Shapeways FM switchers: Cleaning FUD

[wcfn100]

I welcome evidence that there is a process other than dissolving with heptane that is as safe and effective.

As do I.

Jason

[up1950s]

What confuses me is the color white it turns . Wax or any clear liquid applied coating should not change white to clear , except for paper , and therefor the coating removal should make the clear only clearer .

[DKS]

What confuses me is the color white it turns . Wax or any clear liquid applied coating should not change white to clear , except for paper , and therefor the coating removal should make the clear only clearer .

Apply hot wax or any liquid to frosted glass and watch what happens. Precisely the same principle.

I welcome evidence that there is a process other than dissolving with heptane that is as safe and effective.

As do I.

Jason

And in the meantime, I will continue using heptane with confidence (and encourage others to do so without hesitation), because at this point in time I am not aware of a viable alternative.

[mmyers05]

And in the meantime, I will continue using heptane with confidence (and encourage others to do so without hesitation), because at this point in time I am not aware of a viable alternative.

+1

[Chris333]

except for paper

The FUD to me seems porous sort of like a paper/plastic/resin combo. I can get water to soak into it. Perhaps the wax/oil is embedded deep into the FUD.





So the wax supports the FUD and I assume some of the cross hatching you see is an impression of the wax. Maybe the "resolution" of the wax is the problem? Or does the wax layer go down after the FUD layer.

   Wax, I don't see no wax:

/>

 

[Chris333]

http://www.shapeways.com/materials/frosted-detail

After the oven we put the basket in a ultrasonic bath with oil to remove all wax rests. After the oil bath the product are really greasy, so we put the basket in another ultrasonic cleaner with water to flush all leftover oil away

[bbussey]

... Finally, I feel sorry for modelers who are so impatient that they eschew a process known to be effective. To quote Yoda, patience.

Agreed.  I don't understand why there is a rush to paint/prep when the solution delays the process by only a day or two.

Also, My G32C gondolas have arrived with more caked wax on the insides than the Difco example above.  I just let it soak.  What's the rush?

The FUD to me seems porous sort of like a paper/plastic/resin combo. I can get water to soak into it. Perhaps the wax/oil is embedded deep into the FUD.

Which is why it is necessary to prime any ProJet parts prior to pouring the molds, with extra coats on any inner surfaces such as the inside of bodyshells or gondola cavities.  Otherwise, the rubber sticks to the master.

[DKS]

After that, we get the models from the tray and put them in a basket. That basket we place in an oven to melt the wax away. After the oven we put the basket in a ultrasonic bath with oil to remove all wax rests. After the oil bath the product are really greasy, so we put the basket in another ultrasonic cleaner with water to flush all leftover oil away. Then we dab away the leftover water on the models.

Yikes. I get uncomfortable reading this--may explain why some parts arrive broken, some arrive warped, and all have waxy residue. There is strong evidence this process isn't ideal.

It does, however, make me want to try heptane in an ultrasonic cleaner... hmmm...

[Philip H]

Yikes. I get uncomfortable reading this--may explain why some parts arrive broken, some arrive warped, and all have waxy residue. There is strong evidence this process isn't ideal.

It does, however, make me want to try heptane in an ultrasonic cleaner... hmmm...

Just don't stick any locos with motors in them into the bath . . . .

[bbussey]

I want to try having an item rendered and having no wax removed, and see if that is a better solution.

[DKS]

  Wax, I don't see no wax:

/>

I see quite a bit of "casual" handling of the parts, enough to make me nervous.

I want to try having an item rendered and having no wax removed, and see if that is a better solution.

+1

[Sokramiketes]

First, you assume there is only a thin waxy film all over the model. Note the photo I posted above; this is what I see most of the time. I have rarely seen a model with a consistent thin film all over. The dumper is the kind of item that requires days of soaking, since the heptane dissolves the wax slowly. If, however, the part does indeed have only a thin wax film, then the heptane will work perfectly, as it should remove that thin film in just a few minutes; agitation will accelerate the process, too.

There are few alternatives that will reliably remove the wax completely. As I have indicated, heat is ineffective, and other methods either risk mechanical damage, or require a secondary cleaning process to remove residues such as oils or detergents. I welcome evidence that there is a process other than dissolving with heptane that is as safe and effective.

Finally, I feel sorry for modelers who are so impatient that they eschew a process known to be effective. To quote Yoda, patience.

I built 4 of the Z scale Difco dump cars you're using as an example. 

Mine didn't have wax everywhere.  I ordered maybe 3 months ago, how long ago did you get your example? 

Mine were clean, but "oily".  I dunked them in Naptha for maybe 5 mins, took a toothbrush to it, and let it air dry.  I painted the first one the same day. 

[wcfn100]

Agreed.  I don't understand why there is a rush to paint/prep when the solution delays the process by only a day or two.

Who said I was in a rush?  I would spend hours hand cleaning parts if I could get a better result than Bestine.

I don't have the luxury of wondering off whenever I want to go play with chemicals.  I can get maybe 3 hours in a day just to myself and I have many other things to spend that time on, preferably golf  .  If I could could somehow clean parts during the day at the kitchen sink so I could then paint later that night, it saves me a bunch of time.

Jason

[bbussey]

Who said I was in a rush?  I would spend hours hand cleaning parts if I could get a better result than Bestine.

I don't have the luxury of wondering off whenever I want to go play with chemicals.  I can get maybe 3 hours in a day just to myself and I have many other things to spend that time on, preferably golf  .  If I could could somehow clean parts during the day at the kitchen sink so I could then paint later that night, it saves me a bunch of time.

Soak the parts and paint them the next night.  I don't see where your time is being burdened.  Soak them, pull them out, let them air dry which takes minutes, and then airbrush.  No manual labor involved prior to painting other than unscrewing the lid of a glass jar and extracting the parts.

You're not going to get a better result than Bestine if you want all of the wax removed.  Perhaps your Bestine problem is that you aren't using it properly.  Because if you leave the parts to soak and walk away for a day or two, they are totally wax free without any scrubbing of any sort.

[DKS]

I built 4 of the Z scale Difco dump cars you're using as an example. 

Mine didn't have wax everywhere.  I ordered maybe 3 months ago, how long ago did you get your example? 

Mine were clean, but "oily".  I dunked them in Naptha for maybe 5 mins, took a toothbrush to it, and let it air dry.  I painted the first one the same day.

Mine are perhaps six months old, maybe older. They may have improved the wax removal process; however, obviously the parts still come with some sort of residue. Bestine is a good de-greaser as well, and would probably clean the parts in a half-hour or so, with no need for a toothbrush.