Best Of Yard Layouts

[davefoxx]

Lee:

Have you looked at the WM track diagrams I gave you.  I know you can't actually do the whole Hagerstown yard but it should give you an idea on how they laid out the yard and you could modify it for optiumum operations.

Oooh, I'd like to see that.  Usually, there's no need to reinvent the wheel, if the model yard is to operate like the prototype.  Heck, the prototype already figured out what's needed.

Dave

[wm3798]

I have looked at the track charts... very helpful.  Trouble for me is the available space.  10 lbs of shil and a 5 lb. bag...

PM on the way, Dave.  But you can wait till next time you have to go to Hurlock...
Lee

[wm3798]

Here's the track chart....

from 1955 track charts... just post steam.
Lee

[Bob Bufkin]

Lee:

Don't mean to change the subject but I found a reprint of the Rand McNally 1928 Handy Railroad Atlas of the U.S.

It shows the PRR coming into Cambridge but at Hurlock it shows the BC&A crossing the PRR.  The maps don't have a listing for this RR.  Can't seem to find out what the initials stand for.  Do you happen to know.  I also have an early 70's Rand McNally maps which are also quite interesting since it shows the WM, B&O, PC, etc.  I'll try to scan them for MD ans post later if anyone is interested.
Bob

[davefoxx]

Bob,

That's the Baltimore, Chesapeake & Atlantic Railroad, later the Baltimore & Eastern Railroad, and, of course, now, Brian's railroad, the Maryland & Delaware RR.

Dave

[davefoxx]

Lee,

That track chart is great!  The things that I pick out of it are a double-track mainline bisecting east and west classification yards (looks like more classification is done for westbound traffic than for eastbound in Hagerstown, which would be convenient for you since eastbound trains go right into staging), the roundhouse, interchange with the B&O, and a passenger station (was this still active in the 1970s?).

One new thought.  If the shelf is 36" deep, you're going to have a heck of a time reaching those tracks towards the rear.  That may be another reason to move Elkins and slim down the depth of the shelf.  Can the roundhouse go into the corner?

Dave

P.S.  PM received.  I'll send that to you tomorrow.  I'll also include a photocopy of the page of Hagerstown from my railroad atlas.  Looks like you got it just about right in your "modified" Google map.

[Bob Bufkin]

Thanks Dave.  The 70's map shows it as the B&E.  Always great to have some old maps to check out how things used to be.

[wm3798]

The BC&A was independent and affiliated with the steamship lines from Baltimore to Claiborne Landing in Talbot County east of St. Michaels, running from there via Easton, Preston and Vienna to Ocean City.  )There's another historic landing at Love Point on Kent Island, but that belonged to the Queen Anne Railroad, which traversed that county to Hillsboro in Caroline County, and on to its terminus in Denton.)  Sometime in the 1930's, the BC&A was acquired by the PRR, which changed the name to Baltimore and Eastern, a wholly-owned subsidiary.  When the FRA upgraded the requirements for bridges during the 1930's, the PRR opted to abandon most of the B&E's, diverting all through traffic to the PRR, and using the branch connections such as Hurlock to handle what local work that remained on the B&E lines.  There are still several remnants in service, but not many.  M&D recently filed to abandoned the line from Hurlock to Preston.  Hurlock to Vienna saw the rail pulled around 2009, but is still owned by Delmarva Power in the event that the power plant at Vienna should ever be converted back to coal.  It hasn't been used since the early 70's.

The Conrail final system plan report from 1975 (I think I loaned it to Ed) has a really good break down of the traffic volumes on these lines.  A good deal of the car loadings, outside of agricultural, came from various Koppers plants that made cross ties for the Penn Central.  Not exactly revenue freight...

And yes, Dave, the chart bears studying.  The passenger station, which is visible in the Birds Eye I posted earlier, was taken out of service in the late 1950's when the grade separation project moved the tracks behind and above it.  It now serves as the HQ of the Hagerstown P.D.

Lee

[3rdrail]

Lee, the FRA is a creature of the 1960's, so it couldn't have mandated bridge updates in the 1930's. It was not the force of law but the free market that rendered the bridges no longer useful. As freight cars grew in capacity from 30-40 tons to 50-70 tons a lot of the PRR spans on the Delmarva were too frail to handle 70 ton cars. PRR had rid itself of all pre-1914 design power by the 1920's, except for a handful of 4-4-0's, which were used on the Delmarva branches with lightly built bridges. But light power was of no help if the cars themselves were too heavy but the volume insufficient to justify new bridges.

[wm3798]

Thanks for that clarification, Gregg.  I knew it had something to do with car weights... I couldn't remember if it was mandated or as you stated, more organic in nature...  Although someone told me that it had something to do with federal standards for bridge capacities being ramped up in preparation for war traffic.  Obviously it wasn't the FRA, but could it have been the War Department?

Lee

[3rdrail]

Thanks for that clarification, Gregg.  I knew it had something to do with car weights... I couldn't remember if it was mandated or as you stated, more organic in nature...  Although someone told me that it had something to do with federal standards for bridge capacities being ramped up in preparation for war traffic.  Obviously it wasn't the FRA, but could it have been the War Department?

Lee

No, because there were some very lightly built lines elsewhere. But the ICC could have mandated higher minimum weights on some traffic, or set bridge capacity rules, but I do not recall anything like that. The War Department had no authority over railroads during peacetime.

[Ed Kapuscinski]

Now, getting back to business, I had an EXCELLENT meeting on this subject yesterday (actually, it was about some other topic, of which I had to be involved for 1 minute, leaving 59 for layout design!).

Here's what I came up with. As drawn originally, Hagerstown yard "looked" like a yard, but would be a nightmare to operate. I've worked this up, based on my experience working the existing "temp" yard (both alone and with a capable man on the ground).



There are lots of things going on here, so I'll take it from the top (the west end).

First, there is only one main in. That could be expanded, but I feel like a single "feels" more WMy. There is also the west drill track that should be as long as the longest A/D track (but if it's not, we can live, you just have to double up). This can be tied back into the main, but really doesn't need to be.

Now, in sequence of operations:

Notice the way the initial throat is there at the west end, and how classification can go on without interference by stuff moving into / out of the A/D tracks.

The Arrival / Departure Tracks (green). I've put in 3, that would probably be fine. 4 would be outstanding, but we currently get by with 2. Trains would either pull in here entirely, or just back blocks to be worked in there. It's accessible from either direction from the main, and the drill tracks. Ideally, these tracks would be as long as your staging tracks, so an entire train can originate or terminate there. However, we could live if they're not (by doubling up... they even have to do that in Enola). I think I've drawn them rather short here. They could probably be extended by wrapping them further down and putting their tie in to the east drill below (left and down) of the class tracks using a crossover, but you'd then have to get to the servicing tracks somehow.

Next up are the caboose servicing tracks. Nothing too exciting here, just notice that they're easily accessible from both ends of the A/D tracks. Make sure to have enough capacity here. There's also a stub for pure storage. I'd imagine trains would pull in, and their cabs could be removed by yard crews prior to working a the train.

Notice how you've got TWO types of engine tracks: storage and ready / arrival.
This way, one track is for power coming in, one is for ready stuff going out, and then there's the "round house" for storage. This way, power is ready to go east or west, or can just get out of the way. This could actually be a third "job", just making sure that whatever is needed is on the ready track, and that whatever has come in has either been "serviced" (heh heh heh) and made ready, or stored.

Finally, there are the classification tracks. See how it's double ended? That's so that one crew (west?) can take cars that have arrived and sort them, and the other one can take sorted cuts and place them into the A/D tracks to go out (either for insertion into trains, or as entirely new ones). Ideally, there would be a class track for each "block" that needs to exist, but this can shrink if need be (it'll just make thing inefficient). A more detailed analysis should be done on this.

There are two caveats to this whole thing:
1. It's not drawn using anything NEAR to real geometry, it's more of a schematic.
2. It's not anywhere near the prototype

But I think this is a good place to start.
 

[wm3798]

I really like the flow of that...  I was getting all hung up about the yard being "behind" the ET, and across US 11 like it is on the ground up there.  But we really do need to focus on the flow, as you've shown.

I don't see any real major hang ups with this outline, and I'll dip into the RTS and see what we end up with real geometry.  I think it won't be too hard to expand this a bit and make it fit.  I think I'll keep a double main around the back though, if for no other reason that's a proto element that will be worth having in terms of allowing through trains to pause and still have room to get around them.

Thanks, Ed!  I think you've got something there!

Lee

[Ed Kapuscinski]

Excellent! I'm glad you're digging it.

I did miss some things, like a RIP track and "storage" tracks (which might be handy). I figure they can go in wherever you have room, since they really won't be getting worked too frequently.

[Bob Bufkin]

Glad you mentioned the Rip Track.  I was going to suggest that.  Also a good place to place a work train and Lee's excellent ice breaker.