Suggestions for mounting layout in new train room?

[pnolan48]

I didn't want to hijack Hyperion's Perfect Layout Room thread, but I'd like some thoughts about my new basement room.

It will cost me only about $600 for studs, sheetrock, and insulation.

But this is not an ordinary basement. The concrete walls are finished like drywall and painted white. It is bone dry and spotlessly clean--it was used as a guest room since built. It is warm in winter (68 degrees F) and cool in the summer (75 degrees).

My layout was mounted on closet racks back in Albuquerque. That was unsatisfactory as the racks flex--but it made it much easier to lift sections out. The sections are generally 20 inches wide by 8-12 feet long, and not heavy.

I'm thinking, if I stud in the wall, that I'll cantilever 2 x 4 supports out about 16 inches or so every second stud, or about 32" apart, and use a layer of plywood under the racks to eliminate the flex. But that will make drywalling quite a challenge, as there will still be three decks to the layout.

Or I could mount the old closet rack uprights directly on the concrete and mount the layout the same way as in Albuquerque.

I think the stud walls (and finished ceiling) are my easiest alternative. But it's still a lot of work for someone my age, with my back.

Anyone with any other thoughts or suggestions?

Thanks!

[Philip H]

Pete,
Why not screw the shelf brackets to the studs through the drywayy, assuming the studs are anchored well, it should be fine?

[Sokramiketes]

Mark Runyan is lagging Unistrut to his concrete walls.  There are several bracket options available in the Unistrut line and there is an infinite range of height adjustment as you dial in the elevations. 

Since your walls are clean and dry already, this might be another option.

[dwyaneward]

Pete,

I have used the double slot wall bracks for my layout with a wood frame attached.

You can see my install here http://kdrail.blogspot.com/

[pnolan48]

. . . It was built on suggestions from another n-scale forum.  We used Rubbermaid metal bracket runners installed with drywall screws on the finished drywall.  I elected to use the 24" brackets and placed 1/2" plywood ontop of the bracket; the plywood was fastened from below with a minimal number of screws. I mounted 2" extruded polystyrene foam ontop of the plywood. . .

Hi Roger,

This is about what I did in Albuquerque. Except I skipped the plywood and used 1" foam, which was attached to the brackets by a minimal number of bailing wire loops. Not satisfactory. I used 20" brackets on the first level and 16" on decks two and three. I should have realized that a 20" bracket is as deep as a 2 x 4 (i.e., 3.5"), so I wasn't saving much depth of the decking. Of course the bracket is tapered, but I will taper 2 x 4s if I use them. I still have the runners. But undoing the bailing wire is impossible, as wiring runs through it. It's not complicated wiring (DCC), and is well ordered, but it still uses the loops. I want to use plywood under the racks so I don't have to mess much with the wiring. It's just getting the plywood cantilevered from the wall that's got me bamboozled a bit.

[inkaneer]

"$600 for wall studs,sheetrock, and insulation."  YIKES!!!  Is all that necessary?  You don't say how much room you have for the layout but the one thing that I think should be avoided in any layout  is the idea of permanence.  Eliminate any thought that this will be the ultimate layout. Because what you might think today is 'cool' probably won't be later on.  It's a real shame to build something only to, later on, change your mind and rip it out.  So, if you have the room, I would say build a modular free standing layout and avoid attaching it to walls.  Now by modular I do not mean it has to be Ntrak as that is what most people think of when the word modular is mentioned.  I prefer to build modular for a number of reasons not the least of which is that it allows me to work on one module at a time.  Ballasting an entire layout can seem like and is, a tedious task.  But doing one module at a time breaks it down into manageable portions.  You can ballast one module and work on other scenery on another then wire a third, etc.  Helps to keep the interest up and the layout progressing.  Just remember the day will come when the old layout just doesn't do it anymore and you will want to do this or that over again.   Like I said, "What you might think today is 'cool' probably won't be later on."  Going with a free standing modular design allows you to incorporate changes later on much easier.   So if you got the room for a walk around layout or island type, I would recommend it.   

[DKS]

One thought comes to mind, and that is to mount the studs to the concrete wall flat, rather than edgewise. Mount the shelf bracket standards to the middle of the studs. Then attach the sheetrock to either side of each standard. It would be a fair amount of work, but in the end you'd have a smooth, flush surface, with no bracket hardware protruding. Your backdrop can then be attached directly to the wall. Or, tape/spackle over the standards between decks, and paint the backdrop image right on the sheetrock. Just thinking out loud, really. Might not even be worth all the work.

[pnolan48]

Inkaneer,

Actually, I built the layout in modules with Closet-Maid like runners and brackets mounted on drywall. Many of the sections were built on a work table in another room or, once in a while, on the kitchen table. This was a great method, as I could wire them upside down at table level, then transport the whole wired closet shelf plus foamboard to the train room, and hook them on the brackets. I even "pre-lighted" much of the bottom level modules with flat spotlights and rope lights installed. The largest section, about 20" x 12', weighed probably 40 pounds, ballast included.

Yes, I put lightweight scenery between the layout board and the wall, often times to try to curb the flexing of the wire racks (it sorta worked). When it came time to move, I just cut vertically along the wall. It left a bit of a mess on the drywall, but I repaired all of it in about four hours. I was a mudder the summers I was in college, so that wasn't hard.

David,

That's a neat idea! What I did before was use 1/4" foam core over the brackets. Here, the brackets would run from about 30" to about 68", so I could do the bottom and top uninterrupted, and the space between brackets with about 32" x 38" pieces (I did every other stud before, and it worked).

I "cheated" dead level in Albuquerque. With the help of a laser level, the long "level" walls actually climbed at 0.5 percent. Why bother? Over 20' it gained me 1.2 inches, which cut the main grades on the non-level, climbing sections. It was just enough to cut grades by about 0.25 percent. When I decided to have ships, I forgot that water is dead level (except in my world). This cut the climbing distance by about 50 percent. Besides, running a grade on the front edges of a layout doesn't always work.

[pnolan48]

Inkaneer,

Yes, materials are about $600--part of it is already finished. All told, it's 30' x 12', but I need only 66 linear feet of wall to complete it before it goes off to an even bigger space. I'll recheck sheetrock prices, though. And the concrete floor is polished almost to the level of big-box stores. I will put some of those interlocking floor pads to save my feet and back.

[ElginLoco]

I love the Unistrut install I'm using. plus all the same same type of stuff can be found at Home Depot, they carry the Superstrut line. I had ordered mine from McMaster-Carr. I actually eliminated a middle deck and readjusted the height of the lower deck in an evening, without having to remove the sections at all. My article in NSR tells so much more. With your room done, studs and drywall take 4" of floor space around the room. The strut is just 13/16" thick, so your deck widths could be the same and your aisles gain 3". Or keep the aisle position and gain 3" to the radius of the curves in the room corners.
And with 8 to 12' sections you don't need many struts.
I wouldn't build it any other way knowing now what I do about this scheme. Chime in with any Q's
-Mark Runyan