EL / Trailer Train / UPS Question

[Bluford Craig]

Trailer Train made the jump from brown to yellow in 1970,
http://www.bluford-shops.com/bluford_1025_026.htm
so yes both brown and yellow are fair game.

EL ran E8's in freight service around that period too.

Craig

[FrankCampagna]

The E-L passed east-west through my home town, while the PC went north-south.

While even as a young rail-fan one got the feeling of "decrepit" with the PC, the E-L was always held in higher (quality) regard... Even after the bankruptcy filing following Hurricane Agnes in '72.

The E-L trains seemed to run faster and their mainline through this area was considered to be top-shelf.  I have a video someone shot while riding an E-L train through the southerntier of New York State and the speedometer was hitting 70mph.

Boy, seeing a train come through being led by SD45's in that wonderful color scheme... Just took your breath away as a railfan. 

You are right on the difference between EL and PC. At the start of Conrail, CR took the UPS trains off the EL and ran them on the shorter West Shore/ old NYC route. They couldn't keep the trains on the EL's schedule. UPS told CR to put the trains back where they were, or UPS would put the trailers on the highway. EL really meant it when they said "Friendly Service Route".

Frank

[Dave V]

I posted a summary of the MRing UPS trailer series and the timelines for the schemes in the Trainworx announcement thread....

I read that summary again, and while very good, it still doesn't indicate to me when specific stripes would have been in service, only that the yellow and red stripes would have been seen "through the nineties."  Were they delivered that way?

[MichaelWinicki]

You are right on the difference between EL and PC. At the start of Conrail, CR took the UPS trains off the EL and ran them on the shorter West Shore/ old NYC route. They couldn't keep the trains on the EL's schedule. UPS told CR to put the trains back where they were, or UPS would put the trailers on the highway. EL really meant it when they said "Friendly Service Route".

Frank

From the reading I've done it sounds like the EL would have made for a great merger partner, but there seemed to be some issues with the folks that worked for the railroad.

[SecretWeapon]

EL & D&H were going to merge, but the unions shot it down.

[James Costello]

I read that summary again, and while very good, it still doesn't indicate to me when specific stripes would have been in service, only that the yellow and red stripes would have been seen "through the nineties."  Were they delivered that way?

Sorry Dave, on the road for 6 weeks and away from the books....hopefully someone else can help out. The article was focused on 90s modelling though....

[FrankCampagna]

EL & D&H were going to merge, but the unions shot it down.

The D&H was actually part of the original EL talks. They backed out because at the time, the D&H was well off, and DL&W and Erie were in financial trouble. The D&H board didn't think it was in their investor's best interest. That had changed by the time of the Penn Central merger.

Chessie System was supposed to take over the EL with the advent of Conrail. They backed out, claiming union intransigence. That may or may not be the real reason. Maybe they just got cold feet.

Frank

[lock4244]

The EL and B&O mainlines crossed at Sterling, OH., where a connection could have been made and the EL downgraded or abandoned west of there (or west or Marion as the EL provided a straighter shot to Cincinnati from the Northeast). That or the B&O shuttered west of there. Either way, it looks good on the map and Chessie would have had a big leg up on the hot intermodal traffic in the Chicago - NY lane (and a lock on NE bound double stacks in the 80's), direct connections to New England (and the D&H and B&M were ripe for the plucking in the 70's), and a faster route out of Buffalo to the west. The rot coming out of the east at the time would have been enough to scare any sane person from the EL, but one wonders...

[Ed Kapuscinski]

From discussions with the people who were actually involved, the unions were responsible for lack of a Chessie-EL merger, but for good reason. They really were going to get the shaft.

[conrail98]

From discussions with the people who were actually involved, the unions were responsible for lack of a Chessie-EL merger, but for good reason. They really were going to get the shaft.

Same with the Reading,

Phil

[JDouglasFisher]

For anyone whose really interested in the nitty gritty regarding the Erie Lackawanna, I'd highly suggest "Erie Lackawanna: Death of an American Railroad" by H. Roger Grant? You'll come to find out that the EL's Troubles start "Pre Merger", and with some unforeseen natural events combined with poor management choices, and you end up with a failed railroad seeking last minute inclusion into Conrail.

as an aside, did you know, that the EL had plans to order both GP38-2's and U23B's? (U boats ended up on the L&N I believe)

Would've made an interesting competitor to Conrail if it survived.

J.....

[SecretWeapon]

I knew about the GP-38's & U boats. They were ordered but never delivered. I've been looking for that book. I heard it was great. Espiecally if your an EL fan.

[Robbman]

Would've made an interesting competitor to Conrail if it survived.

Dereco as originally planned would have been a real competitior... RDG, CNJ, EL, D&H and B&M

[SecretWeapon]

Dereco as originally planned would have been a real competitior... RDG, CNJ, EL, D&H and B&M

Don't forget N&W.

[lock4244]

For anyone whose really interested in the nitty gritty regarding the Erie Lackawanna, I'd highly suggest "Erie Lackawanna: Death of an American Railroad" by H. Roger Grant? You'll come to find out that the EL's Troubles start "Pre Merger", and with some unforeseen natural events combined with poor management choices, and you end up with a failed railroad seeking last minute inclusion into Conrail.

as an aside, did you know, that the EL had plans to order both GP38-2's and U23B's? (U boats ended up on the L&N I believe)

Would've made an interesting competitor to Conrail if it survived.

J.....

Stuff I dug up on the internet - 20 x GP38-2 and 19 x U23B's. I believe the GP38-2's were ordered (PO was supposedly issued) but they were never built... for anyone. The U23B's were ordered with AAR B trucks, but the order was delivered with FB-2's when to the order when to the L&N.