Supersecret Hint for CR Modellers...

[ljudice]

OK - don't tell anyone about this, but...

If you head to Michael's craft store (take care to avoid the suspicious glares from the 90 women in the store by steering clear of the the artificial flower section, the scrapbooking section and the basket weaving section.) If you are particularly concerned about entering this store, bring a small child with you and talk to them repeatedly and loudly about their "class project".

Go STRAIGHT to the craft paint section and pick up a can of Colortool Terra Rosa. Then get the HELL OUT!

It is a near exact, dead on match for the Atlas Conrail Freight Car red and nearly, perfectly right for CR freight equipment. This paint is remarkably thin and sprays on nicely in dry, warm weather - a lot like Scalecoat II.  It leaves a nice decal surface also.

Just don't tell anyone, especially your wife or G.F. or they will be down buying this stuff up to use for their flower arrangements or dollhouses or whatnot...

Lou

[wm3798]

How does this compare to WM oxide red?  I've been hunting for a better option to Walmart primer...  It's a little thick, and hair too "red"...
Lee

[ljudice]

It's a much better paint than the Walmart stuff (generic)...  I have tried some of the other colors, but actually there are not too many useful for railroads - these paints are for floral arrangement use, apparently. 

However, there is also a useful new Krylon color - I think it is called Harvest Gold, which is very close to the Yellow Chrome color used on MOW equipment...

[Allentown Hump]

What boxcar red from what Conrail shop do you think it matches the best? 

[ljudice]

Sounds like a trick question.

Let's see - the shop in Hillside, NJ or I guess it's actually in China somewhere?

I never said it matched ANY PARTICULAR prototype color, I said it matched Atlas' - specifically the recent runs of the ACF boxcar and FGE boxcar.

I've been modelling Conrail since 1989 - so for about 19 years I've been looking around for easy matches to what I perceive as their freight car color, and this is the best I've found.

Hey, Allentown Hump, here's a question for you:  Where was this photo taken?

[Walkercolt]

Don't get too hung-up on the "right color" for frieght cars. I've gone up to BNSF boxcars and with my pocketknife, taken a chip of paint off a freshly painted boxcar, and compared it to another freshly painted boxcar, and guess what? They didn't match....not even close. Depends on how good they stirred up the 55 gallon drum of paint, what lot # the paint is, and how it's put on, and this is "boxcar red". The grey covered hoppers are all over the place color-wise and it says it's all PPG#xxxxx SuperPoxy or Glidden what-ever-they-call-it. In a dozen freshly painted cars, there's a dozen colors.

[ljudice]

Walkercolt,

Luckilly for me, between June, 1992 and August 1995 I had access to 2 Hewlett-Packard 92212 Laser Color Densitometers. Since Conrail was in the process of selling off excess parcels of land along the Lehigh Line in New Jersey, I was fortunate to be able to lease 2 small triangles of land on either side of the line in Middlesex, NJ. I had high speed data lines run to the equipment boxes I installed, along with a pair of MicroVAX minicomputers and a custom designed train presence detector.

For three years I used this gear to analyze the color of every single freight car (and locomotive, for that matter) that ran between Port Reading Jct. and Oak Island, NJ. Data was normalized for lighting by sampling BOTH sides simultaneously.

So you see, I'm not relying on my perception at all - it's scientific data. And this is the internet, so it must be true.

Seriously, Atlas got the color right - and this paint is damn close to it. So either try it and be happy or ignore my advice and spend eternity the way the Pennsy fans do - growing older and grayer, bitterly and resentfully clinging to their failing memory of Brunswick Green.

 

[Hyperion]

Don't get too hung-up on the "right color" for frieght cars. I've gone up to BNSF boxcars and with my pocketknife, taken a chip of paint off a freshly painted boxcar, and compared it to another freshly painted boxcar, and guess what? They didn't match....not even close. Depends on how good they stirred up the 55 gallon drum of paint, what lot # the paint is, and how it's put on, and this is "boxcar red". The grey covered hoppers are all over the place color-wise and it says it's all PPG#xxxxx SuperPoxy or Glidden what-ever-they-call-it. In a dozen freshly painted cars, there's a dozen colors.

As the person who buys the appropriately-spec'd BNSF paint for the Havelock shops, I can tell you that 1>  It's actually either Valspar or Davis-Frost paint, 2> it's "Mineral Brown" (not "boxcar red") according to our Research and Development team that came up with the formula (and a huge amount of testing went into selecting the color and formula) and 3> the formula does change ever-so-slightly between batches.  We also change between manufacturers on occassion, so the color will change a tad bit more on those occassions.

But, yes, your point still stands -- no 2 cars look the same color when they roll off the line.  It was even worse back in the days of BN Green, when 2 cars would not only be slightly different, they might be HUGELY different depending on the day of the week they rolled out of the shop.

[ljudice]

Very interesting!

I think it's been pretty well established that paint varies in color from batch to batch, from shop to shop, from contract shop to contract shop, from day of the week to day of the week.

Fortunately, I don't have that problem - since as I said, I am matching my paint to the Atlas models, which approximate what I remember.

Feel free, anyone to dispute my memory!

[Walkercolt]

Yeah, the covered hoppers were probably UTLX, and brands of paint vary, but most are right on the side of the cars nowdays. I was in the Air Force and all the paints were "MIL spec'd". And no two Phantoms were ever re-painted the same color. Even on the insides, the zinc chromate green varied all over the place. Even "equiptment black" varied from what it was on, the prep on the surface, and how heavy the guy sprayed it on. Add in aging and weathering, and how often an engine's seen a wash rack, and unless you paint Conrail engines fire engine red, you're gonna match somethin',sometime. My boss has an old set of Santa Fe paint "drift chart" which shows how far "Catwisker Yellow" can be "off" and still be acceptable and the blue, and Warbonnet Red and the silver. There are five paint chips of each color on each page, and they vary ALOT.

[Ryan87]

unless you paint Conrail engines fire engine red

Be careful when you say that!  ;D

[David Leonard]

I got a can of the Terra Rosa, and a quick test shows that it is indeed a close match to the paint on an Atlas CR hopper. I'd prefer it a bit warmer, but I will not be using florescent lighting on my layout, so it will work fine. Incidentally, look for the brand name "Design Master"; "Colortool" is in smaller lettering on the can, and it's hard to spot if you're only looking for that.

Even if you can't find a kid to go with you, it's worth the time exploring other paints, etc. that Michaels stocks. They have a fair selection of paint markers (black, red, yellow, etc) that are close enough for touching up handrails or small mistakes in spray painting. Unlike regular markers, paint markers are not adversely affected by Dullcoat.

[Ed Kapuscinski]

I got some good scenery material there. It's called "scenic moss" or something like that. It's kinda "organic" looking.

I stretch it out and spray it gray and it works good for generic forest floor covering.

[DKS]

I got some good scenery material there. It's called "scenic moss" or something like that. It's kinda "organic" looking.

Yes, I've gotten their scenic moss, too. I find quite a few other useful things there. I've gotten something called "natural lichen branch" in the dried flower section. Doesn't look anything like the lichen sold for modeling; it looks more like brambles or undergrowth.

I get a dried flower called "candy tuft" which makes for really nice small trees--background, forced perspective, transition, etc. I get the natural color and just spray-paint it gray from below (for trunks and branches) and green from above (for foliage).

I also get the Sophisticated Finishes there, as well as texture spray paints for a quick and dirty scenery base. I was eyeballing the floral sprays a while back, wondering if they were useful. Glad to know they can serve a purpose.

[Walkercolt]

Yes indeed! With Polly Scale paint running about $640 a gallon(well, you only buy an ounce at a time), for many things, looking outside the hobby shop's worthwhile. I like "artists" acrilycs, especially for structures, because of the colors available. You can thin them enough to be workable. I use the one's in two ounce bottles, I get on sale at Wally-World. Might not work for rolling stock.