New layout plans.

[ScrewySqrl]

Too bad Dave's not around to re-jigger this plan.


I think it's excitement level could be amped up some. 

I liked the branch line... I would have made it a little less convoluted at its terminus.

I don't like the twisty-curvy thing the green line makes at the top... The green line could also use a passing siding.

teh twists and curves are something *I* like, and it gives the length needed to reach a 2" rise

The yard is more like a yawn.  It needs a couple servicing tracks.

No interchange tracks?  Interchange tracks are maybe the valuable "industry" tracks a layout can have since you can place/pickup any car there.   Without an interchange there is no connection to the outside world on this layout.

The yard can double as my interchange, but I'll look to add one.

I think one passing siding/runaround track with buildings between the passing side and the main is interesting, but two of them on the layout is one too many.  Also what passing sidings you do have are very short.

Those buildings are supposed to be the passenger stations, which is why there are two of them.

I've modified the layout to code 55 for wider min radius.   one thing I did was move the passing siding from the back to the front.  min curves are now 12.5" instead of 11", and goes as wide at 30.5"



a 3D view:




two bridges will be over a river that cuts across that side, while another bridge crosses a busy passing siding.   The tunnel helps make a scene break (and will be accessible by rolling the layout out of the way).  The rise is 2% , the rise pauses in the switching area (0.57") at the two bridges (at 1.55", and 1") and peaks along the tunnel area (with a factory up there) and at the third bridge (2")

My skill with the terrain and building in SCARM is non-existent right  now, but should have a similar layout of buildings as my previous post

[tom mann]

Two things come to mind:

1.  The four track yard is really short.
2.  The oval on the left side seems a little "bland".

[ScrewySqrl]

Two things come to mind:

1.  The four track yard is really short.
2.  The oval on the left side seems a little "bland".

the yard has a 24 car capacity for standard 4-inch long cars (8, 6, 5, 5).  Industries at 2 cars each holds 12 cars.  Some spurs are longer than that, but that represents just 'travel time' to reach the siding, overall I'd say capacity is in line with industries. And a full-ish yard that requires extra switching moves to build a train is interesting to me!

as for that blank oval, I agree.  But It was a real headache getting track to meet over there, so I ended up scaling it back to something simple.  The not-pictured river should make things interesting, and give plenty of room for a town and rural scenery  (especially since I was told my first plan was a horrible spaghetti bowl)

[Kisatchie]

...The not-pictured river should make things interesting, and give plenty of room for a town and rural scenery  (especially since I was told my first plan was a horrible spaghetti bowl)

Hmm... I love spaghetti...

[eric220]

Is there any way to pull that grade along the left side away from the edge? That is, unless you're planning to conceal it behind a bank of trees or something. It's just REALLY close, especially for being along the back. Also, the plan overall has a lot of track parallel to the sides of the layout. It really helps reduce the "model-railroad-y-ness" to angle the tangents relative to the edges of the layout.

[VirginaCSX]

Two things come to mind:

1.  The four track yard is really short.
2.  The oval on the left side seems a little "bland".

You could slant the yard back towards the corner and also start the left front track curving off towards the corner sooner making the turn smother (not a 90 degree turn).

[Bsklarski]

Sorry for my caveman drawing, but this gives you a basic idea. Make the curves are broad as possible. I say this now. You can fill in the other stuff, but I wanted to give you an idea how you can keep the longer run and have a decent yard with tracks that can hold a dozen plus cars each, A yard that hold 5 cars each wont ever work. (sorry to sound harsh, im speaking from experience)

[jpec]

I like your second and third efforts...I agree less is more in smaller layouts. That said, I offer a few gentle suggestions - unless that up and over is well-hidden by trees with a few breaks so the train pops in and out, it borders on toy-like. That yard in the front could be reworked to an interchange yard; its current iteration looks like a push-pull commuter yard.

It is truly a shame we can't throw up the DKS signal...a few of his tweaks would turn this into a masterpiece.

Jeff

[ScrewySqrl]

possibly a step backwards.  but, back to Code 80 (turnouts are the main reason why.  in Atlas code 80, each manual turout is about $10-11.  Code 55 is more like $15 per turnout plus I gotta buy and install round throws, which comes to around $18.50 per turnout -- 60% more!



25 turnouts (yeek!).  The presentation is turned 90 degrees from how I was showing it before but this is how it will be in the corner of the garage.  this are 30x80 doors instead of 36x80 due to reach issues.  Further, there is nothing to the far corner, with its 43 ich reach, that'll end up as suburbs.  No grades on this pike.  8 Industries, all pretty generic.  The Yard Lead (and to some extent the yard itself) doubles as an interchange, and there will be heavy use of the infamous 0-5-0 switcher. Passing sidings are short, but I expect one train at a time operation here - the sidings will be more for use as runarounds. Plan is for it to be a busy urban layout (some buildings and roads are vaguely placed). I plan for the left side to be a downtown area, which industry in two areas, and suburban housing to the back of both boards.

Operation plan for this, when I'm not watching a train just do loops will be to run the yard as a gigantic inglenook.  By my count, the yard tracks hold 9, 7, 6, and 6 cars (35", 30", 27", 27").  Plan is to build a 16 car consist randomly out of 22 cars in the yard (the lowermost track will be empty). Yes this will mean a lot of switching in the stub yard.  Thats fine, I want to do that!  The 16 car train Plus caboose, will then deliver to the 8 industries, picking up outbounds (whatever was placed there last time)  and returning them to the yard

[Bsklarski]

How set are you on the figure 8?  I would open that up. You can get a longer yard and a wider radius in the visible part.

[davefoxx]

You won't get six cars in that classification track with the caboose track off of it.  That track has become worthless for you with the caboose track turnout so deep in the length of the track.  I'm with the others who say your yard tracks are way too short, unless you're only running six to eight car trains.

I think you will find that your passing sidings are also too short.

Hope this helps,
DFF

[ScrewySqrl]

You won't get six cars in that classification track with the caboose track off of it.  That track has become worthless for you with the caboose track turnout so deep in the length of the track.  I'm with the others who say your yard tracks are way too short, unless you're only running six to eight car trains.

I think you will find that your passing sidings are also too short.

Hope this helps,
DFF

wait, what?

I see no reason not to use teh straight part of a turnout I use as a spot to store a couple of cabooses as further storage. I am squeezing an extra inch or so in the yard to make the first two tracks fit one more car in (35" won't hold 9 cars. but 36" will!).

I guess people are forgetting I want a crowded yard.

[nscalemike]

I'll just throw out a few observations and thoughts, take it for what it's worth.  Others here are much more qualified that me when it comes to these HCD layouts, see Davefoxx Seaboard Central for one example.  First, I really don't think you will get your targeted numbers in that yard.  You say your era is 1970's - present.  Your shortest car on the layout is likely to be a 50' boxcar.  That is going to be 4.5" long by itself, coupler to coupler.  You'll go up from there.  I model present day also and I figure 6" per car on average just to be safe.  Throw an autorack or something in at 89" now your looking at even less.  Plus, you need to take into account your clearance points in the yard.  So, I see you fitting 6, 5, 5, and 4 in each track tops.  Also, like Davefoxx said, your caboose track is going to eliminate your longest yard track.  Yes, you could store a car on the turnout, but what happens when the train comes in with a caboose and cars are blocking the turnout?  If anything, the top track must be left open and the bottom used for storage.  Having a "crowded yard" may imply busy, but I think the general recommendation, both for our model layouts and the prototype, is roughly 50% capacity is considered 'full'.  So, your yard 'should' hold 10 cars on average.  There will be heavy times and light times, but the goal would be 10 cars sitting there.  This is so you have enough room to sort cars and take in new cars. 

Next, your passing sidings are no where near long enough to run around a 16 car train.  Again, using the numbers mentioned, about an 8' siding would be needed.  You may be able to get away with 7', but 2' certainly won't work.  Same with your yard lead.  It is basically 1.5' long, assuming you have cars sitting on the last 1' of interchange track.

I do like the general idea of the plan.  You might be able to lengthen the passing sidings some.  The top one you could probably get a bit longer by straigtening out the main and eliminating the S-curve, then pushing the left turnout back.  The bottom one would take a bit more adjustment, but you could wrap it around the bottom bend if you could fit a turnout in that curve. 

Another option is to limit your train size.  Remember, a railroad likely wouldn't switch all these industries everyday.  You could pick 3, maybe 4 industries and rotate their switching schedules.  That would help with the number of cars on each train. 

You'll moving in the right direction, so don't get discouraged!  Lot's of us have been there done that and I know at least for me I've learned a lot of this the hard way.  It's all just my opinion, take it for what it's worth.

Good luck,
Mike

[Blazeman]

Check this out for calculating how many cars you can have on the layout.

http://model-railroad-hobbyist.com/magazine/mrh-2014-10-oct/publishers-musings

[ScrewySqrl]

To show I *can* take advice, heres a further revision, with a through yard.

expanded the passing sidings to quite long lengths

I will admit I'm uncomfortable with the through yard.  I fear it will make building trains too easy!    I might drop three turnouts and make it a stub yard with AD tracks.  The yard lead is officially ridiculously long - 97".  Its long enough to build the Autotrain!

These are probably operationally simpler than what I had before

The shortest siding is the first yard track, and its 50 inches long.

Still 8 industries.  All stubs are along sidings, except Acme, but its quite close to the other two sidings.

for those wondering, the 'interchange' is the yard, thus the three rerailers.  the 0-5-0 switcher will get a workout