunset.

Not cheap, but for smaller layouts this would really add a level of realism.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/philips-friends-of-hue-120-lumen-12w-lightstrip-luminaire-15w-equivalent/3285911.p?id=1219090033410&skuId=3285911&st=Hue&cp=1&lp=8

[C855B]

https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?topic=29239

Also: https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?topic=26087.msg389223#msg389223

[C855B]

I've also done a little bit of Hue development, but needed to devote the time elsewhere. Apparently that's the case generally, as activity in the developer forum has fallen-off to nearly zero.

Unfortunately the "Friends of Hue" color strips are insanely expensive for what you get - 6-1/2" feet of strip - and they're dim. This product was rushed out because a couple of developers hacked the original E27 ("conventional" household shape) bulbs into RGB strip controllers and I think Philips wasn't happy that folks were breaking into their bulbs, liability and all that, especially when you're talking about 220V bulbs in the Euro market. Also, I'm not certain that Philips' approach is going to pan out. Somewhere in their process they made a decision they were not going to make a true RGB product in favor of having a "tunable" white, so the gamut is quite limited. Red has good saturation, but blue is washed-out, green is barely possible and there is simply no true yellow. The RGB strips are full RGB, however, but that is the exception for their product line. I haven't tested the strips, but I get the impression that the dozen or so apps written for Hue are a little constrained by the reduced gamut of the core product line, so you don't have as much color control with the strips as you would expect.

If you're looking at controllable RGB strips as an end game (...I'm not...), then go find some bargains on eBay. There are strip controllers on eBay, and superbrightleds.com also offers nice strip controllers as well as brightness-rated RGB strips and especially RGBW strips, albeit at a price... but still mountains cheaper per foot and per lumen than the Hue product.

This concept is now getting a lot of competition. GE/Quirky has recently introduced app-controllable lights - Wink - at 1/2 the price of Hue (available at Home Depot, as is Hue), although at the moment they are white (3000K) only. The Quirky hub can also control other light systems such as Hue. OSRAM/Sylvania has an E27 full RGB bulb in production that is currently Euro-only; I have a starter kit coming from Germany next week and am crossing my fingers that the bulb will work on 110V, tho' prepared to wire a 220V test rig if I have to.

The most frightening... yes, frightening... issue to me about these super-wizbang magic-tech lighting products is that everybody but Philips requires you to log into their cloud server. No internet = no control of your bulbs. Period. That is, other than basic off/on with the wall switch, where it becomes an expensive dumb light. And you have to commit to a system, although slightly less so with Quirky since they address other formats. The other - again, frightening - issue is tech turnover. Here on one hand you have lights that are rated to last 20-plus years, on the other hand is the cloud server or even the company supporting it going to be here 20 years from now? I doubt it.

[Smike]

Just when you think you have read every thread on TRW 

Excellent write up mike. Yes pricy, and I will look up the RGB strips and controllers for the layout.  I don't like as well for one second that controlling your lights requires a connection to the cloud. Given that Phillips does not require this, I may play with a starter set for the wife to play with.

[nkalanaga]

All that is needed to control LED lighting is a way of dimming the individual colors independently.  If the idea catches on it shouldn't be too long before someone hacks the system.  Within a few years you should be able to control them just about any way you like.  It's only software, and if it can be controlled over the internet, it can be controlled locally.

[PAL_Houston]

Just ran across the new "Hue" line of lighting from Phillips.  Fully color and intensity controlled LED lighting. It can be controlled via an app if you want to mimic day and night ops over time. (even allowing low early morning warm light (sunrise) transition to midday bright white light then back to gradual low warm light for sunset.

Not cheap, but for smaller layouts this would really add a level of realism.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/philips-friends-of-hue-120-lumen-12w-lightstrip-luminaire-15w-equivalent/3285911.p?id=1219090033410&skuId=3285911&st=Hue&cp=1&lp=8

The issue is that this is manufactured by Phillips.  To be nice about it,  their warranties are a figment of some marketers' imaginations.  I have never had any Phillips product last anywhere near as long as their warranty. And it is impossible to get a warranty replacement from them.  I no longer buy any Phillips products.

[Smike]

All that is needed to control LED lighting is a way of dimming the individual colors independently.  If the idea catches on it shouldn't be too long before someone hacks the system.  Within a few years you should be able to control them just about any way you like.  It's only software, and if it can be controlled over the internet, it can be controlled locally.

Here is a good link to exactly that concept: http://www.x2011west.org/handouts/LED-Lighting.pdf

As for the Phillips Hue option, I was hoping the Phillips LED strips and the app would make that off the shelf today, instead of tyring to customize some setup.

Overall I'm not sure of the output needed, but looking to be able to light a shelf layout vs. entire room.

[nkalanaga]

Smike:  As simple as the concept is, I'm not at all surprised it's already available.   And that handout is from mid-2011, so the concept is almost certainly more advanced today.  Somewhere on the internet there is probably someone selling aftermarket controllers today, not "in a few years" as I thought. 

[daniel_leavitt2000]

I did some investigating on this a few weeks ago. I was looking at the Phillips and Ikea versions as both do not require an internet connection. Blue, red and green work great. Yellow and orange are almost non-existent. I ended up making my own system using white, blue, yellow and orange rope LED lights and 4 independent dimmer switches. Better quality light, lower cost and much brighter.

[MVW]

I ended up making my own system using white, blue, yellow and orange rope LED lights and 4 independent dimmer switches. Better quality light, lower cost and much brighter.

Details?

Jim

[C855B]

Well, sometimes simple works bunches better. 

All that is needed to control LED lighting is a way of dimming the individual colors independently.

Well, we're there. Something that continues to intrigue me are the DMX lightstrip controllers superbrightleds.com is offering. DMX is the professional digital stage lighting interchange standard, and there's all sorts of software and especially hardware control consoles that amount to plug-and-play. Wouldn't it be nice to have a purpose-built lighting controller with scripted sequencing that did exact what you wanted to do that also didn't need a PC with its commensurate support issues? And didn't cost all that much? Like under $100?

Even after two years (severely over)thinking this stuff, I'm still drawn to the possibility of a DMX network to drive the effects lighting at the GC&W. The consumer product market with products such as Hue and (OSRAM) Lightify is getting seriously muddy. I'm now spooked by long-term issues as the Philips Hue support community is already seriously fading, and my contact with OSRAM/Sylvania was, to be blunt, eyebrow-raising. There are something like six competing standards, and I want to strangle the next person who tells me their product uses ZigBee, because, so far, Brand X ZigBee doesn't work with Brand Y ZigBee. I'm getting that BetaMax versus VHS feeling all over again. Anyway...

The main thing in the way of a DMX system for my layout is it requires I commit now, while I'm running wires and before the ceiling goes in. DMX is a wired standard, with vestigial wireless support. There's also a fabrication aspect, given the amount of space needing this lighting. The emerging consumer formats are networked at the bulb level and independent of wiring, don't require a lot of re-engineering if something changes down the road, and are available in large-area illumination formats such as floodlights for much less money than PAR cans. [sigh]

[peteski]

Well, sometimes simple works bunches better. 

Well, we're there. Something that continues to intrigue me are the DMX lightstrip controllers superbrightleds.com is offering. DMX is the professional digital stage lighting interchange standard

Didn't someone compare the train layout to a theatrical stage and the trains to actors?    Sounds like the DMX system is a fine solution (assuming it is within financial reach of an average model railroader).

[Mark W]

I bought a strip of these about a year ago.  Would never consider something like this for those name brand prices when it all boils down to just LED hardware.
http://www.amazon.com/XKTTSUEERCRR-16-4Ft-5050SMD-Waterproof-Flexible/dp/B00EMSU3DK/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1414386156&sr=8-2&keywords=led+lights

For control, I recommend looking into Raspberry Pi and Audrino, $35 microcontrollers.  I'm playing and learning with my first Pi right now (https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?topic=34250)

One could set up a Pi with wifi and control all kinds of things via a website that you simply access from your phone.  I'm imagining about a 15 minute cycle of scripted effects controlling atmospheric lighting, down to individual street-lamps, signs, signals, animation, everything.  Within that cycle, random effects will be triggered by sensors and interactive input. 

[C855B]

Didn't someone compare the train layout to a theatrical stage and the trains to actors?    Sounds like the DMX system is a fine solution (assuming it is within financial reach of an average model railroader).

I'm glad this discussion made me go back and look at DMX again. One of the stage lighting brands, Chauvet, recently introduced an inexpensive ($160) mini PAR can (stage light) with RGBAW+UV. Chauvet is popular with the DJ-for-hire crowd, so you'll see a lot of Chauvet stuff at wedding receptions, etc. This new can probably isn't suitable for soffit lighting, but this capability is now price-competitive against the Hue, etc. These cans are nice and bright, so I may get one for testing since I haven't finished the layout room luminary wiring just yet.

Anyway, small DMX controller panels can be surprisingly inexpensive. The Chauvet Obey 4 is a basic controller yet has fade scripting and special effects. The real work is being done in the DMX lamp drivers such as the ones I mentioned from superbrightleds, the controller is just the human interface. If I were doing soffits with lighting strips, frankly, I would definitely look at this combo.

This Chauvet controller keeps popping-up every time I start configuring a system in my head. For only $120 this has a huge amount of capability for doing our kind of day/dusk/night simulation very simply.

[PGE_Modeller]

Didn't someone compare the train layout to a theatrical stage and the trains to actors?   

That was the whole premise of the series of articles published in Model Railroader, Railroad Model Craftsman and Toy Trains in the 1940s and 1950s regarding Frank Ellison's O-scale "Delta Lines".  Oh yes, and the third item was that the "timetable was the script".

Cheers,