Multi Cab Operation

[sd75i]

      I am far below a beginner for wiring a layout.  I want to have a 6 cab DC operation.  Do they make a 6 position switch I can use for each block?  Remember I am below beginner!  Thanks

 Dave t

[peteski]

Dave,
easiest way to do this is with a rotary switch.
Digikey carries hundreds of this type of switches.  Their search engine is a bit overwhelming, so here is one I found which should work: http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/A20615RNZQ/CKC7004-ND

It has 6 positions and 2 poles (as you probably don't use common rail wiring).  It is non-shorting which means that when you switch it from one position to another, the adjacent contact will not short out (a good thing in this case).  It is rated for 2.5 Amps which should be more than enough for N scale trains.  The datasheet is available at the link above. It'll give you the switch layout and dimensions.

You'll also need a knob to put on the shaft (so you have something to grab as you are turning it).    There are thousands of knobs to choose from.  is has a standard 0.25" shaft.  You might have to trim the actuator shaft's length so that the knob doesn't stick out too far.

[eric220]

Short answer is yes, there are multi-position switches out there. You can drop by a Radio Shack and take a gander at some. Longer answer is that there might be better ways of wiring things than using a multi position switch on every single block. What does your layout plan look like?

[C855B]

...there might be better ways of wiring things than using a multi position switch on every single block. ...

+1.

I did exactly this on a club layout 40 years ago. It was a bloomin' pain. I would never do it again. It also begs the question: six cabs on a personal layout?

[crencs]

Dave,

I concur with Mike!  How big is your layout?  Have you decided how many electrical blocks you need?   Six position rotary switches takes some time to wire. It helps to have planned ahead and purchased specific color wire for each cab bus or, you label everything and keep it organized!! (Requires a larger control panel) If not, this will easily turn in to a bowl of spaghetti wiring - which will make trouble shooting a nightmare!

Have you thought about operation?  Having all six cabs in operation will give your wrist a work out!  I set up 6 cab operation for a small n-trak club 15 years ago and that had 21 rotary switches divided among two control panels. (each mainline had 4 blocks and the remainder were for yard and siding control - the layout filled a 12'x24 space)  It worked great with 2 or 3 operators, but more than that, it was a pain spinning the rotary switches.

DCC might seem expensive to start and overwhelming at first, but is easier to wire and more enjoyable running trains!!!     

There are several DCC manufactures out there and everyone has their favorite!  It took me about 2 months of research before deciding which one to purchase. (I went with a NCE Pro cab) 

Ultimately the decision is yours - weather you want to enjoy or develop carpal tunnel syndrome running trains! 

Craig

[Kisatchie]

Digikey carries hundreds of this type of switches.  Their search engine is a bit overwhelming, so here is one I found which should work: http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/A20615RNZQ/CKC7004-ND

Hmm... you can get 5000
switches for $15,366.00...

[Cajonpassfan]

Dave,

Few years ago I converted to DCC from a six position rotary DC arrangement that worked reasonably well. It actually worked perfectly well, it's just that the operators were less than perfect, myself included.

I love DCC, but this is not intended to "convert" you; there are many legitimate reasons to stay with DC. I just thought I'd share some thoughts with you based on my personal DC experiences.

First, about cab assignments. As has been pointed out, you need to interrupt the power temporarily when using rotary selector switches to assign a cab to a block. Easy enough, but a required step. I actually used six position rotaries only at yard throats and OS sections (master blocks). In between stations, and in the yards, a two position toggle thrown left or right would simply connect to whatever the adjacent master block was set for. Generally speaking you can't have more than two trains inbetween master blocks anyway so all that is needed is a two position toggle, w/center off position. Simplified wiring tremendously.

Second, I assume you want six cabs because you have a layout large enough to support as many mainline operators, in addition to local jobs and yard jobs which can again be assigned with a two position toggle (local cab/rotary assigned cab). I used up/down for this function.

Third, you need to think through the role of the "dispatcher". Assigning blocks can be left to the crews as they move along, or to one centralized panel (dispatcher). Unless your crews are highly trained and disciplined (I don't  know any) there will always be somebody who messes up, shorting the block and shutting down the entire railroad. It gets old and frustrating, and takes out a lot of the enjoyment and the ambiance. A centralized panel can be a better choice but there is a price to pay....you are likely to be the one "dispatching" during ops sessions while your friends are having fun. That may be okay if that's what makes you enjoy the railroad and your friends, just put the panel somewhere where you can enjoy both. Dispatching and block assigning are not quite the same.

Finally, a thought about operations in general. I've spent twenty years building a large layout based on a  general idea about how I would operate it (like he prototype, right?), but the most valuable experience has been relatively recent, operating on other people's layouts, regardless of scale, to see what works and what doesn't (for me) and I've made adjustments, including converting to DCC. I'm not suggesting DCC is the answer for everyone, just that actually operating on a number of layouts put my own creation in perspective and taught me things I would have never otherwise considered. If there are "round robin" groups in your area, I would highly recommend participating.


Just my two cents worth...
Have fun!
Regards, Otto K.

[sd75i]

   The layout i bought is roughly 17x20 3 tier. Its in several pieces right now until i can confer with united nations(wife) for garage space. It was a friend of mine from work who lost his life way too young.  It is modeled after tehachapi.  I want to keep it going.  I would love to go DCC, but just have too many engines to convert.  6 cabs may be too much, but i would like a good amount of operations when friends come over.

 Dave t

[eric220]

Go DCC, you won't regret it.

Now that I've got that out of the way... Can you post a plan or photos of the layout?  We might be able to give better advice if we knew exactly what we were advising on.

[peteski]

I would also wholeheartedly recommend converting to DCC.  Not all the locomotives have to be converted (or not at least all at once).  Decoders can be purchased for less than $20 a piece (probably closer to $15 a piece in quantities).  If you spread the conversion over time then it is not that bad (both in the effort involved and in the expense).

I have been operating on many layouts (both DC and DCC).  I have also operated on few layouts that converted to DCC (I operated on them before and after the conversion). Let me tell you, the decreased hassle factor of not having do worry about DC blocks alone is well worth the pain and the cost of DCC conversion.

Yes, DCC is not perfect. Sometimes it'll develop a glitch or two and you also need to learn a new technology.  But compared to the 70-plus year old DC block control, it is so much more fun to operate!  Have you ever participated in a real operating session on a DCC-equipped layout?

[sd75i]

     I have 7 sidings and i am currently figuring out the diagram of the the 8 sections i need to put back together. I guess maybe 4 cabs would be better.


  dave t

[robert3985]

     I have 7 sidings and i am currently figuring out the diagram of the the 8 sections i need to put back together. I guess maybe 4 cabs would be better.


  dave t

Hey Dave,

Since you are self-admittedly "below a beginner" as far a wiring a layout is concerned, you may be biting off more than you can chew.  Complex DC wiring is COMPLEX, and if you are also green in the layout operation aspect, what you build the first time will most likely be unsatisfactory.

Several people here are not "below a beginner" as far as layout wiring, or layout operations are concerned, (just the opposite) and have "suggested" to you that the benefits of DCC far outweigh the simplistic argument that you have too many engines to convert. 

You would be well-served to re-read those posts and listen to the logic rather than listening to whatever is going on in your head that keeps you building wagon wheels when you should be considering Z-rated low-profile tires instead.

Although there is a group out there I have had unfortunate contact with a few months ago who insists that DC is "perfect", their opinions are not based on logic, but on misinformation and nameless fears.

Hopefully, your real reasons for not wanting to go for DCC is just lack of experience with it, vs last century's complex analog technology you seem hell-bent to attempt to replicate (as a rank neophyte) on your new layout.

Although a DC layout will possibly operate "OK"...take it from me, who has just recently "converted" over from a complex DC layout to DCC...my operations are exponentially easier, more realistic, more logical, and far simpler than my well thought out DC "rat's nest" of wiring, power routing turnouts, powered relays and several different styles and types of switches to flip, push and twist.

Do the right thing.  Go DCC...simple.

'Nuff said, other than I hope you are listening.

Cheers!
Bob Gilmore