TheRailwire
General Discussion => Product Discussion => Topic started by: Dreadnought on May 25, 2017, 08:24:12 PM
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Hello!
I am looking into producing a resin shell kit for a Lima LS-1000/1200 Switcher. The reason I chose this locomotive is because the LS-1000 and LS-1200 used an identical carbody, so both could be modeled by one model. It was also used by several major roads, including B&O, Wabash, NYC, New Haven, and others.
The front locomotive in this picture is a Lima LS-1000.
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/0e/a5/c3/0ea5c33f5c94f7e72138557a1704f8c5.jpg)
Now I want to decide whether to produce the kit in HO scale, N scale or both. Hence, I have created a survey to gauge interest in each scale.
This kit will hopefully be able to be adapted to either Bachmann or Atlas Baldwin chassis in HO and Atlas or Baldwin chassis in N scale. If you have interest in the kit, please fill out the form. Once I decide what scale to do the kit in, I will begin taking pre-orders. If enough pre-orders are received, the locomotive will be produced. The cost of the kit will be about $110 in HO scale or around $90 in N scale. Also, hand-finished ready-to-run models will be available.
Here is the form:
https://goo.gl/forms/2X89pFVWw9x571042
Thanks for your input.
Dreadnought
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I'm at work. How close are these to the ones Erie had? They are kinda modern for me, but almost all of Erie's Limas were used in my area.
http://file.vintageadbrowser.com/c4jdz1p7pwifoa.jpg
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Chris,
Thank you for your interest. I believe that the Erie owned several of these switchers: they owned at least 10 LS-1000s, which are identical (externally) to the LS-1200.
Regards,
Dreadnought
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Gotta ask... what sort of chassis can be used to power such a shell?
Here is a list of original owners, just in case anyone is interested...
LIMA LS-1000
Armco Steel (3 units) 707 (ex-Lima-Hamilton demonstrator 1001), 708, 709
B&O (10 units) 330 – 339
Erie (10 units) 650 – 659
NYC (6 units) 8400 – 8405
NKP (4 units) 305 – 308
TP&W (3 units) 300 (ex Lima-Hamilton demonstrator 1000), 301, 302
WAB (2 units) 400, 407 (ex Lima-Hamilton demonstrators 1002 and 1003)
LIMA LS-1200
Armco Steel (3 units) 710, E109, E110
B&O (24 units) 320 – 329, 340 – 353
CR&I (NYC) (6 units) 8406 – 8411
NH (10 units) 630 – 639
NKP (4 units) 309 – 312
TRRA (6 units) 1200 – 1205
WAB (10 units) 401 – 406, 408 – 411
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Gotta ask... what sort of chassis can be used to power such a shell?
Um, that was mentioned in the initial post:
This kit will hopefully be able to be adapted to either Bachmann or Atlas Baldwin chassis in HO and Atlas or Baldwin chassis in N scale.
See next post. :|
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jmlaboda,
The chassis which will be used for this shell will most likely be a Bowser or Stewart VO-1000 in HO scale, or the Atlas VO-1000, Atlas Alco S-2 or Bachmann Alco S-4 chassis in N scale.
Regards,
Dreadnought
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I'm interested in N scale :)
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peteski,
I've just noticed that's incorrect. It should say 'Bowser or Stewart' Baldwin chassis. Bachmann and Atlas do not make a Baldwin switcher chassis. Apologies for the error.
Dreadnought
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What would be most accurate between the S4, S2, and VO-1000?
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Thanks. Will be problems using ALCO S-unit chassis... they are too short. Trying to find technical info to see what the truck spacing is... looks like it might be able to use to Atlas VO1000 in N but want to be sure...
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pjm20 and jmlaboda,
I have looked into the issue recently and found that the VO-1000 chassis is the closest to correct. It is about one foot too long overall. The S-series chassis is too short indeed, by about two feet, but this is less noticeable in N scale. The VO-1000 does use the correct trucks, though. The reason I chose to include the S-series switches in the N-scale category is to allow the chassis to be able to fit more than one frame. Further, the N-scale VO-1000 may have problems with the mechanism fitting under a shorter hood, since the Lima switcher has a shorter hood than the Baldwin switcher. I don't believe this is as much of a problem in HO scale.
Dreadnought
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Hey all,
Here's an update on the chassis situation. It appears that the Bowser VO-1000 will not be a suitable chassis. Its mechanism takes up too much space within the locomotive. It appears the Stewart VO-1000 still fits. Hopefully, the Stewart S-12 switcher will also fit. Of course, this only applies to HO scale. If anyone has any information on the height of the N Scale Atlas VO-1000 mechanism, please tell me.
Regards,
Dreadnought
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My Wyoming & La Grande could use some Limas .
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(http://i917.photobucket.com/albums/ad16/PJM20/20170526_094436.jpg)
Atlas '05 Mechanism
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If you use the Alco S-2 from atlas, you can have sound without excessive effort... I think I could ignore the 2 foot difference in distance between the trucks if there's sound pre-installed. I'm doubtful that the VO-1000 will be the correct height. The hood looks significantly taller and it will be a squeeze.
David
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Hey all,
After some feedback I've decided to adjust the N-scale price to about $75-80. $90 is too high. Also, I am discluding the Atlas VO-1000 as a chassis choice due to the height of the mechanism. The only remaining viable chassis are the Stewart VO-1000 in HO scale and the Alco switchers in N scale.
Regards,
Dreadnought
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Would be nice if with our komputers we could match line drawings that we set to the same scale and make one black and the other red , then overlay them as if they were drawings on clear vinyl . It would make bashing so much more clear as to how things line up , and slicing and dicing .
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The S series chassis would be several FEET too short, right?
I'm thinking RP brass chassis halves that use a truck from the S4, VO1000 or SW1200.
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daniel_leavitt,
Indeed, the S-series chassis would be about 2 feet too short. I'm not sure I understand what you mean by RP brass chassis halves, though. Can you elaborate on what that is?
Dreadnought
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daniel_leavitt,
Indeed, the S-series chassis would be about 2 feet too short. I'm not sure I understand what you mean by RP brass chassis halves, though. Can you elaborate on what that is?
Dreadnought
That is what happens when acronyms are used. RP means "rapid prototyped" or 3D printed.
He suggested to design a new stretched chassis with a correct wheelbase and have it 3D printed in brass. Then stuff it with the S-series mechanical parts. I suspect that some modifications would have to be made to the original mechanical parts (like drive shafts extended) to make this work.
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peteski,
I see. I'm not sure of the cost of 3D printing in brass, but I suspect it's not incredibly low. The chassis which will most likely be used in HO scale is the Stewart Hobbies VO-1000. The Bowser version is too tall mechanically to fit inside the shorter Lima hood. The VO-1000 itself is one foot too long (or about 0.138 inches), so if a difference of one foot is so important to require a substantial increase in size and effort to make a new chassis, then I will happily look into it.
In N scale, the S-series chassis will result in a deficit of about 0.15 inches. Again, if that difference is so important to require a new chassis, then I will pursue that route. Feedback from others has intimated to me that differences of this magnitude are not enough to require the increase in price and effort necessitated by creating a new chassis, but I can pursue that route if it is of great importance.
Dreadnought
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I don't know about everyone else, but I can live with 1/8" too short, especially given that (1) designing a new chassis would make these prohibitively expensive and (2) the Atlas S-2, as someone pointed out, already has an ESU sound decoder built in. So if the N-scale Atlas S-2 works height-wise (don't forget the height of the decoder board), I can live with the 1/8" short to get something that will never be produced commercially. The NKP had 8 of the 1000/1200 series, and I'd be in for a couple while I'm waiting for Atlas to do the S-2 in NKP paint.
John C.
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Atlas S-2 would need new trucks/side frames.
I was interested in this for a second because I knew the RI had Lima models but alas it was the 900.
Jason
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The S series chassis would be several FEET too short, right?
I'm thinking RP brass chassis halves that use a truck from the S4, VO1000 or SW1200.
I've attempted this in the past, and I know that Brian Bussey (sorry if I butchered the last name there) has done a larger unit with a Rapid Prototyped frame, but the major problem that I had was the fact that the machines at both shapeways and Xometry were not accurate enough. I think I will try again soon because of the new tech that is being introduced, but it is something to keep in mind. I'm also toying with the idea of printing the mechanism on my FDM printer using PLA plastic and having someone do lost-PLA casting. But I think in the end this is not significant enough to warrant a new mechanism. An MP15DC to C415 like I was attempting is a little different.
Atlas S-2 would need new trucks/side frames.
True, but that's pretty easy:
https://www.shapeways.com/product/KQGCXH6AB/alco-hi-ad-trucks-n-ho-o?optionId=62297549
https://www.shapeways.com/product/888BU9RGF/flexicoil-kato-early-production-sd40-2-n?optionId=62297668
https://www.shapeways.com/product/L5H2SQREU/mlw-zwt-sideframes?optionId=62297382
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David,
Thanks for chiming in, you definitely know more about this than I do. How exactly do you get those new truck sideframes onto the trucks, though? I don't have an N scale Alco on hand, but I know that it'll require some major surgery to get the sideframes off my HO scale Alco, unless you just slice them off and glue on the new ones - Solution a la Occam's Razor?
Dreadnought
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...Solution a la Occam's Razor?
Hmm. I cut myself too
many times with Occam's
Razor...
(http://bayouline.com/o2.gif)
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If the Atlas MP15 will take a different truck with a 8' wheelbase, that truck center should only be 4" too short.
Jason