TheRailwire
General Discussion => N and Z Scales => Topic started by: ridinshotgun on June 22, 2018, 11:10:35 AM
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I know some rumors had gone out a few weeks ago but now it looks official that Atlas bought the n scale rolling stock and locomotive e tooling from Walthers.
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10156877792320110&id=129250295109 (https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10156877792320110&id=129250295109)
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Thanks! I'm not on FB so I missed the annoucement. :trollface: I wonder why they announced this before the manufacturer's breakfast at the NSE convention. That would have been a great news at the breakfast.
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This is what I was told at Trainfest last fall. Not surprising.
Hopefully the tooling sees the light of day sooner than later. Would love to see some FA's released again.
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The rumors are true.
Atlas Model Railroad Company, Inc., and Wm. K. Walthers, Inc. have reached an agreement under which Atlas will purchase all N scale locomotive and rolling stock tooling owned by Walthers, including the Walthers N tooling as well as former Life-Like tooling. Atlas will incorporate this tooling into its Atlas Master, Atlas Classic, and Trainman N scale lines. Walthers will continue to offer N scale items in its Cornerstone, SceneMaster, and Walthers Controls brands, including new items as well as items currently in those lines.
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Holy cow. Hell hath frozen over.
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No more F*** Walthers threads!
Does it have a list of items acquired?
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"...all N scale locomotive and rolling stock tooling owned by Walthers, including the Walthers N tooling as well as former Life-Like tooling"
Does not include the Cornerstone buildings.
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For the record, thanks to @spookshow , here's a list of locomotives they just picked up:
0-8-0 USRA Switcher
2-8-4 Van Sweringen Berkshire
2-8-8-2 USRA Mallet
Alco C-424
Alco DL-109
Alco FA-2 & FB-2
Alco PA-1 & PB-1
Alco RS-2
EMD BL2
EMD E6A
EMD E7A & E7B
EMD E8A & E8B
EMD GP18
EMD GP20
EMD GP38-2
EMD GP60
EMD SD7/9
EMD SW8/900/600
EMD SW9/1200
Fairbanks-Morse C-Liner A & B
Fairbanks-Morse Erie-Built A & B
The C424 might not be included, but god damn I hope it is.
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God, I hope they re-run the LL Berk, the 0-8-0, and the 2-8-8-2. Those were all terrific steam locos. The Berk wasn't built for DCC and really needs traction tires for pulling ability, but perhaps some updating of the mechanism could be done. The shell was excellent, and they run like a Swiss watch - light-years better than the Bachmann version. The 0-8-0 and 2-8-8-2 were both DCC ready, and the 2-8-8-2 came in a sound version, which could easily be switched to an ESU LokSound given Atlas' current relationship with ESU.
John C.
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I just got the announcement, via email, from Atlas. I'm stoked. Woo-Hoo!!! Atlas DL-109's and BL-2's!!!
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As a steam buff, I really hope they re-release the 0-8-0 and the 2-8-8-2. Both were terrific locomotives and deserve another run.
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In my mind, this fills a big void in Atlas' stable of locos to add more transition era (1950s) locos and they do so at a bargain price.
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The C424 might not be included, but god damn I hope it is.
I think True Line Trains (ex Like-Like Canada) owns this tooling.
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So bring back the snow plows and maybe expand on the passenger car line.
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So bring back the snow plows and maybe expand on the passenger car line.
Passenger car stuff went to Lowell Smith.
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Fix the PD hoppers!
That would be cool...
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FA-1 & FB-1 as well.
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So what would that include in regards to freight rolling stock?
Log flats
Difco side dump
Russel plow
Coil car
OB auto box
NACC insulated boxes
Greenville 100T
Cyro reefer
GSC Commonwealth flats
GSC Commonwealth bulkhead flats
Pulpwood flats
PD Hopper
PS 4427
Bay window caboose
What am I missing?
fixed a micro-font issue - gfh
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YES. A few small updates on the Berkshire would make it one of the greatest steam locomotives ever.
Ditto on the 0-8-0. Tender pickup work, some weight, and (in the Berk's case), DCC readiness would
make these spectacular entries back into the N Scale steam market.
Berk--SHIRE... Berk--SHIRE! .... Berk--SHIRE!!!!
And the crowd goes wild!
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So what would that include in regards to freight rolling stock?
Log flats
Difco side dump
Russel plow
Coil car
OB auto box
NACC insulated boxes
Greenville 100T
Cyro reefer
GSC Commonwealth flats
GSC Commonwealth bulkhead flats
Pulpwood flats
PD Hopper
PS 4427
Bay window caboose
What am I missing?
Thrall 5-unit well car.
Ballast car.
That’s all I can think of.
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I dunno just how soon we'll see the really old stuff like the Erie-builts. In the pocket analysis, I would expect any re-releases under Atlas to be in reverse order - most recent are first - as these would require the least amount of tweaking to bring to current market expectations such as ease of DCC-capability or even chassis space for sound.
FA-1 & FB-1 as well.
Case in point. Solid performers and pretty reasonable shells, the most recent revision is now 16 years old and the brick-like chassis will need more than a little rework to update for electronics. Good candidate for "Classic" line, but the market is sort of tough now for lower-end models that cannot be reasonably user-upgraded for sound.
I'm really, really interested in how this is going to turn out. The handful of Life-Like locos I have in the fleet are favorite performers, and even Walthers managed to improve, much less not screw-up the GP20, which I certainly appreciate ('cept for the loss of traction with the wheel-blackening :( That's an "oops".).
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I would LOVE to see the shorter WKW GP38-2 fuel tank chassis make its way into the Atlas line...
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Definitely encouraging news. Personnally I'd like to see the 0-8-0 and cryo reefers in short order!
Cheers,
Kev
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I would LOVE to see the shorter WKW GP38-2 fuel tank chassis make its way into the Atlas line...
Yes! Southern had plenty of GP38-2's with short fuel tanks.
I'm really excited that now Atlas has the GP20 tooling, a correct N&W passenger GP9 can be made. While it may not be an actual RTR model, if Atlas produces parts it would still be better than nothing.
And please rerun the 2-8-8-2 in Virginian!
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I'm really excited that now Atlas has the GP20 tooling, a correct N&W passenger GP9 can be made. While it may not be an actual RTR model, if Atlas produces parts it would still be better than nothing.
Another interesting aspect of that. Atlas NOW has a mechanism that can support chop nosed GP7s and GP9s. They've shown their willingness to do oddball units before (SD26s, SD60Es), so we may still some day see weird stuff like Paducah Geeps from them.
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Looks like my April Fools joke came true after all!
Joe D
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If the C424 is partially owned by True Line Trains, I would hope Atlas could negotiate to either purchase the True Line rights or do a joint offering to get this great model back onto the market. The same mechanism can support variations of shells representing all the various phases of C424s and C425s and paint schemes could run right up to current short lines. Add modern ESU sound in a Gold Series release and WOW, the sales could be huge....
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Now that's beleivable. Having worked in a hobby shop, I would never trust scuttlebutt.
Hope we can get new runs of some older stuff with DCC ready and equipped loco's.
Don't know if some of the old freight car tooling was owned by WKW though.
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Shipsure gave a very vague hint at this when the SW1500 supply fell apart.. So hopefully the SW1500 will be back on track..
~Ian
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Wonder what their production plans are? I've got an FA/FB set at White Rose for conversion (including frame milling). Something tells me if I let the guy proceed (he's only had them since November), Atlas will roll those out first.
If that's the case, a couple of you owe me big time.
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If that's the case...
Good point! What about the jewel cases?
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YES. A few small updates on the Berkshire would make it one of the greatest steam locomotives ever.
Ditto on the 0-8-0. Tender pickup work, some weight, and (in the Berk's case), DCC readiness would
make these spectacular entries back into the N Scale steam market.
Even better than Kato Mikado and FEF? Yes, Walthers had more fragile hand-applied details (which can be both a curse and blessing), but mechanically you think that they were also superior to Kato?
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Even better than Kato Mikado and FEF? Yes, Walthers had more fragile hand-applied details (which can be both a curse and blessing), but mechanically you think that they were also superior to Kato?
Not the 0-8-0, but the Berk, yes. The LL Berkshire, internally, almost IS the Kato Mikado, right down to the bearing blocks and
the way they pinned and geared the drivers. It is also geared lower, which makes it run slower and smoother at low speed.
Where it always fell short was on the tender pickups and the pulling power. Even the pulling power was comparable to the Kato Mikado, except that Kato offered the traction tire replacement driver, and LL never did.
The more I think it through, yes, I think that with pickups and a traction tire driver, the LL Berk would be better than the Kato
Mikado. Now, whether it is as *useful* is another question. A USRA 2-8-2 was a very common engine. Not so with the
Berkshire, which only saw action on a few railroads.
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... Now, whether it is as *useful* is another question. A USRA 2-8-2 was a very common engine. Not so with the
Berkshire, which only saw action on a few railroads.
VERY useful - if you model NKP :D
(the 0-8-0 is also useful if you model NKP of course)
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So bring back the snow plows and maybe expand on the passenger car line.
Yes. Yes on the snow plows!
Also the ballast hoppers.
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VERY useful - if you model NKP :D
(the 0-8-0 is alsouseful if you model NKP of course)
Also very useful to many others as a few continued running as excursion locos (the last run of the N&W's Pocahontas on the day before Amtrak was hauled by #765 #759).
Mark
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All diesel motive power to be reworked with DCC/Sound. Don’t know about the steam power.
This acquisition also includes the original Walthers freight car tooling such as the Articar and PD-5000.
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Not the 0-8-0, but the Berk, yes. The LL Berkshire, internally, almost IS the Kato Mikado, right down to the bearing blocks and
the way they pinned and geared the drivers. It is also geared lower, which makes it run slower and smoother at low speed.
Where it always fell short was on the tender pickups and the pulling power. Even the pulling power was comparable to the Kato Mikado, except that Kato offered the traction tire replacement driver, and LL never did.
The more I think it through, yes, I think that with pickups and a traction tire driver, the LL Berk would be better than the Kato
Mikado. Now, whether it is as *useful* is another question. A USRA 2-8-2 was a very common engine. Not so with the
Berkshire, which only saw action on a few railroads.
Yeah, Max, I agree.
The LL Berk is even smoother at slow speed than the Kato FEF or GS4. The Mike equals it, but is not better. If Atlas could re-run the Berk with traction tires on the 3d or 4th driver set and re-do the tender with needle/cup axle pickup trucks a la Kato and the Bachmann Berk (which doesn't run very well, but has superior power pickup from the tender), it would rank up there with the all-time greats.
But even I'll admit that there has to be a limited market for Berkshires; with the Bachmann version still popping up here and there, how many would they actually sell? Of course, if they re-did the shell for a proper C&O version and added the Mars light on the NKP . . . (Oh my; I don't want to think about what that would do to my bank account . . . ).
John C.
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FA-2s in Speedlettering, please! And, uh, 304 in red, white and black......
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Thrall 5-unit well car.
Ballast car.
That’s all I can think of.
Also the stand-alone Thrall well car.
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But even I'll admit that there has to be a limited market for Berkshires; with the Bachmann version still popping up here and there, how many would they actually sell?
John C.
The Bachmann Berk was a swing and a miss for me - so I would definitely want a model of #765 #759.
Mark
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FA-2s in Speedlettering, please! And, uh, 304 in red, white and black......
+1 8)
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Would love to see some Erie Builts...
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All diesel motive power to be reworked with DCC/Sound. Don’t know about the steam power.
This acquisition also includes the original Walthers freight car tooling such as the Articar and PD-5000.
1. They had better upgrade the PD5000. New etched end cages and roof would fix all the issues with the model.
2. If they choose just to toss it in the Trainman line unmodified, maybe this will motivate someone to help me make an etched update kit for it.
3. Russel plow needs to come out soon. Add lights.
4. New Jewel cases?!
5. Maybe we will see the Thrall double stack cars get a proper makeover.
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Fix the PD hoppers!
That would be cool...
Even though already have one good PD hopper, it would be nice to have two body styles to pick from.
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This is great news!! I will be looking forward to an announcement for the following (fingers crossed):
NYSW GP18's 1800, 1802, 1804
NYSW SW9 120
CR and/or PC SW9/1200
Cryogen Reefers
and if they have the tooling for the C424...DH, ME, and any shortline that got ahold of them.
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I need about a dozen or so undec ballast cars and few Difco side dumps.
At least Walthers sold the tooling instead of letting it rot away. Hopefully between Lowell and Atlas we end up with a resurgent N scale market.
Chris
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VERY useful - if you model NKP :D
(the 0-8-0 is also useful if you model NKP of course)
0-8-0 is important to B&M Modelers.
B&M also had Coffin feed-water heater Berks, but the LifeLike model was a bit different.
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Could it be that Atlas bought the tooling so Bachmann couldn't and apply those prices printed with helium based ink ? I wonder if Walthers will drop N everything . My guess is Atlas will not use many if not all of the dies . Knowing that they will not be stepping on any toes because they own the rights , do redesigns on some stuff to keep mechanisms Atlas with shared Atlas parts . I further guess Atlas will do the models members of The Railwire request the most . :D
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Even though already have one good PD hopper, it would be nice to have two body styles to pick from.
PD5000 covers 1990's and earlier - - and some more colorful schemes.....
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My worry is that since if the cars: NACC box, PD5000, ballast hoppers are too crude and Atlas will abandon them rather than spend the money to update them. The NACC box has rivets 6+ inches LONG in some places near the door. Both hoppers would need totally new end details plus a roof walkway for the PD car. The ballast car has very bulky weights and I doubt it could be remedied easily.
I think the bay window caboose is on the cusp: new under frame, window glass and end rails. But they could sell. These are the same prototype that Bluflord is making.
The Thrall container cars are a no-brainer. They need milled articulated joints and etched details replacing the crappy plastic. A good model would easily sell $100 at the shop.
The cryo body is excellent but the under frame is garbage. That would be a fairly easy fix. I imagine they could also do a refrigerator conversion as well.
The PS covered hopper won't need much to be in the Trainman line.
The side dump, Greenville hopper and Russell plow could make it to the master line with little modification.
Maybe we'll see the rebirth of the 50' autobox. Without warped doors this time.
Does this mean Atlas will have X72s?!
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+1 8)
What’s a guy gotta do to get a few fireballs!?
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Great news indeed 8) hoping to see the C424, also the C425 is a much needed Alco in N scale lots of good road names could be done.
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I just hope Atlas finds a way to get additional production capacity. Having more products to force through the same small funnel is pointless. They can’t produce what they already have timely. I expect by the time a lot of this Walthers stuff comes to market most willmhave forgotten Walthers ever produced N let alone remember who Life Like was!
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Atlas, please make the 10-6 sleeper available. Please make the 10-6 sleeper available. Pretty please.
I need at least one in C&O colors and perhaps one in Illionois Central colors for my California Zephyr.
Javier
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I think Walthers proved that they couldn't sell to the N market at the prices they thought.
Atlas' tendency to rerun ad-infinitum with a new paint scheme should keep them busy for another 20 years, and the paint quality is first rate even if some of the older tooling isn't. There are gems and stumps in there. It doesn't solve the problem of Chinese production unless, by some miracle, this deal actually includes all the tooling and it can be relocated to another production site.
Hmmm. I've had a bunch of SW's, the Berk, a 424 (original Canadian), GP20. The only flaw I ever attributed to all LL production was an odd wheel alloy that got better tractive effort than slippery Atlas, but tended to corrode up and seemed to need cleaning more, then fine for a long time.
Just think. Atlas now has a PA. And the real historic mess of all LL- NO FREAKIN PARTS - might be addressed as well.
But on the downside, the incentive to invest more money in any completely new tooling? Well.... you may never see that RSD15 at least from them.
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Atlas, please make the 10-6 sleeper available. Please make the 10-6 sleeper available. Pretty please.
I need at least one in C&O colors and perhaps one in Illionois Central colors for my California Zephyr.
Javier
Atlas did not buy Walthers passeneger stuff, Lowell Smith did a while back...
I was getting used to my custom painted Milwaukee Erie Built ABA sets being worth a mint....
I'll miss all the offers to buy them from train show folks.
RSS
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Atlas, please make the 10-6 sleeper available. Please make the 10-6 sleeper available. Pretty please.
I need at least one in C&O colors and perhaps one in Illionois Central colors for my California Zephyr.
Javier
Javier-
See the Lowell Smith "On Track" at the bottom of this webpage and check out the "Railsmith" button on the webpage header:
https://lowellsmith.net/
He also has a survey to help him determine future releases: https://lowellsmith.net/railsmith-fan-survey/ (https://lowellsmith.net/railsmith-fan-survey/)
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I might be the only one, but I’d sure like to see Atlas run a bunch of the old Walthers 4427 hoppers, even under the Trainman line.
Exactrail sure doesn’t seem interested in making more.
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For the record, thanks to @spookshow , here's a list of locomotives they just picked up:
0-8-0 USRA Switcher
2-8-4 Van Sweringen Berkshire
2-8-8-2 USRA Mallet
Alco C-424
Alco DL-109
Alco FA-1 & FB-1
Alco FA-2 & FB-2
Alco PA-1 & PB-1
Alco RS-2
EMD BL2
EMD E6A
EMD E7A & E7B
EMD E8A & E8B
EMD GP18
EMD GP20
EMD GP38-2
EMD GP60
EMD SD7/9
EMD SW8/900/600
EMD SW9/1200
Fairbanks-Morse C-Liner A & B
Fairbanks-Morse Erie-Built A & B
The C424 might not be included, but god damn I hope it is.
Minor correction
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If Atlas does update the cryogenic reefers, since they need a new frame and underbody, maybe they could add sound to it as well. I love that Athearn did that on their reefers. It’s nice to have some audio in the middle of the train. When railfanning you hear the reefers running all the time.
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So what would that include in regards to freight rolling stock?
Log flats
Difco side dump
Russel plow
Coil car
OB auto box
NACC insulated boxes
Greenville 100T
Cyro reefer
GSC Commonwealth flats
GSC Commonwealth bulkhead flats
Pulpwood flats
PD Hopper
PS 4427
Bay window caboose
What am I missing?
fixed a micro-font issue - gfh
The Life-Like version of the Northeastern caboose WM/RDG/CNJ/ etc. prototype.
Bob Witt
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Was the Life-Like F40PH included?
With a new drive and a few upgrades, it may be a viable Trainman-quality Phase I F40PH that Kato or Rapido probably won't release in N in the near future
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Was the Life-Like F40PH included?
With a new drive and a few upgrades, it may be a viable Trainman-quality Phase I F40PH that Kato or Rapido probably won't release in N in the near future
Kato never makes "Trainman-quality" variants of their models. Neither does Rapido. So you are correct, I doubt that either would ever make such model. But Kato's F40PH is a very good looking model, runs like a Swiss watch, and its street price is not that much more than Atlas Trainman models. I guess time will tell what Atlas does with the molds they acquired. Even if they did what you are hoping for, I would still rather have a Kato.
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I wonder if Walthers will drop N everything .
Not sure what you mean. Walthers sold all of their N scale rolling stock and locomotive tooling. But they stated that they will still manufacture N scale structure models. That statement is posted in the thread about the NSE convention going on now.
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Kato never makes "Trainman-quality" variants of their models. Neither does Rapido. So you are correct, I doubt that either would ever make such model. But Kato's F40PH is a very good looking model, runs like a Swiss watch, and its street price is not that much more than Atlas Trainman models. I guess time will tell what Atlas does with the molds they acquired. Even if they did what you are hoping for, I would still rather have a Kato.
No $#!+ Sherlock, nobody expects Kato or Rapido to offer any new products to actively compete with the Atlas Trainman line of products.
A Phase I F40PH from any manufacturer is another story, whether Kato, Rapido, or an upgraded version of the old Life-Like F40PH...assuming it still exists and was included in the sale...
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No $#!+ Sherlock, nobody expects Kato or Rapido to offer any new products to actively compete with the Atlas Trainman line of products.
A Phase I F40PH from any manufacturer is another story, whether Kato, Rapido, or an upgraded version of the old Life-Like F40PH...assuming it still exists and was included in the sale...
Sorry to have ruffled your feathers.
I guess the "Phase I" part think eluded me. Are you talking about the Amtrak paint scheme, specific body details, or both? I would not expect the all the variation of that model as done by Rapido in H0 (https://rapidotrains.com/f40ph-master-class/) ever rendered in N scale. But one could dream.
Back around 25 years ago, using the Model Power F40PH body (that was before the Life Like model was produced), and then-new Bachmann GP40 mechanism, I modeled few phases of Amtrak locos. While not 100% true to the prototype, I did model different underbody bits (fuel and air tanks, batttery boxes) and paint jobs. They looked pretty good.
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Sorry to have ruffled your feathers.
I guess the "Phase I" part think eluded me. Are you talking about the Amtrak paint scheme, specific body details, or both? I would not expect the all the variation of that model as done by Rapido in H0 (https://rapidotrains.com/f40ph-master-class/) ever rendered in N scale. But one could dream.
Back around 25 years ago, using the Model Power F40PH body (that was before the Life Like model was produced), and then-new Bachmann GP40 mechanism, I modeled few phases of Amtrak locos. While not 100% true to the prototype, I did model different underbody bits (fuel and air tanks, batttery boxes) and paint jobs. They looked pretty good.
Phase I as in EMD phase of production. Amtrak had already adopted the Phase II paint scheme when these started showing up.
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+1 8)
+1 more about the speedlettering, especially!
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Oh hey...
I wonder if this includes the containers.
40' logo-panel hi-cube - sure would be nice to see some new schemes on this one.
and
48' exterior post (but it's an inferior model to the ones MT is now pumping out).
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I think Walthers proved that they couldn't sell to the N market at the prices they thought.
Atlas' tendency to rerun ad-infinitum with a new paint scheme should keep them busy for another 20 years, and the paint quality is first rate even if some of the older tooling isn't. There are gems and stumps in there. It doesn't solve the problem of Chinese production unless, by some miracle, this deal actually includes all the tooling and it can be relocated to another production site.
Hmmm. I've had a bunch of SW's, the Berk, a 424 (original Canadian), GP20. The only flaw I ever attributed to all LL production was an odd wheel alloy that got better tractive effort than slippery Atlas, but tended to corrode up and seemed to need cleaning more, then fine for a long time.
Just think. Atlas now has a PA. And the real historic mess of all LL- NO FREAKIN PARTS - might be addressed as well.
But on the downside, the incentive to invest more money in any completely new tooling? Well.... you may never see that RSD15 at least from them.
The Atlas comminque specifically states Walthers and LL tooling as part of the deal.
You make a very good point that no-one else has about keeping Atlas busy for the next 20 years. Atlas's N scale output while steady is hardly herculean these days and to keep their fans happy with the new tooling over the next twenty years they would have to either double their output or cut back heavily on their existing model line.
I'd rather see a RSD-15 from Atlas than some of the former Life Like clunkers given a new lease on life.
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I'd rather see a RSD-15 from Atlas than some of the former Life Like clunkers given a new lease on life.
Just remember that your clunker might be someone else's diamond.
John C.
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I'll be looking for the 50 ft auto box, as it's very useful for the early BN. A few more log cars wouldn't hurt, and I have lettering for my logging company, so there's another possible purchase. And another side-dump car would be nice, for my work train.
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This means the AS616 can't be far away? :trollface:
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If Atlas does update the cryogenic reefers, since they need a new frame and underbody, maybe they could add sound to it as well. I love that Athearn did that on their reefers. It’s nice to have some audio in the middle of the train. When railfanning you hear the reefers running all the time.
The Walthers model was of the original cryogenic reefers that were cooled with carbon dioxide "flakes" that sublimed from solid carbon dioxide to carbon dioxide gas. I am not sure if there would be any "sound" associated with that process.
However, many, if not all, of those cars were rebuild into mechanical reefers, and I would really like to see that version, with or without sound! :D
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>> new under frame >.... blah
As noted for rivet counters this may be important, those of us who just want runners (and at recent costings) DO appreciate the finer body detail, print AND conversion to metal under-frame for pure runability. Yay! :lol:
Extra fine details and assembly time, nope, not required. Moulded in schema just fine.
Days of having to add weight to keep 40'ers of this brand on track with 50'ers, hoppers and flats/ empty gons of other brands are nearly over. Yay again! :lol:
"Will they/ won't they..." well they must have been during a heck of a due diligence on the potential.
regards davew
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So we are starting to see what large industry consolidation is doing with the N scale market
I don't think Atlas needs to add capacity because I feel we have already reached parity with demand in the market. This means a much longer time between runs off the same model, but that's not a bad thing.
The monthly release cycle with a few manufactures actually helps me plan my money better than the crazy influx of new product line the early 2000's.
From Walters to Deluxe to LBF... We have recovered a lot of quality tooling thought to be lost or abandoned.
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As to other Walthers freight cars: 42' wood side gon
As for FA-1s coming back - hopefully DCC or DCC/ready - YAY!!!!
As for Walthers and N -- them keeping the structures line must mean they actually like (i.e. profit from) them. Now if they'd just make more N scale versions of their HO ones they'd REALLY like N scale.
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From Walters to Deluxe to LBF... We have recovered a lot of quality tooling thought to be lost or abandoned.
What'd I miss about Deluxe? Was there a thread on that?
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What'd I miss about Deluxe? Was there a thread on that?
Any recoverable molds sold to Fox Valley. Simple statement so I'm sure there are other nuances that other will expound on. :)
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Another interesting aspect of that. Atlas They've shown their willingness to do oddball units before
E-6s rebuilt to E-8m s?
Single headlight E-8s and E-7s? (I sold off my LLs because they were dual headlight).
The one B&O SD-7 with dB and s/g (SP and the Q had some like that, as well)?
B-units for the DL-109?
FPA-2s (unless Rapido does them in N)?
If Atlas does re-run the USRA 0-8-0, I do hope that it does something about that delicate wiring harness from locomotive to tender.
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FA-2s in Speedlettering, please! And, uh, 304 in red, white and black......
.................and if it does #301, the wings must be shorter than the other three.........................(was it #301 or #302?)..................................
LL did do #303 and #304 in the plastic frame. You can adapt the plastic frame shells to the metal chassis, if you can find a WM in plastic frame at a show, or somewhere. I was surprised that LL substituted L&Ns for the WMs when it went to the metal frame. LL usually would run a road that ran into Baltimore, if said road had that power.
I did adapt a pair of plastic frame WMs to the metal chassis. In addition, I adapted the B&O Original Blue and Grey to a metal chassis. I still have a pair of metal chassis B&O 1959 scheme (which is the B&O scheme that LL did on the metal frames--it did the Original on the plastic frames) somewhere, but 1959 is out of my era, so I do not run them that much.
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B&M also had Coffin feed-water heater Berks
................some of which wound up on the SP and were converted to oil.
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What’s a guy gotta do to get a few fireballs!?
Microscale decal sheets?
In order to do the wings correctly on the speed versions, you must chop up three of the Microscale, except for #301 (or was it #302?), which requires only two.
The FA-2s did not last long in fireball paint. The WM painted them in speed some time between 1953 and 1955, but I forget exactly when it was.
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Just think. Atlas now has a PA.
................and might actually issue it in P&LE! We have all of these manufacturers who offer, or have offered PAs in N scale. All of them have done NYCs. It shall remain one of the minor mysteries of N scale locomotive production why no manufacturer ever has offered a PA in P&LE.
Perhaps Atlas even will issue a PL&E at the same time that MT issues it new single window coach in P&LE (with brass window sashes!).
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The Life-Like version of the Northeastern caboose WM/RDG/CNJ/ etc. prototype.
That one actually could use some of the improvements that Atlas likely would bring to it. B-mann's version of it is so much better than LL's. LL's looks like it is on stilts and the handrailings are extra clunky.
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................and might actually issue it in P&LE! We have all of these manufacturers who offer, or have offered PAs in N scale. All of them have done NYCs. It shall remain one of the minor mysteries of N scale locomotive production why no manufacturer ever has offered a PA in P&LE.
Perhaps Atlas even will issue a PL&E at the same time that MT issues it new single window coach in P&LE (with brass window sashes!).
Got to believe that reissuing PA's is going to be low on Atlas' list, given the other ones out there. Similarly, I wouldn't look for a LL SD7/9 ever - Atlas already does the SD7/9 series, and the LL version was plastic frame.
Everything else, though, I expect to see sooner or later. Maybe not for a year or so, while they re-work frames for DCC/Sound (although the 0-8-0 and 2-8-8-2 should be pretty much ready to go on this front).
John C.
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As to other Walthers freight cars: 42' wood side gon
I'm pretty sure that is the old Roco car so it isnt in this.
Mark
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There is a lot of excitement here but :
- it does not mean they will use of all them right away and maybe never
- most of the locos need new frames to be at least DCC ready or available with DCC at the factory
- some of these models are not on par details wise ....
Dont get me wrong I am also excited but ....
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- some of these models are not on par details wise ....
I assume that Atlas will cherry pick the models that fit into their existing lines. Some are "master" quality, some are "trainman", others might not get released by Atlas.
I think most of the Lifelike/Wally split frame locos are quite good so we'll likely see most of em. As for rolling stock, only a handful of the Wally cars interest me.
Mark
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I assume that Atlas will cherry pick the models that fit into their existing lines. Some are "master" quality, some are "trainman", others might not get released by Atlas.
I think most of the Lifelike/Wally split frame locos are quite good so we'll likely see most of em. As for rolling stock, only a handful of the Wally cars interest me.
I concur with this assessment. LL garnered a low reputation for fidelity and other quality issues in the early days, but in the '90s there was clearly a big effort to improve their image. However, that improvement seemed to be concentrated in their locomotive products. I have the [possibly incorrect] impression that the rolling stock was mostly left alone, that the original "lesser" tooling carried on and has subsequently outlived its usefulness.
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Got to believe that reissuing PA's is going to be low on Atlas' list, given the other ones out there. Similarly, I wouldn't look for a LL SD7/9 ever - Atlas already does the SD7/9 series, and the LL version was plastic frame.
I can see Trainman Sd's and Master SD's.....giving some kid a good entry point.
The old plastic frame locos are above par of the Bachmann train set stuff, and about the same pricepoint.
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My worry is that since if the cars: NACC box, PD5000, ballast hoppers are too crude and Atlas will abandon them rather than spend the money to update them. The NACC box has rivets 6+ inches LONG in some places near the door. Both hoppers would need totally new end details plus a roof walkway for the PD car. The ballast car has very bulky weights and I doubt it could be remedied easily.
I think the bay window caboose is on the cusp: new under frame, window glass and end rails. But they could sell. These are the same prototype that Bluflord is making.
The Thrall container cars are a no-brainer. They need milled articulated joints and etched details replacing the crappy plastic. A good model would easily sell $100 at the shop.
The cryo body is excellent but the under frame is garbage. That would be a fairly easy fix. I imagine they could also do a refrigerator conversion as well.
The PS covered hopper won't need much to be in the Trainman line.
The side dump, Greenville hopper and Russell plow could make it to the master line with little modification.
Maybe we'll see the rebirth of the 50' autobox. Without warped doors this time.
Does this mean Atlas will have X72s?!
The cars could go into the Trainman line. That makes the most sense.
You’ll have proper X72s shortly. 8)
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I concur with this assessment. LL garnered a low reputation for fidelity and other quality issues in the early days, but in the '90s there was clearly a big effort to improve their image. However, that improvement seemed to be concentrated in their locomotive products. I have the [possibly incorrect] impression that the rolling stock was mostly left alone, that the original "lesser" tooling carried on and has subsequently outlived its usefulness.
A couple of silly comments from them made no sense whatsoever. One was that N scalers didn't want DCC and I know for a fact they did say that. The second one I'm not 100% sure of but they didn't do a lot to help their cause and that was reported as being that N scalers didn't care about detail. While we can go over board in detail for to produce the Berk and then doing the C&O without flipping the sand dome was a pretty good confirmation that they might have said that.
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Another interesting aspect of that. Atlas NOW has a mechanism that can support chop nosed GP7s and GP9s. They've shown their willingness to do oddball units before (SD26s, SD60Es), so we may still some day see weird stuff like Paducah Geeps from them.
I would hope they would do Hi-Hood GP30's, 35's and 40's. Some may or may not consider those odd balls but come on....,....
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What'd I miss about Deluxe? Was there a thread on that?
Not a separate thread, but the info was posted in the NSE convention news thread in this (https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?topic=44911.msg579698#msg579698) post, and few more posts scattered later in that thread.
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This gives me hope that someone will now make a Greenville 100T woodchip car like this:
[attachimg=1]
Walthers has them in HO and I feel sure no one wanted to commit to them with Walthers still hanging around. Now that they are out I am hoping someone will pick them up. Every southern railroad had a whole bunch of these or similar. But with Walthers still making them in HO it is still a long shot.
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Quote from: OldEastRR on Today at 02:30:09
As to other Walthers freight cars: 42' wood side gon
I'm pretty sure that is the old Roco car so it isnt in this.
Mark
Correct.
And the B.mann version is near indistinguishable 'cept for screw mount trucks, so why would you not just get em?
Dave
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The Walthers CryoTrans body could be used to replicate one of their newer, RBLs. They have 25-50 of these cars to handle high value commodities like wine. Attachment included.
I too would look forward to seeing Atlas producing a new underframe for this car and adding a reefer unit on one end to model their reefers. I have previously, discussed this with Paul, a while back, and suggested he might produce a similar car using the former BMLA reefer as a possibility...maybe even as "foobie"?
The CryoTrans cars are some of the most colorful of modern cars.
Barry
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Sound for mechanical reefers: Instead of trying to convince manufacturers to add sound to all of the different models out there, most of which would require either floor or body modifications, why not a stand-alone sound generator, battery and/or track powered, that could be added to any car? Someone, Aztec maybe?, used to make one. I have it, in an ancient Atlas reefer from the 70s. The only change was that the builder replaced the floor with an MDC floor, drilled some holes in it for sound and a small slide switch, and glued the button-battery powered sound unit to the inside of the floor.
The metal floor seems to be unneeded, unless one wants weight for track pickup, so the same technique could be used for an aftermarket device. Drill some holes in the floor of your reefer, add the sound unit, and go. With today's electronics, I'm sure it would sound better, and could probably be tailored to the various makes of reefer units.
Actually, I don't remember ever hearing a mechanical reefer make noise. There were a lot of them in Pasco during the fruit harvest, but from normal viewing distances, there wasn't any obvious reefer noise. It just blended in with the other yard and traffic noises, if the units were running at all.
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Let's talk about duplicate entries:
SD7/9 The LL has a scale width hood and the detail is comparable. The Kato unit had end grab irons that the LL unit lacked, but this seems like only a small tooling mod to update the LL unit. If the LL unit was put on a split metal chassis and updated handrails, I think this would be better looking than the Classic unit now on sale.
GP38-2. Different phase than the Atlas models. Adapt the hood and cab to the Atlas Sound equipped chassis. Maybe use the walkways to update the GP40-2.
100T hopper. Will they just toss these molds? Didn't LL just copy the Atlas tooling in the first place?
SF offset cupola caboose. The LL version has a separate cupola with better fore and aft windows. Rivets are also much smaller than the Atlas model. I would sat Atlas should toss the Atlas version and update the LL version with finer end rails and window glass. (Proper trucks would help as well)
40' Stock car. These are very different models. Not sure if one should be retired or not.
50' Reefer. The LL version has a larger door but similar. Atlas could better match paint schemes to prototype.
50' Double Door box. These two models have similar proportions as well as side panels and skirting. The Atlas skirting is noticeably narrower but taller. The LL car has a very different door style.
40' ARA box. Kill the old LL version.
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I think most of the Lifelike/Wally split frame locos are quite good so we'll likely see most of em.
Put the LL GP20 or GP60 chassis against an Atlas GP and tell me LL didn't just walk into the factory and say "clone this"......
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Let's talk about duplicate entries:
GP38-2. Different phase than the Atlas models. Adapt the hood and cab to the Atlas Sound equipped chassis.
The issue here is that the LL models come with either a large or small fuel tank. If you simply stick an Atlas mechanism under the LL shell, you get sound but the fuel tank is now potentially the wrong size depending on the road name. Atlas has never offered a small fuel tank for its N scale GP38 lineup, and adding sound would seem to reduce the chance they ever will due to them needing the space for the speaker. The LL GP38-2 mechanisms run extremely well. I would prefer if they attempted to add sound to it and keep the correct small fuel tanks where appropriate. Thank you.
Jeff
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Let's talk about duplicate entries:
100T hopper. Will they just toss these molds? Didn't LL just copy the Atlas tooling in the first place?
If your talking about the Greenville 100 ton Aggregate hopper, no. I thought the old LL coal hopper was long gone.
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If your talking about the Greenville 100 ton Aggregate hopper, no. I thought the old LL coal hopper was long gone.
The old LL 100Ton hopper isn't worth resurrecting in my opinion (I have a few lying around)
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The old LL 100Ton hopper isn't worth resurrecting in my opinion (I have a few lying around)
I had one I decided to try and do derailment damage and put it on flatcar. That didn't work out too well. pretty much melted one side of it.
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I have the feeling this is going to turn into an exercise of 'perfection is the enemy of good' here. The protos and the rivet counters can justifiably pick apart a lot of the LL-Walthers stuff, everybody has their favorite glitch. So there will be at least some debate within Atlas as to whether they 'dare' to rerun a given item as is, or fix tooling, or simply park it, cherry-pick a few select items with some new roadnames and minor updates.
I don't think most of the LL/Walthers stuff was so awful that it can't be sold, particularly if the price is right. They made a business decision here, they've essentially rescued a LOT of product, potentially, and need to get a return from it without a lot of backfire from here. Atlas has shown an ability to evolve forward with models as needed, right? We'll have to wait some of this out. But think about it. Do you really want to wait for X years for a certain model to hit the shelf again because it has cast-on handrails or a detail in the wrong place?
Some of the work like the GP20's was just stellar. I've got maybe 30 locomotives in Santa Fe on my 1972 layout, and one of about three that haven't been redone from factory paint is the warbonnet GP20. Man, that's a nicely decorated unit, certainly as good as any Atlas, pulls better than any Atlas, and at least when I got themas LL's was a lot less expensive. Now, it doesn't have a cutout for sound, so will we wait for five years to see it again waiting for that feature? And even the old F40PH was an EXCELLENT trainset engine, virtually nothing to break off in smaller hands. The SW chassis, despite the weird pickups, has also evolved and is a pretty good takeoff, and the body tooling still compares well with current work.
I wonder if they purchased the naming rights. They could simply call it "Atlas-Life Like", to distinguish the product instead of "Trainman". That GP15 has a heck of a lot more mechanism design flaws in it than the GP20.
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Which LL GP38-2?? :trollface:
Is the old one still around?
~Ian
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The old LL 100Ton hopper isn't worth resurrecting in my opinion (I have a few lying around)
It does have a better interior than the Atlas car, and the stirrups and ladders are much better in my opinion. I think the side panel/rib spacing is more accurate too, so there's some good parts.
The "shadow" you can see on the outside of the bays is not good, and the wierd underframe :-X
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Another interesting aspect of that. Atlas NOW has a mechanism that can support chop nosed GP7s and GP9s. They've shown their willingness to do oddball units before (SD26s, SD60Es), so we may still some day see weird stuff like Paducah Geeps from them.
Did Atlas get the tooling for the GP9u as well?
Some GP16 rebuilds would be wonderful.
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It does have a better interior than the Atlas car, and the stirrups and ladders are much better in my opinion. I think the side panel/rib spacing is more accurate too, so there's some good parts.
The "shadow" you can see on the outside of the bays is not good, and the wierd underframe :-X
Agreed, but the weight of the car sux, fix that and you'd be much closer to a functional car. :D
Mark
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Did Atlas get the tooling for the GP9u as well?
Some GP16 rebuilds would be wonderful.
Would those be different enough from IM upcoming GP 10 to sell well? I guess Atlas could make slight variants, but that was always said to be the problem with making chop noses, since many done in house by railroads themselves, getting them specific enough was a challenge. However, most mfg's are now coming out with several proto variations, so maybe.
For all the ease Atlas has in reissuing LL and Walthers locos to develop product, IMHO, their biggest score would be to have a few gen sets come to market......not GP 38, SD 7, GP 18, etc.
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brokemoto:
"LL did do #303 and #304 in the plastic frame. You can adapt the plastic frame shells to the metal chassis, if you can find a WM in plastic frame at a show, or somewhere. I was surprised that LL substituted L&Ns for the WMs when it went to the metal frame. LL usually would run a road that ran into Baltimore, if said road had that power."
I had heard that they originally had WM on the production list, but since they were producing A-B sets and the WM never had B-units, that they switched to L&N after production had started once they were clued in to the error. I don't think it's a coincidence that they picked an L&N scheme that was black and gold also, almost as if they already had the shells painted black....
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..was always said to be the problem with making chop noses, since many done in house by railroads themselves, getting them specific enough was a challenge.
EMD made a kit to chop the noses, and most proto bashes are based on that kit, though some roads used their own design..
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LL did a GP9u? Wha?
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LL did a GP9u? Wha?
Life Like Canada, eh.
http://www.wig-wag-trains.com/Walthers/L-L%20Pages/Life-Like-Canada-GP-9-Product-Page.htm
Referred to as a "N scale Proto 2000" - I thought Proto 2000 was an HO marketing thing.
Is Life Like Canada still a separate entity, or is it part of what was sold to Walthers and now to Atlas?
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Isn't the GP 18 also setup for high and low nose?
~Ian
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Isn't the GP 18 also setup for high and low nose?
~Ian
The LL GP18 shell was extensively retooled between the plastic and split frame runs. Pilots were filled in. The nose and hood became a single unit and the handrails were made much skinnier. I don't believe the shells are interchangable.
I know Walthers was working on retooling the low nose version at one point, but I think that project was shelved. I imagine Atlas will bring the low nose version out at some point.
The GP9U was LL/Hobycraft which later changed its name to True Line Trains. The LL Hobbycraft GP9 shared only truck, motor and shaft components with the standard LL line. I believe the C424 was originally a Hobbycraft project, but was later sold to LL proper, and should be part of the Atlas purchase.
One wonders if Atlas received any aborted projects from Walthers.
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Would those be different enough from IM upcoming GP 10 to sell well?
Yes, that IM GP10 will be dipped in glue to hold everything together (like every other IM release so far).
Jane
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Yes, that IM GP10 will be dipped in glue to hold everything together (like every other IM release so far).
Jane
LOL. Stopped at Train Life/Exact Rail yesterday, and saw the bargain bin with a CNW grain hopper, and sticky note "glue issues". So, even the mfgs with high reps for quality over use the glue at times.
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I had heard that they originally had WM on the production list, but since they were producing A-B sets and the WM never had B-units, that they switched to L&N after production had started once they were clued in to the error. I don't think it's a coincidence that they picked an L&N scheme that was black and gold also, almost as if they already had the shells painted black....
That would make sense, although the plastic frame production did have B-units: dummies. LL simply did not issue any plastic frame dummy Bs for the WM. Still, if they had ordered production with WM Bs and had found out about the gaffe mid-production, and, it was still at a point where they could do something about it, your theory makes sense. It would not have made all that sense to have a bunch of useless B-units in the warehouse.
In fact, in my early days of N scale, I learned quickly that if you want to pee-yo a train vendor, take the As but not the Bs. My first N scale pike was too small for trains that would justify and A-B pair, so As were the only cab units in which I was interested. I wound up taking more than a few Bs that I could not use, at the time. Subsequently, of course, I did find a use for Bs when I built a larger pike. I had to do some marathon break-in runs of Bs so that I could run them with already well-broken-in As,
It really was not that big a deal to adapt the plastic frame shells to the metal frame chassis. In fact, I wound up stripping a pair of shells and doing #301 and #302. I even did the shorter wings on whichever one it was that had them,
The plastic frame BL-2s can adapt, as well. They did issue the metal frame BL-2s in both numbers; one in fireball and one in speed. My era demands fireball for
BL-2s I did buy the one metal frame fireball BL-2 that LL did issue. Later, someone had a sale on B&As, so I bought one and adapted my plastic frame fireball shell to it (after I changed the number, which is not hard on those).
Another thing that is funny is that the LL BL-2s have about the same throttle response as the IM F-7s. As it was WM practice to run BL-2s on the point in MU and coupled to a different EMD product, you can actually run them in the manner that WM did. The roads that had BL-2s used to complain about stress cracks in the frames, so I suspect that this might have been the reason that WM ran them only on the point and with a different Electro-Motive product.
B&M's BL-2s did not have MU hoses. B&M ordered them for use in Boston commuter work, so there was no need for MU hoses. I do not know what it did with them after it discontinued enough passenger trains with the result that the RDCs could handle everything except the Boston-Portland and Boston-Albany (trackage rights from Troy to Albany) trains. For that reason, I am unaware of any complaints from B&M crews or shop men about stress cracks on theirs.
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B&M's BL-2s did not have MU hoses. B&M ordered them for use in Boston commuter work, so there was no need for MU hoses. I do not know what it did with them after it discontinued enough passenger trains with the result that the RDCs could handle everything except the Boston-Portland and Boston-Albany (trackage rights from Troy to Albany) trains. For that reason, I am unaware of any complaints from B&M crews or shop men about stress cracks on theirs.
eBay listing for a slide of B&M BL2 1553 at Groveton, NH in 1952.
Unit was assigned to the Groveton-Woodsville local.
Perhaps the other B&M BL2 locos saw similar use.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/ORIG-SLIDE-Boston-amp-Maine-BL2-1553-just-replaced-a-2-8-0-Groveton-Original-Kod-/162993438739 (https://www.ebay.com/itm/ORIG-SLIDE-Boston-amp-Maine-BL2-1553-just-replaced-a-2-8-0-Groveton-Original-Kod-/162993438739)
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eBay listing for a slide of B&M BL2 1553 at Groveton, NH in 1952.
Unit was assigned to the Groveton-Woodsville local.
Perhaps the other B&M BL2 locos saw similar use.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/ORIG-SLIDE-Boston-amp-Maine-BL2-1553-just-replaced-a-2-8-0-Groveton-Original-Kod-/162993438739 (https://www.ebay.com/itm/ORIG-SLIDE-Boston-amp-Maine-BL2-1553-just-replaced-a-2-8-0-Groveton-Original-Kod-/162993438739)
Yup. They were used for locals for a few years after they were displaced by the Budd cars. They went back to EMD in 1961 as trade-ins on the GP18s. Interestingly, the four BL2s and one F2 that went as trade-ins are why five of the six B&M GP-18s have four small fans, unlike the more common two large fans.
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The old LL 100Ton hopper isn't worth resurrecting in my opinion (I have a few lying around)
Having just begun the process of preparing excess stock for sale, I've come across a single one example (the B&O) amongst a bunch of Atlas models coal and covered hoppers, and find the exterior appearance if you refer to these - http://www.spookshow.net/freight/ll100hopper.html , "...indistinguishable from Atlas models". There is some slight weirdness on the ends, and the subframe is differently weighted, but enough.
I've a couple of box packs for mid-western roads as counter-running train consists.
Cheers d
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It does have a better interior than the Atlas car, and the stirrups and ladders are much better in my opinion. I think the side panel/rib spacing is more accurate too, so there's some good parts.
The "shadow" you can see on the outside of the bays is not good, and the wierd underframe :-X
As to dimensions, its almost exact. Details, same.
A fraction of a millimetre shorter, because the Atlas cars have a more pronounced and longer/wider/thicker top chord. The Ribs are exactly the same dimensions- an exact copy. What is larger are the 'rivit lines', which I assume is your objection. To me they add to the detail on an otherwise dour model (until weathering).
But no use defending the indefensible.
Atlas won't need to retool them. Will they ever 'rebrand' the 90 ton nomenclature to 100T?
d
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I doubt it. By now, everyone knows which car their "90 ton" hopper is, so changing the name would be confusing.
Now, if they started making them with 100-ton trucks, then renamed them, that would be good marketing. It really would be a "new", or at least improved, model, and would need to be distinguished from the older ones.
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I wonder if they purchased the naming rights. They could simply call it "Atlas-Life Like", to distinguish the product instead of "Trainman".
I have seen advertisements for ATLAS BLMA . I thought the nod gave respect and as well an expectation of sameness the buyer would have .
Now if Atlas combines the Life-Like parts with theirs , what would be that mutts / mutations ( I never put those 2 words to thought before ) name . Atlas Life-Like mutt ? Sounds kind of wordy to me . But I think the difference warrants a distinction between a clone or a mutt .
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I think Atlas stated in their announcement that the line would be incorporated into their current brands so I doubt you will see Atlas-Life-Like. Also most of this stuff was rebranded to Walthers, so there would be little consistency.
As for the name of the hopper... Wouldn't 90 ton hoppers need 100 ton trucks?
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As for the name of the hopper... Wouldn't 90 ton hoppers need 100 ton trucks?
Well yeah, but I am pretty sure that out of the box these don't come with 90 ton trucks! :trollface:
This model was tooled when there were no 100 ton trucks available, hell Atlas only had Bettendorfs at the time, so the original releases came with Bettendorfs.
They look much better with 100 ton trucks: https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?topic=20824.msg193275#msg193275
Mark
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That was my idea. All of mine came with plain friction bearing trucks, 50/70 ton, and I added 100 ton trucks when they became available. I suspect that Atlas called them "90 ton" cars so people wouldn't ask "where's the 100 ton trucks?".
For what it's worth, Atlas 100-ton trucks with plastic wheels won't fit. I had to grind clearance notches in the slope sheets to allow the flanges to clear on curves. So it wouldn't be as easy as Atlas telling the factory to use different trucks.
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Let's talk about duplicate entries:
SF offset cupola caboose. The LL version has a separate cupola with better fore and aft windows. Rivets are also much smaller than the Atlas model. I would sat Atlas should toss the Atlas version and update the LL version with finer end rails and window glass. (Proper trucks would help as well)
LL underframe also has bolsters in the correct location.
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I have seen advertisements for ATLAS BLMA . I thought the nod gave respect and as well an expectation of sameness the buyer would have .
Now if Atlas combines the Life-Like parts with theirs , what would be that mutts / mutations ( I never put those 2 words to thought before ) name . Atlas Life-Like mutt ? Sounds kind of wordy to me . But I think the difference warrants a distinction between a clone or a mutt .
BL-LMAtlas?
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That was my idea. All of mine came with plain friction bearing trucks, 50/70 ton, and I added 100 ton trucks when they became available. I suspect that Atlas called them "90 ton" cars so people wouldn't ask "where's the 100 ton trucks?".
For what it's worth, Atlas 100-ton trucks with plastic wheels won't fit. I had to grind clearance notches in the slope sheets to allow the flanges to clear on curves. So it wouldn't be as easy as Atlas telling the factory to use different trucks.
Trainworx makes 100T trucks with offset bolsters
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CJM413: Thank you. I may need them for something some day. For now, all of my Atlas cars are converted, and I doubt that I'll need any more of them, as I still have half a dozen BN in storage.
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Trainworx makes 100T trucks with offset bolsters
As does MTL.
Mark