NKP SD9 Detailing Project

[central.vermont]

After laying the factory handrail/stanchion assembly over the new stanchion I can see the GMM stanchion are taller.  I think the design is to fold the top tab over the handrail.  My thought was to solder them together.  I'll now have to trim some of the tab off the top if I go that route.  QUESTION for those who've done this before:  Did you fold the tab, clip and solder, solder and clip, or just solder?  My concern about folding is it seems like it would be tough to fold the tab around the handrail such that the handrail stays parallel to the frame (no dips).  I can closely control the handrail position with tape if I solder it.  Any thoughts on the matter?

Steve

Steve,

Maybe prebending the handrail stanchions around that neat little
tool you have for forming eyelets!! You said it was .010 dia and
that should leave you enough room to slip in the .008 handrails
without it binding to make it easier to adjust the positioning of the
stanchions. Then just solder in place. By the way, nice work so far!!!! ;D ;D

Jon

[sd80mac]

Very clever indeed Steve! Innovation keeps this hobby extremely interesting! ;D

Donnell M. Wells

I made a spacer from balsa & basswood sheet to provide a plane upon which the stanchions will rest during handrail installation.  Wood, because my plan is to solder the handrails to the stanchions.  The graph paper serves only as a visual guide to help me install the stanchions perpendicular to the frame.  First time I've done it this way and it helps A LOT.  The spacer for the other side is shown beneath the bolt, graph paper side down.  It's tough to see but I sliced away one edge at an angle to clear the air intake grills on the long hood making the spacer more easily removed after handrail installation.  I usually don't think about those kinds of things until it's too late and my jig is captured behind my work, requiring the work to be removed to free the jig.  :  I must be in "the zone" to have thought about this now.  The masking tape over the bolt keeps the assembly from scooting around while I'm working on it.  CA adhesive holds the stanchion in place.  A dip of Zap a Gap on the end of the stanchion and then a dab applied to the stanchion pocket with .080 wire after the stanchion is in place.


Steve

[SAH]

Maybe prebending the handrail stanchions around that neat little
tool you have for forming eyelets!! You said it was .010 dia and
that should leave you enough room to slip in the .008 handrails
without it binding to make it easier to adjust the positioning of the
stanchions. Then just solder in place. By the way, nice work so far!!!! ;D ;D

Jon

Thanks guys.  I thought about the suggestion you made Jon after I posted the last segment.  I got to thinking about it some more after reading your post this afternoon.  My concern is not being able to control the bend point for the tab once the stanchion is installed in the frame and being locked in to a wavey looking handrail as a result.

HOWEVER, let's consider doing the steps in reverse.  Make a jig that allows the tab bend to be made at the same point for each stanchion BEFORE they are installed.  Drill the holes in the frame a bit oversize to allow some play.  Bend the handrail to shape and slip the stanchion tabs over the handrail, then finish the bend but not so tightly that the stanchions can't slide on the handrail.  Fit the stanchions to the frame and tape them in place to allow the final bends at each end.  With the oversize holes in the frame it should be pretty easy line up the handrail parallel with the frame.  Once satisfied with the placement and fit, glue the stanchions to the frame and solder the handrail to the stanchions.  Worth a try on the other side if the current method turns into a p.i.t.a.  We'll see.

Not too hot here today so the attic is comfortable.  I'll do some scenery tonight I think.  Maybe terrorize Ed with some more bare trees.   ;D

Thanks for your suggestions guys.  The power of an internet forum at it's best.

Steve

[Robbman]

Message deleted

[SAH]

As delivered, the SD9s lacked nose-mounted bells, external low-water alarms and spark arrestors.  All had the standard NKP headlight package on the front only.  The external radiator roof piping is a SD9 phase feature (Ph II), so quite a few other roads SD9s have it.

Starting in early 1960, NKP removed the sill mounted bell and replaced it with a nose-mounted bell indiscriminately on many of it's units (new high-hood power ordered in 1960 and later (the 10 GP18s, 5 RS11s, and 2 RS36s) got nose-mounted bells from the factory).  Around the same time, NKP also began applying spark arrestors (also indiscriminately).

The low-water alarms were moved outside of the carbody in 1963 or so... though N&W put some back inside.

 

My photo survey does indeed show the modifications were made indiscriminately.  I wasn't sure when the mods started though.  Thanks for pinning that down Robbman.  I'll skip the low water alarm, probably do the spark arrestors and if I get really inspired, pick a number that had the hood mounted bell.

[Mark5]

Starting in early 1960, NKP removed the sill mounted bell and replaced it with a nose-mounted bell indiscriminately on many of it's units (new high-hood power ordered in 1960 and later (the 10 GP18s, 5 RS11s, and 2 RS36s) got nose-mounted bells from the factory).  Around the same time, NKP also began applying spark arrestors (also indiscriminately).
 

This casts doubt on the 1957 date of this photo.  ???

http://nkphts.org/pictures/ameling/348-Norwallk-OH-6-1957jpg.html

[Robbman]

Message deleted

[Mark5]

That it's in a paint scheme that didn't appear until October of 1959 casts serious doubt...

Ahh, thanks

[SAH]

That it's in a paint scheme that didn't appear until October of 1959 casts serious doubt...

Ahh, thanks

The simplified wide stripe lettering diagram on the NKPHTS website (might be in the members only section) shows an initial issue date of April 27, 195_.  The last digit is partially obscured.  Could be a 7 or could be a 9.  If I had to choose I'd go with the 9.  Could look to see what units were delivered new with the wide stripe scheme and when.  Haven't done so yet myself.  I suppose it's possible the first repaints weren't done until 10/59.  What is the source of your 10/59 date Robbman?

[Robbman]

Message deleted

[SAH]

Had a bit of a set back last night.  I got the handrail soldered to the stanchions OK but clipping off the top of the stanchion as I described turned out to be not such a good idea.  Wound up bending everything up pretty good so I removed the stanchions and will make another attempt.  Hey, if you never mess up you're probably not trying anything new, right? 

I'm going to try the method I described in response to Jon's post a few days ago.  We'll see.

Steve

[SAH]

Back at it and making progress.

Here's the jig I made to fold the stanchion tabs over.  A stanchion is in the slot, resting against the bottom stop.  The .010" SS wire is laying across the tab.  I attached the SS wire to a small wood dowel to make a handle so my wire guide wouldn't go flying into outer space so easily.  (Guess how I found out this was a good thing to do.  :)  The tip of the knife blade is used to fold the tab over the wire, using my finger to hold the stanchion into place.


I need to fine tune the jig as not every stanchion tab folded in the same place.  I culling the ones of the same height in this photo.  I need to hold the stanchion more securely without deforming the part.  Finger pressure doesn't cut it.  I have an idea I'll try for the other side's stanchions.  Work with these stanchions awhile and you come to really appreciate the effort GMM put into designing and making them.  I hope my effort does them justice.


I stick glued some 1/8" grid paper to a piece of hardboard and used the plastic handrail as a template to draw a pattern.  Bend the wire at the steps behind the cab first, rotate the wire 90 deg and bend the other end.  Easier to do the second time around.  I destroyed the first attempt you'll recall.


I threaded the stanchions onto the handrail as you would for a necklace.  The plan was to simply drop the stanchions into the holes in the frame.  NOT!  A good exercise if you want to drive yourself crazy.  I finally got it done but will NOT be doing it this way on the other side.  I'll leave the tabs open a bit more so I can mount the stanchions first, slip the handrail in place and close the tab after applying a bit of thin CA adhesive.  Using the CA is SO much easier than soldering.  Using the tab makes it possible.


Here's a comparison between factory and fabricated just to make sure I wasn't wasting my time.  The NKP units had yellow handrails the length of the unit, which is the main reason for going to the fine wire handrails IMO.  I think it will be an improvement.  You might notice the handrail at the cab end is not parallel with the frame.  By some good fortune I had not glued the stanchion closest to the cab and handrail together yet, so I was able to fiddle with the bends to line it up better.


Here's the short hood handrail installation.  This was the second one I made.  It took about 20 mins to freehand it using the factory part as a pattern. It turned out so well I decided to use it as a pattern for the other side.  In the process, SPRONG, off it went into space.   :  Down on my hands and knees with a flashlight looking for it, with the cat "helping" of course.  No luck after 5 mins.  (Insert appropriate cuss words here).  Made another one in less than 5 mins.  The moral - Don't be such a klutz and don't be afraid to make another one.  The more you do it the easier it becomes.


Time to break while I wait for my new wire bending pliers to arrive.  I can't help but feel it will be MUCH easier once I get some decent tools to work with.  Good timing too since I'll be off making sure everything really is up-to-date in Kansas City for most of this week.

As always, questions, comments and especially ways to do it better or easier are welcome!

Steve

[sd80mac]

Okay...you've had enough time! ;D Where the rest of this awesome project? :'( > :-[ :-\ :-*

Inquiring minds want to know... 

Donnell

[SAH]

I've run into a bit of a time problem Donnell.  After a 1st quarter of having lots of time to work on trains, since April anytime I'm not eating, sleeping or travelling out of town to work, I'm working.  Probably will continue in this mode for another month.  It pays the bills.  :  Oh, and then I'll be moving to a new house.  The downside - you'll see pix of the last train through Spencer posted soon.  The upside - I'll have a slightly bigger space available that will be MINE, MINE, MINE and the temperature in the space won't reach triple digits during the summer.     Once things settle down I'll get back to the SD9 I hope.  The last time I took down a layout it was 15 years before I had another one running though.  Need to do better this time around.

Steve

[Ed Kapuscinski]

Steve
Whereabouts are you?

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