TheRailwire
General Discussion => Layout Engineering Reports => Topic started by: wm3798 on March 30, 2011, 08:47:43 AM
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I've been keeping a fairly steady journal of the progress of reconstructing my layout elsewhere, so I won't bore you with all the details, but here's a quick synopsis of how far we've come since the project began in the fall of 2009...
First, here's the track plan that we had been working with, which included some temporary loops on the peninsula to allow for some roundy roundy, a "utility sub" to connect the yard at Ridgeley and the staging yard to the layout, and at times, a small boy's bedroom furniture...
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/Track_Plan%7E1.JPG)
Here's a quick photographic review of what it looked like:
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/Yard_Light.jpg)
The yard was compact, but functional. It was also easily overwhelmed with the volume of trains, especially since it was constantly interrupted by traffic flowing in and out of staging.
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/New_Scene_1975.jpg)
The temporary peninsula provided some passing sidings and switching, but were terribly cramped and spaghetti like. Form followed function, and tight radius on the low line hampered longer rolling stock. Still, it was fun to experiment with scenery and structures here...
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/SjnTNK4PJSI/AAAAAAAAFPE/0MsyAUFqYcA/s512/Laurel%20Valley%20Article%20048web.jpg)
To make all of this work, there was a wye junction that took trains from the utility sub and sent them either eastbound or westbound around the layout.
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/Williamsport_Jct_.JPG)
And yes, you needed an advanced degree in physics to figure it out. In the end it was useful, and I could get trains to sort of feel like they were going somewhere, but there remained obvious shortcomings.
So, after a considerable amount of consultations with my operating group, and with the help of David K. Smith's wizardry with track planning software, I arrived at a more or less final new system plan, which is shown here:
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/upper_levelweb.jpg)
Although the main lines and staging loops have been completed, I'm still working the kinks out of the yard design, but for all intents and purposes, this is what I'm now working with. Here's the staging yards that will support all the action:
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/lower_levelweb.jpg)
Here's a tour of what's been changed.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/S2SihF2tV6I/AAAAAAAAIrk/kiNj2_i80CE/s640/Layout%20Rework%20005.jpg)
First, we gleefully tore out the dreaded Utility Sub, and dismantled the yard. With the help of Phil Hoffmann and Dave Foxx (behind the camera) we laid the foundation for the new west end staging yard. At the same time, we fired the first shot at the Thomas Sub, hanging the bare shelf that would be Elkins.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/S2Sikg2fc_I/AAAAAAAAIr8/P3KXjsrQJW0/s640/Layout%20Rework%20011.jpg)
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TBDV0a8DEiI/AAAAAAAAKnA/BnoUu5hNxm4/ReconstructionPh1%20009.jpg)
A while later, I girded my loins for the prospect of an extended period of being unable to run trains, and abandoned the old peninsula. Denuded of trees, rolling stock and details, it had an eerie look to it.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TCE2Zw6_BII/AAAAAAAAK2M/hioKCK6KYoc/ReconstructionPh1%20083.jpg)
I completely dismantled the peninsula and constructed a new frame for it, and officially got underway in June of 2010.
I spent most of the summer reworking the peninsula, which now looks like this:
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TRdEkY9kLVI/AAAAAAAAMLQ/Sr0oPKdSTNU/s640/New%20Weeklies%20084.jpg)
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TRiUWFtEY9I/AAAAAAAAMOQ/-IL6ZW-z84I/s640/New%20Weeklies%20096.jpg)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TNk8BXtgF6I/AAAAAAAAMAQ/rZKA16AFP-4/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20003.jpg)
Inspired, I took on extending the Thomas Sub all the way up to the previously installed Elkins shelf, which involved another work crew day, installation of the impossibly tight helix in the corner, and the engineering of a removable bridge for across the front window.
More later as I get time to review and re-edit...
Lee
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Before we continue, let's take a break and watch a train...
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TZVK3CYGNoI/AAAAAAAAMzY/lnfnHI5OuK0/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20073.jpg)
There. That's better!
Lee
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Ha! looks like my tabby - though he's too fat to get that close to my layout.
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How ironic that Lee has cats, and he lets them oversee the layout where they, like the Chessie System Lines in the early 1970s, will eventually plot a takeover, thereby destroying Lee's version of the Western Maryland Ry. That which will be spared from abandonment will be permitted to rust away. Right, Lee? ;D
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Okay, back to dull updates...
After, well, during the peninsula reconstruction, I undertook the connection of the Thomas Sub to the yard at Elkins. This involved the construction of a 12" radius three turn helix to rise about 8 or so inches between the west end of Thomas and the beginning of the long siding at Kerens.
(http://lh3.ggpht.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TQbQTBXoRgI/AAAAAAAAMHc/NyF1c6ARGnk/s720/TS%20Progress%2022.jpg)
This stretch also includes a location I've dubbed "Hinshaw" for our own Gary, who was instrumental in laying the ground work there.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TCat_IgLXfI/AAAAAAAAK-A/Kol8ef7gDUs/s512/ReconstructionPh2%20020.jpg)
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TOChcZ1qq7I/AAAAAAAAMCE/G9-0_UCc0Dc/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.%204%20009.jpg)
This is Hinshaw in it's current state. The building to the left is the back end of the Kingsford Charcoal plant at the west end of Thomas, followed by the bridge carrying the Thomas Sub over Wills Creek. The highway is to represent US 40 west of Cumberland through the Narrows, and will be lined with used cars and fast food, just like the real one. So far this is only mocked up, but you get the idea.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TRqE06UMwvI/AAAAAAAAMO8/fY4QPQ0iZIE/s640/New%20Weeklies%20106.jpg)
The section around Cumberland remains largely unfinished at this point. The deck is a little over 4' wide front to back, so I'll have to fill in the scenery from the back first before I can detail the lead edge.
Once this area was tracked, however, I realized what a short hop it would be to finish the connections I needed to get all the way into that nice new east end staging yard... So we had another crew call, and Dave Foxx and Bryan Bohn (Sirenwerks) helped get the first stage of the yard area framed up. But first, I had to build the 32" diameter helix (2.5 turns) that would connect the west staging yard you saw earlier, to the Cumberland side of the railroad...
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TWEguMs38PI/AAAAAAAAMf0/71qoPU762YE/s640/N%20Scale%20Articles%20004.jpg)
This was the last difficult piece of the puzzle to build, but it went together pretty smoothly thanks to the experience of building the 24" twist on the other side of the room, and some materials that became available.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TWsYUgbjdTI/AAAAAAAAMkw/r75sS7qa3zs/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20024.jpg)
Emboldened by the construction, I set about to layout the east end yard throat and engine terminal area, which also had to span a drop leaf bridge built to accommodate the closet door in the room.
All of this is based on the plan that was kicked around by the operating crew, literally for months! ...and ultimately captured in pixels by the able Mr. Smith...
(http://whiteriverandnorthern.net/images/yard5d.gif)
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TWwVdo42_BI/AAAAAAAAMmI/E7PtWWG5jGU/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20041.jpg)
This construction, which enabled locating the 20 stall roundhouse I've been working on since last February, also led to the completion of the main line trackage all the way from east to west staging, to complement the completed Thomas Sub up to Elkins.
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Lee & Crew,
That may seem like dull updates to you guys, but I find it interesting. Like being able to take a look at what all goes on
behind the scenes of a stage production.
Also, for folks like I who have never seen your layout and can only see it through pics; it can explain a lot and helps us visualize it better when we see only a single picture or a certain shot of the layout. Like the shot of the high bridge awhile back where someone mentioned something about being like the prototype and always having trees or a poles in the way of a good camera angle.
Nice Job!
Looking forward to seeing more of your layout through pictures.
Thanks,
Allen...
EDIT: Come to think of it, you guys should do what a local enthusiast has done with his 1" scale live steam layout. He has setup several web cams so you can still watch the trains run if your not able to be there in person! That would let others feel like we're there on operating nights, but then again, maybe you've already done that?
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Come to think of it, you guys should do what a local enthusiast has done with his 1" scale live steam layout. He has setup several web cams so you can still watch the trains run if your not able to be there in person! That would let others feel like we're there on operating nights, but then again, maybe you've already done that?
Might not be "family friendly"...
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Might not be "family friendly"...
+1
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Last night I got a decoder in my Reading GP35... (For those of you who haven't finished your birthday shopping, I need a pair of GP30's, too... ;)) I'm gradually adding rolling stock to the layout, and getting ever more confident that the physical plant is up to the challenge of operating...
Lee
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Last night, I had the Oriole game on the radio, a fresh pair of Bachmann engine shop kits in the mailbox (Thanks, Dave Schneider!) and the heady smell of glue fumes in the air... The timing couldn't have been better, because I needed to finalize the car shops before I can wrap the far yard track around to catch the engine terminal tracks, something I hope to accomplish by close of business tomorrow... Here's the reconfigured building juxtaposed to the roundhouse.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TZhpT1fA8dI/AAAAAAAAM0s/zO3GTeedvvU/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20083.jpg)
I stretched the first kit to 6 bays, and left the other alone, adding a "steel" beam in the opening where they join. I still have to fabricate some new roof panels, and spend some time in the paint booth, but you get the idea...
Here's a couple of angles that I'm looking forward to detailing (and operating!)
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TZhpVOcrdLI/AAAAAAAAM0w/05GW7kVThYY/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20084.jpg)
I've never been impressed with this kit's level of detail... Its sort of post-Stalinist architecture is a little more modern than what I was looking for, so I added some Evergreen strip stock to build up some cornices and window sills. These will be painted a concrete color when I paint the building.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TZhpWJ-x4ZI/AAAAAAAAM00/tM8lMzSLSww/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20086.jpg)
For those of you who remember the Hagerstown Roundhouse and shops, I hope this view has you reaching for your hanky.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TZhpXdukTKI/AAAAAAAAM04/Cuqxdeo8MiI/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20089.jpg)
An overview from the west end of the shops... Again, a very Hagerstowny view. The yellow platform there signifies the west bound ready track.
And for those of you taking notes at home, the main lines behind the shops have plenty of clearance...
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TZhpYc4VO2I/AAAAAAAAM08/a5fnDeOWJ8I/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20090.jpg)
Depending on how you define "plenty..." :)
More later as the scene continues to unfold...
Lee
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Lee
Glad to see those kits put to good use. As for the clearance issue, have you thought about tossing in some rerailer sections behind the roundhouse and shops where they will be hidden? You could even roll your own with some track and some glue/epoxy.
Best wishes
Dave
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Lee,
I really like the way that Hagerstown is coming together. Like you, I also have an affection for locomotive maintenance facilities with my preference being developed at the RF&P's Bryan Park Terminal in the early 1990s in that road's waning days. I look forward to hostling some locomotives around the yard one day. Seeing your roundhouse in person in February, I know it's taken a slight beating in the reconstruction of your layout, so I also look forward to seeing you rehabilitate it, as you complete the engine facility, which really is starting to take on a "Hagerstowny" feel.
With all due respect to Dave S., I don't really agree about placing rerailers on the main line tracks at the rear of Hagerstown. This area is expected to be very visible (okay, perhaps not so much behind the roundhouse) and will be subjected to many photographs. Hopefully, since there's no turnouts on the main back there, derailments shouldn't be a big problem.
Any chance of a panoramic shot of the whole yard to give us a good idea of its current state in one picture?
DFF
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Not yet... But I assure you... it won't be long... ;)
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TZjdZUTkUMI/AAAAAAAAM1M/LWlbIkPFgUc/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20091.jpg)
Off the garage to cut some plywood... :D
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Last update for Sunday... Got the east end of the yard decked. Temporary, but instructive as to the final track plan...
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TZkJyFpaVwI/AAAAAAAAM1k/UheCQ3EW3V4/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20093.jpg)
Still have some wiring to do before the final install, but there's only two more small pieces of plywood to cut, and the super structure of the layout is complete.
Now it's time to watch the Civil War. I hear the South has good pitching, but the Union has the power hitters. Should be interesting.
Lee
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Lee,
How's the final elevation of the yard? Is everything still going to roll eastward humpyard-style or were you able to successfully flatten the grade from one end of the yard to the other?
Dave
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There's still a transition, but I concentrated about 1/4" of the slope at the yard throat, so there's a bit of a grade going down from the main into the class bowls. Since the approaches to the class tracks are all curved, a little gravity will probably be useful when backing in cuts of cars. Since shorter cuts will be getting pulled out, then assembled on the A/D track, I've kept the grade on that steady with the main. Also, I'll be assigning BL-2 81 and slug 138-T to the west throat, so there will be plenty of a$$ to handle longer cuts when required.
This will make the majority of the yard on a slope of about 3/16" over about 5', which shouldn't have cuts rolling around on their own.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TZneY7A4P9I/AAAAAAAAM2A/PaHaSRdhxr4/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20095.jpg)
At right, you see the main lines on the cork roadbed. The caboose is on the A/D track, which is at the same grade as the mains, and the C&O car is on the level of the class bowls. It should work out pretty well, I think. I've just got to cut the last couple of bits of plywood, and the whole thing is closed up.
Next, I'm working with click pens and bicycle brake cables to make some turnout linkages for the switches at the rear of the yard. Once that riddle is solved, then I can do the final installation with real screws!
Lee
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Looking great, Lee. I'm eager to run some trains.
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(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TZhpXdukTKI/AAAAAAAAM04/Cuqxdeo8MiI/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20089.jpg)
For those of you who remember the Hagerstown Roundhouse and shops, I hope this view has you reaching for your hanky.
Lee
YYYYYYYYYYYEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS. That was my initial thought from looking at the image. The wood coaling tower from Walthers would make a great stand-in, if this was going to be Hagersbum.
The S.
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(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TZhpXdukTKI/AAAAAAAAM04/Cuqxdeo8MiI/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20089.jpg)
As The S. suggests, a coaling tower would add a nice vertical element to the locomotive facilities and, at least from this angle, do something to camouflage Lee's mug on the wall. ;D
DF2
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Lee,
In the picture above, why do you have a left hand turnout at the far right foreground? It would appear from the lines that you have drawn on the Homasote that the tracks will continue to curve to the right (as you proceed through the turnout into the yard tracks), so a right hand turnout would eliminate an s-curve or two at this location. In addition, all of the other trackwork really appears to flow nicely through here, and this doesn't match the geometry of the other yard tracks, e.g., the turnout leading to the two tracks to the left (in the picture above) of this lefty turnout.
DF2
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Silly Dave. That's the entrance to the A/D track, and inbound trains from the east should keep right. Thus, the "main" route is on the flat, while exiting west bound trains will negotiate the little S as they leave the yard slowly and methodically. Also, bear in mind that these are all #7's, and the camera angle is making the bends look a lot more pronounced.
I didn't get as far as I would have liked today, but I accomplished two critical tasks. First, I salvaged a couple of old 4' flourescent fixtures to hang over the yard... this will serve the dual purpose of improving visibility in that area, as well as freeing up the track lights to fill in the corners and the peninsula.
I also made the final cuts to finish the deck of the yard, and I now have everything tacked into place...
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TZpbR4MdqfI/AAAAAAAAM2Q/snFNj4Rnqbw/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20096.jpg)
So, the last thing I need to buy is the curved right switch for the west throat, and collect some more track to finish out the yard. There's still some technical issues to work out, but I'll have plenty of time to fool with that stuff.
Lee
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Took a break from power tools to work on detailing the car shop building while watching the Civil War and James May's Road Trip last night... I hope to have it finished (more or less) and ready to photograph tonight.
Lee
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Silly Dave.
This is true.
Now to harrass you about another issue: The body tracks of the yard don't look as long as I had hoped. What do you expect the capacity to be, especially on the A/D tracks? Can you tighten up/shorten the ladders at each end?
DFF
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Now to harrass you about another issue: The body tracks of the yard don't look as long as I had hoped. What do you expect the capacity to be, especially on the A/D tracks? Can you tighten up/shorten the ladders at each end?
Careful. That's a touchy subject. I've been hammering him about that since the start of the project. The east end took a hit from the shops, and the west end has an aesthetic bone of contention thing going on with switch geometry. Best to leave this dog snoring, methinks.
(With appropriate winks.)
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Careful. That's a touchy subject. I've been hammering him about that since the start of the project. The east end took a hit from the shops, and the west end has an aesthetic bone of contention thing going on with switch geometry. Best to leave this dog snoring, methinks.
(With appropriate winks.)
I hear you, but he called me "silly" first... ;D
Seriously, I would hate to see sacrifices made for a few bucks in turnouts. In other words, get the right track pieces to do the job. If that's curved turnouts (custom or Atlas) or #5s, then do it. Personally, I have had no problem with #5 yard ladders and they can really save space, especially when you cut a couple of inches off of the tail. Another thing is that the turnouts at the west end do not have to be placed end-to-end, and I see gaps between the turnouts at the east end, eating up further car capacity. I really think that this version needs serious reconsideration before permanently installing anything.
DFF
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I'm with my esteemed colleague, Mr. Foxx. Lee, I think before you glue anything down, it'd be really beneficial to tack it all down using double sided tape or something, then "try it out" a bit first.
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First the good news.
There are two more bowl tracks than were drawn in by Mr. Smith (Total of 10, plus an 11th I'm toying with adding for a RIP track) Track spacing is a generous 1-3/8", which contributes to the "air" between turnouts on the east end, since it approaches at an angle. At the west end, I'm not ruling out compound ladders, I just haven't spent time monkeying with that yet. I guess at first glance, I want to keep the west throat as non complex as possible given the curved turnout that will make the whole thing possible in the first place.
Regarding the geometry, when you look at the picture:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TZpbR4MdqfI/AAAAAAAAM2Q/snFNj4Rnqbw/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20096.jpg)
The older looking piece of plywood is 54" long, and the smaller new looking piece at the west end is another 21". That's a hair over 6 feet from throat to throat. If you can't figure out how to block cars in 50' of track, and a double ended yard, you're fired.
(The longer tracks in the middle of the bowls will be at least 5' long by themselves)
Remember, you're not building whole trains in the class tracks, you're blocking cars. You're building trains on the A/D tracks, which begin at the west end about where the old red car shop building is at the far left, all the way around to main yard lead, about where the grey screw driver is at the lower right. 25 cars will easily fit there, which is the demonstrated length limit based on running the helix with three diesels and no helper or string-lining cars.
My roster presently includes about 350 pieces of rolling stock. If there are 9 trains of 25 cars each in the staging yards, that makes up for more than half of them. If there are 40 cars spotted around the layout, that leaves about 75 unaccounted for. Put 30 of them in the yard at Elkins, or elsewhere on the layout in random locals, and you're down to 45 cars to classify in the yard. So, you have one car per foot of track in the yard. I think you're going to be fine. ;D
Lee
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Remember, you're not building whole trains in the class tracks, you're blocking cars. You're building trains on the A/D tracks, which begin at the west end about where the old red car shop building is at the far left, all the way around to main yard lead, about where the grey screw driver is at the lower right. 25 cars will easily fit there, which is the demonstrated length limit based on running the helix with three diesels and no helper or string-lining cars.
If you go back to my earlier post, you'll see it was the A/D tracks I was mostly concerned with, because they need to be as long as the trains entering/leaving the yard. If these tracks are long enough for 25-car trains plus motive power, then, yeah, you're probably good. That said, the longer those classification tracks are the more efficient the yard can be. Each time that Ed has to see-saw his power or cuts of cars costs the railroad time, and, let's face it, a fast clock doesn't work well in the yard.
DFF
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Y'all need to go back to building your door layouts... ;)
Look, you're getting 10 class tracks, thirty inch plus drill tracks at both ends of the yard, #7 turnouts throughout, and an overall yard length of about 6'. I defy you to present another model railroad in our operating circle that offers as much in the same space, plus a fully functional engine terminal. John has two good sized yards, but they're not as tuned in to ops, at least not yet, and Eric will have more once he gets it all built, but they have a lot more real estate to work with.
We were able to pump 20 plus trains through back when you had a crappy five track yard to work with. This will be quite luxurious for you, I assure you.
Lee
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Lol, I just enjoy the armchair engineering!
This is gonna be awesome Lee. I can't wait.
Except, it looks like we're moving the CRHS's Camp Car May 1 & 2, so the OPS might have to wait.
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We'll address scheduling where we address scheduling... I just can't wait to start throwing darts at your track plan... And they'll stick really well to that foam benchwork! :D
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Spent some more time in front of the boob tube soaking up some bloody battlefields, and soldering LED's...
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TZxXWlcp9BI/AAAAAAAAM2o/ZPw9E02dms4/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20099.jpg)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TZxXXUmFA6I/AAAAAAAAM2s/PBGFSO7h_rc/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20103.jpg)
Oh yeah... Big shop buildings are a waste of space... ;D
Still lots more details to add, not to mention a floor to build. But that'll come sooner or later. Next job will be monkeying with click pens and brake cables.
Lee
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Y'all need to go back to building your door layouts... ;)
Always with the Negative Waves Moriearty
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_utj_WiTT3tU/R1tYHEz-adI/AAAAAAAAAVY/Cg2WmpRu-FI/s400/oddball.jpg)
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Tonight I started installing my first ballpoint pen switch actuator, borrowing a design discovered on Kevin's (JustTrainCrazy)'s blog...
http://ccsb2007.blogspot.com/search/label/Construction
I've modified the approach slightly, in that I'm using a bicycle brake cable to transfer the motion from the pen to the switch, and I'm adding a DPST at the turnout end to route the frog power. I haven't gotten to that end yet, and it's going to be a little tricky, given that I'll be working above the staging yard and below the sloped ceiling. The good news is that the plywood for this particular location can be trimmed back and removed so I can have better access to the work.
If you haven't checked out this design, you need to. It's simply brilliant, and brilliantly simple.
Photos when the first installation is complete.
Lee
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Tonight I started installing my first ballpoint pen switch actuator, borrowing a design discovered on Kevin's (JustTrainCrazy)'s blog...
http://ccsb2007.blogspot.com/search/label/Construction
and I'm adding a DPST at the turnout end to route the
we talking a momentary toggle type switch here? seems like the pen method wouldn't be strong enough to throw a switch.. I'm anxious to see the pics
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I'll be interested to see how this goes as well. My gut says the bicycle brake cable is going to add considerable friction resistance to the system, and the pen clicker won't have the energy to move/hold it properly. Adding a SPDT (I don't think you meant DPST) switch to the mix adds even more resistance. Looking at Kevin's original design, there was only a piece of wire between the pen and the switch.
I should think that, since slide switches have proven to be sufficient to operate switches, it ought to be enough to just mount the slide switch underneath, add a steel wire to the switch lever to move the points, and use the brake cable to actuate it, without the need for the clicker. Just attach some kind of knob on the end of the brake cable to push/pull.
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The experiment will proceed, and I'll keep you abreast of developments. The brake cable is moving in a straight line on the first one, and it's a high quality cable with a metal shield inside the black plastic, so it moves quite freely. So far the pen is clicking quite robustly!
Onward to the summit!
Lee
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Doing more infrastructure work before proceeding with the yard and switch throws. Tonight I added some more of the control bus, running enough cable to get all the way around the room with throttle jacks. I've got to finish the tedious wire stripping and installation of the jacks themselves, which has to wait until I cut a couple of pieces of fascia.
I did find a source for cheap components to assemble my own 8-pin jacks (I'm using MRC Prodigy Advance), a local electrical wholesaler. I got enough jacks and wall plates to add two dual jacks at each end of the yard for about $8. This compared to $8.99 for a single surface mount jack at Rapio Shack.
Anyway, I also engineered adding a work light over the dispatcher's desk, and otherwise got a wee bit closer to being ready for ops. I'm also working on a training protocol by which I will qualify engineers and tower operators. The layout is really pretty easy to operate once you understand how it all works.
Onward!
Lee
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I've got s small under counter fluorescent taking up space in the basement. it's urs for the takin!
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Thanks for the offer... Bring it on by next time you're through. I've got the desk light already, but I do need a strip light under the Elkins yard...
Lee
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Here's a look at this weekend's progress. This may be the last big leap forward for a little while. The sun has come back out, and a rotten front porch beckons... Of course, I'll have to publish a couple more articles to pay for THAT, so I guess the train room won't be completely ignored!
Anyway, to follow up on the brake cable/slide switch/click pen conversation, I've installed three of them, and they work like champs. The only modification I made was to stretch out the spring in the pen barrel a little to increase the tension, otherwise, everything slides, clicks and switches just the way I want it to.
Here's the key component, the slide switch mount:
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TaO_-R0d_HI/AAAAAAAAM3c/o9B0rAjgtIY/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20107.jpg)
I used a square of 1/8" balsa to make a secure plate onto which I mounted the slide switch. I used a very light dab of Gorilla Glue, then used the 1/4" blocks you see there to really lock it into place. I used yellow wood glue for the wood to wood connections. The piano wire actuator is a simple L, the top leg extending through the slide switch itself, then on up to the throwbar on the other side of the plywood.
Here's the top side view:
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TaO_9kdCvmI/AAAAAAAAM3Y/OFa9m8LxkEs/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20106.jpg)
You can see the screw mount that connects the L to the brake cable. The first connection between the click pen and the brake cable is similar to the illustration in Kevin's blog. Once I worked out the basic set up, I whipped through three of these in a couple of hours' time.
With that task taken care of, the plywood base for the A/D tracks could be installed, and for those of you who know me well, that means that track followed shortly thereafter. Here's the first train pulling through the engine terminal and into the yard:
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TaPAdUXbKwI/AAAAAAAAM3k/1LP44neZNIE/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20111.jpg)
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TaPDzQ6I7II/AAAAAAAAM34/2snZLbDKGdY/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20112.jpg)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TaPA3uChoyI/AAAAAAAAM3o/mbafH_y0VQM/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20114.jpg)
So there it is, the West Local bound for Elkins, waiting for clearance at the west end of Ridgeley Yard.
Lee
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Had a nice little impromptu run and gun session with our own RockGP40 and Randy Gustafson this evening. Randy was in town consulting on a local short line project, and Brian, well, he was just loitering on a street corner as usual.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TaUQ_SBAVpI/AAAAAAAAM4Y/VVZr1boA2Ws/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20115.jpg)
Randy brought his absolutely dazzling GHQ Pennsy L-1, but sadly, it is Digitally Challenged, so we didn't get to run it. Also, dopey me didn't think to photograph it. Brian brought some visiting power from the Midwest, though, to provide some more contemporary eye candy.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TaURAo2sqVI/AAAAAAAAM4c/lEC4ObhufOM/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20116.jpg)
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TaURCTQNPwI/AAAAAAAAM4g/_OG2a-X1QWo/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20118.jpg)
Happily, the layout ran great as Randy and I sent some freights around the main and Brian bumped cars up and down the Thomas Sub. The A/D tracks and a run around for the engines are now installed and functioning. Suddenly getting some class tracks in place is more urgent.
Lee
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how long is Randy in town?
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Heading back to Warren PA today... :-\
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Laid out the fan tracks for the 20 stall roundhouse last night. Have to do some quick cosmetic work for a photo shoot, and a few more things to tidy up below decks, then the yard can get built, thanks to a generous influx of salvaged track from a friend who's changing scales.
They're working on casting a golden spike shortly...
Lee
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Installed the fan tracks over the last couple of nights. 20 stall roundhouse, 3 shop tracks, 5 extra storage tracks. Let the wiring begin!
Also fine tuned the Walther's turntable. Still a little wonky on the indexing, but it's getting better. The engine terminal should be open for business in another week or so.
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(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TbNqAGpVsxI/AAAAAAAANCw/H_g4nCs_pDo/s640/Ridgeley%20Engine%20Terminal%20%284%29.jpg)
Mmmmmm. Roundhousey goodness...
Time to start the wiring.... :P
First the track, then the house lighting. Eep!
Lee
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That looks fantastic Lee. I especially like the way the roundhouse opens to the aisle. Just needs fascia...well done.
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Lee, looking great! Warm up the soldering gun, that's a lot of feeders.
Frank
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Thanks, guys. Wazzou, this is the shot of Hagerstown I wanted to get close to...
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TbQrcp2xS_I/AAAAAAAANDg/smlWUwozKv8/s640/WM%20Hagers%20roundhouse%20pan%20cropped%20x200.JPG)
I think I'm getting close!
Lee
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Looks fantastic Lee. Guess those tanks on the flats are going or coming off the Lurgan Sub to Letterkenny Army Depot.
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Heh. I just rounded them up from around the layout... Andy had the Thomas Sub under siege...
Dug through the files this afternoon and found the glass for the sides of the roundhouse. I'm using this as a means of procrastinating the wiring projects...
Lee
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I'd say you nailed that scene Lee. Maybe you should soak the service facility with a bit of spilled diesel and creosote for the compleat effect.
-gfh
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... and creosote for the compleat effect.
-gfh
I see they have you speaking Canadian ... sorry ... Canadien now!
Lee
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Tonight's progress includes the addition of some fascia along the front edge around the engine terminal. I'd have some pictures for you to cogitate on, but I left the memory card from the camera stuck in my computer at work... We were posting amazing pictures of the used washing machines we sell...
Anyway, in the process of adjusting the benchwork to accept the new masonite bits, I managed to knock all of the cars in the staging yard underneath off the tracks. The smart model railroader would have likely moved the trains out of harm's way first, but he and I typically do not reside in the same time zone, let alone the same house... ::)
I've got to get some paint on it to blend it in to the rest of the rig, and that happens pretty soon since I need to get a photo to hit my next deadline...
Lee
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A little farther along... Fascias installed and painted.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TbqzbnClSeI/AAAAAAAANIE/9TcLumJ44vY/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20138.jpg)
Lee
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A little farther along... Fascias installed and painted.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TbqzbnClSeI/AAAAAAAANIE/9TcLumJ44vY/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20138.jpg)
Lee
Lee,
That gap in the fascia: Is that where the removable bridge section to access the closet starts? If so, the joint across the layout and track is invisible from this angle. Or, have you not actually cut the gap yet?
DFF
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Yes, that is the hinge. I probably could have made it about 1/4" tighter. And yes, the gaps are cut, and so far haven't presented a problem. I did have to add some little guardrails due to the angle of the cuts.
Lee
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Starting to look really impressive Lee. Those big roundhouses make great scenes. :)
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I'd say you nailed that scene Lee. Maybe you should soak the service facility with a bit of spilled diesel and creosote for the compleat effect.
-gfh
I see they have you speaking Canadian ... sorry ... Canadien now!
Lee
Only an ignorant American would think that typo is "Canadian". ::) :P
We're starting to figure out this computer thing up here, eh...
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What's the story with the far back corner? Has that been finished? Looks like that'll be a pain in the butt, otherwise, this is looking awesome.
Can I recommend some unsanded grout on top of the black cinder ballast to give it that "dirt" look that's so prevalent in areas like this? I really love the stuff...
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The back corner is unfinished. My plan is take a chunk of foam, cut it to fit, build some scenery on it, then throw it back there with a piece of chewing gum. Once I get the track down in the yard, I'll be experimenting with some textures.
Lee
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Ah, cool, I didn't realize that stuff in there wasn't currently down for good.
I'll tell ya, I LOVE the unsanded black grout for use as that "grimy dirt" that seemed to be everywhere in yard and engine terminals. It's got a really fine texture that just looks awesome.
The sanded stuff is good for gravel, but the unsanded is the shiz-night when it comes to dirt.
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Gee, I wonder where I can find a half a bag of unsanded grout? Oh yeah, on the shelf behind my office! Yay ReStore!
Lee
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I've got a 25LB bag of the sanded reddish-brown stuff that I'm using as a ground cover base layer - looks really good for that.
Now back to Lee's regular program.
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Words to accompany the pictures:
http://wmrywesternlines.blogspot.com/2011/04/nerve-center.html
Lee
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Good lord what was I thinking? I have a lot of hidden trackage, and as the scenery gets filled in, it's going to be even more hidden. I spent the better part of the evening clearing two underground wrecks, both due to human error. (Those damn humans... the house is infested with them!)
I'm thinking a security camera system is going to be required, not just a nice idea. I'm thinking at the staging yard throats, the mid point of East Staging under Cumberland, the back of the two helixes, and somewhere inside the long siding on the Connellsville line. So that's what, 6 cameras?
Yikes. Any suggestions from the peanut gallery? Better start stacking up nickels and dimes again!
Lee
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Maybe something like this ..
http://cgi.ebay.com/USB-30-0M-6-LED-WEBCAM-CAMERA-WEB-CAM-MIC-PC-LAPTOP-/120701758006?pt=PCA_Video_Conferencing_Webcams&hash=item1c1a62aa36
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John went the way I was thinking. But do you really need cameras or just occupancy detection with a panel repeat?
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I was thinking more like a cheap security cam system with a couple of displays at the dispatcher's desk.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/S9ONr1Oe7nI/AAAAAAAAKAk/4-4_lh06OfM/s640/4-24-10%20148.jpg)
Adding detection and repeaters would probably require a lot more wiring.
Lee
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Got a package of modular remnants in the mail yesterday from Phil... (Thanks, Phil!) so now the city of Hagerstown has a Department of Public Works!
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/Tb_lWQIu3cI/AAAAAAAANJM/W2lxs9HQqNM/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20141.jpg)
Lee
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::) ::) ::)
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Got a package of modular remnants in the mail yesterday from Phil... (Thanks, Phil!) so now the city of Hagerstown has a Department of Public Works!
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/Tb_lWQIu3cI/AAAAAAAANJM/W2lxs9HQqNM/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20141.jpg)
Lee
I like it!
The S.
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Great read Lee. Love seeing the updates.
I'm in the midst of pre-planning a HO scale layout for the local club that may or may not be moving if they decide to non-renew their lease.
Unbeknownst to me, until I saw took another gander at your photos of the "Nerve Center" I created almost the exact same track plan for their facilities......weird. ;)
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A little more progress last night. Need to do a little sanding and puttying I see. Maybe I'll buy a trash truck or two.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TcHrrrVAyiI/AAAAAAAANJc/NSY-FJJRNTg/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20144.jpg)
I'm thinking about adding a spur to receive road salt.
Lee
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More fun with modulars...
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TcKWnG8ES6I/AAAAAAAANJ0/iqC825IR_Hw/s640/Reconstruction%20Ph.3%20145.jpg)
Crew dormitory and commissary for the west end of Ridgeley Yard. Based loosely on the scale building at Knobmount Yard.
http://www.wmwestsub.com/thomassub/knobmountyard08.jpg
Lee
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I like it!
The S.
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Operations on the Thomas Sub are starting to come into focus. Last night I ran the East and West locals, with the limitation of just one operator so they ran in sequence rather than simultaneously, which will be the protocol during an ops session. In a nutshell, the East Local runs from Ridgeley to Elkins by way of Maryland Jct. and Thomas, and the West Local originates in Elkins, following the same route in the opposite direction.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/S6pkJ5AnbaI/AAAAAAAAMW4/YcKkyk31_LU/s800/Weeklies2%20004.jpg)
Elkins Yard
There are industries to switch at Cumberland, Maryland Junction, Shaw, and Thomas (east to west) There are facing and trailing point switches at most locations, and sidings for set outs. So, a train heading west can work the trailing point switches, and leave behind cars for the facing points to be worked by the eastbound train. The locals will also carry traffic to and from interchanges with the C&O at Durbin, and the B&O at Belington, both located in the fifth dimension beyond Elkins.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TRdDi7MMaFI/AAAAAAAAMKU/N7SgiQIxsFU/s800/New%20Weeklies%20050.jpg)
Thomas Yard. Coal mine is at right at the bottom of the switch back. Industries are on the left.
In addition to local traffic, the East Local will include empty hoppers bound for Thomas and Elkins on an as-needed basis, and the West Local can pull coal loads when available. The key there will be train length, which is limited by the passing siding at Shaw, which holds about 15 to 20 cars. For traffic moving beyond Thomas, the 24" helix up to Kerens is another limiting factor. In a pinch, longer trains can be split between Shaw siding and the yard at Thomas to let an opposing train pass.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TLsocMFMbuI/AAAAAAAALyM/bZG5jgwrKFc/ReconstructionPh2%20146.jpg)
Shaw Siding: High line on the left of the gorge.
In and amongst this excitement, there will be a mine run turn that originates from Elkins to deliver empties to Shaw and Thomas, and pull loads from the tipples. These loads will typically be held at the yard in Thomas to be consolidated with a coal extra moving east. The coal extra will also originate at Elkins, representing hoppers from "beyond the benchwork" at Webster Springs, Bergoo, and Laurel Bank etc. These cars will have to clear Elkins after the West Local is released, but before the East Local arrives to clear enough track in the yard.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TRiUWFtEY9I/AAAAAAAAMOQ/-IL6ZW-z84I/s912/New%20Weeklies%20096.jpg)
Mine Run Turn working the Francis Branch at Thomas
Running all of this by myself sequentially, and without handling car cards, took about three hours. This included working the industries in both directions, running a mine turn, and and a coal train. Utilizing multiple crews and a yard operator at Elkins (and Ridgeley) should streamline this process, but with meets and paperwork we're probably still looking at a solid two hour shift to handle all the business on the line.
In the perfect world, this would require minimally:
A yard master for Ridgeley
A yard master for Elkins
2 road crews for the locals
Paper Mill crew
The Elkins yardmaster can run the mine run turn, and an extra crew can be called to run coal down the mountain.
I can have this part of the operation organized and ready, at least with switch lists in the next couple of weeks. I just need to get some yard tracks installed at Ridgeley to be able to properly block and classify.
Lee
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Hubba hubba! Guess I need to sign up on the crew call sheet! The real question is which yard will Ed want to run?
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Hubba hubba! Guess I need to sign up on the crew call sheet! The real question is which yard will Ed want to run?
Ed has always planned to run Ridgeley, which will have a lot more work to do than the yard in Elkins. I wouldn't mind running one of the locals into/out of Elkins (I like the Thomas Sub) or, if necessary, acting as yardmaster at Elkins. Or, I could just continue as the general counsel for the Laurel Valley Ry., sit back with my feet on my desk, partaking in Vitamin Y, and waiting out the next disaster at Hinshaw. ;D
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Happily, the bridge at Hinshaw is soundly engineered, and even passed the scrutiny of a Pennsy OCS train with Major Dr. Dave Vollmer at the throttle...
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TcgcOmXaOkI/AAAAAAAANXE/ESMDyWxgu9I/s912/Vollmer%205911%20%286%29.jpg)
Phil, you're on for a local... but you'll need to use the reliable WM power, not that coon-a$$ swamp monster ... You'll scare all the bears out of the woods with that thing!
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That's just a first generation sound decvoder ... And considering how old the the Coffee Grinder is it's definitely era appropriate!
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That thing was actually built while the WM still existed, wasn't it?
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Yup...
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/KCS_Atlas_1G_GP30.jpg)
According to Spookshow, the Roco GP30 was introduced in 1974... So not only did the WM exist, the whole system was still intact.
http://www.visi.com/~spookshow/rocogeep.html
But seriously, folks. The old Coffee Grinder is always welcome... just bring plenty of back up power ;D
To further update the crew, last night I finished rewiring the Maryland Junction panel, so now Brian will have complete local control over the junction turnouts and the new industrial spur for the sand loader (formerly the coal mine branch behind Casselman Crossing).
The turnouts at MY Tower and the west end of the Warehouse are also controllable by the dispatcher since they route the main lines, but the local operator can override them for switching maneuvers.
The next big turnout project will be the interlockings at the west end of the yard. I may end up tearing up the subroadbed and building that at the work bench, as it's a pretty complex piece of railroad there, and there's not much room to work with for the mechanicals and electricals.
That might wait until post-ops session to make sure it's laid out to everyone's satisfaction.
Lee
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(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TdCd2WnxOuI/AAAAAAAANbE/h5sSeONyR2k/s640/New%20Weeklies%20178.jpg)
Here's the revised panel for Maryland Jct. Really just a reference shot for Brian, since this is his domain. Note that the slide switches at MY West and MY have been replaced with single push buttons. These are the local operator buttons that work with the decoder. The two push buttons at the far right operate a twin solenoid at the sand loader, seen here:
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/_ERLF7TTPvmA/TdCd4pNi99I/AAAAAAAANbQ/lY3PK4IGtLg/s640/New%20Weeklies%20181.jpg)
I've reworked the artwork for the panel so I can replace it, but for now it's ugly but functional. I may swap out the bigger slide switches for the micro ones I have... The micros don't throw far enough to work as switch machines.
Ultimately, all of the main line switches and crossovers will be operated by decoders, and a fully functional dispatch panel will be built and located somewhere useful, perhaps in the next room.
Lee
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The time has come to get the A/C into the window. This means cutting the main to pull the lift out section to get to it. This will be a twice annual ritual, and I'm considering installing Ntrak style transition tracks instead of my usual flush cut rails. The reason for this is the proximity of the turnouts on the left side of the window:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-sXZs0dbWqDk/TYlweugXvYI/AAAAAAAAMyQ/pcNt95f9mDY/s640/Reconstruction%252520Ph.3%252520071.jpg)
This one is the trickiest. You can see the break in the sub roadbed just right of the points.
My usual process is to paint the rail, ballast it in good and tight then after it dries solid, cut the rails right at the joint.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-UsD5wUo8g3E/TXYd6_9F7DI/AAAAAAAAMrQ/Dk5TijkDYKY/s640/Bridge%252520Article%252520074.jpg)
That's the joint at the fold-down section at the closet door. It lines up tight and flush, and so far hasn't presented any issues.
I've got the window liftout all wired and ready, so I guess I should stop prattling on about it here and go get on with it...
Updates as they happen.
Lee
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Lee,
Always impressed with not only the quality of your modeling but your updates as well. Never seen your layout but almost feels like I've been there a hundred times. You present some very useful ideas and the pictures are excellent!
Mike
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I've been noodling about with the just using pc ties for the ends on my module, should anything terrible happen while in transit. Those code 55 ties scare me when strictly relying on them and ends.
Granted you only have to move that lift out section four times a year (two up and out, and two back in), but lift outs scare me. Even with the greatest of care.
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Lee -
In the past when I've dealt with this, I have installed screws into the plywood sub-roadbed at the rail ends and soldered the rails to the screws on both sides of the joint.
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I'd seen that screw trick done before. I even saw it before I built this section of track. Sadly, I forgot about it completely prior to your little reminder here... I think it will be worth the effort to add that little feature prior to making the cut... I'll just have to yank up some track and put it back...or maybe not... Stay tuned for further developments.
It's hotter than Hades up there right now... 91 today in Groove City, so I'm in that conundrum... too hot to do what needs to be done to install the a/c so it will be cool enough work...
Projects in the queue include the above lift out, plus installation of a new (to me) counter top for the dispatch/yard office.
To the steam bath!!
Lee
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Did the solder to the screw stud trick on the upper turnout track. Contemplated slashing wrists as alignment became nearly impossible to attain, screwed up gauge through the points. Tried multiple fixes, all failed. Finally pulled out all the stupid spikes I was using to try to line things up again.
Train proceeded through at the prescribed speed without incident.
Quickly installed ballast, crossing fingers as the cool night air works its magic on the glue...
Lee
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It's probably more difficult after the gaps have been cut.
I cut the sub-roadbed in advance, assure proper fit/finish, lay the cork, install screws, cut cork, lay track as normal, remove ties where necessary, solder rails to screws, and finally cut gaps.
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Yeah, I haven't cut the gaps yet. That will likely be this evening.
Lee
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Still haven't cut the gaps yet, but here's where it stands at the moment...
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-3pAma3e0K3E/Td3EHpFlhYI/AAAAAAAANck/zqL6GPgbR0M/s640/New%252520Weeklies%252520183.jpg)
There's a wee gap in the ties there at the right end of the turnout, this is where the screws are. I may go back with some thin strip styrene and paint to "faux" in some ties, but not till after the surgery is done.
Meanwhile, back at the ReStore, a chunk of forlorn countertop presented itself, and was quickly pressed into service as the new and improved dispatch desk and yard office...
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-r8Z8mmGTSyU/Td3EGZLUW2I/AAAAAAAANcc/HDHwjg0XemQ/s640/New%252520Weeklies%252520182.jpg)
This should provide plenty of space for the yard clerk to sort through car cards, as well as a place for the switcher engineer to put down his libation.
While I'm pleased with the results, this was no easy task. The little control box for west end staging had to be moved, which involved cutting and splicing about 10 pairs of wires below decks. Good thing I like the taste of soldering flux, and the pleasant aroma that's produced by hot solder scorching my cornea.
This task will enable me to complete the work lights for the staging yard, and then on to permanently affixing the yard platform on top of the frame. The goal remains to hold a little roundy round shake down session at the end of June.
Lee
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Cut the gaps, pulled the section, installed the A/C.
Put humpty dumpty back together, to discover (to my delight!) that the bottom of the river platform clears the top of the A/C unit by about 3/32"
I also discovered that I never installed track feeders to the main line on the upper bridge... Oh well, now I know why I didn't finish the scenery on that... Tomorrow, wires, solder and pictures!
Lee
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Interesting telephone there... ::)
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It Came from the 70's... Just like leisure suits, disco, and that stupid Chessie paint scheme...
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A nice clean cut from the razor saw...
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-0-Tn97T4qQc/TeDVD3q9GRI/AAAAAAAANdM/bEUEb8j-nYs/s640/New%252520Weeklies%252520184.jpg)
And the unbelievably close clearance over the A/C unit...
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-9E_QTjs6Kl8/TeDVEqBh-YI/AAAAAAAANdQ/xXRPt1RPlg8/s640/New%252520Weeklies%252520185.jpg)
I should have gotten an engineering degree.
Lee
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I should have gotten an engineering degree.
...or a degree in humility. ;D
D. Trump
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Humiliation is usually what I get... :-X
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I'll be curious to see what happens if that AC unit craps out and you need to buy another one. Hopefully you'll find one that fits the same clearance issues. :-X
And that phone is HOTT.
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I've been going through the bazillions of photos I've accumulated of the reconstruction in my picasa albums to reorganize and streamline their accessibility based on the geography of the layout. As such, some of the images posted in these pages may evaporate. I'll do my best in the coming weeks to edit humpty dumpty back together, so please be patient if you don't see something you were looking for.
You can also check out my Picasa gallery in the mean time.
Among the first shots in the order of things would be this little accomplishment completed today...
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-8PZy1zvxzoo/TeW1spPwD6I/AAAAAAAANkw/f15I0O_pbvI/s640/New%252520Weeklies%252520189.jpg)
Should be plenty of light for the clerks reading the numbers off of those N scale freight cars as they shuffle through the yard.
Lee
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That's a yard? ::)
The light is a key addition though.
-gfh
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The journey of a thousand miles begins with being able to see what the hell you're doing... ;D
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Here's the link to one of the albums. You ought to be able to find your way around from there. Hint, sort albums by title, and they'll all be at the top.
https://picasaweb.google.com/Lee.WildCard.Graphics/021HighBridge?feat=directlink
There will be a quiz later...
Lee
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Last night I finished the last little bits of wiring that will allow me to proceed with construction of the yard. I'll be starting with the east end, toward the engine terminal.
I've also discovered I need to add some stiffeners and maybe a couple more legs under this side of the layout. I've spent more time than I like clearing cars from staging that have been jostled off the rails.
Lee
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Houston, we have a problem.
After months of successfully running trains through the west staging yard, the last couple of days have presented amazing challenges that are causing me to re-think this whole side of the layout.
Well, at least the bits that are under ground and virtually impossible to reach.
I'm not sure if a heat kink has developed (the layout is in the attic, and it got hot as hell last week), or there's debris that's fallen on the track, or if my haste in laying the recycled c80 flex I used down there is rearing its ugly head... But it's turning out to definitely NOT be ready for prime time.
It's been exacerbated by the installation of the yard office desk, which makes the distance between the aisle and the exit throat unmanageable without extraordinary effort.
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/lower_levelweb.jpg)
This is the "as built" drawing, and you can see how far back the turnouts are from human contact, and this is made doubly challenging because the vertical clearance is only about 6".
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-alQBTcT6KIM/TeW1tl6VayI/AAAAAAAANk0/4mfTI19_AYg/s640/New%252520Weeklies%252520182.jpg)
That view pretty much illustrates the problem.
In retrospect, I should have brought the helix around another 1/4 turn, and placed the turnouts closer to the front edge, as I did on the east end in the original construction.
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/Layout_pictures_206.jpg)
Why I didn't take this into account is beyond me. And I'm afraid that in the present condition, an easy solution is too.
I'm thinking of dismantling the yard and engine terminal as close to a single chunk as possible, and completely rebuilding the staging loop to a higher standard. I think I can simply flop the plywood over, and build the "s" needed to get from the helix to the throat. The throat should end up directly under the front edge of the yard frame seen in the shot above. Any thoughts?
Lee
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OK, take a deep breath. Let's take this in steps.
Are the problems more or less confined to one area, or is it a widespread issue?
If the debris theory is valid, then I'd think a thorough cleaning would be in order, followed by some methodical testing to zero in on the trouble spot(s).
I think a crawler (or something that lets you comfortably lie on your back under the layout) and a mirror might help you inspect things visually that can't be seen from above.
The desk went in last; can it be extricated without causing grave harm to anything else?
Is the yard that's built on top of it structurally integrated with the staging yard's plywood track support? This might offer some insight into options other than just tearing everything apart.
In retrospect, I should have brought the helix around another 1/4 turn, and placed the turnouts closer to the front edge, as I did on the east end in the original construction.
Hindsight is always perfect. I think I'd have reversed the direction of the helix, so it enters and exits at the front.
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Yeah, I'm with DKS. Let's slow down and diagnose the problem. Sure, it would have been better to bring the turnouts up front, but that might turn out to be a non-issue. Get back in there and clean out the funk. Could be as simple as a piece of sawdust from construction is between the rails or shoving the desk in there killed clearance for the trains. I don't think that you should consider tearing that section out until it turns out there is no other solution. Hopefully, worst case scenario is just replacing a piece of track that's gone bad. I say leave the yard alone and just correct the problem that is causing derailments.
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Yes, the desk can be structurally removed without major incident. The only issue there is the cabling to the little control box, which was already cut and reinstalled once, so I can manage doing it again. If it ends up getting moved again, I'm thinking it will be wise to install a multi pin plug, like a video monitor cable, so it can be more easily unplugged in the future.
No, I have not done a thorough inspection or run multiple tests with an engine or two, but I have tried to run a couple of trains through, and the problems became apparent that way. I will be doing that at some point in the near future.
Regarding working below the yard area, I think I can manage that with minimal disruption to what's there. One trick I can pull would be to temporarily suspend the front edge of the yard from the new light valance:
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-8PZy1zvxzoo/TeW1spPwD6I/AAAAAAAANkw/f15I0O_pbvI/s640/New%252520Weeklies%252520189.jpg)
I can use some temporary legs to prop up the back while I work my way down to pull out the staging loop. Now that I'm thinking of it, when the staging loop is out for revision, that would be an ideal time to build the yard and get it wired from below, since it will be unobstructed. I can then reconstruct the staging loop to a higher degree of quality and reliability, then slide it back underneath, connect the tracks at the base of the helix, and it's off to the races...
As for timing, I will try to get at least two of the tracks functional in their current location for the purpose of our planned session at the end of June, then when my wife goes to Florida in July with her girl scout troop, I'll make use of the time by doing the major structural work that will be needed.
It can be done. The east staging yard works very well because when I originally built it, I took my time to make sure everything was solid. When I rebuilt that, I was able to reconstruct the inbound throat with long switches, because it was accessible from the aisle. The west end was not as well thought out, nor as methodically constructed, and the simple fact is that I am now paying the price for those oversights.
Lee
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(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/Revised_West_Staging_Plan.JPG)
That's what I should have done in the first place... Now to plot out how to make it happen.
Lee
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Could you do a twist and turn, instead of a overhaul and flip? Just hack out the throat, pivot the whole shebang forward, and craft a new throat?
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Could you do a twist and turn, instead of a overhaul and flip? Just hack out the throat, pivot the whole shebang forward, and craft a new throat?
This actually an ingenious idea, if it comes to redesigning the west end. The problem will be getting to all of the screws holding that yard down to the benchwork. A right-angle drill with screw bit would be indispensable. If I remember correctly, though, the track was put down before the yard was installed, so the screws should all be exposed and not buried under track and cork.
DFF
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Here's the rub. When I laid the track down under, I used hot glue, which has turned out to be inadequate on many levels. Over time, it lets go of the plastic ties, And during installation, it dries so quickly the it created a few lumps that may be contributing to the problems I'm having now.
I also used a lot of well -worn salvaged track, and since then, I've gotten some much better quality new track that can replace the worst of the worst.
If I'm going to extend the efforts to fix the accessibility, I might as well go the distance and reinstall the track properly.
Lee
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Yikes. Three steps forward, two point nine back.
Hope you didn't assemble the helix that way...
...and if you did, is that at risk of possible failure, too?
May I suggest, if it is, then go the whole nine yards and reverse it. That would make life much easier on many levels (pun intended).
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Here is some accurate geometry for your consideration. Hope you have lots of left-hand switches...
(http://whiteriverandnorthern.net/images/west_staging_1.gif)
Larger: http://whiteriverandnorthern.net/images/west_staging_1.gif
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No the helix is the standard c-55 over cork installed with yellow carpenter's glue, just like most of the rest of the layout. The staging loop was the only hot glue experiment, probably because I didn't have $3 to get a bottle of yellow glue :P
The max width of the return loop will be the same 36". You've got 48" there. Also, I eliminated the crossover after the helix because it made the reverse circuit too short for the typical lashup. Left hand switches shouldn't be a problem.
I shall head up to the lab shortly to see if the stopgap repairs I made last night have held.
Lee
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The max width of the return loop will be the same 36". You've got 48" there.
Sorry, I was trying to follow your rough draft, and was having a bit of trouble. Will revise.
Update: Refresh the page, image has been replaced.
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While you're up... note that the lowest level of the helix extends beyond the 32" radius loop.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-LAtIMlBOvvI/TeW-f7oPfaI/AAAAAAAAN5I/eMvv092sMTk/s640/New%252520Weeklies.jpg)
Not by much, maybe 3". Hopefully this fact will help make the modification go a little more smoothly.
For ease of construction, the transition would begin at the end of the plywood there on the bottom rung.
Lee
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While you're up... note that the lowest level of the helix extends beyond the 32" radius loop.
Always a surprise lurking somewhere.
For ease of construction, the transition would begin at the end of the plywood there on the bottom rung.
May ease construction, but sure won't ease that S-turn...
Hey, ho...
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And one final thought... I think I'm going to kill the two track stub tracks, and just pull a single track toward the aisle to serve as the helper pocket. I don't see any viable way to bother using those tracks for ops otherwise.
I'm not worried about shortening the track lengths, either. The helix has proven to accommodate 25 car trains, max, so there's no point in having 40 car storage tracks as a minimum.
Lee
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OK, this is it for tonight. I have to go eat dinner....
(http://whiteriverandnorthern.net/images/west_staging_2.gif)
Be sure to hit refresh to see the latest.
http://whiteriverandnorthern.net/images/west_staging_2.gif
P.S. The shortest track is 11.5 feet long, which should be more than enough for a 25-car train.
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So tonight I ran some tests. First a couple of engines forward and backward through all the tracks, verified that all the turnouts are correctly wired vis a vis the diagram I did, so all that's fine. Ran a couple of cars through next, no obvious problems appeared.
While my fastidious side feels like I need to rip it out and do it "right", my "do it now" side is content with the tests. So far the things I'm focusing on is to add the legs and stiffeners it obviously needs... (the main problem appears to be stuff falling off the track if the benchwork gets jostled) and some simple rules about train length, train speed, and NO LIVE or Unsecured loads EVER down into the rabbit hole.
I may add some ballast and glue around inbound turnouts to keep them from shifting... damn Peco Snap Monsters... That could either help or cause more problems.
So anyway, tomorrow I'm going to close up the yard deck again, then run some more tests. We shall see...
Lee
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Is it possible to put the yard onto a piano hinge - to allow you to reach the lower area?
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That's an interesting idea, but the most difficult to reach parts are under the engine terminal, which needs to be pretty permanent. Also, the idea of clearing the yard out to raise it up doesn't appeal to me any more than crawling around under the layout...
Lee
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Would another turn or two in the helix be better? You could just keep the whole staging yard you have now and lower it another 2-4",
Phil
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That crossed my mind, too... The main obstacle there is maintaining clearance for the beer fridge...
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-4dJHk3tsYMQ/TXYeL3uxBgI/AAAAAAAAMsA/DR4tD6Vr8Mw/s640/Bridge%252520Article%252520033.jpg)
I mean, a guy's got to have his priorities straight!
;D ;D
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That crossed my mind, too... The main obstacle there is maintaining clearance for the beer fridge...
I mean, a guy's got to have his priorities straight!
;D ;D
I completely understand
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-2ZfjsnJovU0/TPO1YfuHWvI/AAAAAAAAC9Q/6U_8byrqElk/s400/IMAG0093.jpg)
Phil
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put the beer fridge in the other room
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Blaspheme! ;) No really, I don't want the staging yard any lower, and it will be easier to rebuild as David has shown than to add another twist or two to the helix.
Lee
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I would imagine that, as you contemplate yanking the current yard, you're thinking about ways to make it easier to remove in the future... such as, perhaps, attaching it to the benchwork from below, instead of above, so that it simply drops straight down. And perhaps adding a joint in the benchwork just west of the first throat switch, so the parts are smaller and easier to manage. Or some such.
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Guess I'll copy this over here to keep it a part of the "permanent record"...
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-xve-Qslgwso/TfZncNadYsI/AAAAAAAAOh0/tb6e_BkUyMs/s512/Peninsula%252520%2525284%252529.jpg)
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-IU_sEylwInA/TfZnru5nawI/AAAAAAAAOiU/rdyc5cS3128/s640/Peninsula%252520%2525288%252529.jpg)
Google Earth view of the peninsula. For comparison, here's a view of the old one from a similar angle...
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/Attic_004.jpg)
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I had a good shake down of the layout tonight, with just a couple of hitches. You can read about it at the bliggity blog.
http://wmrywesternlines.blogspot.com/2011/06/little-honey-then-little-vinegar.html
In the process of watching a variety of traffic roll through, I started thinking about the regular jobs that the layout will support. Here's a first stab at the list. Bold Face indicates a position requiring a throttle.
1. West End Dispatcher. This will be the most critical job on the layout, because the first order of business here, other than keeping traffic moving, is to keep it moving Safely! West Staging continues to be shrouded in mystery and doubts, but when it behaves, it works like a charm. Concentration and a steady hand will be the key to success on this job.
2. East End Dispatcher. Equally important in terms of traffic flow, and it will have its nuances, but the goal here is simply to release trains onto the layout, and put them away when they come back. In limited ops, this job may be combined with the yard operator, or perhaps the engine hostler since the trip to and from East Staging to the yard is relatively short.
3. Ridgeley Yard Master. This position will be the nerve center of the entire layout, doing the blocking and switching for all the locals, and setting up the pick ups and set outs for nearly all the through traffic. At one point or another, he'll see just about every train on the layout.
4. Elkins Yard Master. This position will also serve as the Thomas Sub Dispatcher, handling any movements from Maryland Junction up to Elkins. This is where much of the local traffic is generated, and there aren't the headaches of the through trains (other than the occasional coal extra going up or down) so it should be pretty fun.
5. Maryland Junction Operator/Mill Job Switcher. Brian Carhart. There, I said it.
6. Road Crews. There could be as many as three trains running the layout at a time, but odds are yard work and other obligations will restrict that to two at the most, plus whatever local business or coal might be drifting in. Figure two road crews at any given moment, since the throttles can do a little multi-tasking.
Those would be the basics to have a full ops session. As noted, the East Dispatcher could be combined with any of several positions, likely the West Dispatcher if we're short handed.
Others would be purely optional, such as:
Yard Clerk - to handle the paperwork of the yard
Brakeman/Conductors on locals to deal with car cards and waybills, and to direct the engineer.
Separate Local Crews Basically another engineer.
Hostler - to delegate power assignments to all trains changing power at Ridgeley.
So, who's signing up for what?
;D
Lee
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so is 6 your minimum required?
how may crews (trains) are starting off atthe top of each session (minimum).
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Still working out those details. Since I don't have all the mileage you've got, I'll try to keep it sparse. I think I could get by with a three man crew, but we'll all have to be on attention span supplements.
Ideally, there'd be a train in the yard ready to be dispatched, there would be cars to work at the paper mill, and cars would be blocked in the yard, ready for the first Alpha Jet to arrive from the east. That would be the three man set.
A four man set would be the above, plus a coal train to assemble and dispatch out of Elkins.
A five man set would be all of the above, plus a train released from West Staging, maybe just a grainer that would run all the way through, maybe with a power/caboose swap at Ridgeley.
The optimal 6 man set would be all of the above, with a floating dispatcher to direct traffic.
Lee
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yeah, i guess my question was 2 pronged...
1) if you have people there, you have the whole attention span issue/keeping people busy (at least somewhat) with jobs (after all, that's the point right?) which (for me) has been tricky.
2) if you have people there, how much space do you have for people to move. I had to ultimatley move my A/D tracks in Bellevue to the east to facilitate upper level operators. I have a space issue that i didnt consider in my track planning and honestly, it wasnt even a consideration at the time... I went from "casual dude who loves ta run trainz", to "what the hell is op's, i'll try it" and now I am "how to do Op's better because i kinda like it" mode. All the while, Operator comfort is never a concern (lol). My vision is that you have 4 people (perfect) or 6 people (ugh oh) to 7 or 8 (oh my, katie bar the door) crammed in there. So that was my only point... to consider the number of people needed, then where to stage those bodies, all whilst keeping the WM running efficiently.
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Sign me up for local crew. I'd say hostler too, but I am still tres novice with the DCC and would end up asking way too many questions and annoying those around me (not that I don't do that already).
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Sign me up for local crew. I'd say hostler too, but I am still tres novice with the DCC and would end up asking way too many questions and annoying those around me (not that I don't do that already).
it is even easier than my place... Lee's not running Digitrax... life is simple on the eastern shore in MANY ways... DCC being one of them.
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DCC throttles are just not (yet) intuitive. I guess I don't play enough (any) video games or use phone cue systems often enough.
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DCC throttles are just not (yet) intuitive. I guess I don't play enough (any) video games or use phone cue systems often enough.
I started with Digitrax in '98 with the superchief and the DT100 throttles.....those throttles were a giant PIA! You had to push a sequence of two buttons to get to the next command then two more buttons before having to dial the knobs to call up a loco or chip. I always had a hard time remembering the sequences. When the DT300 and DT400's came out, it was a godsend! Most all of the commands were done with a single push of one button.
For example: To MU two locos, you select the right throttle [or knob] by rotating it a bit, then punch in the LOCO [or chip] number with the number pad and hit the LOCO button again, it's then acquired. Then you can repeat that process for the second loco on the left knob. To MU them, you press the MU button and select the YES button and your ready with two locos on the one button.
Most of the commands are done that way, simple one button commands. Once you play with them for awhile, it gets easier. I've heard that the NCE controls are a little easier to use.
Now I haven't played with the DT402's yet as I have no need for any of the sound or special effects. I've kept my life simple so far. ;D
But the basic ops are relatively easy now. I just wish the screens were a little bigger.
Allen...
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The last ops session I was at - before the recent buildout - it was crowded with 6 people in there .. now that the layout has gotten bigger - I don't see how you can support all that .. the dispatcher has got to go .. into the other room - and maybe do both ends ..
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For example: To MU two locos, you select the right throttle [or knob] by rotating it a bit, then punch in the LOCO [or chip] number with the number pad and hit the LOCO button again, it's then acquired. Then you can repeat that process for the second loco on the left knob. To MU them, you press the MU button and select the YES button and your ready with two locos on the one button.
Wow that sounds awkward. Especially if you want to do more than 2 engines. Or set up a consist with one throttle and then run it with a different throttle.
Most of the commands are done that way, simple one button commands. Once you play with them for awhile, it gets easier. I've heard that the NCE controls are a little easier to use.
We use NCE at my club, and it's pretty straightword.
To select a single engine, just hit "Select Loco" and punch in the address of the engine (if the layout owner has any sense, it'll be the same as the number painted on the model).
To select a consist that's already set up, just do the above with the number of the lead engine, or you can punch in the consist address instead (if you know it).
And running is easy. Faster, Slower, Reverse.
Setting up a consist is pretty straightforward too. "Setup consist", enter an address for the consist, then enter all the engine numbers and directions. You can consist as many engines as you want really quickly.
And for newbies, just get someone to help you set up the consist if required (any train from staging should already be set up in advance of the session) and once that's set up, you're off to the races.
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The last ops session I was at - before the recent buildout - it was crowded with 6 people in there .. now that the layout has gotten bigger - I don't see how you can support all that .. the dispatcher has got to go .. into the other room - and maybe do both ends ..
John's right. When I read earlier about the suggestion of a six-person minimum for ops on the WM, I thought to myself that Lee's train room is a six-person maximum at best, or else operators will be tripping over each other. That new peninsula, as evidenced by Lee's recent before and after pictures, really cut down aisle width around the new yard.
In other words, thankfully, there's no room for Steve to sit behind me, annoying the sh*t out of me, while he's reading a magazine rather than being helpful during an ops session. (There exists photographic evidence of this ops session.) I finally gave him a throttle to get him to move. ;)
DFF
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Wow that sounds awkward. Especially if you want to do more than 2 engines. Or set up a consist with one throttle and then run it with a different throttle.
To select a single engine, just hit "Select Loco" and punch in the address of the engine (if the layout owner has any sense, it'll be the same as the number painted on the model).
To select a consist that's already set up, just do the above with the number of the lead engine, or you can punch in the consist address instead (if you know it).
Actually the way you described it [I probably didn't describe it eloquently as you did] is pretty much the same way. Sounds like NCE might be a step or two quicker. But it's pretty much the same thing.
As for more than two units, you just keep calling up the next engine and add them to the consist. The DT400 has two knobs on the same throttle, this way you can have the consist on one knob/throttle and use the other knob/throttle to call up the second, third or more locos on the same DT400 and keep adding the units. Once their setup, you just need to dial up the lead unit or the first loco in the consist. Of course you need to make sure their all running in the same direction before consisting them.
Once the consist is made, you can "DISPATCH" [the consist is made up, then is released so anyone can dial it up] the consist so anyone else can dial up the lead loco or consist number with his/her own throttle, or anyone can "STEAL" the consist by dialing up the lead number and it will show "STEAL??", then you just press "Y" and away you go.
It really doesn't sound much different, other than a few keystrokes or pushes of the buttons.
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.. the dispatcher has got to go .. into the other room - and maybe do both ends ..
I'm surprised no one mentioned how awkward that sounded too.
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Well, one thing you'll notice in the new configuration is that there is actually MORE floor space to work with. The larger layout actually allows more of the ancillary crap to be stored out of harm's way, plus, the work bench, which once commandeered about 25% of the room, is now out in the other room. This was a MAJOR consideration of the redesign. All of the yard clerkin' and dispatch work can be done by people sitting on the one side, with plenty of room for the yard master to work the throats. (Does this edge up there with the "working both ends" comment?)
The only real choke point might be conflicts between the Elkins operator and the west end of Ridgeley, but given the lighter density of work at Elkins, this could feasibly be the same person.
Here's the track plan (more or less) as a reference.
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/upper_levelweb.jpg)
Also, let's not forget that the last time we had a real mob up there, we were still working around a lot of Andy's furniture, toys, and probably Andy too. The aisles are all very accommodating, even of us full figured N scalers.
As for DCC, Digitrax continues to confound me. I have MRC prodigy advance, which follows the same simple protocols as NCE. About the only head scratcher is why you have to reset the speed steps to 128 every time you call up a new locomotive. But that's simple enough anyway. Maybe the newer versions have a way to set 128 as a default. (Maybe mine does too, only it's shrouded in that mysterious booklet that came with it...)
Anyway, one goal will be to tidy up the workbench area on the other side of the door to create a more inviting crew lounge, that done, I think a max crew of 8 with a few rotations will work out fine. I don't want to put the dispatcher in the next room, because that would require either a significant systems upgrade, or a cable to carry the necessary communications to a remote control panel. Plus, even when I'm dispatching, I like to watch the trains too.
It may come to pass that I can have an A crew and B crew, so I can have more ops sessions with more people.
Lee
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Having been in the room after the penninsula build-out, and with some of the yard/staging benchwork on the "right" side in place, I am not worried about the space issues. Ed will be largely confined to the visible yard, Brian will likely be stationary on the paper mill, and there is enough room for four or five other engineers to run the rest of Lee's trains as he has outlined them.
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Yes, but just to make sure, we'll be stocking diet shakes in the fridge instead of beer... :o
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Yes, but just to make sure, we'll be stocking diet shakes in the fridge instead of beer... :o
Those mix well with Vodka....
Best wishes, Dave
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After two nights of successful multi train operations, I decided to bite the bullet and start installing the yard. Tonight I got the switches in for the back half of the class yard. I decided to run the piano wire actuators to the front edge of the deck, where I've installed some Caboose Industries throws temporarily. I've got some slide switches around somewhere, but couldn't put my hands on them tonight. With all the throws located along the edge, they'll be easy enough to replace. Ultimately the frogs will all get wired, and there will be a secondary bus line to tie the slide switches in.
I've also still got to run power to the round house tracks in order to make the engine terminal fully functional. The A/D tracks and ET ready tracks are all working, but there are a couple of dead spots that will need drops, too.
I'll try to pop some pictures tomorrow once the glue dries.
Lee
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(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-8jGJHp2E_sQ/Tf1xj8mh2VI/AAAAAAAAOko/VmQOSSr-fv4/s640/Ridgeley%252520Yard%252520East%252520%2525281%252529.jpg)
The east yard throat.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-da1yts5Ejj4/Tf1xfcecYfI/AAAAAAAAOjc/ZgNho03SSJo/s640/Ridgeley%252520Yard%252520East%252520%2525283%252529.jpg)
viewed from the west.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-GUU7eYmNEKg/Tf1xnZmyjFI/AAAAAAAAOlc/BS7f9l0ZxlQ/s640/Ridgeley%252520Yard%252520East%252520%2525284%252529.jpg)
...and suddenly, filled with cars!
The drill track out to the fold down section worked brilliantly, save for a few underweight talgo mounted cars, and the temporary switch throws may just work out to be more or less permanent. There are a couple of turnouts that definitely need the frogs powered on, mainly in the single track at the turntable, which handles all yard traffic at one time or another.
Once all the drops are in, I can bet that Ed (who serves as my yard master during ops sessions) will have one of those four-hour erections they talk about in those pill commercials...
Lee
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Worked out the west throat this evening. Tomorrow I'll work on getting it installed. I've got #7's on hand to employ here, so it shortens the shorter outside tracks quite a bit, dropping them down to about 30" The middle tracks are still nice and long, but it might be trickier to work the yard from both ends... we'll see.
I've got some tortoise installations on the west end that are going to be absolute bears... I may end up disassembling the plate over the helix to do the job... not pretty.
Also not until after the 26th...
Lee
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So will you be needing those ballast cars of cinders before the 26th? I can have my agent expedite shipping . . . . .
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No, not yet. Ed's got me on strict orders not to ballast anything until he gives the yard a thorough sniff test.
I'm surprised I haven't heard from him yet...
Lee
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(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-8jGJHp2E_sQ/Tf1xj8mh2VI/AAAAAAAAOko/VmQOSSr-fv4/s640/Ridgeley%252520Yard%252520East%252520%2525281%252529.jpg)
The east yard throat.
Lee
Lee, on the right set of bowl tracks, it looks as though you used a LH TO in lieu of the RH you had marked there. Is that just temporary until the couch cushions have been shaken out again? ;)
It looks like the geometry will be much more reliable and efficient if the RH is used.
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Lee, on the right set of bowl tracks, it looks as though you used a LH TO in lieu of the RH you had marked there. Is that just temporary until the couch cushions have been shaken out again? ;)
It looks like the geometry will be much more reliable and efficient if the RH is used.
I agree the Feng Shui looks a little botched up with the LH opposed to a RH switch.
The S.
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The only real choke point might be conflicts between the Elkins operator and the west end of Ridgeley, but given the lighter density of work at Elkins, this could feasibly be the same person.
Here's the track plan (more or less) as a reference.
I run at a buddies layout that has the same issue as you do at Elkins. He makes sure that job is done during one of the lulls in the sessions. Depending on the crew and the size, sometimes the job is the first one assigned, or the last one.
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(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-8jGJHp2E_sQ/Tf1xj8mh2VI/AAAAAAAAOko/VmQOSSr-fv4/s640/Ridgeley%252520Yard%252520East%252520%2525281%252529.jpg)
Lee,
You need to reverse that right-left-right hand turnout you've got going on on the tracks in the middle (tracks 6 & 7 counting up from the aisle). The yard will constantly derail there. If anything, I would suggest removing or shortening tremendously the curve coming out of the turnout at the bottom (the end is just appearing in the photo) and go with two right hand turnouts in a compound ladder. I would hate to be the one to operate the yard if the throat in its current configuration is maintained,
Phil
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Like this?
(http://whiteriverandnorthern.net/images/rye_rev.jpg)
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Like this?
(http://whiteriverandnorthern.net/images/rye_rev.jpg)
Precisely,
Phil
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Good news, everybody... I've got a RH switch to correct the offending S turn. I wanted to make sure I had everything I needed in order to work on the West End, which I did today...
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-Cfseii5MB8o/TgAEv8-XDVI/AAAAAAAAOpk/dGaB9Z_UpVA/s640/Ridgeley%252520West%252520End.jpg)
For now, the LH will remain in place. All of the turnouts are #7's, and so far, in the process of bumping a few cars through here, I haven't had any problems. The only cars that presented a risk were the trailer flats and auto racks, so I'll have to change it sooner or later to make sure the yard provides optimal flexibility.
Here's an overview of the whole mess...
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-IVIblzaHs0w/TgAMRPKbVSI/AAAAAAAAOp4/9Q19RcDLkjA/s640/Ridgeley%252520West%252520End%252520%2525282%252529.jpg)
You can see the replacement turnout laying over the errant left hander...
Lee
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Lee, I'm jealous, your yard is shaping up to be larger than my entire layout will be! :'( Everything looks great aside from that one pesky left hand turnout. Also, that's quite an impressive roundhouse! Is it scratchbuilt?
--Jake
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Lee, I'm jealous, your yard is shaping up to be larger than my entire layout will be! :'( Everything looks great aside from that one pesky left hand turnout. Also, that's quite an impressive roundhouse! Is it scratchbuilt?
--Jake
Kind of... It's an amalgam of about 4 Union City roundhouses, which provided the floor plates, the skeleton and the roof panels. The sides and back walls will all be customized to look more like Hagerstown.
Lee
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(http://whiteriverandnorthern.net/images/rye_rev.jpg)
Excellent work Smithers.
-Mr. Burns
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Nice work- I like the tanks defending the east end. Talk about railroad security.
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While everyone is up at Hershey enjoying theyself, I toil away on the yard, lettering passenger cars, and generally cleaning up the train room.
I'm stuck on the whole RH curved c55 turnout... Eric offered one to me, but last time I was there I forgot to put it in my pocket... Grrr. Oh well, we can still work part of the yard.
Back to the attic!
Lee
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While everyone is up at Hershey enjoying theyself, I toil away on the yard, lettering passenger cars, and generally cleaning up the train room.
I'm stuck on the whole RH curved c55 turnout... Eric offered one to me, but last time I was there I forgot to put it in my pocket... Grrr. Oh well, we can still work part of the yard.
Back to the attic!
Lee
Since I am going out that way on Saturday want me to pick you up a switch?
The S.
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Thanks, Tim, but I finally broke down and ordered one. Maybe it'll be here by Saturday... maybe it won't!
Sooner or later I had to pay for SOMETHING on this damn layout!!
Lee
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Finished the body of the yard tonight, including replacement of the dreaded left hand switch in the east end throat. Just waiting by the mailbox for the missing link...
Lee
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(http://whiteriverandnorthern.net/images/waiting.jpg)
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(image removed)
+1!
;D
The S.
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Thanks, Tim, but I finally broke down and ordered one. Maybe it'll be here by Saturday... maybe it won't!
Sooner or later I had to pay for SOMETHING on this damn layout!!
Lee
LOL cool. As an aside I'm bringing my Dad with me aka "Easy Rider", as penance I will bring some suds. He needs to see some N Scale in action and learn about DCC.
The S.
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I'll make room in the driveway for the Harley. Are you driving the GPW down?
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HA yeah I'll get there sometime next year if I did, gotta remember the top-end on the GPW is 40-45mph, 30-35 cruising. :P I'll be bringing the BattleWagon (FJ). Trying to wrap up the brain transplant on the Super-Berk but it wont be painted, if I'm really lucky the lights will be complete. May have a B&Y business car for the parade depending on the Berk. Still bringing the PA's with assorted B&O/C&O power.
I think I had you at "suds" to be honest ;)
The S.
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You always have me at "suds"... ;D
Andy's dying to meet the GPW. He had a good US history class this year, and is all about killin' dirty nazzies...
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Here's the latest from Ridgeley Yard...
The west end is laid out, all the turnouts are functional, and the drops from the yard track are all wired in.
and now a few details:
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-qyZ9dFeLCws/TgQFdj6H1uI/AAAAAAAAPAw/tGoS7pDtIfs/s640/New%252520Weeklies%252520002.jpg)
The two stub tracks (I think they're 10 and 11) will be detailed as a piggy back ramp/auto rack reload. The driveway will follow around to the left, cross the main switch lead, then off to a storage lot in the fifth dimension.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-33ONNlhw_CQ/TgQGLVw44kI/AAAAAAAAPA4/ySLJNw-_AcU/s640/New%252520Weeklies%252520006.jpg)
An overview of the new work and its juxtaposition to the rest of the terminal. Notice how you almost don't notice the slide switch throws there to the right...
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-1ouuxzVqKqI/TgQG3lea8hI/AAAAAAAAPA8/f1UwNfPZTiQ/s640/New%252520Weeklies%252520007.jpg)
Here's a look from the east with the yard trackage now complete
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-9JK9SyM_8gg/TgQG5T_J_KI/AAAAAAAAPBA/0seRQFfhuzs/s640/New%252520Weeklies%252520008.jpg)
...and yes, I replaced the #@$*& turnout! And yes, it works a whole lot more smoothly.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-1i2hW0Ctrlw/TgQG8FOhx0I/AAAAAAAAPBI/4xWHO6FgKnc/s640/New%252520Weeklies%252520010.jpg)
Finally, an Alpha Jet is lined up on the A/D track, ready to head east to Lurgan and the Reading interchange...
Lee
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Looks great. I agree, those slide switches nearly disappear into the background compared to the Caboose throws. Is it a rigid wire you use to throw with the switch, or is it a more complex mechanism?
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Pretty much just a wire. Sometimes I have to bend a little spring into it, but other wise it's just a straight shot.
I found some switches on line that have just about the perfect amount of travel to throw Atlas switches.
Lee
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Great, thanks for the details. I think I am going to try that in my yard as a temporary measure. I have been using springs made of stiff wire to lock the points, but I find they can interfere with the coupler trip pins, and I also want to power my frogs.
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(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-qyZ9dFeLCws/TgQFdj6H1uI/AAAAAAAAPAw/tGoS7pDtIfs/s640/New%252520Weeklies%252520002.jpg)
You can sort of see what I've done in this shot. I take my Dremel and rout a channel into the plywood surface, wherein the wire is placed. This is useful as it allows me to curve the route of the wire if needed. I then take a piece of masking tape, cut a thin slice to put over the channel sticky side up, then cover that with another piece to hold it in place. The sticky side up bit is to prevent the adhesive from binding up the wire should it slip out of the groove.
Anyhoo, this gives me a nominally smooth surface to put scenery material on, and keeps the scenery glue from infiltrating the channel for the wire. I'll try to snap some close ups tonight to illustrate the process.
Lee
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Very nice, Lee.
Don't you hate it when the Asshats are right? ;)
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It makes me proud to be an a$$hat!
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Better ;D
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Dammit, Jim! Ebay vendor cancelled sale, I assume the reason is out of stock. Are there any RH c55 curved turnouts available anywhere on the planet? I just want to finish my yard!!!
(http://www.freevector.com/site_media/thumbs/preview_images/FreeVector-Anger_jpg_646x0_max_q95.jpg)
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I got an unused, open box one, but I'll warn that it's one of the problem children from Atlas. I used it to show them this:
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-0XVjoiJZ5bU/TRmFeIImxpI/AAAAAAAAF0w/hHp3hbCIUB4/s800/DSC_0135.JPG)
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-Ihr0s3cQ6IQ/TRmFenSVmdI/AAAAAAAAF00/lXX1dxUhrzY/s800/DSC_0136.JPG)
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-E5ysXZgxq-g/TRmFeztHOqI/AAAAAAAAF04/rwcRLIle3X8/s800/DSC_0137.JPG)
I'm not going to take the time to tune it up so if you'd like it or just can't find one elsewhere, PM me.
Jason
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Last night I splashed a quick coat of paint and some scenery material around the yard.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-94pIUeJ_l5o/TgfS1FB5FXI/AAAAAAAAPFk/votZPkTMZRo/s640/New%252520Weeklies%252520007.jpg)
That's Phil's GEVO, idling there at Ridgeley while WM 23 gathers some cars for the next interchange run.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-8Ct6_sYeZQc/TgfSz_eKg0I/AAAAAAAAPFg/7PFXAxsVpHo/s640/New%252520Weeklies%252520006.jpg)
I still have to add the cinders and what not, but that will come sooner or later. Probably after the turnout arrives for the west end.
Had a nice run with the boys today. Now that this little shake down is out of the way, I can get started on finishing up the wiring (especially around the engine terminal) and installing the remaining switch machines I need to add.
The next big push on scenery will be the Cumberland area.
At this point I think it's appropriate to offer a word of thanks to all the members here who have had a hand in making today possible. As most of you know, the economy has really taken a toll on my family, and being able to keep working on the layout has been a blessing beyond measure. I guess to some extent it's been a good hiding place, but it's also been very therapeutic, and a good way to mark progress on a lot of things, not just the trains themselves.
Anyway, for all of you who helped out, my gratitude knows no bounds.
John, whose layout and approach to the hobby has been an inspiration since the first day I washed up on your doorstep... what is it, 8 years ago?
Dave Foxx, Phil Hoffman, Ed Kapuscinski, Brian Carhart, Bob Bufkin, Carl Tweedale and Tim Alder, my regular crew, who were instrumental in making the jump from the old layout to the new, and who have contributed countless hours and 6 packs to the cause.
David K. Smith, who puts it all into an image that's worth a thousand hours of labor saved... and whose creativity and innovations continue to push me forward.
Jerry Britton, for getting out of N Scale, and showering me with surplus track. There needs to be bronze plaque on the layout somewhere for you, Jerry. Literally, the layout expansion would not have happened if not for your kindness.
Bryan at ESM and Craig at Bluford, who helped me pull off the hopper car project last year that financed much of the project.
Eric Payne, Dave Vollmer and so many others who have asked the right questions at the right moments to make me think my way out of various corners, whether they involved scenery, operations or what have you.
Thanks also to Victor Miranda, who helped dig me out of a couple of steam loco situations along the way.
Jason, Mike, Gary Hinshaw, Phil, Tim, Ed, John, Bob, and so many others who were happy to dip into their junk boxes to pull out whatever salvage I needed to finish this project or that. I've got plenty of leftovers that I hope one day to "pay forward".
So, onward and upward. Now that most of the railroad is in place, I suppose it's time to start editing those old car cards and way bills!
Lee
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Long views of the yard with scenery.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-0nAG_Gxk30w/Tgf4tbjMZDI/AAAAAAAAPHI/53M3pMOrgPE/s640/Yard%252520Scenery%252520%2525283%252529.jpg)
East end looking west.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-8tstT0xs1sg/Tgf4uaNbodI/AAAAAAAAPHM/PeaOiYDTpc8/s640/Yard%252520Scenery.jpg)
West end looking east.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-59ekVNMZ8-0/Tgf4RVuLl_I/AAAAAAAAPHQ/jyUGnU-K55w/s640/Yard%252520Scenery%252520%2525282%252529.jpg)
Ed's office.
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Lee,
you get what you give, and I think all of us are grateful for your wisdom and needling. Both keep me on top of my game.
As to the yard, I think you need to put down the cinders, add the odd weed and stray coupler hose, install that last phantom turnout, and call it good.
And a better sign entering the helix under the yard throat would probably help. As we learned yesterday, I still don't know my left from my right.
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As a point of reference, here's the same view about 5 years ago...
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/Layout_Pics_062.jpg)
:D
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:ee
I might have a rh curved but it's a Peco code 80 not 55 if you want it and I can find where I put it.
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I've got an open, unused Atlas C55 RH curved turnout that you can have, but I've got a strong suspicion that it's the same vintage as Jason's. I've done some limited testing on it, and I haven't noticed any problems, but there's only so much testing that I can do when it's not connected to anything. If you're interested, PM me, and I can either mail it or I can bring it next month.
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Add the Postman to the list of thank you's...
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-7fH9MvTSRI0/TgkDva7DxoI/AAAAAAAAPIE/oMsX_NAyUvM/s512/Final%252520Turnout%252520%2525281%252529.jpg)
Arrived around 3 p.m., and by 4:30 it was installed, tuned up, and BL-2 82 was happily dragging cars back and forth through it.
Thanks, Jason!!
On to the car cards and waybills!
Lee
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Spent the evening doing some classifying... It felt just like the first time.
;D
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Now we're singing Foreigner songs?
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We'll give you a few minutes to yourself . . . ;)
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We'll give you a few minutes to yourself . . . ;)
1-2 tops. ;D
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...and I'm going to do it again tonight!
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ironically... I too am classifying... my basement is currently turned upside down and i need to et it back in order...
i guess it is time to update my thread
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I can't tell you how pleasing it is to have more yard tracks than potential destinations... Sheer nirvana. :-* Ed's not going to know how to act.
I've created a killer card sorting system, too. I'll have to take pictures tomorrow, since Andy already threw me out of the room for the night (his bed may not be in the same room, but he still gets to control the layout schedule)
Anyway, those acrylic "J" racks I showed the crew Sunday are perfect. I've got one that's long enough to hold all 11 stacks of cards. Since the rack is clear, you can see right through to the card you're looking for. I took a black Sharpie to add the track numbers, then I can use a dry erase marker to note the destination of each track being sorted. Concerned about maintaining access to the seventh level of the inferno under the yard, I placed the rack up on top of the light valence, where it fits perfectly, and it puts all the cards right at eye level... at least for me... (Ed might have to stand on a box, or wear my old disco shoes). There's also room for an identical second rack, in case the east end is being worked at the same time the west is. The only cost is access to the handy little shelf that appeared as part of the light valance.
As I said, stay tuned for images so you can see what these thousand words are going on about.
Lee
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Pictures to go with the words...
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-v72y63N2njo/Tgx4YJ5tAOI/AAAAAAAAPIo/XaOD--zgg3Q/s640/Card%252520Box.jpg)
Overview of the card box
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-l3SOiMKU2us/Tgx4Z_H-RuI/AAAAAAAAPIs/px3QZaWJ7qM/s640/Card%252520Box%252520%2525281%252529.jpg)
Close up showing classification marks. This should greatly enhance the efficiency of the yard.
Lee
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Pictures to go with the words...
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-v72y63N2njo/Tgx4YJ5tAOI/AAAAAAAAPIo/XaOD--zgg3Q/s640/Card%252520Box.jpg)
Overview of the card box
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-l3SOiMKU2us/Tgx4Z_H-RuI/AAAAAAAAPIs/px3QZaWJ7qM/s640/Card%252520Box%252520%2525281%252529.jpg)
Close up showing classification marks. This should greatly enhance the efficiency of the yard.
Lee
looks good
the problem wil be getting the Yardmaster to:
1) use the system
2) block cars (although he does have space in your yard to do that, vs... mine, which is a bit snugger. So he just might. ;D)
I have heard that blocking cars tends to help in Op's. or, conversly, not blocking them makes things more fun (depending on your definition of fun).
EP
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I have heard that blocking cars tends to help in Op's. or, conversly, not blocking them makes things more fun (depending on your definition of fun).
Yes, not only blocking by town, but also blocking by industry. I can't tell you how annoying it is on the layout I operate on to get to a town and have not only cars scattered throughout the town in my train, but also the industries scattered as well. Also, blocking by industry would let one quickly realize if there aren't enough spots for the cars instead of trying to cram it all in,
Phil
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Yes, not only blocking by town, but also blocking by industry. I can't tell you how annoying it is on the layout I operate on to get to a town and have not only cars scattered throughout the town in my train, but also the industries scattered as well. Also, blocking by industry would let one quickly realize if there aren't enough spots for the cars instead of trying to cram it all in,
Phil
preach the TRUTH
ask John Hale and Tim Nixon about this!
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One solution would be to bust the yard master down to conductor on a couple of locals, let him be hoist on his own pitard so to speak... Just because you like to run a yard, doesn't mean you'll always get to! ;)
As for blocking, I've got a couple of advantages. One, the major traffic generator, the paper mill, will receive cars from Elkins as well as Ridgeley, and the Ridgeley traffic might come from a regular local, or from the dedicated Luke Digger. The other advantage is that there is a dedicated mill switcher that sorts it all out on the ground there, so while it's nice to have it all blocked, it's not crucial if it's not.
Most of the other local traffic is located along the Thomas Sub, which has a scheduled local in each direction, so whatever traffic can't be efficiently worked in one direction can be left for the crew coming the other way.
The bulk of the work in the yard involves sorting cars for the various through trains. The trick here isn't just getting the cars into an eastbound train, but rather getting into the RIGHT eastbound train etc.
Still, if the yardmaster got to "walk a mile" in the shoes of the grunts out on the line, he might be a little more sensitive to the work he's doing in the yard... Just sayin'
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Lee, excellent points. There are about 5 guys that rotate through the 3 yards (one's a passenger terminal) on the pike I operate on. If this one guy is working either of the freight yards, I try to draw locals originating from his yard, otherwise, I'll attempt to get through and passenger trains. Also, they do rotate the guys out onto the road, just like you are suggesting about once every 5 or 6 operating sessions,
Phil
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preach the TRUTH
ask John Hale and Tim Nixon about this!
Where would be the challenge in switching Tucker if all the trains were blocked? ::)
Heck, even Ed could do that! :P
Tim
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Where would be the challenge in switching Tucker if all the trains were blocked? ::)
Heck, even Ed could do that! :P
Tim
Well it's not like Ed knows how to block a train, so it should be fairly easy for him.
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TESTIFY!
But seriously folks...
I can see where cars can be blocked by destination, but blocking them by industry would be a luxury the yard doesn't always have time to afford.
That's why at heavy switching areas, like Thomas, the paper mill and ultimately Cumberland, there are a couple of "yard" tracks on site to facilitate blocking by the local crew. With few exceptions, the other locations at least have a run around track to work with.
So, as long as all the cars bound for Thomas, North Junction, or Luke are grouped together, the crew can shuffle around the facing points and trailing point moves.
I worked for about 3 hours last night, I've got about 1/3 of the cars on the layout bagged and tagged now. It's taking longer because I have a bunch of cars that I've accumulated over the past two years that lack cards, a few that needed to be re-numbered, and a bunch of waybills that had to be edited to change destinations to places that are actually on the layout now.
I'm figuring that by the time Eric and Phil show up on the 18th, it should all be blocked and ready to run.
Lee
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Blocking by location is a big help (IMO)... blocking by industry is a luxury.
of course, my pike has Yard issues with space... so Ed get's a quasi free pass... for now. ;)
On the flip side, ithink it takes a special person to step up and have the desire to operate a Yard. I don't have any experience in Op's (very limited) and have observed that usually when given a choice, people back away from it. It takes a certain desire for punishment IMO.
We have had Ed out on the main before... he does fine out there if i recall correctly. We just like to lock him in the Yard and pound him for more trains and block his main's.
I think thee is a shirt slogan there with Ed's face.... Maybe a royal Blue shirt we can all wear... with a pic of Ed and in Conrail font with a caption "This is Ed. We pound him for trains, and block up his Mains".
;D
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(http://whiteriverandnorthern.net/images/pound_me.gif)
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that's what I'm talkin' about!
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More classifying... Goddam I have a lot of freight cars :P But we're getting there.
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Having read Gary's discussion of available floor space, crew size etc., and also having spent the last few evenings giving the yard a workout, I'm re-thinking my crew size and available jobs. Last time we got to a minimum of 6. Let's see how it slices down now.
Yard - can function with a single operator.
Dispatcher - can double as yard clerk and/or a road crew.
Road crew - to handle traffic in and out of staging
Local crew - can handle Thomas Sub, paper mill, or North Junction.
This will suffice to keep traffic flowing at a reasonable pace, prevent the short main line from getting jammed up, and give the yard plenty of time to work the trains coming and going.
A fifth operator can be utilized to pump a little more life into the Thomas Sub, working the coal mines and Elkins.
A sixth operator can be posted at the paper mill, which will actually be an important component in keeping things flowing through Maryland Junction.'
So we can get away with four, have more fun at 5, and be fully staffed at 6.
-
Dispatcher - can double as yard clerk and/or a road crew.
have you considered having the dispatcher be a dedicated position? that way troubleshooting (answering questions), paperwork (planned and extra trains) and other gremlins could be addressed?
EP
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Yeah, but until I'm comfortable that everyone's familiar with running in and out of west staging, I'll have a throttle at the ready to take over at least that part of the trip. Sort of like a qualified pilot bringing a ship into port ;)
I'm sure as familiarity increases, I'll be able to let go a little more. That being said, I still want to run trains now and again!!
lee
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That being said, I still want to run trains now and again!!
lee
yea .. after everyone is done and gone .. you get to restage every thing :)
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I think I've only got two "regular" trains left to card, then I'll start on the massive hopper fleet.
Does anyone have any thoughts on car routing for coal hoppers efficiently? I mean, block waybills, that sort of thing? I've got some ideas I'm kicking around, but nothing's really becoming obvious.
With a fleet of over 100 cars and a multitude of possible destinations on and off the layout, the idea of thumbing through train loads of cards is going to be mind numbing.
Lee
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Mine blocks - run them as unit trains - just put the cards together with a rubber band ...
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That would work in some circumstances, such as the Laurel Valley cars coming down from Rockwood and getting combined with WM coal for the trip to Port Covington.
Other blocks would head to various steel mills, power plants, and of course, the several on-line users...
I'll tease it out a little and see where it takes me.
Lee
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Ran a legit local last night and switched the paper mill for the first time in eons. Added a rack to aid the operator there with card sorting, and thinking about how I might be able to install click pen switch mechanisms in the mill complex. Giant caboose throws and chubby fingers have taken their toll on some of the scenery in there.
The sorting and tagging of coal hoppers will commence shortly.
Lee
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Perhaps you, Eric, and I can sort mine blocks in a couple of weeks.
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not sure how prototypical you are going.... do you have a scale track somewhere???
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Mine blocks - run them as unit trains - just put the cards together with a rubber band ...
My buddy runs his coal trains (19 cars) as one "unit." They all get sent different places on and off the visable layout, but he decided that one card for each 19 car chunk was easier to handle for the crews, and easier on his printer. ;)
-
Perhaps you, Eric, and I can sort mine blocks in a couple of weeks.
I'm down.
-
Last night I pulled the first coal train into the yard. I had already blocked a few hoppers for the locals, so it's starting to come into focus a little. But I'll be breaking things down a little further. Here's the breakdown I've come up with so far:
Coal Extras
(Train Symbol = Road Number of Lead Unit)
Connellsville Sub:
GREY TRAIN: Eastbound. Originates at Somerset, PA on the Laurel Valley, also picks up at Blue Lick at Meyersdale (all off layout). Consists of Laurel Valley and WM hoppers, usually with Laurel Valley power through to Ridgeley.
FAIRMONT EXTRA: Eastbound. Originates Fairmont, WV(B&O) via Bowest Jct. and the Connellsville line. Consists of WM and B&O hoppers. May include B&O power through to Ridgeley.
ELKINS EXTRA: Eastbound. Originates at Elkins, with coal from the WM’s local lines in WV, as well as cars from Thomas. WM hoppers, WM power through to Ridgeley.
Eastbound from Ridgeley:
ALLENTOWN EXTRA: Eastbound. Originates Ridgeley, with cars bound for Bethlehem Steel at Allentown. Usually includes cars from Fairmont.
PHILADELPHIA EXTRA: Eastbound. Originates Ridgeley, with cars bound for Philadelphia Power electric generation plants. Soft coal from the Grey Train, WM and Laurel Valley
BALTIMORE EXTRA: Eastbound. Originates Ridgeley, with cars bound for Baltimore Gas and Electric generation plants. Soft coal from the Grey Train, WM and Laurel Valley
PORT COVINGTON EXTRA: Eastbound. Originates Ridgeley, with cars bound for Port Covington for export. All 55 and 66 ton cars due to limitations at the rotary dumper. Cars from the Thomas Sub.
Westbound from Ridgeley: (loads)
PITTSBURGH EXTRA: Westbound. Originates Ridgeley, coal for US Steel and other manufacturers via Connellsville/PLE connection. Small numbers of cars may be added to BT-1. Train also includes ore loads from Port Covington.
Westbound from Ridgeley: (MT)
FAIRMONT EXTRA: Westbound. Originates Allentown (East Staging) proceeds through to West Staging.
GREY EXTRA: Westbound: Originates Philadelphia and Baltimore, combined at Ridgeley. WM Power into Ridgeley, LRV power west to Rockwood Jct. (West Staging)
ELKINS EXTRA: Westbound: Originates Port Covington, Baltimore, Allentown etc. Combined at Ridgeley with cars for Shaw, Thomas, Elkins and points beyond. Also includes westbound ore movements bound for Pittsburgh.
Obviously, all that blocking could occupy the yard for an entire session, so I'll have to winnow it down a bit. Also, if blocks of cars can be condensed to say 5-6 car units, then some of the movements could be tacked onto other trains, such as the Allentown cars can go with an Alpha Jet bound for Lurgan. It will take some time to get it all straight. One thought might be to set up an entire session based on only coal movements, but that might get dull...
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One advantage of all this sorting and waybilling is the opportunity to inspect and fix up some of the rolling stock. Last night I also loaded a couple of auto racks, and body mounted their couplers.
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/New_Weeklies_008.jpg)
I was having trouble with the truck mounts buckling going down the helix. The Santa Fe car was done by Dave Foxx with the body mounts, and it's worked fine over the whole layout, so hopefully equipping all the racks this way will make some of the bumps go away.
Lee
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Thanks for the props, Lee. It's very easy to install body-mounts on both the MT auto racks and flat cars. There is a plastic piece that the corner stirrups are molded into that snaps into place on the bottom ends of the car. Pop that out and drill and tap a hole to accept the coupler box. Install the coupler and snap the part back in place. You do have to cut off and file the screw, so it does not project through the part, or it will not snap back into the car body. This installation prevents having a visible screw penetrating the flat car or auto rack deck.
If I remember correctly, you must use an undermount coupler, but then it matches the height gauge perfectly. Although my layouts don't allow me to run 100 car (i.e., really "heavy") trains, I have never had the part pop out under load.
DFF
P.S. Oh yeah, in case anyone's wondering, I used to run that very ATSF auto rack on the Virginia Central, before I gave the car to Lee. It ran well with body-mounted couplers even on the VC's minimum radius of sub-13" curves! I once even tested it with an IM two-bay hopper (with body-mounts) as the next car. Despite the extreme difference in the lengths of those cars, they ran reliably.
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Last night I pulled the first coal train into the yard.
Oh, no, you didn't. I pulled a coal train down from Thomas a few weeks ago! If anyone's the "Neil Armstrong" of a coal run on the WM Westerm Lines, it's me. ;)
Obviously, all that blocking could occupy the yard for an entire session, so I'll have to winnow it down a bit. Also, if blocks of cars can be condensed to say 5-6 car units, then some of the movements could be tacked onto other trains, such as the Allentown cars can go with an Alpha Jet bound for Lurgan. It will take some time to get it all straight. One thought might be to set up an entire session based on only coal movements, but that might get dull...
Personally, I can see how it could be initially perceived as boring, but, since I have been fortunate to be involved in actual ops sessions on Lee's and Eric's layouts, I can add this perspective. Once the ops begin, the trains become game pieces, and I become more concerned with moving those "pieces" along. It doesn't matter what kind of cars I'm hauling esthetically, because my job is to get those cars down the line as efficiently as possible. It even becomes less important whether that car is modeled with 100% fidelity. For example, does it have molded on or freestanding grabs? Does it have pizza cutters or low-pros? Eh, who cares. My point is that I enjoy the fun of moving trains with a purpose, and it doesn't matter if I am running a unit train or a mixed manifest. Obviously, this differs from what I enjoy seeing when I'm railfanning, but that's not what ops sessions are about. I have found that ops sessions really provide me with an entirely different view of model railroading, and I love it.
So, if we were only running hoppers at an ops session, that wouldn't be boring to me, because the ops possibilities are huge. Don't forget, to do it right, those cars aren't just filled with coal. There are various grades of coal and different weights of cars for shipment and delivery to customers. You probably don't want to deliver a cut of loaded 100-ton hoppers to a customer's rickety decades-old wood trestle unloading ramp. Oh, and we have to get those cars back to get 'em refilled to do it again. Sounds like fun to me!
DFF
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And this is why you have the Elkins yard/Thomas Sub assignment!
Lee
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I've posted the entire schedule at the Bliggity Blog: http://wmrywesternlines.blogspot.com/
Obviously, with staging for only 9 trains (or so) there will have to be some recycling of train sets. The next thing to do will be to think through the sequence, so everything can be staged properly.
F'rinstance, There will likely be two trains set up as Alpha Jets, one from the east and one from the west. If I remember the schedules, AJ-1 would arrive at Hagerstown in the early morning hours from the east, and depart by about 10 a.m. Around 8 a.m. BT-1 would pull in from Baltimore. AJ-2 would roll in around 11 and head out by 4, AJ-3 and the NW train from Roanoke would arrive around the same time, to get worked into AJ-12 later in the evening. WM-6 would lope into town also in the early evening on it's way to Baltimore.
So, one trainset can be both BT-1 and WM-6
one can be AJ-1/AJ-12
one can be AJ-2/3
The NW Roanoke turn (NW11/12) would start in staging and get broken up at Ridgeley, and would probably be the last train off the layout, so it doesn't need staging space during the session.
Likewise, the Union Bridge Local would be in staging only at the beginning of the session and at the end.
So there's room in East staging for 4 extra trains.
Mmmm.
I'll have to graph this out.
Lee
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"Once the ops begin, the trains become game pieces, and I become more concerned with moving those "pieces" along. It doesn't matter what kind of cars I'm hauling esthetically, because my job is to get those cars down the line as efficiently as possible. It even becomes less important whether that car is modeled with 100% fidelity. For example, does it have molded on or freestanding grabs? Does it have pizza cutters or low-pros? Eh, who cares." ...
"I have found that ops sessions really provide me with an entirely different view of model railroading, and I love it."
DFF
I agree with both statements.
1) the thing i like about an op's session is everyone moving all the pieces around with some semblance of order. (actually, truth be told, i like the chaos better, and watching the Operators work their way out of it. In my case, i don't have to plan the chaos... it just "happens" lol).
2) I too have gained a better appreciation for the hobby. I am looking forward to getting to the Eastern shore this fall for a session.
EP
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One or two more trains to classify, and we'll be all staged for Monday. What I really need to work on is wiring the frogs in the east yard throat. The switcher is getting very angry over there...
Lee
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(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-4ctKXJCI1qY/TiPQI_arzLI/AAAAAAAAPL0/WhdiL5mGUBw/s640/Staging%252520%2525283%252529.jpg)
Railwire exclusive - glam shot.
Train NW11 arrives at North Jct., digging in to crest the hill and hit the crossover to gain entry to Ridgeley Yard.
We found a nice shady spot under the Highway 11 overpass...
Lee
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Very nice shot Lee!
Hopefully the family is saving up for new jalopy. ;D
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Hamburgers for dinner! YUM!
The S.
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After last night's ops session, I've got a few thoughts.
Apart from the obvious things, such as finishing wiring frogs and installing switch machines etc., the layout ran extraordinarily well. The crew did as well. The critical junctions at the top of the helix and at the end of double track were well manned, all the trains seemed to run in the right direction, and toward the end of the evening when we slipped into "Railfan" mode, we had two and at times three trains running orbits seamlessly.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-LV3f1Zypqx4/TiWMMfeTHcI/AAAAAAAAPOE/McvQvoqU3SQ/s640/NW%252520at%252520Ridgeley.jpg)
Ops wise, I still have some work to do. I'm using four cycle waybills, but frankly, I could easily demote many of them to two cycle. The yard gets jammed up very quickly when a 25 car train arrives and 20 of them have to be switched. I need to make sure the "thru" blocks are there to keep the trains fleshed out, and minimize the cars that get dumped off for local switching or transferred to other thru trains. I'm going to try running some more of the schedule as is to see if the cards work themselves out, and I'll probably do some editing along the way.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-HULLJEU9oTo/TiWMOEJDTOI/AAAAAAAAPOI/B9mNRom4-A0/s640/Laurel%252520Valley%252520at%252520Maryland%252520Jct..jpg)
I also need to whip up some train description cards to attach to the packets so crews have a clearer picture of what's going on, and what they need to do to keep things moving. At the end of the evening, Phil and I spent some time running "clean up" trains to pick up cars that had been missed by their scheduled trains.
There are a couple of points where I desperately need to install signalling, especially at the approaches to the staging yards, and I need to add the local controls for siding at Shaw, either that or remove the decoders entirely and go to a simple control panel. There's not enough traffic up there to warrant decoder control.
Still, overall, it was a good evening, we got through about a dozen or so of the 28 train sequence, which is about what I expected. Thanks to the crew, and especially to Eric, who just flew in from California, and Boy are his arms tired!
Lee
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Lee, for your through trains, a guy I operate with up here in South Jersey uses the following for his thru trains/blocks (or has and will when his layout is rebuilt):
http://home.comcast.net/~prrndiv/operations.html (http://home.comcast.net/~prrndiv/operations.html)
He describes his blocking in the section "Through Freights and Off Line Staging". Just a thought,
Phil
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Thank you for having me! I had a great time. I hope I wasn't responsible for too much of the cleanup. ::)
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No worries, Eric! Just having the Broadway Limited diverted over the Connellsville Sub was all it took to give you a free pass! Besides, it gave us something to do while we finished up those beers... :D
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Besides, it gave us something to do while we finished up those beers... :D
Heavens that the vitamin Y should go to waste!
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The yard gets jammed up very quickly when a 25 car train arrives and 20 of them have to be switched.
And you thought I was crazy when I kept saying "more space, more tracks"... crazy like a fox!
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And you thought I was crazy when I kept saying "more space, more tracks"... crazy like a fox!
Just do what we do at our regular ops session, flip the waybill and keep it going down the line, :)
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No worries, Eric! Just having the Broadway Limited diverted over the Connellsville Sub was all it took to give you a free pass! Besides, it gave us something to do while we finished up those beers... :D
I wish I would've had the brains to divert Super-Berk power to NW12.... I blame the afterthought to the geniuses sucking up all my brainwaves during the day.
The S.
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And you thought I was crazy when I kept saying "more space, more tracks"... crazy like a fox!
We were all pretty much in agreement that the main problem was lack of a consistent and competent yard boss. If you know anyone who might want the job, let me know!
Lee
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(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-4ctKXJCI1qY/TiPQI_arzLI/AAAAAAAAPL0/WhdiL5mGUBw/s640/Staging%252520%2525283%252529.jpg)
Railwire exclusive - glam shot.
Train NW11 arrives at North Jct., digging in to crest the hill and hit the crossover to gain entry to Ridgeley Yard.
We found a nice shady spot under the Highway 11 overpass...
Lee
I know it's your RR Lee, but you'd pretty much never see non-dynamic brake merger power on the Valley line.
Mark
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I know this. I also know that I had a pair of U25's in stock, and NW decals available... I needed a short term representation... Don't worry, it'll be our little secret!
Lee
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Gotcha! Mums the word!
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I've been avoiding the heat today by working through the rest of the 28 train schedule.
I think I figured out how to keep the yard from backing up like a port-a-pot at a Nascar event... Thru freight and coal are the primary traffic on the layout, so streamlining how they get to and thru the yard should make a huge difference in how well we can do the other work in the yard, especially building sorting locals. If the through trains, the fast freights and coal drags, don't go into the yard, it simplifies everything. When the trains coming out of staging are properly blocked, the thru cars will be the first section behind the engines.
So, if the train pulls in on the main behind the yard, it can be cut behind the thru cars and the yard switcher can grab the back of the train to be reclassified. If the yard has been doing its job (and the dispatcher allows adequate time between trains), then there should be a cut of cars ready to pull from the A/D tracks to tack on the end. On trains that require a power swap, there's plenty of run around tracks available to make the change out on the main.
The idea behind the fast freights was to get them through the terminals as quickly and efficiently as possible. We were pulling entire trains into the yard, with about a third of the cars requiring no switching. By keeping them out on the main, congestion will be reduced substantially, and switching blocks of cars vastly simplified.
For the coal trains, the first major improvement was going to block waybills covering anywhere from 4 to 6 cars. This cuts the paper shuffling down substantially. While all coal trains will be terminated and re-shuffled at Ridgeley, when a coal train comes in, there will be blocks of cars that will continue on through. These will become the basis of the outbound train. Blocks of hoppers can be lined up on the long siding behind the main by destination, so it's easy for the switcher to pull the cars needed to add to the outbound train provided the sequence of arrivals is close to the sequence of blocks on stand by.
More science going on soon...
Lee
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Lee, what I did to judge traffic flow through my yard was create a small chart that listed:
Each train number/ID that was either dropping off or picking up from the yard
The number of cars currently in the yard when the train arrived
The number of cars being dropped off or picked up
The number of cars left in the yard after the train departs
For example:
Train 3 from Cleveland to Olean (36/12/0/48)
Train 4 from Olean to Warren (48/0/7/41)
In other words when Train 3 arrives there are 36 cars presently in the yard. 12 cars are being dropped off. 0 cars are being picked up and there are now 48 cars in the yard.
Train 4 is then assembled. Seven cars are removed from the yard, leaving 41.
Yeah, I get the point that you may not have the same trains dropping off or picking up the exact same number of cars in every operating session, but still this type of chart helped establish the train schedule so the yard wouldn't be overwhelmed.
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Interesting approach, Michael. I've got a total of 10 tracks for classification, plus two A/D tracks.
My thinking is to use the A/D tracks to build the cuts of cars due to be picked up by the thru freights, so they can quickly be swapped for the set outs. In the perfect world, an Alpha Jet comprised of 30 cars would have 10 cars that are just passing through, 10 cars that are being redirected to other thru freights (If the thru train is going from Lurgan thru to Connellsville to meet the N&W, set outs might include cars bound for Baltimore, Roanoke, York, and/or the P&LE connection at Connellsville.) and 10 cars bound for locations on the layout. The yard is very much the hub of a multi-spoke system.
To follow your charting, it would be helpful to have a laptop in the train room.
Especially since at any given moment there could be two trains being processed for thru traffic, plus any of several locals being built.
If I had the real estate, I'd add a smaller yard to handle nothing but the locals. That way the yardmaster can sort a block of cars as "Local" without having to sub sort them into the different local trains. It will be an evolutionary process to be sure.
Thanks for the input.
Lee
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Lee, do you break down your yard into subsections?
Essentially I ended up with two tracks for my Depart Yard, which holds the cars that were switched out of the various industries and branch line that are part of the layout.
I ended up with two tracks for my Branch Line Yard, and three tracks for my Local Yard.
The chart I talked about in the earlier post was later enhanced with more detail showing the flow of cars in and out of each of the yards.
I ran the complete schedule of trains myself a couple of times, tracked the cars in and out of the yard and the results caused me to reset my train schedule some in order to get better flow.
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Yes and no... There are no "permanent" class tracks. Things move around depending on the ebb and flow of traffic. I use a long acrylic rack to sort cards, so I can use a dry erase marker to be flexible with what goes where.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-v72y63N2njo/Tgx4YJ5tAOI/AAAAAAAAPJc/wVf2g4abkI8/s640/Card%252520Box.jpg)
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-mull_urcAkU/TgQG650xrHI/AAAAAAAAPBE/LD9Moc_6V8o/s640/New%252520Weeklies%252520009.jpg)
When I designed the yard, the idea was to have the first five tracks on the left be the eastbound tracks, and the second 5 for westbounds. The last two tracks are the A/D tracks. In practice, it's worked out that the front tracks are where the local traffic gets sorted, and the longer tracks to the rear are for blocking through traffic. Depending on the ebb and flow, these designations can shift around.
Lee
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Lee, have you put the entire train schedule through its paces on your own?
That's what I would suggest if you haven't yet.
Take a clip board and track the number of cars in the yard after each train arrives or departs, placing special attention on the number of cars in your "Local" yard and the "Through" yard at any one time.
By running the entire schedule yourself you'll find the "bottlenecks" and you'll probably then be able to formally designate parts of your yard, even if it's say 4 tracks that make up the Local yard, 4 tracks that make up the Through yard and 2 overflow tracks.
It'll make it much easier for someone, other than yourself, to then be able to come in and manage the yard during ops sessions.
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Good thinking, Michael. If I have to sacrifice all day tomorrow running trains, I suppose that's a cross I'll just have to bear!! :D :D
Lee
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Took a break from running trains to put some more work in on scenery and infrastructure. (some copied from Weekend Update, I didn't want it to get lost in the sauce)
Here's the brewery warehouse that's now underway, shown in position. You may recognize some of the components being resurrected from the junque box.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-smrfo52xInc/TjYd3JntOSI/AAAAAAAAPUk/RDF39Gr5vO8/s640/Brewery%252520%2525281%252529.jpg)
That cold storage warehouse hasn't been on a layout since maybe 1983. It almost made it onto the 1991 Laurel Valley, but proved a little too bulky for the location I wanted it in. So a little cut and paste with some DPM modulars will create a whole new building. A few more views:
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-sbjnk_eNqUk/TjYd4F0dKhI/AAAAAAAAPUo/2D0UQNhe-l8/s640/Brewery%252520%2525282%252529.jpg)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-otIFof_Bkyo/TjYd5V5DX0I/AAAAAAAAPUs/-vWuc1oQoQM/s640/Brewery.jpg)
Note that the loading doors from the rear side of the cold storage have been cut out and relocated on the second level, bringing the truck warehouse closer to the grade of US 40 behind the building. Here's the overview of the location with a sketch plan of the rest of the building:
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-mQBT5PlYfkE/TjYd7fNWxoI/AAAAAAAAPVI/ZVU0EeXsKR4/s640/Brewery%252520overview.jpg)
You can see how the loading dock faces US 40. This will be pretty much invisible from the aisle, but I plan to tease it out enough to drop the camera back there on occasion. The main brew house will be a larger brick structure to the right of and attached to the warehouse. It will include a switch and separate siding that will accommodate the requisite grain cars, and maybe a coal dock for power. I've seen photos of the old Queen City brewery with a pile of coal on the side of the building, presumably to power the operation, but it appeared to be dumped from a truck. So I'll bend light a little to create another destination for some Laurel Valley coal...
I also finished mechanically and electrically hooking up the interlockings at the west end of the yard, and ran the cable to wire the east end interlockings. Just need to wire the frogs, and put in the machine for North Junction, and the main line will be fully functional.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-rxOOl-8BTH0/TjYd8gf3DqI/AAAAAAAAPU0/1VXq7L64GZ0/s640/Interlocking.jpg)
The two (actually 3) machines that are horizontally mounted run two switches each. This the full interlocking at the west end of the yard. The track in the foreground on the lower level is the Connellsville Sub through Greenwood.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-h7asGbUiKEI/TjYd9jbIWgI/AAAAAAAAPU4/Ac8vMJlJr5o/s640/Interlocking%252520%2525281%252529.jpg)
And there's the medula oblongata that runs the mainline switches around the yard at the east and west ends. I need two more tortoises to complete the installation. But first, I need to ransom the car from the repair shop! :-X Afterall, I paid it off two weeks ago, so naturally it overheated on the way to work Thursday.
Lee
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Finished wiring all the tortoises that are there. One last crossover to install. I'm thinking about taking out the tortoises on the Shaw siding and making it manual. It doesn't get that much traffic, and I put them in there more or less as a test bed for the first decoder I installed. Even if I leave the machines in place, I may move the decoder somewhere where it will be more useful, not sure yet.
The best part is, with the interlockings all wired at the west end, I can now commence with scenery for Greenwood. I'm thinking a little central PA style hamlet, perhaps with a friendly local watering hole...
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-pgM4dqGIg_A/Tj6d5cI1omI/AAAAAAAAPbE/gKhbUYkVP7M/s640/RailBQ2011%252520060.jpg)
We shall see!
Lee
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(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-N2p7YaadNWM/TcYXcQW2ZgI/AAAAAAAANQM/U6DUdGY2v7c/s640/RailBQ2011%252520071.jpg)
Hmm, looks like a nice place to quench one's thirst. Yeah, I'd be willing to partake of a Yuengling or two there. Oh yeah... I have. ;)
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Oh Yes, I do think that would be a great place to down a few. Of course, it would even be better if this was across the street.
(http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa149/rkbufkin/Conrail%202011%20Newport%20Picnic/024.jpg)
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We really should work on that business plan...
"Bullet Bob's Trackside Tap"
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I'm thinking a little central PA style hamlet, perhaps with a friendly local watering hole...
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-N2p7YaadNWM/TcYXcQW2ZgI/AAAAAAAANQM/U6DUdGY2v7c/s640/RailBQ2011%252520071.jpg)
NZT's next kit, perhaps?
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We really got to get photos of the sides and rear of this fine establishment for someone to model.
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I'm working on a "close enough" version using a DPM kit as a base.
I'll pop a picture of the one I'm using. It's not listed on the DPM website, because apparently Woodland Scenics feels that N scale has enough structure kits available... ::)
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(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-ANvLtwXrbOU/Tj9b4jMhkmI/AAAAAAAAPeQ/sozdLTlIY-A/Hard%252520Hat%252520%2525283%252529.jpg)
This will be located in Greenwood, at the top of the west end helix...
Lee
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I like it. The "tin" roof really makes me think western Maryland or South Central PA.
The S.
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It's just missing a few asshats. ;D
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It's already got one hardasshat 8)
Groovy structure.
Love local (loco?) color structures!
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I suspect that sign may end up being reworked by someone at some point...
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(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-pgM4dqGIg_A/Tj6d5cI1omI/AAAAAAAAPbE/gKhbUYkVP7M/s640/RailBQ2011%252520060.jpg)
Opens at 7 am? Woof, the Hard Hat is Hard Core.
(Great model BTW!)
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The first thing I noticed was some shifting of the model cars on the shelf above the paper mill:
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-YJjqGk5XF-c/TlQYlZLo1zI/AAAAAAAAPhA/VE2RNkDGeO4/s640/Earthquake%252521.jpg)
Then I saw what could have been a whole lot worse: Millions of gallons of 1:32 gasoline spilled all over a 1:160 forest!
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-ecEoI1WgNW8/TlQYnS2urpI/AAAAAAAAPhE/Qjd99QPJhnY/s640/Earthquake%252521%252520%2525281%252529.jpg)
Relieved that no hazmats were spilled, I went on to inspect the rest of the railroad...
East staging suffered one derailment (at least one that I can see right off.)
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-3Ok8QGm0LBk/TlQYoXxU5nI/AAAAAAAAPhY/oPB9CgD6EDY/s512/Earthquake%252521%252520%2525282%252529.jpg)
Another spill was spotted in the A/D tracks at Ridgeley:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-2DqsXS-jxhI/TlQYqVrRKZI/AAAAAAAAPhM/hRwPi5WRHUQ/s640/Earthquake%252521%252520%2525283%252529.jpg)
But the most noticeable damage from the disaster took place out on the Connellsville Sub:
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-CRP4rPUayos/TlQYulGxi8I/AAAAAAAAPhU/BzhBwafAvPc/s640/Earthquake%252521%252520%2525285%252529.jpg)
CNN crews are on site as are emergency crews from the surrounding counties. So far no injuries have been reported...
Lee
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No damage for me --- but, I couldn't tell anyway - considering its always in a state of destruction :|
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But the most noticeable damage from the disaster took place out on the Connellsville Sub:
Looks like a dangerous spot. Isn't that where the girl fell down the enbankment onto the river bank the several months ago?
Charlie
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Okay, so I've got a mid October ops session brewing, so it's time to get back to work. I'm going to try to get the roundhouse wired up and functioning, or at least enough of it to make it a little more manageable to handle all the visiting power that usually shows up.
I've also got to get the east throat switches wired and set up with slide switches to enable both ends of the yard to be worked.
A couple of other odds and ends will also be on the menu... We'll see.
Lee
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Okay, so in MC's Summer Shunting thread I mentioned that I was kicking around the idea of simplifying my layout to better suit my space.
The crux of the matter is that after running some ops sessions at Eric's Nickel Plate, I'm realizing that I really am trying to stuff 10 pounds of railroad into a 5 pound bag. The track plan is good, staging is adequate, and I'm happy with the overall effect of the scenery:track ratio, but there's simply not enough "air" between elements to run the volume of trains I had hoped... at least with the size of crew I need to run a full schedule.
At Eric's, there's plenty of room for a large crew, he usually runs with about 10. My room can only handle 5, maybe 6 comfortably, but I'm trying to run the same volume of trains.
My first (and most logical) solution is to trim the train schedule. I'll be experimenting with that over the next few sessions. If that doesn't work to my satisfaction, I may start with a clean sheet of paper.
Of course, the other option opens up in a couple of years when I no longer have to domicile a teenager upstairs... Opening up some more real estate for a larger layout with longer runs. We shall see...
Lee
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yeah, i feel the same pull... as if i am running too many trains... there IS also the feeling of "needing to keep people busy"... instead of "letting them sit around"... after all, they are here to run trains right??? anyway... i can tell you that the Op's tend to take longer and dont run as smooth if trains arent blocked... for short trains.. no biggie... 8 cars or less... for over 8 cars, we are trying to master blocking...
here is an example
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-Pg1x3uYA1qs/ToHwzYLmf9I/AAAAAAAABjM/X2vsGMD7gEE/s400/Blocking%252520Trains%252520in%252520Bellevue%252520Yard.jpg)
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Well, if we do one of John Allen's Givens and Druthers analyses, we find:
Givens
- A set foot-print for two more years
- layout design elements really close together, causing consternation and slow-downs during operating sessions
- a recent and major reconstruction
- an ambitious but prototypically based operations schedule
- a finite capacity in the on-stage yard for both cars and switching work
- a well-liked scenery to track ratio
Druthers
- more capacity for human operators
- ability to run the full schedule as planned, not just s shortened version
- the ability to maintain scenery to track ratio
- beneficino from the most recent set of investments - i.e. not making wholesale changes that require massive amounts of new track, etc
- a DCC system up to the operating task
That's all I can think of for the moment, but you probably get the idea. Seems that trimming the schedule (or breaking it up into tricks so that you do 24 hours of operating in 3 sessions or something) might be the shortest distance between two points here.
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Lee, what about splitting the session in half? Run half the trains one month, the other half the next? I know many layouts do that to keep things moving and not so cluttered by in people and cars,
Phil
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you're using switchlists right?
i remember seeing car cards, but i konw you can do switch lists and leave the car cards to the clerk...
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A couple questions Lee...
How many times per year do you anticipate operating sessions where more than say 3 or 4 show up?
Do you enjoy running the layout on your own?
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I'd like to settle into a groove where we're doing a regular ops session at least once a quarter. I know that doesn't sound like a lot, but there are now at least three of us in the area with "actual size" layouts set up for operations, and we sort of round robin. There are potentially a few more that will be joining the group in the next year or so. Also, I'm about 2 hours away from most of my crew, so I don't want to become an economic liability asking people for a half tank of gas once a month...
I do enjoy running the layout myself, and I'll run the "clean up" jobs between sessions, or just pick a train and work it through its part of the schedule. I do see the value in breaking up the 24 hour schedule into three distinct cycles. I've found that I do have adequate staging to handle the volume of trains scheduled, so it's not a big problem waiting for the clock to tick down a few.
Last weekend I ran for the first time with a fast clock at Eric's, and that really seemed to help the flow. Although, the relative length of his main line run helps with the illusion of time passing. I'm not sure how well that would translate to my more compact track plan. I'll definitely look at Master Blocking, too, Dr. Seuss... We'll get Ed trained yet!!
If I get really fancy with the three trick schedule, and I invest a few bucks in some more LEDs, I'd love to have a night running session where we're working in the dark...
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/LRV_1801.jpg)
Lee
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yeah, the night running thing is something i wanna explore a little.... after sunnyside and the engine facility and the west end expansion...
when i put it that way, it is time for a work session!
lol
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Lee & Eric- Don't worry about Ed. I'll handle his work while he pontificates. I had a great time at the ops session a couple weeks ago Eric. Thank you. I wouldn't mind becoming a regular if you'd have me.
Russ
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See, Lee's yard has the right amount of tracks (cause I yelled and hollered about it for so long), so it's quite possible to block cars there... just sayin...
Lee, I think if you're gonna do something different, wait till you'll have the second room. Enjoy what you've built for a little bit. But then...
Conrail on the Shore in June of 76?
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Well Ed, when you are there, it does have the right amount of track. When Carhart and I are there . . . well we need a tad more room. Just sayin . . .
And Lee- Ed's right - let's bask in the glory of what we have done for a time . . . .
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I dunno.
If Lee's not happy with the flow, he's not happy with the flow.
I know with my layout if I get a thought about something not being right... It about wears me out until I fix it.
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i agree... there is the "this is good enough" flow... which, for me, means running freight only... and then there is the this is how it should run... which adds passenger service into the mix....
for me, the flow won't be complete until i do some more expansion, to lengthen things out a little and get the final west end established... until then, it is a work in progress and won't "feel right"...
flow also has to do with the operators... i am very fortunate to have a solid core of people willing to put up with me... i always tell them thank you ...
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Tell the whole story, Eric. You say "Thank you, now get the hell out... it's 10 o'clock!"
Lee
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well
that is true
:)
i do say that... ;) but only after a good time is had by all... (wouldn't want the non-experienced to think i was totally rude)
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Tell the whole story, Eric. You say "Thank you, now get the hell out... it's 10 o'clock!"
That was me last time. It's why I'm not on the invite-back list. Well, among other things... like brownie scarfing and drinking all of the diet Mt. Dew...
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Mmmmmm ......... Brownies......
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they were good... every OP's session needs a tradition... and the daughter / son love to play host.
Lee has Vitamin Y, I have brownies... both are yummy in small doses.
EP
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We need to get Ed a radio...kid doesnt pay attention to squat when hes working the yard.
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and we have a winner.
:o
radios are probably a year off... when the dispatcher gets moved...
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We need to get Ed a radio...kid doesnt pay attention to squat when hes working the yard.
LOL... I annoyed the sh*t out of Ed trying to keep that yard fluid while I worked through him on the local with my big-a$$ 2-8-8-2. He paid attention to my driving an almost HO-sized steam loco through his yard a dozen times.
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LOL... I annoyed the sh*t out of Ed trying to keep that yard fluid while I worked through him on the local with my big-a$$ 2-8-8-2. He paid attention to my driving an almost HO-sized steam loco through his yard a dozen times.
Heh, Ed just gave me the ol' skunk-eye when I ran SP GS-4 #4449 through the yard once or twice on a local freight. :D
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In Ed's defense, every time he shows up to YM, the yard is a mess and he spends the first half digging out... I intentionally took the day off tomorrow to stage the yard. That being said, Ed has mentioned that he is willing to serve anywhere, and would enjoy a time or two on the main...
EP
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Okay, boys. Let's bring this back into focus here. We can gab about Eric's yard in Eric's thread.
I'll be working on tidying up the yard and pre-blocking some things, and maybe even reducing the number of cars in circulation prior to our next WM session... Once the systems are in place, it'll be a little easier to start growing the schedule again.
Lee
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so, back to Lee's yard... what are you envisioning for the Yard Clerk position... is it a combo position with classification, or is it straight clerk? (either way is cool) :D
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I built the desk to allow for a yard clerk as a "non throttle" position.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-alQBTcT6KIM/TeW1tl6VayI/AAAAAAAANk0/4mfTI19_AYg/s640/New%252520Weeklies%252520182.jpg)
There is potential for two yard switchers to be operating simultaneously, as there are full throats at either end. The switcher crews would sort and block the cars, using the card rack above the yard (they'll be standing)
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-v72y63N2njo/Tgx4YJ5tAOI/AAAAAAAAPJc/wVf2g4abkI8/s640/Card%252520Box.jpg)
Once the train is blocked, the clerk will get the cards, make sure they're in order, and if the train has work on the layout, provide a switch list.
On incoming trains, the crew's paperwork will be handed to the clerk to determine how much of the train needs to get worked in the yard, and then index the cards by car order as well as destination. This will provide the switcher crew with the information it needs to break down the train and classify it.
The only other assignment the yard clerk would have would be as master of the west end staging yard. The controls for access to these tracks are located at the clerk's station, and he will be responsible for all clearances in and out.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-nLFoc5JskaY/ThG55a1CDGI/AAAAAAAAPKY/EMCB5vwXUJI/s640/Operations%252520%2525282%252529.jpg)
(You'll note that in one of my earlier track plans, the A/D track was located along this front edge of the yard to provide immediate visibility of all cars for the clerk, but this arrangement was determined to be a disadvantage limiting access to the class tracks.)
Again, this is a non-throttle position. If I ever end up putting a full dispatch office in the other room, this duty would be eliminated and transferred to the dispatcher.
In order to keep things streamlined, in a 25 car train, I'll try to keep as many as 10 cars as "through" that won't have to be switched. These will always (ideally) be blocked at the front of the train. If the two A/D tracks in the yard proper get jammed up, these cars can be left on either one of the mains or the long controlled siding behind the yard... there are full interlockings at either end to allow full access in either direction. Power can still be cut off and run around, cabooses can be switched out for servicing, and new blocks of outbound cars can be added to trains on the main this way, provided they have clearance from the Dispatcher to use the interlockings.
Basically, the Yard Clerk would be the guy that determines if the next train is ready to be received, and who directs inbound trains to particular tracks to be worked. He would also be the one to alert the dispatcher that the next train is assembled and ready to depart.
Not a very "Hands on Trains" position, but probably the critical post that makes sure things keep running smoothly.
Lee
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Question Lee...
If you were to "sweep" all the industries that need switching during a full operating session on the layout?
Just trying to get some idea of how many cars are funneled through that yards during a full operating session.
One other thing Lee... What is your yard capacity in 50' car lengths?
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The on-line industries are just a fraction of the fun. All totaled, there are spots for:
North Junction: 12 cars
Cumberland: 16 cars
Luke: 25 cars
Thomas sub: 24 cars.
Total: 77.
Between the yards at Elkins and Ridgeley, I have room for over 150 cars so just running local on-line stuff will never jam me up..
The trick is all the switching that gets done to the through trains. Blocks that get shifted from one westbound train to another to reach an alternate connection, blocks of incoming cars for local switching, outbound cars that result from same... etc. The ops schematic is an X, so from a train from the southeast, you have potential for four different destinations for blocks of cars (the other three points of the X, plus local.) In most cases, at least one of those blocks will stay with the train, but typically out of a 20 car train, 15 will be pulled and switched to other trains. Likewise, other blocks will be already set up in the yard to be added to the train as it gets ready to leave. It makes for some very interesting switching for the yard crews.
Lee
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Gotcha Lee.
Sounds like your first thought was spot on, i.e. reduce the number of trains.
But maybe you could make more of the trains run-throughs without the need to drop-off/pick-up.
How's the operator-space for two folks trying to work both ends of the yard?
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Should be no problem. There's about 12' of aisle along the front of the yard. If the clerk is seated at the desk, the switchers can run from the corners. The only other duty the east end switcher would have is bartender. The fridge is under the roundhouse!!
Lee
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Should be no problem. There's about 12' of aisle along the front of the yard. If the clerk is seated at the desk, the switchers can run from the corners. The only other duty the east end switcher would have is bartender. The fridge is under the roundhouse!!
Lee
Thus the phrases "A round of drinks on the house" and "Drink you under the (turn) table."
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Lee,
Have you ever thought of doing Joe Fugate's Layout Design Analysis on your layout to see if maybe you are running too many trains? The link to his method is
http://siskiyou-railfan.net/e107_plugins/content/content.php?content.32 (http://siskiyou-railfan.net/e107_plugins/content/content.php?content.32)
Just a thought,
Phil
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Interesting stuff there, Phil, but damn that's a lot of reading. I'm guessing that's targeted to the armchair crowd that suffers from paralysis by analysis. I've always been in the "Build Something... Anything" faction of the hobby. Sure I put some thought into it, but that's just making good use of the time I have to wait until I have enough money and/or material to tackle the next project.
Lee
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Interesting stuff there, Phil, but damn that's a lot of reading. I'm guessing that's targeted to the armchair crowd that suffers from paralysis by analysis. I've always been in the "Build Something... Anything" faction of the hobby. Sure I put some thought into it, but that's just making good use of the time I have to wait until I have enough money and/or material to tackle the next project.
Lee
Not entirely Lee. I've know another modeler whose applied it post build but was setting up operations once trackwork was down. He wanted to make sure he actually had enough engines for trains on his layout, or what might be needed to move the cars from his industries. There was also issues with one siding and his desired train length, i.e., it was too short. He found he needed to lengthen that siding to dramatically improve on the number of trains to run and move more cars, otherwise about half the cars on the layout could be moved. What I've read from people applying this to their already built layouts is that they find they shouldn't be attempting to move all the cars on the layout (or move less) or they need to add more staging. In your setup, the latter might not be an option, but the former may hold the key to smoother running op sessions. Again, just another tool to look to to gauge if the operating plan is optimal for the layout,
Phil
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Okay, so I'm running down the list here, and I've hit a snag. About half of my main line is double tracked, and half is single with long sidings. The double track section has some interlockings built in, so it can also serve as single with long sidings but in general practice, it's double track. The formula for calculating the number of passing sidings doesn't address this. Should I figure anywhere I can stop a train and run around it as a siding?
For instance, there are three mains that run around the outside of the yard, with full interlockings at each end. Does that account for three sidings? Or should one always be considered the main, with two sidings? And out on the double track main, if there are two interlocking plants at each end of an 8' section, does that mean there's one or two 8' sidings?
I just want to make sure I'm doing the math right, something my accountant will tell you is not my strong suit.
Lee
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Here we go... I was working with a lot of guesstimates on the track measurements, but they should be within a reasonable margin of error.
Here's the summary for the layout:
Room Area (sq ft): 234
Layout Area (sq ft): 134 (57%)
Number Turnouts: 123
Total Track (ft): 593
Train Length (cars): 56/32/24
Maximum Cars: 921
Trains: 68
Dispatching Threshold: 33 car trains
I'm sure these numbers are somewhat skewed, particular car capacity. I've got less than half the cars that the formula came up with, and can't imagine running the layout with all of them on line at once.
The number of trains is also skewed, probably due to the size of Ridgeley and my staging yards, particularly the east yard, which can handle two long trains or three shorter ones on each of four tracks. I also keep one "through" track open to provide for loopty loops when I just want to drink beer and watch a train run the circuit.
However, the train length is spot on, and if expanded to a 24 hour cycle, 45 to 60 train movements is not outside the realm of possibility. So yes, this has been a useful exercise.
It's also interesting to see that my total mileage is a about 18 scale miles... (only about 4 miles is actual main line running, and about half of that is accounted for in double track, so really, three scale miles end to end on the visible layout.
Lee
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So after doing all that Lee, what thoughts do you have?
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Mmmm. I'd say that my initial thought to reduce the number of trains is probably still a good place to start to make sure the yard can handle some volume. Once established, I can see if that can be turned up a bit.
It would also appear that reducing the overall schedule to allow for 16 to 18 trains during a session (instead of the ambitious 23-25 now planned) will also provide the flexibility needed for dispatching in and out of staging. I'm looking at a clock equivalent of 2-3 hours = 8, maybe 12 hour shift, that should keep everything paced out and allow for that potential 60 train per "day" the statistics indicated.
Lee
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Do you anticipate cutting down on the number of locals that are run during that 8-12 hour window?
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There aren't that many locals.
You've got two that run between Elkins and Ridgeley, one in each direction.
Then there's an extra that runs paper mill traffic from Ridgeley to Luke.
Finally there's the Union Bridge traveling switcher, which works the traffic east of Ridgeley, and terminates in east staging.
Other switching jobs are comprised mostly of the coal extras running up and down the Thomas Sub, which are pretty much isolated from the main line, and don't really clog up the yard, other than a few consolidations that take place to build coal trains bound for Baltimore or Allentown.
The through trains that get worked in the yard are the east and westbound fast freights, which carry blocks of cars bound for various destinations in addition to straight through. As long as these trains are pre-blocked in staging, they run pretty smoothly.
Here's an example of a typical fast freight.
Alpha Jet AJ-1 is staged in East Staging, representing the Reading's Rutherford Yard near Harrisburg. Power would be a mix of RDG and WM engines.
The train would consist of 25 to 30 cars, which would be blocked as follows:
Cars 1-10 would be through cars destined for the N&W interchange at Connellsville. These cars would be destined for Bellevue Ohio, and ultimately Chicago and points west.
Cars 11-15 would be bound for the P&LE interchange at Connellsville. These cars would be bound for Pittsburgh and Youngstown, and will be switched out to be added to train BT-1, which runs from Baltimore to Toledo, OH via the P&LE.
Cars 16-20 could be bound for Baltimore or Elkins. These would be dropped at Ridgeley then added to trains headed to those destinations.
Cars 21-25 would be designated for locals on the layout.
Obviously, the actual car counts would fluctuate based on the car cards, but that's the general idea.
The train would arrive from east staging, and stay on the westbound main behind the yard.
The train crew would cut off the Reading power, and move it over to the engine terminal. Meanwhile, the east end yard switcher would pull the cars to be worked at Ridgeley (all but the first 10), and move them into the A/D track in the yard. If the yard crew has worked its magic, the cars to be added to the train will be blocked and ready on the other A/D track, or at least on one of the yard tracks. The switcher can then pull that cut, and add it to the rear of the train.
The ET hostler will then build up the new power (in this case, there would be a mix of WM and NW power) and move it to the front of the train. The caboose would also be pulled, and replaced with either a WM or NW caboose for the trip west.
Once all this is done, the train waits for clearance to head west to Connellsville.
Lather, Rinse Repeat.
In order to really streamline the schedule, it's these through freights that will need to be consolidated and pared down a bit. I'll be working out the details of that as we go through a few sessions.
Lee
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Gotcha!
Thanks for the explanation Lee.
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Okay, so I'm running down the list here, and I've hit a snag. About half of my main line is double tracked, and half is single with long sidings. The double track section has some interlockings built in, so it can also serve as single with long sidings but in general practice, it's double track. The formula for calculating the number of passing sidings doesn't address this. Should I figure anywhere I can stop a train and run around it as a siding?
For instance, there are three mains that run around the outside of the yard, with full interlockings at each end. Does that account for three sidings? Or should one always be considered the main, with two sidings? And out on the double track main, if there are two interlocking plants at each end of an 8' section, does that mean there's one or two 8' sidings?
One should always be considered the main. Also, on staging, one is always considered the main. I know you have looped staging so break them up into slots, i.e., 3 slots per track or something like that, that'll give you more. For the double track, consider one the main and one sidings and just calculate that way, otherwise it will skew calculations higher for cars/tracks. Also, remember, for arrival tracks and yard tracks, you want to make them connecting, not storage. I saw your calculations a little further and man, that's a lot of track,
Phil
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what about any unscheduled extra's? Can you YM call for an extra to clear the yard (if needed) or clear local industries? or is that still TBD?
philosophically, are you open to it?
EP
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Yes, they will happen, mostly with coal movements. F'rinstance, BT-1 might bring a long cut of empties into the yard, some of which are bound for Elkins (on-layout) others might be off to Fairmount via Bowest (off layout) or Somerset and the Laurel Valley via Rockwood (also off layout). So as these cars pile up, trains can be assembled and sent off to their various destinations.
If an abundance of cars bound for a particular scheduled local crop up, we can send out an extra to pick up the slack.
As for clearing industries, other than picking up coal loads, that's done by the locals. If you're dropping off a load, you're picking up the empty, that sort of thing.
The paper mill has an around the clock switcher, so it can digest whatever gets fed to it, and keep a steady stream of outbound shipments on the departure track. (also sorted for numerous destinations... if there's space available, the blocking can be done on-site, and cars added to trains headed in the right direction, further freeing up space in the yard for the fast freight work.
Lee
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There's been some discussion of upgrading the DCC system to Digitrax, as I believe I'm reaching the outer limits of what my MRC Prodigy Advance can do. One of the deciding factors has been the control bus wiring, since the MRC uses 8-pin and Digitrax uses 6 pin.
Well, after a little experimentation, it turns out that a standard 6 pin plug fits snugly into an 8 pin jack, and provides a good mechanical and electrical connection with the middle six wires. This being the case, I'll be able to make the conversion without having to rewire the whole mess, and can even leave the existing jacks in place!
So last night, in celebration, I finished wiring in the control bus, which involved adding 4 more jacks to the system. The control bus is now completely looped, so that should reduce or eliminate the "SVDA" displays when someone bumps a loose wire, and otherwise help the signal strength.
I've now got 11 jack locations (including two dualies at either end of the yard) around the layout, located on both sides of the aisle, so even with my current tethered throttles, there should be no problems getting tangled up in red tape...er... black wires...
Lee
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Lee,
Well, the additional good news, when you finally bring this Digitrax plan to fruition, is that many of us have Digitrax throttles (and those fancy Droids) that we can bring to ops sessions.
DFF
P.S. Your PM box is full.
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Lee - you can not "loop" the control bus - if that means connecting both ends .. not if you expect the digitrax to work
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Easily handled. I can simply disconnect the plug at the drop leaf bridge, and it becomes a point to point bus.
It's working smashingly with the MRC.
Lee
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I've been running through the schedule to see how things should work out for an ops session, and so far everything is going swimmingly. Apart from a couple of time consuming "operator error" issues, the yard is working smoothly, and my plan of working the through freights on the main is definitely a success. I've also been working on correcting a couple of wiring issues to make the yard run more smoothly.
I set up the outbound cut of cars on the A/D track. When the through train pulls up on the main, the yard crew goes out, pulls the set outs (which are conveniently blocked to the rear of the train) and swaps them for the pick ups. It takes a couple of minutes, but it simplifies everything, and allows the yard to keep jumping setting up locals and other cuts of outbounds.
As I'm going through, I'm figuring out where the best spots are to work in the locals and the Thomas Sub traffic. Once I've gone through the schedule from top to bottom, I may rig up a fast clock just to see if I can make sense out of it from the stand point of a time table. I never thought I'd get into that, but last time I ran at Eric's I liked the way the clock aided the ebb and flow of traffic.
Off to the train room to run the West Local down from Elkins!
Lee
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check out this link
http://www.thegmlenterprises.com/id19.html (http://www.thegmlenterprises.com/id19.html)
although i am quite sure you can probably rig one up simple enough... while i don't advocate stealing someone's product ideas, maybe you can inspiration from his control panel options that may be specific for you if you do-it-yourself.
Dave F. can probably chime (pun intended) in on it as well... he known as "Father Time" around my way... although he is spreading his wings in the Yard with respectable results :)
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It turns out that the MRC hand-held has a built in fast clock feature. I'll have to read up on how to set it. One issue it might have would be if when someone splits a switch and cause a brief outage if it resets. I'm sure I'll have plenty of occasions to test that today!
Lee
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So does Digitraxx in the 402D throttles. I have a Super Chief 8 amp Duplex wireless if you'd like, next time I'm down, I'll bring it with and we can fool with it. I also have Digitraxx's computer interface, which is what allows you to run JMRI software, soundbug, and DecoderPro (DP is worth it's weight in gold...No more CV programming on the throttles.)
I love my Digitraxx.
Russ
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Put in some time on the layout today, mostly on adding fascia around the front side across the windows.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-SaYEPSoH7WQ/Tp-EI8O8p6I/AAAAAAAAPoA/ChQt4x5rQDk/s720/Fascia%2B%25281%2529.jpg)
If you disregard all the rubbish below that narrow green band of masonite, you can see the progress. The most interesting (read Pain the Arse) part of the project was figuring how to make the helix look a little better, yet still keep it accessible for emergencies.
This is what I came up with.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-L3E37mbezDM/Tp-EGPweqHI/AAAAAAAAPn8/UuhPt4cPZro/s720/Fascia.jpg)
The portal on the left is the Connellsville sub going into the top of the helix. I cut the portal out of sanded plywood and added some trim pieces. The whole section from left to right was supposed to be one solid piece of plywood, but somewhere between the attic and the garage, I lost a half an inch, so I opted to just cut it in two and use some foam to fill the gap.
I'm going to make a "half dome of foam" to stick some scenery there next to the upper helix track, which is now, by the way, ballasted. If nothing else, I can use this as a photo backdrop for rolling stock shots.
The primary access for the helix remains up the middle... the blue tub you see there slides out, leaving plenty of room for even us full-figured railroaders. And I'm going to have to under there tomorrow, because I've got three more bike cable/click pen installations to do to get the A/D tracks fully functional.
So at this point, I've got about 6' of fascia to do around the Cumberland area, and another 4 or 5' on the front edge of the yard. Inch by inch, it's getting done!
Lee
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Last night I completed the ops schedule, ending up where I started with the West Local coming down the hill from Elkins, and the westbound train of ore and coal empties coming up out of east staging.
All tolled, there were 20 moves, although an actual session might involve a couple of more or a couple of less depending on the ebb and flow of local traffic. At the leisurely pace I ran (about 2 - 3 trains a night over the course of the week) the yard never got overwhelmed, and local moves got inserted as their traffic filled up a class track in the yard.
When the cycle was completed, there are two through trains set up in the yard ready to go (a coal extra bound for Allentown, and a mixed WM-6 train bound for Baltimore that includes a dozen Laurel Valley coal loads for Port Covington) as well as the Union Bridge Local, which handles North Junction and points east, and a few cars bound for Luke.
So, with that cycle run, I can confidently say that the schedule is up to the physical plant I've built, the train lengths and mix of traffic works, at least in a "one at a time" scenario, and the yard is plenty big enough, as long as it doesn't get slammed through over-aggressive dispatching. I do need to spend some time cleaning wheels and reseting decoders to get over a modest power shortage, but overall, everything worked well.
There are a few infrastructure issues remaining to be done, chiefly mechanization of a critical interlocking in the A/D tracks, the failure of the electronics in the turntable, and the construction of the industrial sidings at Cumberland. There's also something going on in the approach tracks to one of the west staging tracks that only afflicts Intermountain F units... and the usual assortment of dead spots around a few turnouts.
The optimal crew size remains 5, four on throttles and a dispatcher, with room for an extra yard operator, yard clerk, and perhaps a couple of conductors, but more than the basic might make the trains run too quickly for the yard to keep up.
Anyway, back to tinkering.
Lee
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A major advance on the technology front... I wanted to finish the west end of the A/D yard, which involved hooking up a few more manual switch throws. Two I could snake across the surface, and used the micro slide switches I've become quite enamored with.
The third was more complicated. I wanted to use another pen clicker, but this would be more complex because I wouldn't have the direct access to it the way I did for the other three during installation. Mechanically I wouldn't have too much trouble, but lining everything up to connect the slide switch near the points was going to be a nightmare.
So, I tried installing the slide switch on the pen itself... I ended up with this Rube Goldberg special...
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-si8s6EIeNFQ/TqXGRkXijOI/AAAAAAAAPpI/oH7ivJdW6qc/s640/Technicals.jpg)
I cut a 3/8" notch near the tip of the pen, to nest the slide switch in. I used clear heat shrink tubing to secure the switch to the pen barrel. a touch of gel CA cements it in place. Next, I bent a piece of relatively thick piano wire (.030?) to make a hook that snugs next to the metal pen point, tightened down by the screw post on the left. The wire was then bent to be able to insert it through the hole in the slide switch rocker.
After a million minor adjustments, I got the pen to click and fully throw the slide switch. So I wired it up, and inserted it into the fascia... from the inside. I had to pull the clicker end off, slide the barrel through the hole I drilled, then put the clicker back on. No problem. I use a 5/16" hole, which gives a nice snug fit.
Once that mess was installed, I hooked the other end up to the bicycle cable, which was then attached to the lever to throw the switch. Again a few minor adjustments, and mechanical success was achieved. At that point, just wired in the connections to the track power, and voila. Power routing pen!
Finally, with those nettlesome mechanical and electrical chores behind me, I dug out some more foam from the old Chaffee Branch and started forming up the landscape around Greenwood and the helix.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-pbuOkBVMTt0/TqXGWMrgHoI/AAAAAAAAPpQ/iimVXY_oWgY/s640/Greenwood%2525201011%252520%2525283%252529.jpg)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-2KwJ-jnewZU/TqXGTwViY2I/AAAAAAAAPpM/QVON2h6Uh7w/s640/Greenwood%2525201011%252520%2525282%252529.jpg)
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-f5oLY3Fgor4/TqXGYIp3zbI/AAAAAAAAPpU/Rk5hHydOs7s/s640/Greenwood%2525201011%252520%2525284%252529.jpg)
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-6LHDAxpReU8/TqXGae7WX1I/AAAAAAAAPpY/n536QUICHQg/s640/Greenwood%2525201011.jpg)
The A/D switches are located just behind the yard commissary building. The pen clicker is there sticking out of the fascia above the helix tracks.
Lee
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well,well, lookie at that UNPROTOTYPICAL switch throw pen thingy sticking straight out of the hill! :ashat:
Seriously, looks good, now I just hope i can remember which way is down . . .
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Very cool.
And the pen spring is strong enough to pull both the points and the slide switch "back"?
Reliably & for a long time?
Just wondering as I found the spring-loaded Caboose ground throws too wimpy for pulling the slide swiches.
But maybe I'm using stronger slide switches (radio shack).
Thanks for sharing!
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(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-6LHDAxpReU8/TqXGae7WX1I/AAAAAAAAPpY/n536QUICHQg/s640/Greenwood%2525201011.jpg)
Lee,
That skewed portal over the helix makes my skin crawl. The opening is so large that it's blatantly obvious that there is no tunnel lining. Why not rebuild a portal that is more perpendicular to the tracks and then you can fill over that with a foam scenery base? That will also hide most of that fascia for those low angle pictures.
Ducking for cover,
DFF
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Dave, this is one of those instances where form has to follow function. The helix is exposed so I can monitor progress up or down, and reach in from below to deal with any calamities. My preference would be to pull the yard scenery over the whole thing, but at this stage, I'm content with the compromise. The goal is to have a few other locales on the layout that are more conducive to photography...
And yes, MC, so far the pen clickers I've installed have performed well. I typically stretch the pen spring out a bit, maybe an extra 1/8 to 1/4" to increase the pull back. (The mechanical clicker holds the push position tight). Also, since there are two connection points between the pen and the points, you can crawl around and use the screw posts to make minor adjustments down the line if needed.
Phil, I'm working on rigging up some sort of signal to indicate red if the points at the top of the helix aren't aligned properly.
Lee
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Dave, this is one of those instances where form has to follow function. The helix is exposed so I can monitor progress up or down, and reach in from below to deal with any calamities. My preference would be to pull the yard scenery over the whole thing, but at this stage, I'm content with the compromise. The goal is to have a few other locales on the layout that are more conducive to photography...
Fair enough, but one question comes to mind: When have you ever been intimidated by hidden trackage? :trollface:
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The hidden trackage isn't that big a deal... The main issue is a 32" diameter loop under a 24" deep yard. If I pulled the yard all the way out, it would be harder to reach back in, it would visually clog Greenwood and the west yard throat, and also block up the dispatcher's desk more than it already is. Believe me, I've thought this corner out for 4 years before I even started building it.
Tonight I ground gooped around the area a bit. There's still more to do, so it's not really ready for prime time photography. But stay tuned. Maybe by next week's update it'll be in more or less finished form.
I'm amazed it's ended up as presentable as it is!
Lee
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(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-FuXsu8_2Ecw/TqdsiDN5KwI/AAAAAAAAPpk/9XxdZuYJAEo/s640/Greenwood1025%2B%25282%2529.jpg)
Fast freight AJ-2 clears the tunnel at Greenwood, heading eastbound toward the Casselman River and Ridgeley yard.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-BSLH7EMYy7s/TqdsnR5THPI/AAAAAAAAPps/kZ9JC3mjj7k/s640/helix1025%2B%25282%2529.jpg)
View across the Greenwood cut and the helix overlook.
Working on the base scenery for downtown Greenwood now. Just waiting for the liquor license for the Hard Hat to be approved!
Lee
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Very nice. The Hard Hat? Even better...
What did you use for the rock face in the back there? I need to do some rocks on the shelf, and that looks like a good technique for what I need.
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I used ... wait for it... rocks.
When I went out to Hancock over the summer, I scooped up a big pile of mud shale from the side of the ROW. I set it into the sculptamold, stuff in some ground cover, and wash it with thinned white glue.
I've added some more ground foam since I took those shots.
Lee
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Lee,
Ed may actually be referring to the "goop" or tinted Sculptamold that you used on the hill over the helix, because he asked about the rock face "in the back there."
DFF
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That's not even done yet... It will get a similar treatment, though. Tinted sculptamold, pressed in rocks, ground foam. That piece will be removable so I can peek inside the helix when needed.
Lee
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I was talking about the stuff back above the caboose.
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That's just blue foam, coarsely shaped, with enough of a schmear of sculptamold on it to hold it together. It's nowhere near finished.
Lee
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Thanks to my ADD and some unsupervised play time while my wife was in class, I started monkeying around with the lay of the land for Cumberland.
Thanks to some research via Google Maps, and some field photography from my friend Paul Hutter, a Cumberpatch local, I'm beginning to assemble some ideas.
The first thing that became apparent was the need for a more efficient run around track, since all of the industries are located on switch back spurs. So I dug around in the track box, and found a few remaining turnouts to press into service.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-3TrKOkkRSXE/TsSPKd40CUI/AAAAAAAAPvs/2d9QyD68hzE/s720/Cumberland%2Bindustrial%2BTrack%2B%25281%2529.jpg)
It's comprised of #5 turnouts, one left coming out of the curve, and a right. While this crossover is between the two mains, it is not a controlled crossover, and is only to be used for run around moves by the local crew. Thru traffic will almost always run through right hand rail, so there won't be many occasions for picking points coming out of the curve.
With that installed, I cut some foam to form a mock up of the industrial tracks behind the Cumberland Station. Utilizing one of the many wye tracks in my collection, I came up with the following:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-1aJ9M0mAY70/TsSPPs2iBWI/AAAAAAAAPwA/bgq8dBtIRYc/s800/Cumberland%2Bindustrial%2BTrack%2B%25288%2529.jpg)
The plan is quasi-prototypical, with the newspaper plant right behind the station. By my era, I'm not sure whether it was receiving paper by rail, but in my world it is. Also, I know there was a freight house near the station, and I'm sure there were other industries served by rail in this vicinity. I plan to build a freight house in the style of the one still standing at Hillen Street in Baltimore. The industries could be any kind of down townie warehouse or manufacturing places, not sure yet.
Anyway, this configuration will join the B&O interchange, the brewery, and the PPG plant already proposed for Cumberland. This will be another destination for a busy traveling switcher.
Stay tuned for further developments.
Lee
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Wow! :o Very nicely done. I skimmed thru many of the pixes and will make a more thorough go-thru when I get home. Thanks for sharing your journey.
I've still got a lot of pink & plywood showing, but Sculptamold and scenery aren't too far off.
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I like it. Who makes the stand-in WM warehouse buildings they look pretty neat?
The S.
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Lee,
Having worked Cumberland the one and only time I've "played trains" on the WM, I think the improvements you've made are spot-on! Good call!
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you need an SBVR interchange... although technically it is in Greenspring.. down the road a little...
how else are we going to ferry cars between the two layouts?
I can use the WM Interchange in Sandy Springs...
what say YOU?
8)
p.s that reminds me... i need a M&O interchange...
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How far is the reach there Lee?
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I built those structures out of card stock following plans published in MR a million years ago. If I remember correctly, I worked on them while I was waiting for my first daughter to be born. She's now 26. I'll try to take some better pictures of them so you can see how ratty they really are!
The buildings are located in Binghampton, NY behind the station...
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/mURI_temp_daf1c72b.jpg)
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/mURI_temp_c37a9e0c.jpg)
You can take a closer look when you come down.
The next step will be to cut out some 1/4" plywood to make the structural base, and lower the grade to account for the foundation of the Cumberland station. All the industrial tracks will be about 3/4" below the main line grade. The B&O interchange track will be on a fill at the same grade as the main.
My plan is to build the city blocks as removable panels that can be detailed and dolled up with interior lights and details, then plopped back into the layout.
@wazzou, the industrial tracks are all close to the aisle, within easy reach. Refer to the track plan below, and see Cumberland. The only thing that's a bit of a stretch is the Thomas sub line across the back of that section. But even that can be accessed from the aisle if the need arises.
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/upper_levelweb.jpg)
Lee
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As promised, my ancient and venerable card stock industrial buildings...
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-c86vpdHDjSU/TsZRv7UGKJI/AAAAAAAAPww/uyYoIMjkR-k/s912/New%2BWeeklies%2B091.jpg)
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/--NXL4yEiwVs/TsZRtTxSR1I/AAAAAAAAPws/K9N6W3bUPFQ/s912/New%2BWeeklies%2B092.jpg)
They've spent much of the last 10 years or so in storage, before that they were on the Delmarva Club layout for a couple of years, but otherwise haven't seen any active carloadings since about 1993.
I used a cardboard tube from a roll of paper towels for the curved end of the orange building, and some pinking shears to make the zig zag brick trim on Einbinders. Otherwise it was simply layering strips and shapes over a photocopy of the MR drawings.
The third building in the block was between these two, and you can see the facade in the background of this shot.
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/Laurel_Valley_Switcher.jpg)
I'm debating whether I should "renovate" these, or just chunk them and start over with styrene. I have a good supply of windows and doors and some Plastruct brick sheet, so I may be able to re-skin them.
I've got a couple of others, but they're in even worse shape.
Lee
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I'd chuck and restart . . .
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I think you'd be further ahead Lee by starting over. They look pretty rough at this point.
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I wouldn't chuck them, but maybe make them background buildings if you can. I think you'd need a little more detail since they'd be front and center at the location you were thinking of putting them,
Phil
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The orange one is stable enough to be a core that I could re-skin, in the process I'd cut out the windows and add styrene windows and glass. Einbinder's has definitely seen better days, and is likely headed to the scrap heap. I will probably cut them back to be shallow flats and place them against the back drop as the industries, then scratch out the freight house for the front.
To keep it era appropriate, I may model the freight house on the big concrete block structures that were at Hillen. Somewhere I've got a picture of that. It had a big WM logo painted on the end of the building that would be way cool...
Lee
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I think despite the age of those buildings and the deterioration, they look really believable...well done.
Oh and by the way, extra points to you Lee on Einbinder's for the Craft Scissor work on the facade.
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Enjoyed a casual afternoon of car bumping with Brian Bryan and Timmah. Tim brought his V&O and AM Gevos, which are beautifully done, although for some reason, Fox Valley opted for dull yellow LED's...
Part of the fun was test driving a new Bachmann RS-3 brought by Tim. I was extremely impressed with its performance. It m.u.'d effortlessly with a recent Atlas release, and handled the East Local with great aplomb. I'll be discussing this situation with one S. Claus in the coming weeks, in hopes that one arrives via the chimney in the living room...
Sadly, there was no photographic evidence of either of these momentous occasions, as we were all mesmerized into a stupor by the aromas of home made pot roast emanating from the galley two flights down.
Overall, the railroad ran well. What hiccups occurred were attributable to wheels that needed cleaning, and the occasional stray bit of ballast. The need for a proper time table and fast clock became even more apparent, as several near misses occurred on single track, and at least one instance of missing a crossover thus requiring a reversing maneuver.
The other thing that continues to parse down to further clarity is the need for wireless control. Even with the extreme number of outlets that have been installed on both sides of the aisle, we continued to find ourselves tangled in our throttle tethers. Bottom line on all of the systems, the layout runs great when I'm lone wolfing it, and certain sections are trouble free in just about anyone's hands, but there should definitely be some qualifying process to help the regular crew get more familiar with everything from simple rules (KEEP RIGHT!) to knowing which turnouts are decoder controlled, and which are on local panels. (Complete decoder control is on the horizon for the main lines.)
Physical plant-wise, we got a look at some more industrial develpment around the Cumberland area...
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-8yvwKRFsCWU/TsnKVJO_GNI/AAAAAAAAPyA/gv-XMTG7O_E/s720/Cumberland%2B1119%2B%25281%2529.jpg)
The fresh plywood there on the lower left will be the PPG Plate Glass plant. In reality this was on the other side of Cumberland, down by Mexico Farms, but it generated an interesting variety of traffic, and I have room for a large building and a couple of spurs, so it made the cut. It will be reached via a switchback that comes off there next to the Wills Creek beam bridge.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-aQbmUD3yIi0/TsnKX3c7zrI/AAAAAAAAPyE/bgjGaY8hHAI/s720/Cumberland%2B1119%2B%25282%2529.jpg)
The switchback tail runs along the bottom edge of Wills Creek, there behind the Cumberland control panel. The creek itself will be fitted out with a concrete channel, per the prototype, which should make this scene quite recognizable to anyone familiar with Cumberpatch.
The brewery will be on the far bank of the creek, which will extend back to meet the creek bed already built under the Hinshaw Bridge. It's looking like I'll need to schedule a separate local train just to switch Cumberland.
Lee
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Bliggity Blog updated. Pull up a chair and set a spell...
http://wmrywesternlines.blogspot.com/
Lee
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Sat down with some bits and pieces to build the receiving bins for plastic pellets at PPG.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-dSe9EFStEvM/Ts7cLrQPXrI/AAAAAAAAPyQ/itcuaVfYGIo/s720/PPG1.jpg)
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-31sYsgJfs5k/Ts7cRImADeI/AAAAAAAAPyg/rRPhX4xKq78/s720/PPG1%2B%25281%2529.jpg)
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-sUO0KipgJxU/Ts7cT4oSugI/AAAAAAAAPyY/b-_DlnqrHTE/s720/PPG1%2B%25282%2529.jpg)
The storage tanks are plastic sleeves gleened from a scrapped chandelier, the big ducts on top are chunks of sprue, and the rest came from the various junque boxes I have accumulated over the years. Hit it with a flat white rattle can, then went back to highlight a few things with some color.
The red structure is the old engine house from the temporary yard, it will be painted white and expanded to reach the warehouse tracks on the left. The office building is part of an old station kit that came in from the Bufkin Collection, which will be re-skinned a bit to provide some truck loading bays. I'll add a facade to represent a second large warehouse on the edge of the fascia, and I'm plotting to do it as a cutaway with a detailed interior.
If you have storage bins in your future, just let me know. We scrap 2-3 chandeliers a week at the ReStore. :D
Lee
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As promised, my ancient and venerable card stock industrial buildings...
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-c86vpdHDjSU/TsZRv7UGKJI/AAAAAAAAPww/uyYoIMjkR-k/s912/New%2BWeeklies%2B091.jpg)
Durn cool! They look really nice given what they are. If still on a shoe string they could still be useful until something more effective becomes accessible for ya.
Mark
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(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-1caofo9VK70/TtPUpk5q7rI/AAAAAAAAPzM/A05UsQoXiSk/s720/New%2BWeeklies%2B091.jpg)
Bob's C-Liners provide a little eye candy along the main line... That is all.
Lee
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...Trainphone...? :?
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...Trainphone...? :?
Oh, those plumbing pipes on the roof :)
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I got a bunch stashed away but putting those on is not one of my favority things to do.
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This crew has a Smart Phone...
(http://media.thestar.topscms.com/images/21/af/e75345f9461e8a7b393f3805a047.jpeg)
Chief
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Okay, so we compress time with a fast clock, but how do we compress distance? Usually it's an arbitrary factor based on the amount of space we have available. i.e., distance is more compressed on my layout than on Eric's, simply because he has a bigger room. Or is it? Eric might be modeling 500 or more miles, while I'm modeling less than 200. So how does distance relate to how we operate our trains?
Considering that our distances are the most substantially compressed dimension, using typical train length in lieu of scale miles could do the trick!
So, since a prototypical train can easily stretch out to a mile in length, it makes sense to take my typical train length of about 25 to 30 cars in N scale and use that as my benchmark "mile." This translates to about 1,000 feet, or 75" actual. Thus, I can compress my "mile" to 1,000 scale feet, and set my mileposts accordingly... This will help me determine where to put signals, whistle posts, and all manner of scenic and operational elements, including safe distance between trains...
Does this make any sense at all? Or should I just go fix myself another drink?
Discuss.
Lee
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Considering that our distances are the most substantially compressed dimension, using typical train length in lieu of scale miles could do the trick!
So, since a prototypical train can easily stretch out to a mile in length, it makes sense to take my typical train length of about 25 to 30 cars in N scale and use that as my benchmark "mile." This translates to about 1,000 feet, or 75" actual. Thus, I can compress my "mile" to 1,000 scale feet, and set my mileposts accordingly... This will help me determine where to put signals, whistle posts, and all manner of scenic and operational elements, including safe distance between trains..
This sounds like an excellent starting point--much better than just winging it--especially in terms of "operational elements" as you suggest. For example, an electrical block shorter than a train can be useful for DC control, but modeled blocks (for signals and operations) need to be able to at least contain an entire train, plus however much is needed for good visual effect between trains.
I suspect, though, that in order to get a useful length of mainline additional compression will be required. Even one-fifth of scaled real-world geography is still a lot of real estate.
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This is interesting. My sense is that distance and time scale effects compound rather than are independent. So the compression of space we have to fit our trains to a reasonable size (say 25 cars) is one kind of scaling, but the shorter lengths of distance between stations is another (2 scale miles instead of 25 miles). It all sounds an awful lot like work figuring it out :P
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Yeah. This is where I was going to make good use of staging (or at least visually blocked) trackage, so I could stop or slow down a train, rather than have it be so obviously roundy-round. Somehow though I'm thankful I switched to an urban harbor switching layout. Cramped trackage and scenery is prototypical so I don't have to worry about it.
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Does this make any sense at all? Or should I just go fix myself another drink?
Yes
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Bruce Chubb's old book "How to Operate Your Model Railroad" had a handy dandy table that provided this info. Wish I could find my copy. :D
From memory, believe it or not, using an 8:1 fast clock translated into 3 feet per mile.
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From memory, believe it or not, using an 8:1 fast clock translated into 3 feet per mile.
In my experience on Eric's NKP layout, which uses a 4:1 fast clock that we installed this fall, the fast clock works great to compensate for the compressed mileage for the operators on the road. In the yard, however, switching and blocking doesn't translate to a fast clock as well, unless you're classifying cars at ludicrous speed... when nobody's looking, of course. ;)
Father Time
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speaking of the fast clock... Lee, are you planning on using one?
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Jury's still out on that. I want to experiment with the distance compression and see if it nets any payoff. Given the much shorter distances available on my layout, I'm concerned about the fast clock/yard switching issue.
I'm concerned that strict adherence to the clock will create a kind of limbo out on the main lines.
Lee
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In my experience on Eric's NKP layout, which uses a 4:1 fast clock that we installed this fall, the fast clock works great to compensate for the compressed mileage for the operators on the road. In the yard, however, switching and blocking doesn't translate to a fast clock as well, unless you're classifying cars at ludicrous speed... when nobody's looking, of course. ;)
Father Time
Good point about using a fast clock in conjunction with a yard. I hadn't thought of that challenge.
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Isn't there a ludicrous setting on those DCC boards?
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One potential problem that I could see with compressing distance would be speed. If you compress distance at a rate of ~5:1, the speed of your trains will go up 5x. Put another way, at a given speed, a train can cover 5 times as many miles in an hour. This would seem to exacerbate the issue of trains that are usually already too fast.
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Funny thing, I had a brand new WM RS-3 show up in one of the yards today. Seems to have been misrouted for some reason. Anyhow, it's now headed for the proper railroad.
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Santa Bob strikes again!! :D
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One potential problem that I could see with compressing distance would be speed. If you compress distance at a rate of ~5:1, the speed of your trains will go up 5x. Put another way, at a given speed, a train can cover 5 times as many miles in an hour. This would seem to exacerbate the issue of trains that are usually already too fast.
Eric, I think of it this way: A train going 60 miles an hour travels a mile per minute. Now, using an 8:1 fast clock, that mile is represented by three feet of track. Your "minute" is now just 7.5 seconds long. So covering that three feet of track in 7.5 seconds is the equivalent of traveling at 60 mph.
I've only done a little operating with a fast clock (although I expect to be doing a lot more within a few months, if the layout gods cooperate). But I think the big surprise to a lot of folks is just how slow you have to go. At 30 mph, it takes 15 seconds to move three feet. At 15 mph, you're up to 30 seconds to cover three feet. That's crawling!
Jim
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Eric, I think of it this way: A train going 60 miles an hour travels a mile per minute. Now, using an 8:1 fast clock, that mile is represented by three feet of track. Your "minute" is now just 7.5 seconds long. So covering that three feet of track in 7.5 seconds is the equivalent of traveling at 60 mph.
I've only done a little operating with a fast clock (although I expect to be doing a lot more within a few months, if the layout gods cooperate). But I think the big surprise to a lot of folks is just how slow you have to go. At 30 mph, it takes 15 seconds to move three feet. At 15 mph, you're up to 30 seconds to cover three feet. That's crawling!
Jim
Jim, I definitely get that a fast clock's job is to slow the trains down and create "distance" by increasing the time it takes for a train to get from point A to B. I suppose if you used the two in conjunction, you could use them to balance each other, making the effect of the fast clock that much more pronounced. So take a 5:1 distance reduction, coupled with a 5:1 fast clock, and you've changed both terms of the equation equally, so a train going a scale 60 MPH will take a fast 60 seconds to go a shortened mile. Interesting...
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Lee,
I would recommend not using a fast clock. No one around me uses one and the reason was simple, if even one person isn't there, it can throw a whole schedule off if you are doing fast clock operations. Use a train sequence with real start times (could be based on a starting time of say 7:30 PM or 0 based) and go from there. It'll help keep your operator and dispatcher sane,
Phil
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It'll help keep your operator and dispatcher sane...
That's assuming they started even remotely close to sane, of course.
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Lee,
I would recommend not using a fast clock. No one around me uses one and the reason was simple, if even one person isn't there, it can throw a whole schedule off if you are doing fast clock operations. Use a train sequence with real start times (could be based on a starting time of say 7:30 PM or 0 based) and go from there. It'll help keep your operator and dispatcher sane,
Phil
I say BS to that old argument. The problem is your schedule not how you measure time. If it takes 30 real minutes to do something, you schedule 0.5*fastClockRatio fast-hours to do it. A fast clock doesn't really make time go faster or slower, you're just measuring it differently.
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Maybe I'll just go back to releasing a new train from staging whenever it's time to open the next beer... Much less controversial, especially after the 4th or 5th train is out... :trollface:
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Maybe I'll just go back to releasing a new train from staging whenever it's time to open the next beer... Much less controversial, especially after the 4th or 5th train is out... :trollface:
Definitely the way to go.
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Lee, your setup is like mine, in that you have a list of trains that are released according to a schedule with some trains being dependent upon what other trains pick up or leave off in the yard(s).
My question is, what is you're looking to gain by using a fast clock? I'm not using a fast clock myself, If your explanation is good enough maybe I should consider it! :D
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Maybe I'll just go back to releasing a new train from staging whenever it's time to open the next beer... Much less controversial, especially after the 4th or 5th train is out... :trollface:
I likes this one, even though I've yet to have a stake (or a steak) in this!
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Maybe I'll just go back to releasing a new train from staging whenever it's time to open the next beer... Much less controversial, especially after the 4th or 5th train is out... :trollface:
So the bottleneck becomes the bottleneck.
You put the N in zeN.
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Maybe I'll just go back to releasing a new train from staging whenever it's time to open the next beer... Much less controversial, especially after the 4th or 5th train is out... :trollface:
Will they have to take a drink at every signal?
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Having run Seusscaboose's layout on a fast clock, I like the way it helps manage the schedule. It is also useful to know when it's time to send everyone packing... :D
However, as noted above, Eric's layout is much more spread out than mine, so the fast clock works well as trains are located a fair distance from each other. On mine, becoming a slave to the clock may lead to a lot of unnecessary bottlenecks...
It might be worth an experiment, but otherwise, I'm not dedicated to the idea.
Lee
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Just to let you know I'm still working on stuff...
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-DePBb_1o2sg/TwaB79B6ilI/AAAAAAAAP3w/T0-EU_dmvWs/s640/New%252520Weeklies%252520138.jpg)
Lee
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Conjunction Junction... What's Your FUNction?
that will look nice when it is all blended together....
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Most of us normally put the sub-roadbed in before the track .. :scared:
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(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-DePBb_1o2sg/TwaB79B6ilI/AAAAAAAAP3w/T0-EU_dmvWs/s640/New%252520Weeklies%252520138.jpg)
What you have there is the layer cake that exists beneath the streets of Cumberpatch, and a little bit above. At the lowest level, you have the east staging loop. Next, where the NW engines are, is the Connellsville sub, the train is headed west. Above that is the West Sub main line, with the F units pulling mixed freight. To the left is the B&O S-2 working the coal mine on the Francis Branch, and last but not least, the chop nose geep is working its way east on the Thomas Sub.
The "No subroadbed" thing in front of the F's is (or more specifically "will be") the steel beam bridge just west of Cumberland Station. I've got the stuff to build it, but I want to fill in the fluff between the Thomas Sub and the west sub main. There will be a tunnel portal there at about the third car back. I'm probably going to want to make that chunk of scenery as a removable section.
I took this shot to illustrate my next N Scale column, wherein I discuss how liberating it is to design a complex track plan with DCC as your control system.
Lee
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Cool.
How it that S-2 running? Also did you get the decals?
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Pretty cool. It looks like the Tortoise is holding up one of the tracks.
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Bob,
The S-2 is a smashing success. It has a little throb to it, but hell, it's an Alco. It's almost like it has a sound system. I'm plotting and scheming how to put headlights in it.
And yes, I got the PRR decals you sent. Thanks!
And I can't recall if I already mentioned it, but your C-liners and S-2 are in Eric's care, he's going to try to connect with you to hand them off.
Thanks.
Lee
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Bob and I are in touch
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Eric
I made it to St Denis today and didn't have a chance to make it to you house. We'll get in touch hopefully soon.
Bob
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I'm starting to get excited about building out Cumberland. Urban scenery presents a fair amount of challenges, and for me one of those is getting some unique flavor out of the buildings. DPM is a good place to start, but frankly, I get weary of seeing the same buildings on everyone's layouts...
So I dove head first into the parts bin... and came up with this:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-WHyc1erssZU/Tw0CDBjNq3I/AAAAAAAAP4U/7TDdpnKJNVw/s512/BaltoStCMB.jpg)
I should first explain that I had some help from my friend Paul Hutter, who lives in Cumberland, and who went on a mission to get some pictures of buildings along Baltimore Street, the old main drag through town. He provided some outstanding examples, several of which are far beyond my modeling capabilities... But with a little smoke and mirrors, and plenty of stuff accumulated over decades of model railroading, I don't think I'll have a problem breaking up the monotony of the usual DPM parade...
Downtown Cumberland has some magnificent examples of late 19th/early 20th century architecture, and many of the main street buildings are very well preserved. Here's the pair I'm simulating...
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-rCH7T61JBDM/Tw0E4spqPlI/AAAAAAAAP5A/SD9c30Rklm0/s640/057.JPG)
I love the faux stonework on the one on the right, and the bold arch of the hobby store building is awesome. I'll be trying to get the flavors closer as I paint and further detail the buildings, but obviously, I'm not trying to build inch for inch replicas.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-6Bpzpv5uHpk/Tw0BzJKlVeI/AAAAAAAAP4Y/8m03ozmiDyg/s576/BaltoStCMB%252520%2525281%252529.jpg)
Bear in mind that my main street will be about 3' long, so there will be quite a clutter of buildings once it's done. My goal is to do a couple key buildings that capture the essence of Cumberland's streetscape, then use the usual suspects to fill in the blanks.
I'm giving most of the attention to the facades, because as you can see, the buildings are pretty much cheek by jowel. These will back up to the curved skyboard that encloses the Thomas sub helix, and will be placed closer to the rear of the scene. I like their three story elevations, and the arched windows.
To make the facades, I started with half of an old Heljan engine house to get the big single arch. I clipped out the pockets designed for the door "hinges" and simply shortened the opening as such. I used the doors to build up the arched windows, adding some strip styrene to fill in the gaps. A couple of Gloor Craft dual windows sufficed for the second floor. The first floor is all scratched out of strip styrene, with a couple of door and window frame castings to finish it out. I used DPM Modular walls cut in half to make the side walls, and blank sheet styrene to make the unseen rear of the building.
I just started the second building this evening, but I'll be adding the storefront next chance I get. You may recognize the twin arch windows as coming from the back wall panel of the Walther's Union City Roundhouse. (Recall that I accumulated about a half dozen of these kits to build the bones of my 22 stall roundhouse at Ridgeley, so odds are, you'll be seeing these windows again!)
Once they're painted I'm hoping they look a little closer to the proto photos, but I'm mainly concerned with getting the right flavor.
Perhaps David and the wizards at NZT can work on giving us some more arches and cornices to work with, since DPM's have gotten rather stale.
That is all for now...
Lee
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Nice Lee - very Queen City. You always have a good eye for capturing the essence of a scene. It would be cool to paint the window cornices in the 2-color scheme on the stone building. (Of course that means adding cornices to the 2nd story windows.)
-gfh
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After a successful run on ebay, I was able to order the last two Tortoises and decoders to finish automating the main lines. More news as it happens.
Lee
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Expanded and expounded...
http://wmrywesternlines.blogspot.com/
Lee
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Expanded and expounded...
http://wmrywesternlines.blogspot.com/
Fourth paragraph begins with a linked "Downtown Cumberland," but I'm afraid the linkey no workey.
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Fourth paragraph begins with a linked "Downtown Cumberland," but I'm afraid the linkey no workey.
It appears that some HTML tags got mixed into the link.
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It's supposed to be a link to a Google Map aerial view of the main street... I used the link Google provided, I suppose its some sort of intra-google thing. I'll try to fix.
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When I copied the link and pasted it Firefox it shows as one link being repeated twice. When I deleted the dupe, it works fine.
BB
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The Public Works Department up in Cumberland was hard at work today laying out Baltimore Street and environs. I'm using a benchwork technique I experimented with down at the Delmarva Club, which worked out pretty well.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-6L_PuVsEK5w/Tx4F_M7VBAI/AAAAAAAAP7o/nOJAflW5TNc/s720/Balto%252520St%252520Cmb%252520%2525283%252529.jpg)
I start with a masonite framework that follows the street grid. Since there's a lot of railroading going on below decks, I'm limited to how many risers I can use. Don't want to block access to the staging level or the flying hidden siding on the Connellsville line. By establishing the location and grade of the streets, I can accomplish that, as well as use the cut outs as the foundations for the city blocks.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-JlwSE81jOVU/Tx4GwkeuzII/AAAAAAAAP8I/MRCtppxeEw0/s720/Balto%252520St%252520Cmb%252520%2525282%252529.jpg)
The above shows the basic configuration of the buildings on the rectangular block against the backdrop. With the foundation in place, I can use shims to elevate each building slightly to have them properly climb the grade.
I made the main drag a total of 4" wide, which happily is the exact size of the styrene vertical window blinds I accumulated for the finished paving. This allows two traffic lanes, two parking lanes, and enough "lip" to support the sidewalks, which will be attached to the block modules.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-It4-TVePGrY/Tx4Ggoq7vSI/AAAAAAAAP8A/TSiz7Y1_Pg0/s720/Balto%252520St%252520Cmb%252520%2525281%252529.jpg)
I also solved the riddle of how to get Baltimore Street to disappear at the back of the scene.
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/CSX_near_City_Jct_Cumberland_2003.jpg)
On the north end of town, the old B&O Grafton line crosses Wills Creek, several roads and the WM on the City Viaduct. It's a crumbly old concrete affair with broad arches. Rummaging around in the junk box, I came across this plaster tunnel portal I've had for at least 30 years...
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-DhPxuaPe2q8/Tx4GD4vEUgI/AAAAAAAAP7w/4la165my294/s720/Balto%252520St%252520Cmb%252520%2525284%252529.jpg)
So now I have a one-arch homage to the great viaduct... This is in the back, and will be surrounded by urban clutter, so I'm hoping it just blends in nicely with its environment.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-VqjF8GRoYy0/Tx4GKOX6UGI/AAAAAAAAP74/ldFo6TDqZtk/s720/Balto%252520St%252520Cmb%252520%2525285%252529.jpg)
The next piece of business will be bracing this off with some risers, then I can start working on the city blocks in earnest.
Until then!
Lee
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Vertical window blinds! Haven't heard that one before ... but it sounds like a great idea.
Lee, is that a common source for roads (or styrene) I've just never run across before, or something you dreamed up at the ReStore?
(Always enjoy the updates, BTW.)
Jim
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(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-JlwSE81jOVU/Tx4GwkeuzII/AAAAAAAAP8I/MRCtppxeEw0/s720/Balto%252520St%252520Cmb%252520%2525282%252529.jpg)
Lee
*drool*
The S.
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Jim,
I work at a Habitat for Humanity ReStore, so I see all kinds of material come through that piques my interest as a modeler. We took in a whole pile of vertical blinds a few months ago, not the fancy type you'd have in a home... those are usually textured or covered with fabric. These are the cheesy kind you'd see in a government office. The strips are an off-white styrene, 4" wide, and the set I got were 48" long.
I could almost use them with just a little weathering and some scribed expansion joints to make concrete pavement.
Again, given the depth of this part of the layout, the best part is I can paint and otherwise prep the pavement off site, then install it in place. I'll try to pop some pictures of the paving material tonight or tomorrow. But for now, it's off to the ReStore to see if I have any other fun stuff for the layout!
Lee
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Resetting the ReStore has been keeping me on the go the last few days, but I've been able to get a little bit of tinkering time in. I've been working on painting the new buildings for Cumberland... Here's a little progress report...
Before:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-WHyc1erssZU/Tw0CDBjNq3I/AAAAAAAAP4U/7TDdpnKJNVw/s512/BaltoStCMB.jpg)
And After:
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-DjhP7zuA95k/TyIakKr-UNI/AAAAAAAAP9E/hnhyzMJd7Zg/s720/Balto%2520St%25203.jpg)
A couple of more touch ups, and this one will be ready for some lighting.
Lee
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I like the color combination.
I was going to ask if you were going to show any mortar lines but it appears the orginal building doesn't show any.
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I may throw a dark wash over it. Not all mortar is white or tan, you know!!
It would be nice if the brick detail around the arch was a little more refined, but this will be tucked back in a block about 3' from the aisle, so I'm not losing sleep over it. I even detailed the windows, even though the building will be wedged in between two others.
Lee
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I may throw a dark wash over it. Not all mortar is white or tan, you know!!
It would be nice if the brick detail around the arch was a little more refined, but this will be tucked back in a block about 3' from the aisle, so I'm not losing sleep over it. I even detailed the windows, even though the building will be wedged in between two others.
Lee
Correcto about mortar not having to be white or tan.
I've looked at a lot of brick buildings around here and there's a great many where you can't easily see the mortar.
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The sign of a true artisan when it comes to brick laying...
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In between leaning on their brooms and taking coffee breaks, the Cumberland Highway Department continued its good work today, completing the subroadbed for Baltimore Street, as well as installing the real estate needed for the Western Maryland Station. This also included establishing the line of U.S. 48, which will cross much of the scene on a bridge...
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-cz75TFnnMoQ/TyYWr3oDM6I/AAAAAAAAP-E/Cg_uBANVuHE/s720/Balto%2520St%25204%2520%25282%2529.jpg)
This overview shows the scene west of the station, with Baltimore Street, the concrete flood channel for Wills Creek, and the station laid in. You can also see some minor progress back at Hinshaw Bridge, where I've extended some foam downstream a little.
I'm using the sheets of plastic salvaged from a cheap set of vertical blinds. They're exactly 4" wide, perfect for a main street with two traffic lanes and two parking lanes. The sidewalks will overlap the outside edges to clean up the overall look.
Also, I'll be adding a road on top of the blue foam in the foreground that runs along the west bank of Wills Creek. It'll be handy for my little kid visitors who like to push automobiles back and forth.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-69RMoiq3Xg0/TyYW31KylRI/AAAAAAAAP-c/_ptHL13qKRI/s720/Balto%2520St%25204%2520%25284%2529.jpg)
This overview gives you a better look at the plastic sheet. Once I have it painted, I'll install it on the masonite frame with some spray adhesive. You can see the station is a little worse for wear. I started that almost 8 years ago, if you believe the photo uploads. I'm going to try to rehab it so it's at least the right shape for placement purposes, and hope that something better comes along.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-28NyMGPRoI0/TyYWmIqzTWI/AAAAAAAAP98/skaB7IbaT24/s720/Balto%2520St%25204%2520%25281%2529.jpg)
This view shows the entire scene, including the "cross town bridge" carrying US48 (now I-68) across the background industries, the station tracks, and the creek. Again, a single slice of vertical blind provides for 4 lanes of high speed traffic quite comfortably.
Tomorrow I'm going to finish a couple of lingering track wiring issues around the glass plant and the station tracks, then I can go full tilt making this installation more precise and permanent from below.
Lee
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So Lee, are ya gonna put in the hairpin exit ramp from 48/68 to street level after crossing the crick?
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I toyed with the idea, but I'm don't think I'll have room for it. I'll put up a big green sign to indicate that the ramp is just off stage...
Lee
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Looking great, Lee. Small suggestion: try tapering the roads slightly narrower as the recede in the distance to add a little forced perspective.
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Looking great, Lee. Small suggestion: try tapering the roads slightly narrower as the recede in the distance to add a little forced perspective.
He'll have to taper the cars too . . . :facepalm:
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David, I cogitated on that, and it may yet come to pass, but this section is about 4' deep, so the actual distance should do the trick.
Also, on the freeway bridge, I'd have a time tapering the guardrails, and as Phil said, the vehicles. I'll see how it plays out. I've got a million of those blinds slats, so it's not like I'll be wasting any material!!
Lee
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Nothing photogenic yet, but last night I worked on adding some wiring drops, and installing the trackwork for the newspaper and freight house behind the station. Should have that all wrapped up tonight, then I can start in on the scenic elements.
Lee
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I'm not sure why it took me so long, but I think I finally understand the geography you are modeling here. I was confusing this Cumberland setting:
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-28NyMGPRoI0/TyYWmIqzTWI/AAAAAAAAP98/skaB7IbaT24/s720/Balto%2520St%25204%2520%25281%2529.jpg)
with the B&O/Amtrak station a few blocks over. :facepalm: (I've only been to Cumberland in modern times.) So if I have my bearings right, the WM main crosses the the Potomac just to the right of the US 48 bridge as shown here:
http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=298862&nseq=15 (http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=298862&nseq=15)
which also includes the confluence with Wills Creek and the start of the C&O canal. The way you have US 48 laid out, you could include this confluence almost verbatim, including the curved bridge. Is that your plan?
I would also be tempted to put a photo backdrop of Cumberland in there too. Something like the top half of this shot, which is slightly hazy and not too detailed, and therefore good background material:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/brianbreighner/4945800651/sizes/l/in/photostream/ (http://www.flickr.com/photos/brianbreighner/4945800651/sizes/l/in/photostream/)
(You can also see the Potomac bridge in this shot pretty clearly.)
-gfh
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That second aerial is a good reference, it's just about the same angle as my picture.
RE the confluence of the creek and the Potomac, that will be occurring in the aisle. The elevation change necessitated by the Connellsville line makes it impractical to try to include the scene. There is a bridge a bit further along, but it's straight, and a thru truss.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-MQG8vCNOipg/TfTCiNGOOTI/AAAAAAAAOZ8/1kokvZupbCM/s800/New%2520Weeklies%2520004.jpg)
The lower track is the Connellsville Sub which is routed underneath Cumberland, a concession to the layout's givens. I've installed the creekbed at an elevation about 1/2" higher than that, with the Cumberland main line crossing directly above. I'm using a steel girder plate to mask the "Tunnel to Nowhere" on the lower line. I'll try to tidy up and take some progress shots tonight.
Another project I'm going to try to engineer will be the WTBO neon sign up on the hill side above the east side of town. It lights up W- T---B---O--- then it flashes on WTBO. I'm sure there's a circuit wizard out there who can bring these red LED's to life...
Lee
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Another project I'm going to try to engineer will be the WTBO neon sign up on the hill side above the east side of town. It lights up W- T---B---O--- then it flashes on WTBO. I'm sure there's a circuit wizard out there who can bring these red LED's to life...
Yes! I was looking for pictures of that too. Very iconic for Cumberland.
-gfh
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if you get to rub a couple pennies together, Micromark has an "experimenters kit" for the electro-luminescent stuff that they make their HO light up bill boards out of.
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That's an idea... I was thinking of doing a piece of etched acrylic, you know, going to the sign maker, having the call letters cut into the back of some clear stock about 1/8 thick, then arranging four red LED's under each letter, then having someone much smarter than me whip a circuit to make it go.
I'll have to have my Cumberland Connection shoot a night time video of the sign in all its glory...
Lee
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if you get to rub a couple pennies together, Micromark has an "experimenters kit" for the electro-luminescent stuff that they make their HO light up bill boards out of.
That's true--their animation kit has a programmable circuit that has the classic 1-2-3-4-all sequence (among about 30 others). The only problem with the EL stuff is that it doesn't produce bold colored light--just a wimpy blueish color or a wimpy pinkish color. Even gels don't help much--they just tend to diminish the brightness. Ngineering might offer a better solution--if they don't have a circuit for the sequence, they'll program a custom circuit for $20.
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While I'm dreaming of my radio station sign, I've otherwise been having fun with Cumberland. Here's the new freight house for Cumberland, starting with a DPM Trackside Transfer kit.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-74nfS0Xo3AE/TzJ1TqD8ZiI/AAAAAAAAQAM/cZo-YLj5Hnk/s1024/CMB+Frths.jpg)
I modified the loading doors with some corrugated styrene to represent rollup doors, the roll covers are cut from sprues I had laying around. I also changed the dock roof to corrugated, and built a sloped roof for the main building. The trackside wall was eliminated and replaced with a solid wall of 12' wide roll up doors, more typical of WM practice on its later freight houses. (I'll post some shots of that side once the batteries recharge for the camera!)
But that's not all... as night falls over the city...
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-jri94hOeBKk/TzJ1tkWcpGI/AAAAAAAAQAU/TIAwyIWCLJc/s1024/CMB+Frths+%281%29.jpg)
The lights begin to come on to illuminate the round the clock nature of the railroad...
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-LtgMmJutb1s/TzJ2erfwa8I/AAAAAAAAQAc/sv3k-JJaKSE/s1024/CMB+Frths+%282%29.jpg)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-g2iz52aeq5Y/TzJ2uVvV-kI/AAAAAAAAQAk/HqXO3WcarQI/s1152/CMB+Frths+%283%29.jpg)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-gyqLymC0rxQ/TzJ3CtmKIhI/AAAAAAAAQAs/mtOkU8Newoc/s1024/CMB+Frths+%284%29.jpg)
I love LEDs. I can eat them by the handful!
Lee
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OK, Lee. For ignoramuses like me who've barely thought about adding exterior lighting, can you give us a brief how-to and list of materials?
Looks like the makings of a great scene!
Jim
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Luv the roll-up doors Lee.
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I went on eBay and bought some of those direct from China LEDs, they're usually 100 pieces for about $12 with free (but painfully slow) shipping. I'm using 5mm bright white for the interior lighting, and 1.8mm yellow for the outside lights.
The LEDs are shipped with the resistors needed to step down 12-16v, and I'm using a 9v power DC wall wart power source. As such, I have to wire the resistor to the + side consistently, or they won't light.
To route power, I run a pigtail into the building using a 2-conductor phone cord, with the jack end dangling below the benchwork about a foot or so. I use an old piece of c80 track or two as roof rafters, and solder the phone cord one side to each rail, with jumpers as needed to get to the other rails. From their, I simply solder the resistors to the + side, and black wire to the -, wash, rinse, repeat until all the LEDs are lit.
Finally, I wire the 9v power source to a series of phone jacks under the layout, plug in the pigtail to the phone jack, then the wall wart into a power strip, and Bah Zinga! The building blazes forth in unparallelled glory.
I'll be using this method to wire entire city blocks, with the phone jack allowing me to unplug and pull the block into the workbench for further detailing etc. I'll take some pictures to illustrate the process and try to post them this evening. At some point I'm going to go back and retrofit the paper mill, which I did with Christmas lights. It was cheap, but not quite as effective as the LEDs.
I do like the contrast of the bluish interior lighting, similar to flourescent or mercury vapor lights, and the yellow sodium lights outside... I've also got some warm white, blue, green and red in the repertoire... Coming soon to a street corner near you!
Lee
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Thank you, Lee. This ignoramus thinks that is quite doable.
Jim
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Looking good Lee. You'd better pull that cork out so the trailer deck matches the height of the dock or your going to have to stuff those trailers by hand.
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We threw out a bunch of old cordless phones at the store today, so I salvaged some more wall warts. I've got a 9v AC which will hopefully reduce the frustration level if I get a wire backward somewhere. And yes, dear Wazzou, the photo is "for placement only"... the details will be parsing down in the coming days.
My plan is actually to build up the paving. The dock is set at boxcar height, so a few extra inches of backfill will be needed before the asphalt goes down!
Lee
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Here's the "topless" picture you've all been waiting for...
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-acVGaquD88s/TzNPJEPt97I/AAAAAAAAQBI/G7oUNknNbQo/s720/CMBFRT2+%289%29.jpg)
You can see how I used old c80 rail to provide the power to the various LEDs in and outside the building. A pair of wires run into the annex at one end of the building to light that.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-IiFTfKnJrgc/TzNcWFfwfyI/AAAAAAAAQBk/vJTzSyd2x1Y/s720/CMBFRT2+%283%29.jpg)
Here it is all lit up. I added two lights to the fascia over the rail loading bays to help illuminate the industries that will be behind the freight house. This will also be below the highway bridge. I'm pretty excited about how this is going to look...
Lee
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Looking good Lee. That freight house has such a mid-century feel to it, and the lighting is really effective. I was inspired to dig around for some more photos of Cumberland and came across this page that might wet your whistle, so to speak:
http://korns.org/misc/RR-TC/RR-TC.html (http://korns.org/misc/RR-TC/RR-TC.html)
Lots of shots of Cumberland from the turn of the century to the 60s, with a strong WM and B&O presence, including this shot from 1957:
(http://korns.org/misc/RR-TC/080.jpg)
Is this the same freight house? If so, you need that sign and apparently a bunch of cars parked about.
-gfh
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That's sort of it, Gary. The location of it is about right. I believe that building was torn down in the early 60's to make way for the freeway bridge, so I'm "bending light" in a couple of instances. Using the DPM kit as a base takes out the pitched roof, but gives me the lower profile I need, since I'm crossing the site with the highway on a viaduct. The layout of the building overall is very loosely based on the freight house that stood at York, PA, with the sloped roof and the wall of wide roll up doors on the track side.
I've also fashioned some signs to go on the annex that are reflective of the signage at York. Stay tuned for some pics.
I'm developing some ideas to replace this building with something even more WM flavored, but for now this is a good place holder. (another advantage of using easily unplugged modular wiring!!)
Lee
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Using the old C80 rail is a very groovy idea.
"Fits" with the structure as rafters, too.
I got some copper tape http://www.homedepot.com/buy/outdoors-garden-center-animal-pest-control-insect-mosquito/corry-s-15-ft-slug-and-snail-copper-tape-barrier-182003.html (http://www.homedepot.com/buy/outdoors-garden-center-animal-pest-control-insect-mosquito/corry-s-15-ft-slug-and-snail-copper-tape-barrier-182003.html) that I was going to try on the ceiling of buildings to run the lights off of, but I'm a-re-thinkin' mah thinkin'.
Thanks for sharing, Lee.
I really dig the various colors to subtlely separate the scenes.
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(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-m_jwPLwkCdI/TzPW_qHanRI/AAAAAAAAQC0/gmRwPDPSz_g/s1440/New+Weeklies+153.jpg)
Now with signs!
The big signs follow the York warehouse style.
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/wm-york-fh-w.jpg)
I'd love to build a replica of the York head house for this... Maybe one day.
The sign on the canopy follows the WM practice on most of its stations and TO offices.
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/Our_Travels_038.jpg)
Now I'm thinking of adding a couple more LEDs to illuminate the signs on the annex...
I've tried the copper tape, but I never had much luck with it sticking permanently, especially after trying to solder to it after it's installed.
Lee
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(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-y6JzlQcPVxc/TzZY1CO7rsI/AAAAAAAAQC8/L_kla9QIHnE/s720/backflat1+%282%29.jpg)
As introduced elsewhere in these pages, there's a new business, Hoffman Manufacturing, that has joined the Cumberland Chamber of Commerce.
There's some interesting 1:1 Hoffman Manufacturing companies out there on the interwebs, and I'm seeking suggestions as to what type of business this should be. Here are some of the likely candidates:
http://hoffmanmanufacturing.com/
Sheet metal fabrication... Interesting, maybe coil steel going in and lots of odd little products going out... or
http://www.hoffmanmfg.com/
This one's based in Oregon, and does a lot of environmental techno stuff, which is right up Phil's alley being as he's a science nerd, but might be a little too green for a gritty industrial site in 1970. I did notice they make vibrators though... Might make for some interesting carloadings.
http://www.hoffmanmc.com/
This one's my favorite so far... Good medium scale manufacturing, good potential for inbound and outbound freight, and a product I have at least a working understanding of... Also likely to have existed in 1970.
http://www.hoffmanonline.com/index.aspx?cat_1=1361
Air conditioning systems... another good one for the building in question, and without a doubt, the most workable logo for signing the building. Flat car loads of large heavy objects could be sourced here.
As always, your thoughts and opinions are welcome...
Lee
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Personally I'd go with option 3 because it would give you an excuse for a gantry crane and all sorts of other ad ons to move the steel. And asdly you are correct - the enviro techno stuff is too new for your era..
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Today my attention turned to US 48, which passes through town on a tall viaduct. I picked up some basswood at Ben Franklin (the closest thing to a hobby store around here since Hobby Town USA went teats up) to build the pilings, and pulled some Rix bridge railings from the collection of stuff I've accumulated.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-DCFhKDnwSA4/TziMw_COH1I/AAAAAAAAQDk/8VF6OcfFcNM/s720/CMB48.jpg)
I have three 3/16" I beams running under the deck. I plan to add some larger and more detailed girders along the outside where they'll be more visible. To make the center guard rail, I used some Gold Medal brass ladders laid on their sides, and sandwiched between two strips of styrene.
Here's a wider look at the scene:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-LGkDbRvOzSM/TziNb9cJjVI/AAAAAAAAQDs/IsrVOBPHqUQ/s720/CMB48+%281%29.jpg)
The upper shelf is the Thomas Sub where it exits the helix. I'll be adding a slightly wider fascia board to that to mask the hardware and wires under there. Ultimately, the highway will have street lights, road signs and other details to draw attention away from the upper deck.
This view shows the proximity of the bridge to the station, and the type of girders I need to build for the long sections.
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/mURI_temp_4e66daa2.jpg)
The last major scenic element to deal with in this corner is the B&O interchange track, which shouldn't be too big a deal. I've got to get a few more packs of I-beams, and install the flood walls in Wills Creek... then we'll be careening headlong into the station building project....
Lee
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More views of the bridge as it progresses...
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-OTIO_WdoVAY/TznbZMztq4I/AAAAAAAAQEA/e5Xia5xs3dw/s1044/US48cmb3+%284%29.jpg)
Concrete pilings installed
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-F9Gx6CHh-Dg/Tzntz9o6C8I/AAAAAAAAQEM/lB_xMdXmJkw/s1044/US48cmb3+%285%29.jpg)
Bridge deck assembled, aligned and masked
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-3OK1uuZvdpM/Tznt21-x1GI/AAAAAAAAQEU/evHB6BnoP6Y/s1044/US48cmb3+%286%29.jpg)
Roadway paved and lines marked.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-GpOBYxwOb7o/Tznt-o36_oI/AAAAAAAAQEs/EJHyYHGJFxc/s1044/US48cmb3+%2811%29.jpg)
Details painted.
Final touches will include the big main beams, and street lights, along with some signs.
Lee
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Wifey's at a conference in Ocean City, so in the hotel, I built the heavier looking beams for the highway bridge. I'll post a couple pics when I get home on Monday.
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Okay, for those of you concerned about the structural integrity of the US 48 bridge, here's the progress I made this weekend...
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-rw7VrdXcdOo/T0RtzcLK5yI/AAAAAAAAQHM/-h08wtQeGFU/s735/us48CMB4+%281%29.jpg)
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-SoMLGjd-PnI/T0RuLB4FbuI/AAAAAAAAQHQ/QP0Fshd-aA8/s735/us48CMB4+%282%29.jpg)
Still a bit more to do in the painting and weathering department, and there's a few minor alignment issues to iron out, but I think this accomplishes what it needs to. I used 3/8" Evergreen tile, split off one row of tiles, and added strip styrene to get the ribs. The section over the main line tracks will be removable.
While waiting for paint to dry, I started monkeying around with some el cheapo signals I picked up on ebay for a song...
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-fESTvBv89rY/T0RvQfQUz5I/AAAAAAAAQHU/VwYx_-2DLR0/s735/cmbsig.jpg)
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-lemlAJnPL2w/T0RyB0Ref9I/AAAAAAAAQHg/RQp60m4vD_Y/s735/Signals+%281%29.jpg)
You'll pardon the hasty paint job. These come from our favorite Chinese ebay vendor, "We Honest" :scared:, and they're a pretty good deal for what they are. They're about the same height as an NJ International, but clearly nowhere near as well detailed. But I got four signals for the price of one NJI, including shipping. I have a couple of NJI's that I'll be using in high visibility locations, but these are not bad for stand ins. The main issue is the heads are pretty fat, and they don't trim much off the LED connections on the back. But a little black paint and a good photo angle can cure a world of sins.
Currently I'm using these simply as switch indicators, but I'm planning to buy enough to install signals everywhere they'll be needed. One day the electrical elves will come to help me wire in a proper signaling circuit.
The next signals I'll install will be at the top of the helix to West Staging, so that begat some scenery work around Greenwood. I decided to add a little more real estate to the town, so I bumped out the fascia with a piece of 2" foam. It went from this:
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-SaYEPSoH7WQ/Tp-EI8O8p6I/AAAAAAAAPoA/ChQt4x5rQDk/s735/Fascia+%281%29.jpg)
To this:
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-6pTpagrCcbE/T0RwQu7e8RI/AAAAAAAAQHY/96ZQG0BYJFU/s735/gwd221.jpg)
Adds a little breathing room around the depot, and will generally allow for a little more "nothing" on the aisle side of the tracks. Probably a stand of trees or something.
Stay tuned for more excitement.
Lee
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Adding the extra 2" of scenery along the fascia makes a huge improvement!
Eric
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I agree, adding foreground scenery makes an incredible difference.
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Adding the extra 2" of scenery along the fascia makes a huge improvement!
Eric
Not necessarily during busy ops sessions when there are multiple operators who could stand to have two inches or more removed from their waistlines. :trollface:
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Not necessarily during busy ops sessions when there are multiple operators who could stand to have two inches or more removed from their waistlines. :trollface:
Of which you, Mr Foxx, are not one (yet)
8)
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That's why "Bean Pole" Foxx will be the Elkins operator...
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Can you share a link to the signals in question? Everything I see on ebay seems a tad above your "for a song" price point.
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http://www.ebay.com/itm/400248654467?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649
For $40 you can get 10 signals. Check the Other Items search, and you'll see he does 2 aspect (red/green) and 2 and 3 aspect dwarfs.
If you can live with the "plump" signal heads, they're a pretty good deal.
Lee
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The bridge looks great Lee.
-gfh
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Progress on several fronts. The windows for the Cumberland Station arrived today, so I spent the better part of the evening figuring out the best way to install them. I think I've succeeded, and they're looking great. Thanks, Zox!
I also worked on un-warping the Plastruct walls so the building looked less like it was made out of overcooked pasta. So far so good, look for photos in of progress here there and everywhere some time tomorrow.
Also got some more work done in Greenwood PA, location of my N scale version of the Hard Hat. I built the facade of the concrete overpass to look more or less like the one over Burhans Boulevard at the east throat of Hagerstown Yard, and I think I pulled it off okay... got the road work done around that, too. Again, too late for pics at the moment, but they'll be up before the weekend gets away.
I also found an old green highway sign I had made years (decades!) ago with press type lettering... I need to revise it to reflect the exits around Cumberland from US 48. Anyone have a half cup of Futura medium font I can borrow? I've got to hurry up and finish some of these projects... if the weather keeps being warm like this, the neighbors will wonder why I'm not painting the house... (especially the neighbor that lives with me!!)
Lee
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(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/WM_Burhans_Blvd_Bridge.jpg)
Burhans Blvd in Hagerstown...
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-XE12m1W3RlQ/T1K9iRzyq_I/AAAAAAAAQLw/fsTJ8NSaad4/s735/More+Greenwood+%281%29.jpg)
Hard Hat Boulevard, Greenwood, PA.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-JS-IaNpwb20/T1KjL_w7JPI/AAAAAAAAQLA/Zul_TW_dzk0/s735/Cumberland+Station+%281%29.jpg)
Paper windows from Lord Zox
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-Heq5r9aWz6g/T1KjZKpKAsI/AAAAAAAAQLk/VsPuUiEtw2Q/s735/Cumberland+Station+%283%29.jpg)
Gradually taking shape...
Lee
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Rob's Silhouette paper windows are the absolute bomb. It was such a simple and effective solution, no wonder it took six years to figure it out!
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-A8ibravB5XQ/T1Nv--t0EFI/AAAAAAAAQME/M_YCMlb6RP8/s735/CMBSTA312+%281%29.jpg)
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-1AuBS2XZEW8/T1NyQo3nTvI/AAAAAAAAQMU/_m8KFIuGrOU/s735/CMBSTA312+%282%29.jpg)
The white strip is a .020 rod that ended up being the margin of error to get a tight seam on the corner. Not bad considering this building has been in storage for about 6 years since I built the original walls.
Lee
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That scene is HAWT! Well done Lord Zox!
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Next we'll start peppering the thing with LED's...
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It was such a simple and effective solution, no wonder it took six years to figure it out!
You just had to wait for technology to catch up to your vision. It happens to Real Men of Genius all the time. :)
Of course, now that I've got my part of your project done, I don't have any excuse to procrastinate any longer on my own projects... :)
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Very nice - both the Hard Hat and the station windows. Where on the layout is the Hard Hat?
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(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/upper_levelweb.jpg)
It's there where it says "To West Staging" to the right of the window. The overpass behind the Hard Hat is the west approach to the yard. I've got to have David update the drawing for me. That section was nothing but a concept when this was prepared, and the yard is completely revised over what's drawn too.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-SaYEPSoH7WQ/Tp-EI8O8p6I/AAAAAAAAPoA/ChQt4x5rQDk/s735/Fascia+%281%29.jpg)
There's a more photographic reference.
Lee
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After dinner, I toggled back and forth between the road work at Greenwood and the Cumberland Station. At Greenwood, I installed "the other side of the tracks" after striping and painting the roadway on a chunk of vertical blind slat. After questioning MC's sanity over using Gorilla Glue for scenery installations, I gave it a whirl on the roadway, and dammit, if it's not the best thing since the snooze button on an alarm clock. The approach from the Hard Hat dips down a bit, and I wanted to make sure the slope wasn't unrealistically steep, but it also had to nest in the web of the c55 rail... I Gorilla Glued it, clamped it in place, and it makes a darn tidy installation. You can see a corner of it in the most recent Hard Hat picture shown above.
I'll pop some pics in the morning once the new section on the aisle side is in place.
At the station, I worked on doing the detail painting on the building, doing the cornice, frieze board, window sills, and the runs of stone along the top of the foundation. I also added a few more partitions in the foundation, which further stabilized and leveled the building. Did I mention that I used still more vertical blind slats in this application? It just keeps looking better and better. When that's done, I'm going to need to have a cigarette, for sure... Again, pics in the morning.
Lee
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Careful with that Gorilla Glue. It expands. :o
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Careful with that Gorilla Glue. It expands.
I used the stuff exactly once, and even knowing it expanded, I found it to be far too much trouble than it was worth. Plenty of other non-expanding adhesives out there.
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I'm quite familiar with Gorilla Glue... remember, I have a 100+ year old house...
I found that if I screed it out to a thin coating and clamp it securely, it works just fine. I had a little bit bubble out at the point where the highway meets the fascia at Greenwood, but other than that, I'm quite pleased with the results. I don't think it will be my first line adhesive, but where it's needed for strength or durability, it can work.
Here's the situation on the Gorilla Glue...
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-P-UMVRyuZBI/T1WLVpshdYI/AAAAAAAAQMw/J0xvG0YwUiM/s735/Greenwood3512+%282%29.jpg)
Note the slope from the intersection down to the grade crossing. The slope down actually begins in the middle of the intersection, accomplished by cutting successive layers of corrugated cardboard in a sort of contour map sort of way. I think there are 3 or 4 layers under there. The first layer compensates for the cork roadbed, the next is cut back a bit to get the distance to the top of the rail, then the next two layers are cut back into the intersection to keep it from being silly looking.
As you can see, the clearance for plow pilots, low hanging ladders and so forth is a potential hazard here, so I wanted to make sure that the road surface and the timber crossing were tight, and permanently affixed. The Gorilla Glue and a couple of clamps worked just so, and I'm pretty pleased with the result. I have yet to run a train through it (I checked clearances with the SD40 pictured, and a couple of various freight cars, but no "real world" tests have been done yet.) which may lead to some minor adjustments, but the appearance is just what I was looking for.
Given the geography of the area I'm modeling, the idea of a "plywood plains" effect, even for this small town vignette, is anathema to me.
I also needed to provide a location for the local teenagers to bottom out their moms' station wagons.
Lee
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Looking good Lee. What size tape are you using to mask the stripes?
I am a fan of Gorilla Glue, but as others have noted I have learned what amount I have needed to control expansion.I have found in some instances it to not be as strong as reported, but I see they now have a stronger formula out.
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I think it's 1 point, or 1/16". I'll have to look at the package. It's whatever I could get my hands on at Staples, since there are no more proper graphics supply stores on the planet. I prefer to use something finer, but outside of ordering it on line and paying more for shipping than for the product, it's pretty hard to find.
Lee
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I am a fan of Gorilla Glue, ... I see they now have a stronger formula out.
:? In the polyurethane formula? They're marketing a CA, an epoxy and a wood glue out under the label, but these are nothing extraordinary.
The newer "dries white" glue is weaker and IMO has too little open time for anything more than quick spot repairs.
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(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-P-UMVRyuZBI/T1WLVpshdYI/AAAAAAAAQMw/J0xvG0YwUiM/s735/Greenwood3512+%282%29.jpg)
Looks like I've got an opportunity for a drainage culvert there next to the road. I'll have to have Ed thumb through some of those magazines in his sock drawer so he knows what it should look like. :trollface:
Lee
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:? In the polyurethane formula? They're marketing a CA, an epoxy and a wood glue out under the label, but these are nothing extraordinary.
The newer "dries white" glue is weaker and IMO has too little open time for anything more than quick spot repairs.
I believe so. I saw it in the back of a magazine the other week. Can't remember which one for the life of me now. There was a red banner on the bottle saying something like improved stornger formula. I saw the dries white one too, but did not know it was weaker.
I constantly make "highway side" repairs of other officers knives where the belt/pocket clip screws loosen and it does not hold tightly. I was using Loctite red but found that to break its hold over time as well. I switched to Gorilla Glue, and it works so much better, but I found one that I have have to redo. The others are still rock solid...but I think that one may be attributed to stripped threads on the screws.
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I'm quite familiar with Gorilla Glue... remember, I have a 100+ year old house...
LOL.
I found out the hard way with Gorilla Glue. Tried fixing an old magnet that my wife cherished, and the glue expanded and oozed out the sides, a made a complete mess. Into the trash it went...
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LOL.
I found out the hard way with Gorilla Glue. Tried fixing an old magnet that my wife cherished, and the glue expanded and oozed out the sides, a made a complete mess. Into the trash it went...
:facepalm:
I found out with T nuts for legs I was making for the Simonds IT. I put some GG around the nut sleeve when I pounded it into the leg, and then when I put the leveling bolt in I was like WTF wont this thing go in! (thats what she said) Took a socket wrench to get it in, and then a few turns in and out and all was good.
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Although I avoid polyurethane glues like the plague, the Gorilla Glue CA formula is actually really good, IMO. I prefer it over any other thick CA I've tried. For one thing, it's really thick. It also dries relatively slowly, giving you some wiggle-room time. And when it sets, the adhesion is impressive. It now joins Brush-On Krazy Glue as my two preferred CA-based adhesives.
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Although I avoid polyurethane glues like the plague, the Gorilla Glue CA formula is actually really good, IMO. I prefer it over any other thick CA I've tried. For one thing, it's really thick. It also dries relatively slowly, giving you some wiggle-room time. And when it sets, the adhesion is impressive. It now joins Brush-On Krazy Glue as my two preferred CA-based adhesives.
I agree. I used it quite a bit when I was building my flooring tile rock walls a few months ago. It has now become my CA of choice.
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(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-A8ibravB5XQ/T1Nv--t0EFI/AAAAAAAAQME/M_YCMlb6RP8/s735/CMBSTA312+%281%29.jpg)
Lee
Can't. Stop. Staring.
:drool:
The S.
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Can't. Stop. Staring.
:drool:
The S.
+1
Beautiful structure!
Eric
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(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-P-UMVRyuZBI/T1WLVpshdYI/AAAAAAAAQMw/J0xvG0YwUiM/s735/Greenwood3512+%282%29.jpg)
Lee,
I realize that the road where the future "culvert by Ed" will be installed is likely only resting in place and not permanently installed. So, when you do install it, allow me to make a suggestion. Looking at the transitions between the road and the tracks, there's already a "bump" on the far side of the tracks that cannot be changed. If the road on the near side joins the tracks at the angle it's in now, that makes for a really uncomfortable car ride. I'd suggest flattening the road so that it is in the same plane as the wooden crossing, so there's only the bump on the far side. In other words, remove some of the concave bow in the road. It'll look better, too.
DFF
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or he could just drop the fascia end so cars going downhill REALLY go downhill. 8)
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So, Dave, how much time have you spent driving across grade crossings in small Pennsylvania towns?
I believe in the metropolitan suburbs they call this sort of thing a "traffic calming device"... :lol:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-8D0i1SU6CX4/S6Lg8iPBSTI/AAAAAAAAJAE/BHyNEnhX_-I/s1096/Excursions+127.jpg)
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Lee,
I realize that the road where the future "culvert by Ed" will be installed is likely only resting in place and not permanently installed. So, when you do install it, allow me to make a suggestion. Looking at the transitions between the road and the tracks, there's already a "bump" on the far side of the tracks that cannot be changed. If the road on the near side joins the tracks at the angle it's in now, that makes for a really uncomfortable car ride. I'd suggest flattening the road so that it is in the same plane as the wooden crossing, so there's only the bump on the far side. In other words, remove some of the concave bow in the road. It'll look better, too.
DFF
(http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i48/miekkailu/Overruled.jpg)
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Lee's got no incentive to change the road crossing. After all, he also owns the tire dealership in Cumberland and makes money on ruined tires :ashat:
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Lee's got no incentive to change the road crossing. After all, he also owns the tire dealership in Cumberland and makes money on ruined tires :ashat:
He also works for MDDOT and we all know that's a state union gig. Damn white hats!
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So, Dave, how much time have you spent driving across grade crossings in small Pennsylvania towns?
I believe in the metropolitan suburbs they call this sort of thing a "traffic calming device"... :lol:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-8D0i1SU6CX4/S6Lg8iPBSTI/AAAAAAAAJAE/BHyNEnhX_-I/s1096/Excursions+127.jpg)
Still looks smoother than yours, but, whatever... If you're happy, that's all that matters.
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(http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i48/miekkailu/Overruled.jpg)
Heh, wouldn't be the first time I've heard this and, unfortunately, won't be the last. A hazard of the job, I suppose.
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Since I pay so dearly for your retainer, I'll take a second look at it. But only until Ed tells me it's too "model railroady"..
And Dr. Dave, I think I see the configuration I'll need for the crossbucks and flashers, too... I'm thinking some sort of concrete foundation in the bend of the retaining wall to hold up a similar cantilever signal on the town side, and a simple crossbucks on the right.
Lee
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Nice crossing Lee.
Are you going to Dullcote the road surface?
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If you look at the left side, it's been hit with a few washes of grimy water to reasonably good effect. The piece on the right has not yet received that treatment, but it will. I need to decal the R R on the crossing markings first...
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Rob's Silhouette paper windows are the absolute bomb. It was such a simple and effective solution, no wonder it took six years to figure it out!
Lee
Lee or Rob, can you fill us in a little more regarding these "paper windows" of which you speak? If there was discussion earlier in the thread, I missed it. Sure do like the look, though!
Jim
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Lee or Rob, can you fill us in a little more regarding these "paper windows" of which you speak? If there was discussion earlier in the thread, I missed it. Sure do like the look, though!
Jim
Basically, I made two-layer (dark red and light gray) cardstock panels, cutting the layers out individually with my Silhouette cutter to get a bit of depth (with the gray "inside" the red). Here's what I sent Lee:
(http://lordzox.com/mrr/2012/cumberland005.jpg)
I put a a peel-and-stick backing on them, as well as spray-painting the rear surface black to make them lightproof. (The multiple panels are simply convenient groupings for replication/assembly; there's no magic to them.)
Lee stuck the panels to his choice of "glass," cut the individual window sets out, and glued them in the window openings on his model.
As for the layout of the windows, Lee sent me a scanned set of building elevations, which I traced in CorelDraw to get vector outlines for the cutter. The finest muntins between the windowpanes were drawn at 0.2 scale feet thick, which is 2.4 scale inches or 0.015 actual inches--which sounds a bit thick, but that's how they scaled out on the elevations.
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(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-b-4qy88I5sU/T1WPMlCxvfI/AAAAAAAAQN8/RRIAz1GI_88/s1001/cmbsta3512a+%281%29.jpg)
As Rob said, I peeled and stuck the windows onto clear plastic, then carefully positioned it in the opening (no handy precast flange like on a Walthers kit.)
I then applied a dot of CA that would wick into the surface between the window and wall.
Next time, I'll plan a little better for the windows by making each unit more uniform. Getting them positioned was a little dicey. Fortunately, Rob provided a couple of extras.
I do need one more transom for the basement doors... There's a doorway at the foot of the subway steps that didn't appear on the drawing.... same narrow one as the one on the far end of the building...
Lee
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Excellent! Thanks for the rapid response, guys.
Jim
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I do need one more transom for the basement doors... There's a doorway at the foot of the subway steps that didn't appear on the drawing.... same narrow one as the one on the far end of the building...
Lee
Any others you need spares of, while I'm about it? I may be able to get this done tonight and in the mail tomorrow.
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I haven't started fooling with the dormers yet, but I may need a back up batch for them...they'll be a little trickier than the nice flat wall windows.
Also, is there a chance that those first floor warehouse doors can be attacked in styrene? I don't have anything that comes close.
Lee
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I haven't started fooling with the dormers yet, but I may need a back up batch for them...they'll be a little trickier than the nice flat wall windows.
Done, and ready to be mailed in the morning. A couple of the spare dormer windows didn't come out--there was a wrinkle in the tape, that kept them from cutting all the way through--but you'll have at least four extras of each kind (and two extra transom windows, in case you want to add a sub-basement). :)
Also, is there a chance that those first floor warehouse doors can be attacked in styrene? I don't have anything that comes close.
Perhaps, but I'll have to experiment a bit. If you can find me a good high-res picture of the doors, it would be helpful--MR's drawings don't necessarily tell the whole story when you're dealing with relief.
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DKS has some detail photos that Jack Brown took back in the late 80's. I haven't seen them yet, but there might be something to work with there.
Lee
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I can make any of his photos available to interested parties. Contact me offline: david@davidksmith.com
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I can make any of his photos available to interested parties. Contact me offline: david@davidksmith.com
Thanks, David--I appreciate the offer. I think I've found what I need for now, though:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/avatar1/269826556/sizes/o/in/faves-mormon_railfan/
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Well, my first experiment with the doors looks like five miles of bad road, but I'm actually encouraged:
(http://lordzox.com/mrr/2012/cumberland006.jpg)
This is made of 4 layers of 0.005" styrene, from front to back:
- the door frame and astragal (divider between the doors)
- the face of the door and the bars across the window
- the panel, with narrow cutouts to indicate the individual boards (this layer was glued in backwards--I need to "key" these the same way I did the cardstock to avoid this problem)
- a backing layer to seal over the cuts in the panel
I'm not certain why the spaces between the bars on the right-hand door didn't cut through, but I suspect a piece of chad got between the cutterhead and the styrene.
(Those spaces, and the ones between the boards in the panel, are very narrow--as small as 0.007", or 1.2 scale inches, in the case of the panel boards.)
I think I know how to avoid most of the issues, but I suspect I'll have a relatively high failure rate on these no matter what. I fear I may be pushing the limits of what can be done with the Silhouette for small-parts fabrication.
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That looks really good, but it may make more sense to leave the bars off of the model doors, and I can whip up some art to have them lasered onto the clear acetate. It's more important to look like they're there rather than to actually be there.
These will not be facing the aisle in the normal layout setting, but I'm planning a portable diorama for photography and display purposes. (The WMRHS convention usually provides a model contest venue...) so the back side will still be an important viewing angle.
Push come to shove, I have enough Gloor Craft warehouse doors. they're the correct width, and will work with the arched transom windows you made previously.
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Here are a couple of parts of the Silhouette thread with some other ideas for making very fine window muntins for those who are interested.
https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?topic=23354.45
https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?topic=23354.135
This is a good looking station and its nice to see it coming together.
Best wishes, Dave
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Got the rest of the windows I needed for the basement... once the door issue gets resolved we'll be back on that.
For now, let's take a quick glance backward. Last May, this is what I dug out of the storage mausoleum:
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/--p5wyVZy7LY/T167bIoWuFI/AAAAAAAAQSI/26waO-vVkkg/s735/New+Weeklies+175.jpg)
I had gotten the exterior wall and cornices cut back in 2003, maybe 2004, then into the Cryothermal Container where it was held in suspended animation until a cure could be found for the "window situation"...
Two weeks ago, Lord Zox sent me the package of Miracle Window Cure I'd been waiting for, and we moved the project along to here:
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-uB0dPcsGHyI/T1KjSTsgZTI/AAAAAAAAQLI/VRRuyybPpdo/s735/Cumberland+Station+%282%29.jpg)
Having the windows in hand, I was finally able to build the interior floors I needed to pull the walls back into some semblance of order. The last two weeks have been spent constructing the rudimentary interior needed to give those big windows something to reveal. I used a couple of those vertical blind slats I've got, which were just the right color, and completely opaque!
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-b-4qy88I5sU/T1WPMlCxvfI/AAAAAAAAQN8/RRIAz1GI_88/s735/cmbsta3512a+%281%29.jpg)
You can't have interiors without lights, so I broke out the LEDs and worked them in all over the building.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-M3C4uN18xok/T1rlarHzDOI/AAAAAAAAQPs/qJjrZ-CruvE/s735/cmbsta3912+%2820%29.jpg)
This weekend, I finished wiring in the lights for the basement and the exterior, added the platform on the track side of the building, and built up the main roof.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-cP4KFk6N5uk/T166Ch-xqeI/AAAAAAAAQRg/mmhtvmtq64s/s735/cmbsta31212+%283%29.jpg)
I went back and trimmed out the roof edge to clean up the appearance, then reinstalled the front two chimneys, and worked on fabricating a dormer that I will use as a master to cast 10 more just like it...
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-OPotHvSMFdE/T166vMyy9aI/AAAAAAAAQRo/FogyvyQQPms/s735/cmbsta31212+%284%29.jpg)
I've got some .100 rod that I'll be using to make the 7 columns I'll need for the platform canopy, then I can begin the fun of detailing the area around the station. I'm really enjoying seeing this come together...
Lee
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Fittingly, this is quickly becoming the signature structure on your pike.
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Fittingly, this is quickly becoming the signature structure on your pike.
Nah, The Hard Hat is fittingly the signature structure on Lee's layout. :D
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It's remarkable how big the damn thing is... Yay N scale!!
Thanks for the kind remarks.
Lee
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It looks so gooooooood. Can't wait to see some layover freights with some F's and chopnose parked out front, in a night scene no less!
Lee, have you thought about another article chronicling Cumberland through the years?
Tim
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No way... I'd have to build the whole damn platform! I like the "austere" look of 1970...
-
So tonight, I decided it was time to grow a pair and do some of my own work. I finished building the template for the dormers, and worked it up in such a way that will be easy to cast in resin. I need ten of them, and after the time it took to build one, scratching them all out got... well, scratched out.
Here's what I started with, again, from the original attempt back in 19diggity doo.
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/More_Train_Stuff_067.jpg)
This thing has been a real globe trotter, being shipped first to Chris to see if he could come up with a design to etch it, then to DKS to see if he had any other ideas, then back to me so it could lay fallow in the the parts box for ten forevers. The little dutz at the peak of the dormer had gone missing somewhere in its travels, so I had to fabricate a new one.
After that, I needed to make it more 3-D, picking up the side walls and roof panels. Since I now have a roof to match it too, that turned out to be pretty easy.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-AkG4puLYfk0/T2AE_S2lgkI/AAAAAAAAQSs/08uPXzRHK1U/s735/cmbsta31312+%281%29.jpg)
After taking this picture, I trimmed out some Holgate and Reynolds brick scraps to apply to the sides of the dormer to represent the slate shingles that reside there on the prototype.
Excited by how neatly the dormer worked with the roof, I set about to build a form in which to create the mold. I bought an Alumilite kit years ago, and I was anxious to try it out. Again, I used the handy dandy vertical blind slat to build the little box.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-d7NsiIiOEE0/T2AGmGOsEYI/AAAAAAAAQTE/Nx2iVhn739M/s799/cmbsta31312+%284%29.jpg)
All I had to do now was mix up the silicone mould material, and do the pour....
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-7TlPuVsnWrI/T2AGzq_tSoI/AAAAAAAAQTM/6zro6R0-gR8/s735/cmbsta31312+%285%29.jpg)
It turns out that the shelf life of the kit is something less than 7 years. I also checked the resin, and while it's got some liquid in there, there's a fairly gooey looking blob in the bottle:
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-b9MI9s-24jQ/T2AHAepMyeI/AAAAAAAAQTU/0_IlzlpYvdo/s735/cmbsta31312+%286%29.jpg)
Sort of reminds me of Damon Wayans' "Baff room" in the vagrant skit from In Living Color...
Anyway, not being well versed in the topic, I'm wondering if it's worth keeping. Both bottles of the hardeners seem to be okay, but the silicon and resin appear to be past their prime.
Never one to be discouraged, I set this aside, and turned my attention back to the highway bridge. I received my latest package from China containing some 6v grain of wheat street lights... Isn't ADD grand?
Lee
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Received a copy of some photos of the grand old station circa 1989, along with some vintage and more recent images. (Thank you Jack Brown and DKS) I quickly see there is more work to do! The good news is that the canopy over the platform will be much easier to construct than anticipated.
In other news, I made some more forward progress on the highway bridge. As always, there's a little more to do, but I'll have some progress photos up in the morning.
Lee
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Here's a look back a the US 48 highway bridge through Cumberland...
We started with this rough sketch:
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-rB4xyp7bUfQ/TyYWunwvIlI/AAAAAAAAP-M/UY0ZXBIlwR4/s647/Balto+St+4+%283%29.jpg)
Then got a little fancy...
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-DCFhKDnwSA4/TziMw_COH1I/AAAAAAAAQDk/8VF6OcfFcNM/s647/CMB48.jpg)
Added some of this and some of that...
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-F9Gx6CHh-Dg/Tzntz9o6C8I/AAAAAAAAQEM/lB_xMdXmJkw/s647/US48cmb3+%285%29.jpg)
Slapped around a little paint...
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/--TjXwq3GmEc/Tznt43riZ0I/AAAAAAAAQEc/hdL-qe0PEJI/s647/US48cmb3+%287%29.jpg)
Beefed up the super structure...
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-rw7VrdXcdOo/T0RtzcLK5yI/AAAAAAAAQHM/-h08wtQeGFU/s647/us48CMB4+%281%29.jpg)
And most recently, installed some lighting and signs...
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-agaPi1i6Jkc/T2NQm9iprbI/AAAAAAAAQTc/S5FPsPRMQ7I/s495/Cumberland+001.jpg)
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-FNQbzizJMf0/T2NREWHPIBI/AAAAAAAAQT0/pIgzhiDzVec/s647/Cumberland+003.jpg)
I'm currently working with the boys in the lab coats at NZT products to develop animated and functional hidden headlight doors for the red LTD there...
Also dressed up the east abutment back in the corner...
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-22MapTuOZO8/T2NRD4SMJ-I/AAAAAAAAQTs/eGlodRVVC-o/s647/Cumberland+004.jpg)
Still a few details to attend to, plus the finish scenery underneath it. I might add an LED or two under the deck to wash the landscape below with light. Once all that's figured out, I can do the finished installation. I built a groovy hinge into the bridge so I can lift up the section over the main line for maintenance purposes...
Lee
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How common is asphalt on a bridge?
Jason
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During the era I'm modeling, it was pretty typical to slap a coat down over aging concrete to extend the life until the funds were available for a full deck replacement. The 1952 Chesapeake Bay Bridge had an asphalt deck for years. My plan is to weather it down, add a whole lot of tar lines and patches, and give it that good ole "deferred maintenance" patina.
Lee
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During the era I'm modeling, it was pretty typical to slap a coat down over aging concrete to extend the life until the funds were available for a full deck replacement.
Still common today. Almost every bridge I crossed on my work commute originally had a concrete deck that was at some point covered with asphalt.
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Still common today. Almost every bridge I crossed on my work commute originally had a concrete deck that was at some point covered with asphalt.
Same thing around here. You will see a few bridges (built post 2000), that may use a concrete deck and top layer but the majority have an asphalt top coat. NHDOT had the bridges on the NH Route 101 expansion (1995-2000) built with visible concrete decks but under the Recovery Act (2009) repaving they paved the decks over, commenting that the transition from asphalt to concrete and back to asphalt on the bridges was causing the plow blades to wear improperly and also caused damage to the asphalt and expansion joints. Concrete roadways are not something Northern New England has adopted yet. MA Turnpike Authority has started experimenting in sections they are replacing on I-90 and I-84 with concrete lanes and asphalt shoulders.
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Concrete roadways are not something Northern New England has adopted yet. MA Turnpike Authority has started experimenting in sections they are replacing on I-90 and I-84 with concrete lanes and asphalt shoulders.
I always thought this had something to do with road salt, i.e., that concrete is more susceptible to being damaged from road salt then asphalt. If true, it would explain why you see more concrete roads down south than up north.
DFF
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Yes. The salt (or other anti-icing chemical) leeches through the concrete and attacks the rebar. Then when the rebar rusts enough, it pushes away the concrete and loses adherence, and the road surface crumbles as it's loaded/unloaded by traffic.
I'm a little surprised to hear of all of the "paved over" bridges. Bridges are engineered to a spec which allows for a specific load weight for the road surface. Just paving over with asphalt reduces the allowable vehicular loading, and you end up with a restricted bridge. Fine for you and me in our two-ton cars, but a major annoyance for big rigs and especially cement trucks with their high axle loading.
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That I did not know. See you learn something new everyday.
How do the northern Midwest states fair with it as I know Wisconsin and Minnesota have some pretty good snows and use concrete.
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There is a sealer admixture in the concrete that is supposed to help, but it kinda sorta doesn't. It possibly extends the service life by about 10 years, and then you're still back to chipping off the surface down to the rebar, sandblasting, and pouring new concrete... if you're very lucky. The bridge down the street from our second house (in St. Louis) was concrete deck built in the early '70s, and was demolished and rebuilt last year. Same goes for a very large number of bridges in the STL region - demolish, and re-do.
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Fortunately, my bridge is made from an old vertical blind slat, so it's specially formulated to withstand harsh UV light. It's a little particular about what glue it likes, but since the vehicles themselves don't move (except for those slippery CMW vehicles with their Hot Wheels like axles) there's very little in the way of weight or live load action to damage the thin layer of spray paint that I used to pave the surface.
I know this is listed as an Engineering Report, but really... Let's get back to the action... :facepalm:
Lee
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Brought home a couple of ReStore cabinets to solve a storage problem, and set about cleaning the workshop. I find that projects take less time to complete if I can find the outlet to plug in the soldering pencil.
More news as it happens.
Lee
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Now that I've found my workbench, I've resumed my efforts on the Cumberland Station. It seems the bigger the project is, the more debris it leaves on the work surface...
Anyhoo, I've found yet another use for those bolster slugs that come with Micro Trains trucks... You've seen a few of them before:
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/81_with_138-T.JPG)
As a headlight housing on my slug is one of my favorites...
Here's the latest:
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-nRu5qAsPO6M/T2qPTMpnXxI/AAAAAAAAQZ0/gaQfc0Pd36o/s735/cmbsta32112+%281%29.jpg)
As column bases for the platform shelter on the station at Cumberland... I just have to work out a way to consistently cut the bottoms of the styrene rod I'm using to let them nest in the little holes. I'm figuring that having these superglued to the platform surface, then the rod glued into these bases, should give me a right sturdy connection. The platform is also attached to the building there above the first floor windows, so that should reinforce it even better.
I also finished the steps down to the subway...
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-hjfUhAiC23I/T2qPGyOq2pI/AAAAAAAAQZs/LTwTooRm49g/s735/cmbsta32112.jpg)
I used some plastruct railings to keep people from tumbling down the steps, and lined the wall with H&R brick to represent the white glazed subway tiles on the prototype. I added a wall mounted light fixture in the stairwell to help highlight it.
I also worked on some printed roof shingles to improve the look of the roof. I sized it a bit small to reach the whole length of the roof, which is just a hair shorter than 11", so I may have to switch to legal size paper to get it right.
Lee
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Well, now that we've been drinking all night at the Hard Hat, it's time to stagger across the street for some sliders...
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-zoVcHy2_7Gc/T2vuBBTN5XI/AAAAAAAAQbI/22EswY2f2FE/s647/WhiteTowerGNWD+%283%29.jpg)
Lee
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1) brilliant on the passenger shed post bases... very nice... i will steal that. :D
2) Stagger for the Slider... sounds like a country song. :)
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Wow. That's the first time I've seen one of those White Towers painted up, and with the lighting and the figures it's pretty amazing.
Speaking of amazing, Lee, how do you shoot these up-close photographs? I have the devil's own time convincing my camera to do unreasonable things like, say, actually focusing on the object in the middle of the image... :?
-
Canon S3, Macro or Super Macro setting.
You have to press the button halfway to get it to focus where you want it, then POW!
BTW, got the doors in the mail yesterday or Thursday, and WOW. So there you have it. POW and WOW in the same post. How's that for value?
:trollface:
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The depot is looking really good Lee.
-
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-6LLh_dGEgBA/T3E1Jdter_I/AAAAAAAAQfo/RXsfvF-FKus/s570/gnwd32612+%2810%29.jpg)
White Tower is now open for business in Greenwood, PA. Offering greasy cheap burgers, and an outstanding view of the WM Main line...
Lee
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That scene looks really good! I especially like the old pick'em-up truck. Have you considered using some fiber optics for the lights?
Tim
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(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-6LLh_dGEgBA/T3E1Jdter_I/AAAAAAAAQfo/RXsfvF-FKus/s570/gnwd32612+%2810%29.jpg)
Is this the White Tower Tanning Salon? :trollface:
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Is this the White Tower Tanning Salon? :trollface:
LOL!
Or the White Tower nuclear plant.
-
Dr. Frankensteins lab!
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Turbo Charged Chicken!
Nuclear Tuna!
"Flash in the Pan" Omelets.
Just a few of our specialties!
Looks like we'll have to stuff some more french fries and paper napkins under that sidewall, too... :facepalm:
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Where is the blue light coming from? Maybe the Hard Hat's neon sign from across the street? :)
-
Looks like Zool & Gozer moved out of Sigorney Weaver's fridge and into the White Tower :o
Very cool scene.
Lee: you are the (Key)Master!
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Gary,
The blue light is emanating from the second floor apartment above the Hard Hat. Under normal viewing, it's supposed to look like someone's up there watching Carson. (If you were born after 1980, no that's not Carson Daly).
During a time exposure, it's pretty intense. I'm working on the wiring, and will include a kill switch for the interior lights. That way, when I'm blasting megapixels for 10 seconds, the lights will only be on for about 1.5 of them. That's worked out pretty well in other night shots I've done.
Lee
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Tonight I experimented with slapping some white paint over those overly bright LEDs. Seems to help. Pictures when I get around to it.
Also finished painting the window bridge on the Thomas Sub leading into Elkins. It was starting to bug me that it looked too "unfinished" as all that work was proceeding on the lower deck.
Started the evening working on my soldered wire trees... Not sure how I feel about them yet. The trunks looked fantastic, but adding the poly fiber and the flocking messed them up a little. I'll have to go back and watch MC's video again. I think my mistake was using the fine grain flocking instead of the coarse... which I don't have any of...
Oh well, I'm going to need a gadzillion trees, so these six should be able to blend in somewhere.
Lee
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The coarse gives more coverage and a better leaf texture.
Then I go back and sprinkle a little lighter fine foam to give variation and highlights to the top.
After I saw you solder your trunks, I got to worrying about my non-soldered ones eventually unravelling.
Hmm... Hopefully the glue/sawdust bark will keep everything in place.
And at least I don't have humidity to worry about.
Looking forward to seeing your trees (all gazillion of them)!
-
As I get closer to the final installation of at least part of the Highway 48 bridge, I made some good progress on the landforms above and below it... Recall that in this corner, the upper shelf between the helix and Elkins pokes through the sky... The trick is to make a reasonably seamless transition to fool the eye into thinking the world has a second deck... Here's the before:
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-q6-TI-lByxg/TeW3nMSwsNI/AAAAAAAANqg/ku6z6V4ZBvo/s735/New+Weeklies+065.jpg)
Note that the portal at Kerens is just sort of "there" and down below in Cumberland, there's nothing...
Here's tonight's progress...
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-AFCPmblBdcs/T3Ug6rCHPOI/AAAAAAAAQgk/-dwXG3z-7JU/s735/Kerens.jpg)
While my hill may not be as anatomically correct as Ed's recent efforts, I think it works out pretty well to transition the main deck scenery up to the second deck. Some more views:
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-rQH3HqRt9cU/T3Ug9IQgivI/AAAAAAAAQgs/hJczXRiz9F0/s735/Kerens+%281%29.jpg)
This scene should stand alone pretty well once the trees are planted. And yes, that retaining wall is indeed yet another application of the fabled vertical blind slats!
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-aypMXMtftQk/T3Ug-QlaaeI/AAAAAAAAQg4/xRFnWgHVpyU/s721/Kerens+%283%29.jpg)
This view shows the freshly painted bridge module across the window on the second deck. I've decided that I will concentrate on installing trees along this entire section from the Helix to Elkins so I can feel like I've accomplished something. The whole section is only 5" wide max, so it shouldn't be too big an effort.
Last shot, a close up of the ongoing improvements in South Cumberland.
Before:
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-Aa-mIOxJSWo/TznbRUI6ILI/AAAAAAAAQD4/7o88uQ6cyts/s735/US48cmb3+%283%29.jpg)
After:
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-9D5Bn0EJ9AI/T3Ug30piX4I/AAAAAAAAQgc/kFzyjBdf6Do/s735/Kerens+%282%29.jpg)
Obviously, the bridge deck isn't there, but I've built up the driveway in front of the freight station, and installed the B&O interchange track there in the foreground. By the weekend, I should have the tracks ballasted, the driveway paved, and the highway cut through. Most of the scenery base is made up of scraps of foam, cardboard and even a little homasote left over from the old temporary loops of the layout. I'll say it again: "Never throw anything away!"
You may now talk amongst yourselves.
Lee
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That very first shot of the new hill an portal make it seem like some sort of Gundam monster that is stepping on Cumberland as it eats Elkins. Just saying . . .
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I like to think of it more as "The Blob".
This is one of those instances where looking at photos (cropped and close up) will be better than actually being there. Once the trees and some more details are added, especially around the Hoffman Manufacturing Company, I think it will look a little better.
I put the highway bridge back in place this morning, and painted the freight house lot...it's coming together nicely.
Lee
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I don't know Lee, you might be better running a fascia up to the hillside of the portal then dropping the hill down on top of that building. In person it's going to look a little weird,
Phil
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Sorry, Lee. I'm with the Phils on this one. I'm not a fan of the hill enveloping the Hoffman building, and that's even before you have added foliage. The reality is that those locations are supposed to be miles apart and, if I remember correctly, not even in the same state.
"You gotta keep 'em separated."
DFF
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Ok, now the President of Hoffman Manufacturing - and his lawyer - have told you to stop encroaching on his property. What are you gonna do Lee? :)
-gfh
P.S. I vote for a fascia treatment, but my vote doesn't count.
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It is a little odd looking Lee...out of character for you, certainly. :?
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We all know Lee is a little ODD. I agree with the rest.
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Confusing. I agree with 2 points raised:
1. It just looks weird, like some kind of post-apocalyptic volcanic lava flow.
2. You've just undone any sense of horizontal distance between the two locations on their respective decks.
I'm usually a huge fan of your visual trickery, but this one left me scratching my head.
-
Okay, first off, it's not done yet. Cumberland is surrounded by mountains, so there will be backdrop mountains painted on the sky board to blend the 3-D stuff into the background.
Secondly, once I'm done installing the 21 million detailed and twinkling buildings planned for this little corner of the universe, there will be enough distractions to draw the eye down and away from the offending corner.
And yes, the two locations are supposed to be a hundred miles apart, but despite Ed's pleadings to the contrary, this is a model railroad, and therefore subject to a bit of model railroady whimsy.
I had pondered doing something with the fascia, but I couldn't get my head around blending the background mountains without connecting the upper and lower. I figured the two locations share the same sky, right?
Let me get a little farther down the road, and hopefully you'll see what I'm envisioning.
Mr. Wizard.
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I imagine Lee has something like this picture in mind:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/brianbreighner/4945800651/sizes/l/in/photostream/ (http://www.flickr.com/photos/brianbreighner/4945800651/sizes/l/in/photostream/)
The hills in the background will somehow be represented on the sky board behind Cumberland. We're watching, Mr. Wizard!
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Lee, I agree it looks weird, but I'm digging how it draws both areas together; I'm looking forward to seeing how you pull it off!
-
Parsing down the first layer... Bridge and lights.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-SoYAhCYKV1w/T3bkxWqGQFI/AAAAAAAAQhw/RE0R_sghXLA/s735/SoCmb33112+%286%29.jpg)
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-Ru1iK8d5fEo/T3bkG2jNlAI/AAAAAAAAQhQ/HM12oKuEOwo/s735/SoCmb33112+%281%29.jpg)
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-LpHB3Nmdp0c/T3bkIzaE8qI/AAAAAAAAQhY/eBZGWwlFn8c/s735/SoCmb33112+%282%29.jpg)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-moDGUGs8X1Y/T3bkLajIlPI/AAAAAAAAQhg/VvoC5AmJCzk/s735/SoCmb33112+%283%29.jpg)
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-Cl9lVROu2hM/T3bkaVylFsI/AAAAAAAAQho/lfSGEwDUcC4/s735/SoCmb33112+%284%29.jpg)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-GvbCCDcuXtw/T3bkz45yrBI/AAAAAAAAQh4/aJFY8N_t7FQ/s735/SoCmb33112+%287%29.jpg)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-HnAIay2doCo/T3bk2Il1JaI/AAAAAAAAQiA/e_JgzJWQ1AI/s735/SoCmb33112+%289%29.jpg)
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/--N4hC76LM4Y/T3bkDZhm8FI/AAAAAAAAQhI/6iEDdPX2d3Y/s735/SoCmb33112.jpg)
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-Cfz2OJ9AhdM/T3bmVu5CBwI/AAAAAAAAQiY/H11e4Bz7O2M/s735/SoCmb33112+%285%29.jpg)
-
Shot that way the Blob doesn't look so bad
-
Next will be some back ground painting... and more daylight shots...
Just bought another 100 LEDs...
Lee
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Shot that way the Blob doesn't look so bad
You mean in the the dark? ;)
You're right though, I think Lee might pull a rabbit out of his hat with this one. I love all the under-bridge activity.
-
Did I just hear someone say "night" ops session?
The S.
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to really finish it off you should paint the bottom of that second deck something akin to this :trollface:
http://literaryden.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/amazing-3d-pavement-art-11.jpg
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Did I just hear someone say "night" ops session?
Groan. A romantic notion but now I have to find a lighted magnifier to perform my switching duties. Lest you're working on a glow in the dark car ID system too?
-
There will be no romance in the train room.
I had a couple of those nifty pens with the LEDs built in, but my children absconded with them.
It looks like the rest of the weekend's progress will be conducted in "radio silence"... I left my camera at work yesterday... so no pics till Tuesday night.
Lee
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Hope none of your workers sell your camera before you get back.
-
Nah, we don't open for business again until Wednesday, and it's locked in my office. So it should still be around when I get in Tuesday morning.
Lee
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Many progresses today. Wired up the lights inside and outside the Hoffman Industries building, painted the road that passes through the industrial section under the bridge, paved the lot at the WM freight house, installed semi-permanent scenery light circuit, finished wiring the US48 bridge, and came to the realization that I really need to clean up the layout room...
Camera still idling comfortably on my desk at work... so you can't prove anything!
Lee
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As of 11 p.m. last night, I am completely satisfied that the blob is working, both in person, and photographically. I've added some more background structures, foliated the hillside from the tunnel portal on down, and painted in the distant mountains on the skyboard.
I've got the camera to bring home from work today, and will take some pictures to prove that I pulled it off... Until then, I'll just leave you to shiver with antici...
pation.
Lee
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Behold...
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-_mjUhHMr_D4/T3uIIK2DNwI/AAAAAAAAQjE/qjLKDs_V3LM/s735/Socmb4312+%283%29.jpg)
I'm really happy with the way this turned out. Now before you go all batshit on the Hoffman Building, I submit the following:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-qaFIls02SNo/T3uICaaTpJI/AAAAAAAAQi0/oLPsp1fW65Q/s735/Socmb4312.jpg)
I stretched and skewed the photo from the box, and trimmed it to try it on as a 2D extension of the 3D building... From the ground angle, it's pretty close. I have to tweak it a little and reprint it to get it into final position, which I think will work well from this viewing (more like photo) angle. The question is, does the ability to take this photo make up from the visual compromise that is needed for just about every other angle?
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-ZO0pj4jGLlw/T3uITa7gTYI/AAAAAAAAQjk/n80UTWbp7PQ/s735/Socmb4312+%289%29.jpg)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-8O9d79DfnrM/T3uIWMgCT0I/AAAAAAAAQjs/xaeHUJgkj9k/s735/Socmb4312+%2810%29.jpg)
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-CiXf15faudg/T3uIZUJU01I/AAAAAAAAQj0/t-6lBWU3f9A/s735/Socmb4312+%2811%29.jpg)
Or will I be better off leaving the back drop alone... Any thoughts?
Here are some other views of the area, which occupies about 2 square feet.:
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-jjQpDLz3PUE/T3uIkaNe8KI/AAAAAAAAQkU/HVErV0v7mps/s735/Socmb4312+%2818%29.jpg)
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-Oasku2yE8Yc/T3uItrAupUI/AAAAAAAAQks/qgRc_DAsfHU/s735/Socmb4312+%2822%29.jpg)
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-EKNun7JQ_Wo/T3uIQBGl4SI/AAAAAAAAQjc/AqxBiw6uZaE/s735/Socmb4312+%288%29.jpg)
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-c8j1rLJn3LE/T3uINJUFssI/AAAAAAAAQjU/aKgjmoPOWz8/s735/Socmb4312+%287%29.jpg)
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-JkVNUEFR9lc/T3uIKqodstI/AAAAAAAAQjM/U1y712skqDo/s735/Socmb4312+%286%29.jpg)
And how about up on the hill at Kerens?...
The tunnel portal at the top of the helix...
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-wko4-9M7WdE/T3uIcsWJ_DI/AAAAAAAAQj8/a7kfBa5yiAs/s735/Socmb4312+%2812%29.jpg)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-_hPQPubPiL4/T3uInGViYNI/AAAAAAAAQkc/MY02uCpsj-0/s735/Socmb4312+%2819%29.jpg)
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-j7Nap0T7MYI/T3uIpp9JYrI/AAAAAAAAQkk/ZcjoNO0vGF8/s735/Socmb4312+%2820%29.jpg)
Next up, landscaping around the Cumberland Depot...
Lee
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Carl's Autoparts is a nice touch
as well as Hoffman's
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Those puffballs need to get hit with some green paint ..
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I think some of the angles make the HMC building addition a tad wonky, but your trackside stuff is spot on, so I'd say pat yourself on the back and move on.
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Those puffballs need to get hit with some green paint ..
Actually, I like them as they are. It looks like Hoffman's is on fire.
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Well David, considering what a coona$$ from the bayou might manufacture in dat der fanceee building . . . fire may be de leas of you worries, 'chere!
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Or will I be better off leaving the back drop alone... Any thoughts?
I think the extension is pretty clever. However, I'm still not buying the blob, sorry to say, but if you're happy with it, that's all that counts.
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I'm not digging the "blob" as well. I think it would look better if it extended down beyond the factory and maybe continued a little to the left more before blending into the painted backdrop.
But your layout.
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(http://whiteriverandnorthern.net/images/noblob.jpg)
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I like david's treatment here .. also, maybe put a light under the shelf to illuminate the overpass
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I am with JB and DKS on this one ... Extend it down and move on when you're happy... Then come back later to revisit.
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I'm not digging the "blob" as well. I think it would look better if it extended down beyond the factory and maybe continued a little to the left more before blending into the painted backdrop.
I'm in agreement with Ian here. I really think the blob needs to go to the bottom behind the building to make it work,
Phil
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I like david's treatment here .. also, maybe put a light under the shelf to illuminate the overpass
Isn't the idea to not draw attention to the termination of the overpass?
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so, not being a theater major .. my eye was drawn to the darkness ..
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I actually like the back of the overpass dark, kinda makes it disapear.
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I can't do David's suggested treatment, because there's 1" foam that wraps down behind the building...
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-OTIO_WdoVAY/TznbZMztq4I/AAAAAAAAQEA/e5Xia5xs3dw/s1044/US48cmb3+%284%29.jpg)
I can add some more ground foam over the offending puffballs, and extend the ground foam over to the left of the building. I'm planning to put some 2-D background buildings at the end of the "road" there, so I don't want to make it too 3D.
To lessen the smoke effect, I can thin the puffballs immediately over the building, or perhaps replace them with some clump foliage, but keep enough there to maintain the transition from the upper part of the hill.
There is a highway light under the shelf, hard to see in the angles posted, but I don't want to add too much light under there, as there are some things going on in the corner that are best left in the cover of darkness. There are just going to be some angles that won't be photographed.
The more I look at the 2-D transition on Hoffman's, the less I like it. I may just paint in some green blobs, maybe dust it with ground foam to texture it and be done with it. Another thought would be to construct a "skywalk" between Hoffman's and the newspaper plant, which will be on the opposite side of the street.
Lee
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I can't do David's suggested treatment, because there's 1" foam that wraps down behind the building...
But... (to quote) it's just foam...
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Not anymore... now it's foam with a coat of sculptamold, textured and blended with the surrounding scenery, with foliage attached (and yes, the dreaded puff balls)... This is over an increasingly complex scenery installation below... setting up and cleaning up such an effort will take three times the amount of time it will take to effect the proposed change... Let me rework the foliage, and see where that takes us.
Afterall, based on the comments thus far, there's an even split between extending the foliage to the left, vs. your proposal of cutting the whole mountain back to the right (which will also necessitate altering the building since more of it will be exposed)...
Regardless, all of the input is appreciated, and will be taken into consideration as I climb the stairs after work tonight...
Lee
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Lee, if you're willing to entertain another suggestion, how about this--if you can't move the hill back, you can "virtually" move the back of the building forward.
If you put a parapet on the "back" of the building, but actually hold it about quarter-inch in front of the 3-D scenery, you can extend the 3-D scenery down and even from above, it will look like it's behind the building--after all, you can see the back edge of the roof, right? :) From lower camera angles, the rear parapet won't be visible, so the disparity between it and the side wall won't be evident.
I'll see if I can photo-edit a mockup of what I'm talking about, just in case I'm not making sense... :)
Here's a (crudely) photo-edited rendition of the idea:
(http://lordzox.com/mrr/2012/cumberland_fiction.jpg)
(Okay, so I modified a bit more than just the roof. The extra "bays" of windows on the side wall make the building look deeper to me than the blank panels did.)
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I like what Lord Zox has done here. Less blob, more background, yet neatly tying the two closely spaced levels together.
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I wasn't bothered by Lee's original attempt ... but Zox has definitely provided an improvement IMHO.
Jim
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Here's another thing to consider... There is a building permit issued for the newspaper plant directly across the street from Hoffman. Depending on the design and massing of that building, the view of the skyboard at the street will be moot.
I'll be working on some mock ups of that tonight, along with some of the proposed fixes provided here.
As always, the input is appreciated and valuable. (except for the parts that are idle piffle, of course.)
Lee
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+1 for LZ
Well played Sir
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+1 for LZ
Well played Sir
It wasn't fair. Zox used his computer thingy to do ... stuff.
Jim
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Actually, Zox's illustration completes the illusion I was attempting with the water tank and the billboard... That shouldn't be hard to work in.
Lee
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Here ya go... Something along these lines...
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/cumberland_fiction.jpg)
Lee
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Even bettererer.
Jim
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better
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Be cool to pop a mirror in there at the end of the street to extend it.
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And at the end of the overpass as well
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Muy bueno!
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Works for me. Good job, Lord Zox and Lee! Much better solution.
DFF
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Lee,
I think the left-hand building and associated catwalk are an excellent solution. And I'll second DKS's suggestion to try a mirror under the catwalk--it looks like the angle is such that it'll extend the scene without being obvious.
(At least, it'll be less obvious than faux-painting a road on the wall, like I tried to do in my photo-edit.) :)
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You know how I feel about the puff balls :-)
And conspicuously missing is "Ed's Douchebaggery", a medical products manufacturer...
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I'm liking it man. The end of the puffballs looks a bit harsh to me though; might could string some poly fibre out thinly to better aid the transition. Otherwise, I like how it pulls both decks together
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Don't worry, Ed. I've got something special planned to commemorate your participation in this extravaganza...
So here's tonight's progress....
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-KiKPDoCVsxQ/T30V9Z7YFRI/AAAAAAAAQmA/X8mcMVflXqc/s735/socmb4412.jpg)
Note the addition of the parapet wall per Zox's recommendation, and the extension of the puff matt (to flat to be puff balls, really...) over to the left, and of course, the new building to house the Laurel Star Apologist newspaper. (10 points to anyone who can recall the obscure reference there...) I haven't added the catwalk yet, and I'm not 100% sure that I will. I'm pondering a row of distant photo buildings that would be visible farther up the road there. We'll see.
After I took this first shot, I immediately saw the problem with the background painted mountain not blending properly with the 3-D stuff. Here's how I fixed that...
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-T-PAxG6cIiw/T30WAOSN5AI/AAAAAAAAQmI/hpYZzp1g-Jw/s735/socmb4412+%281%29.jpg)
I probably have to do a little more color adjustment, but that will come as I blend it around to the left. Note that the future roof of the newspaper building will obscure the lower bit, and I may add some photo buildings to the skyboard to camouflage the curved cut in the roof.
That solved, I went hunting for some more photo angles. Please pardon the construction debris apparent in many of the shots.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-QNKxQECmgC4/T30WC-R3bWI/AAAAAAAAQmQ/X5M8r8CUmww/s735/socmb4412+%283%29.jpg)
Here you can see the photo extension is eliminated. That experiment confirmed my prejudice that 3D is 3D and 2D isn't, and never the twain should meet. This removes the conundrum of having exactly one angle from which you can get a cool shot, and everything else (especially standing there operating a train) looks like crap. This way, no matter how you look at it it looks like crap. :P
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-oVkDMBXQvEc/T30WGNtOtzI/AAAAAAAAQmY/mcO1n4wOJac/s735/socmb4412+%285%29.jpg)
Same angle, a little further back.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-Dv-_4QQCSv4/T30WJP1BSrI/AAAAAAAAQmg/96FWo10_JEI/s735/socmb4412+%287%29.jpg)
This view gives me a little of that "Brick Canyon" effect. This is where the space compromise related to modeling the depot full size and trying to shoehorn in a few more industrial tracks is most evident. I wish I had planned for about 3 or 4 inches of "air" to let the back of the station appear more as it does in nature. I'm not sweating it too hard, though. This is never going to be a primary viewing angle, and I'm planning to make a module that can travel with the station for folks who wish to get the "full Monty" view from the back. (Dear God! It could even be an N track Module!!)
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-HepK78U6vF4/T30WL5B6ZzI/AAAAAAAAQmo/lBSrP2SWQ8I/s735/socmb4412+%2810%29.jpg)
This will be the most likely photo angle, which masks the impossibly narrow alley to the station basement. Gyads, I need to do some vacuuming!!
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-POFNymxGpQg/T30WPEloISI/AAAAAAAAQmw/uLvY_zovmno/s735/socmb4412+%2811%29.jpg)
Another view to confirm the blend of colors from the painting to the 3-D, and also to confirm that the building looks better without the 2-D fake wall there.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-6LFLAOUEpA0/T30WSIedWZI/AAAAAAAAQm8/Eu5uMebwV-A/s735/socmb4412+%2812%29.jpg)
A final look right down the street. This will be where the catwalk concept or the background buildings on the flat will stand or fail.
For the newspaper building, I'm planning a dark brick color, which will help it recede into the scene, allowing the station its rightful spot as the centerpiece of Cumberland.
Oh, by the way, the chunk of foam there to the right of the station will be mudded over shortly, and will await the attentions of the Coonass Grass Master... There will be a little lawn area and a couple of trees per the prototype.
So, thanks for all the input thus far, I think it's really helping to shape up the scene both in person and in photos. Any body gots any more thoughts?
Lee
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Wasn't the Laurel Star Apologist the Shinbone newspaper in The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance?
"No drinking when voting! Why, that's carrying democracy too far!"
Brilliant film (if I've got it right).
If not, it should be :ashat:
The second building will definitely help scene.
I really dig those brick canyon POVs.
And if the bar's still closed and we're still voting, then I vote for the enclosed catwalk.
Provides a "natural" 3D frame through which the road to exit.
(Though if you could animate a bit swirling time warp like in The Final Countdown... wow)
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Nope... The Star Apologist was the newspaper for which "Wordsmith" wrote in a comic strip by the same name back in the 70's. It was pretty funny, and I always thought that was a great name for a mediocre newspaper. One stand out strip had the first panel with Tip O'Neill completing the day's business in Congress, banging the gavel and declaring "Recess!" The next panel naturally had all the congress critters out in the play yard on the jungle gym.
The motto of the paper, at least as it will appear on my layout, is "That's News to Us!"
Enough mass comm major jokes...
Yes, I agree, the only thing better than a catwalk across the street would be the swirling entrance to the Time Tunnel... maybe with some fog...
Lee
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The motto of the paper, at least as it will appear on my layout, is "That's News to Us!"
Lee
I hate to admit it, but the promotional geniuses at a daily newspaper I worked at in the '90s had T-shirts printed up with the message, "If it happens in (our city), it's news to us!"
Just another reason why I say the newspaper industry didn't die. It committed suicide.
Jim
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Lee, that scene is really taking shape and the blob has been tamed!
I second the recommendation to place a mirror under the pedestrian overpass between the buildings. That will extend the street nicely!
Eric
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Lee, that scene is really taking shape and the blob has been tamed!
Agreed!
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I'll have to have one of my goons at the store smash a mirror so I can get the proper sized piece...
Lee
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Check into one of those front reflecting mirrors Lee.
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rBreaking a mirror is bad luck don't you know. I'll buy you the damn mirrow.
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Bob, that's why I have my volunteers break the mirrors!!
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Hey, I'm just trying to keep your employees safe. OSHA and all that you know.
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I really dig those brick canyon POVs.
The Final Countdown
+1
Lee, I'm really digging how you added the extra blending; and also, I vote for the catwalk idea
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I have loads of first-surface mirror material, more than enough scraps to provide a piece of the proportions needed for the end of the street. Just let me know.
PS, did the dormers arrive?
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I'll have to have one of my goons at the store smash a mirror so I can get the proper sized piece...
Lee
i got a piece that would fit right in there... if ya still need it the next time you stop by
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Thanks for the offers of mirror bits... If only my timing was better, you could have put it in the box with the dormers! (which did, by the way, arrive in yesterday's post.... they are magnificent! An N scale bronze plate is being cast in your honor to be placed next to the one dedicated to Zox for his window work...)
Here's the catwalk... and what a difference it makes!! If it's important for the mirror cutters, the opening is 39' (n scale) wide by about 24' high.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-8Dp35OYEqyY/T3724S0vGoI/AAAAAAAAQnQ/BxZpNEhChRc/s712/socmb+40612+%281%29.jpg)
And within moments of unpacking the contents of my NZT pack, shot this...
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-HOh1u8E_Xz4/T3722cgNWRI/AAAAAAAAQnI/--RGDJT5nm8/s735/cmbsta40612+%283%29.jpg)
A little sanding, a little paint, and all I'll have left to do is to fabricate the platform roof and a couple of chimneys...
I think I'd like to call this "better modeling through collaboration"....
This is really coming together now. Thanks to all!
Lee
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looking good
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-sTts3kY-zEQ/T372gYRY6nI/AAAAAAAACQU/zQvNPfPtHnk/s800/The%2520Prototype.JPG)
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Thanks for the offers of mirror bits... If only my timing was better, you could have put it in the box with the dormers! (which did, by the way, arrive in yesterday's post.... they are magnificent! An N scale bronze plate is being cast in your honor to be placed next to the one dedicated to Zox for his window work...)
Here's the catwalk... and what a difference it makes!! If it's important for the mirror cutters, the opening is 39' (n scale) wide by about 24' high.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-8Dp35OYEqyY/T3724S0vGoI/AAAAAAAAQnQ/BxZpNEhChRc/s712/socmb+40612+%281%29.jpg)
And within moments of unpacking the contents of my NZT pack, shot this...
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-HOh1u8E_Xz4/T3722cgNWRI/AAAAAAAAQnI/--RGDJT5nm8/s735/cmbsta40612+%283%29.jpg)
A little sanding, a little paint, and all I'll have left to do is to fabricate the platform roof and a couple of chimneys...
I think I'd like to call this "better modeling through collaboration"....
This is really coming together now. Thanks to all!
Lee
so i literally "drove this" yesterday... and really really need to give kudo's to Lee.... the "overpass/station" positioning... plus the building underneath... . i mean... it is all there....
now granted... there is a little modelling whimsy... but it completely (not kinda) gets the feel for that couple block section of Cumberland.
it is one thing to see it here in pics... .it is another to actially see it with your own eys...
yesterday... as i was driving into cumberland and saw it... and thought of Lee's efforts... i was like... DAMN... he got it!
:)
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I'M GETTING BETTER LOOKING ALL THE TIME
(http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa149/rkbufkin/blob.jpg)
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Thank you Eric. I've had this scene on the brain since my first real visit there in 1989. It's deeply satisfying to see it coming to life in scale.
It'll be even better once I get the layout cleaned up and trains running again!
Lee
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It's all coming together very nicely Lee. Always nice when what you "see" in your mind works out on the layout.
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Lee, now you need to add an N-scale ReStore to the layout, to sell all the dormer windows you won't be using... :P
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I took a look at the area via Google Maps to get a feel for what you are doing. Noticed that it is near the Crabby Pig restaurant. Looks like a decent place to have beer and something to eat. I like what you have done with this scene. Thanks for the updates.
Best wishes, Dave
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(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-TtTOWyP1Gy0/T3-9yITj8II/AAAAAAAAQng/0PLj8P3yyn0/s735/cmbsta40712+%281%29.jpg)
I think this is going to be a very popular photo angle... I'll need to work on making the shelf above less visible, either by zooming in on the building, or by shopping out things that don't belong in the sky...
You can see that I've painted the Star Apologist building in the background, and I added the windows after I shot this. I'd offer you a more complete view of the building in living color, but the cam batteries shat the bed. So, onto the charger, and off to bed!
Lee
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Mikey likes it!
-Mikey
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Okay... freshly charged batteries, and a few more baby steps...
First, the view from the Goodyear Blimp...
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-YChwGUokm6o/T4COhVqx4uI/AAAAAAAAQns/TaM-N37cSOc/s735/cmbsta40712-2+%281%29.jpg)
Obvious things to do include installing lights and the roof on the newspaper plant. But this gives a pretty good idea of how the massing of the buildings and the colors will work together.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-um8wy2Ojb4c/T4COs_JXgII/AAAAAAAAQn0/DF9cjQMiMyI/s735/cmbsta40712-2+%282%29.jpg)
Here's a full frontal of the station, and the platform is still topless! All right, stop fogging up the monitor... next...
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-ZxRbO_RFODs/T4CP47WvUzI/AAAAAAAAQoE/kMt4-zgFe-E/s735/cmbsta40712-2+%284%29.jpg)
Looking north and west from the overpass. Look at all that real estate! This will be quite the tasty urban panorama when all the blanks are filled in.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-W8Zp8w4FyTM/T4Cc4xLcipI/AAAAAAAAQoc/EEBlhx8KTFM/s735/cmbsta40712-2+%285%29.jpg)
Looking west along the tracks. The hole under the platform is where the fire breathing turtles live. The blue DPM building indicates where the grade crossing for Baltimore Street is.... going to be.
So tonight, I'll be working on finishing the station building, and perhaps doing the lights and all on the newspaper. My plan is to work from the skyboard forward so everything is set from the main line back. Once that's done, I'll ballast the track, and finally, build the flood walls in front of the station tracks.
Carry on!
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Like Eric I have to agree - you have done a HAWT job here buddy-o!
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(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-W8Zp8w4FyTM/T4Cc4xLcipI/AAAAAAAAQoc/EEBlhx8KTFM/s735/cmbsta40712-2+%285%29.jpg)
The station looks fantastic in this lighting and from this angle, even without everything in the shot being completed. Well played, sir. I look forward to seeing this in person... hopefully sometime soon.
By the way, that tree looks as if it has bagworms. You may want to get that treated. :trollface:
DFF
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Yes, I have to revisit Master Fuji's School of Tree Making one more time... I found my coarse turf stuff, so that should help.
Thanks for the kind words. This morning I ballasted the track through the station, and I'm getting ready to ballast the remainder of the industry tracks. I dropped the feeder wires last night, and just have to do the five slide switch thingies for the last few turnouts, then I can connect all the wires.
In a brain dead moment, I also cut through the throwbar of a turnout, which will now require an on-site repair... :facepalm: Oh well, anything worth doing is worth doing twice!
Lee
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The blue DPM building indicates where the grade crossing for Baltimore Street is.... going to be.
here is a pic... as if you're standing at the blue building... am i right lee?
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-OKOVb4wpkYI/T4MrjzrP8WI/AAAAAAAACQ0/uvU07tfaFr4/s800/photo.JPG)
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(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-TtTOWyP1Gy0/T3-9yITj8II/AAAAAAAAQng/0PLj8P3yyn0/s735/cmbsta40712+%281%29.jpg)
Perhaps a little to the right, and lower??? Make the depot block out as much of the shelf, or have the set up of the shot naturally crop it out.
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Finished the chimneys, installed the last few Zox doors on the basement (which sadly will never be seen!) and started on the platform roof.
Closing in on completion, and it feels so good!!
Pics as they happen.
Lee
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Lee, as much as you're working hard to remain faithful to the station, I wonder if you're doing it more of a disservice by trying to accommodate the lower floor though considerably trickery and compromise. I wonder if the scene would work better as a whole if you simply leveled off the land under and behind the station and did away with the lower level altogether? Granted, it would damage the model's fidelity, but the setting it occupies might compensate for that loss by having what amounts to a landscape kluge eliminated, which was done just to allow doors that can't be used (or even seen, for that matter) to continue to exist. Just a thought.
Otherwise, quite outstanding work.
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It's kinda late to lower all the terrain behind it, right?
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It's kinda late to lower all the terrain behind it, right?
Lower? Never said lower; I suggested filling in the depression behind/around it, so it's all on basically the same level.
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I'm totally cool with the way it's working out. A few well placed trees disguise the truncated back yard, and I've added driveways in from the left and the right... What happens behind the building visually isn't mission critical.
The building is finally finished... There are a few minor things I might tweak down the road, but here it is in all its glory, divorced from the surrounding scenery...
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-eonrTYjAmwc/T4OpE0-P9JI/AAAAAAAAQr8/m2dV1PD1zOE/s735/cmbstafin+%281%29.jpg)
Here's the back. I wanted to model the building as completely as possible, as I'm planning to do a module that will include it for either the N track crowd, or just to tote to WMRHS events. Zox's doors turned out first rate!
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-TLhO4uOC97E/T4OoE05DwHI/AAAAAAAAQsA/Acr_Pluwmw8/s735/cmbstafin+%283%29.jpg)
And with the lights on...
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-_d3HfTPeLXc/T4OpP13idoI/AAAAAAAAQsE/zFQp4WLOHgk/s735/cmbstafin+%284%29.jpg)
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/Cumberland_Station_1989.jpg)
Uh-huh!
And around to the front...
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-e4LSyOhl3-8/T4OpvbW46PI/AAAAAAAAQq4/9VDj70iijjQ/s735/cmbstafin+%285%29.jpg)
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-abDUEs1sSxw/T4OqRld9QfI/AAAAAAAAQsI/94kZL-Hkxuw/s735/cmbstafin+%287%29.jpg)
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-AG4xYMsa8sM/T4OqxDS8dzI/AAAAAAAAQsQ/58p4WeyFIE0/s734/cmbstafin+%288%29.jpg)
I wish I had some smaller LEDs on hand for the platform, but the way I installed these, I can easily replace them down the road. And boy was it a treat sizing and fitting in those damn columns. You'll notice that the platform rises about an 1/8" from right to left to account for the modest grade that carries the main line. But it all worked out.
I had to finish painting the columns and some other stuff when Andy came up to bed (school day tomorrow after spring break) so I brought the building down to the kitchen table to finish it, and took the photos there. I used all the available light in the room, and a 5 second exposure at F8. The shots that don't have the lights all blown out were done by disconnecting the lights after about a second, maybe less.
So anyway, tomorrow night, it will get installed in its natural habitat, then the push will be on to work on the last 30" of main line (apart from the section behind the yard) that needs to be finished! (just west of the station).
I'm tired now...
Lee
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That is a beautiful structure, Lee! I'm going to have to make another trip out there to see Cumberland once it's all done.
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... and plopped back down on the layout...
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-pVz5Bp9nJP0/T4Qci5-ciOI/AAAAAAAAQsk/-jIo_9Ku4Tc/s1044/cmbsta41012+%281%29.jpg)
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-z_AF6SIyqzA/T4QcyLRTMAI/AAAAAAAAQss/XX7D2RhG8gY/s1044/cmbsta41012+%283%29.jpg)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-DZlD6GwlOuI/T4QdA_uQ7MI/AAAAAAAAQs0/_ekghzSWy0g/s1044/cmbsta41012+%284%29.jpg)
That second view is my favorite, I think, but I'll need to photoshop out the the Thomas Sub shelf to really make it pop.
Lee
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(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-z_AF6SIyqzA/T4QcyLRTMAI/AAAAAAAAQss/XX7D2RhG8gY/s1044/cmbsta41012+%283%29.jpg)
That is a great shot!
-
Have you thought about making a temporary backdrop that would hide the Thomas Sub for photos?
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So sexxxxay! Get in mah bellay.
T
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The trick will be to slip a piece of "sky" between the second deck and the highway bridge. I might pick up a sheet of poster board to experiment a bit...
Even if I can just put in a white background, it will be easier to shop in a proper backdrop.
Lee
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Poster board should work great. As would some of those big plastic signs you've talked about.
-
2 words
fog machine
http://www.redpawmedia.com/fog.html (http://www.redpawmedia.com/fog.html)
blur it up baby
http://www.focusmagic.com/exampledefocusing.htm (http://www.focusmagic.com/exampledefocusing.htm)
-
I believe we referred to that as "Beer Goggles" in college...
Lee
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(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/cumberland_fiction.jpg)
Lee
Judging from this angle, it looks like you should be able to tape a sky board to the front edge of the upper deck, and have it extend about 3" lower, which would probably be just enough to block the shelf brackets, etc. in the money shot above.
This scene is so cool now!
-gfh
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...and no more foolish blather about blobs... :trollface:
Thanks, everyone! I've enjoyed the last two evenings loafing on the couch... would have been better if the Orioles beat the Yankees, but so it goes.
I've got a big sale Saturday at the ReStore, once that's past, I'll probably get a few more things done up there.
Lee
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One last look through the back window of the Plymouth Satellite...
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-XNu2aGg_scw/T4eW93cfTeI/AAAAAAAAQtk/RmmSFg4tljs/s733/socmb41212+%2817%29.jpg)
Time to clean the room and think about running trains again...
Lee
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(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-vQ96IcF1PIA/T4yUIydSFcI/AAAAAAAAQvk/zYveUKSa-vs/s797/Chlng041612+%281%29.jpg)
A very rough cut of the paper sky background. I'll have to work on some sort of faux transition, maybe some puffballs or something to the left, and I'll definitely need to do some lighting under the bridge. It's like there's an eclipse or something going on down there.
Lee
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And there it is, folks, the best N Scale shot of 2012, all brought to you by the recycle bin, the American Dumpster Diving League, and Pack Rats R Us!
:facepalm:
-
(http://whiteriverandnorthern.net/images/cumberland.jpg)
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Repeat that third floor wall on the newspaper building to the left, and you'll be onto something. I'll email the full size image to you if you like. (I see a calendar shot!)
Lee
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That was just a "quickie" for giggles. It would be a lot easier if you re-shot it with the sky cardstock running all the way behind the full width of the station; it's a bear to mask along the edges of all those dormers. Also, if you could pop a little extra light in under the highway, that would be most appreciated as well.
-
(http://www.railpictures.net/images/d1/0/4/2/8042.1334934083.jpg)
Did WM ever get SD40s in this livery?
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Not only did they, that's one of the original ones. After a long career for the WM, Chessie and CSX, this one went into lease service, and was recently purchased by the Georges Creek Railroad out west of Cumberland, rebuilt, and was professionally restored to its original appearance. It either is or will be shortly back in revenue service on home rails hauling coal down to the CSX connection at Westernport.
Ain't she purty?
I have 7471 in my roster, but apparently I haven't photographed it yet... Here's 7495 in the same color scheme.
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/IMG_3590.jpg)
Lee
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I did a little monkeying around in Downtown Cumberland...
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-G9uHFRItpxk/T5TAOesgHmI/AAAAAAAAQwM/e1duXMFc1_E/s733/cmbbaltst42212.jpg)
I started engineering the first block of buildings to be installed there against the skyboard. I'm working from the back wall out, now since once this is all closed up, I won't be able to access it at all. I didn't leave much of a pop up back here, athough I can wiggle through enough to be able to do the scenery along the back and skyboard. Everything else will be "flown in" from the aisle. Anyway, here's step 2:
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-A1r67ATbQ3U/T5TCkTLjlII/AAAAAAAAQwU/KebY3alqEHc/s733/cmbbaltst42212+%281%29.jpg)
This is the foundation for the block. It's a removable panel, which sits as close to dead level as I can get it, despite the roadways sloping all over the place. The block of plywood in the back is the base of the highest building, and includes a 1/16" plywood lip that catches the roadway at the back. This holds the whole operation level. The threaded rod is the handle I'm using to pick it up and put it down while I'm working on it.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-c9_ePyZgU9o/T5TCryA5ZqI/AAAAAAAAQwc/rLuChoIUgQ4/s733/cmbbaltst42212+%282%29.jpg)
And with the buildings in place. Having the tall building in the front, I can probably leave the threaded rod handle in place, and just paint it green or blue or whatever will be suitable to make it invisible. I could always disguise it in a chimney or something. You can see in this view how it relates to the industrial area and station around the corner.
Finally, the streetside view as the proof of concept.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-Yi07V7jelx4/T5TCyeLmy6I/AAAAAAAAQwk/O89uj1DNIzc/s733/cmbbaltst42212+%284%29.jpg)
I have to build on the foundation facades, and do some other detailing, then the sidewalk gets attached at the same slope as the roadway. Then all the sidewalk details get added. I'm in the process now of building the interiors and lighting for the buildings. They will all be linked into one circuit for the block, with a phone jack pigtailed off to make for easy plugging in and out.
All this needs to get in so I can start working on the brewery. There's a lot of tiny thirsty people up there in the hill country!
Lee
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Had to go to Georgetown, DE today, and stopped by the Hobby Stop in Seaford. Picked up some I beams and glue, and got started on the next iconic piece of Cumberland...
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-XHevyJgpo58/T5dc3ThmthI/AAAAAAAAQww/nYgCgMLBHPM/s733/cmbwc42412.jpg)
The steel beam bridge over Wills Creek.
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/mURI_temp_be14f3d0.jpg)
This is a case of selective "extension" since mine ends up a little longer than the prototype. It has a slight curve on it, where my model is straight, but you get the idea.
Of course, NOW I look at the Google Maps, and see that I have to rework it a little to make it look a little more "right"...
http://maps.google.com/maps?q=Cumberland,+MD&hl=en&ll=39.651415,-78.764131&spn=0.000621,0.000978&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=41.682395,64.072266&oq=Cumberland,+Maryland&t=h&hnear=Cumberland,+Allegany,+Maryland&z=20
Oh well... At least it looks like I won't have to worry about buying more beams...
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-EuI7DMfuzEA/T5dtKMXgCsI/AAAAAAAAQxE/UV6f0LXvKG4/s733/cmbwc42412+%284%29.jpg)
Here you can see how it relates to the station.
Back to the workbench!!
Lee
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8)
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Lee,
Nice job on a very unique bridge. I love how the area around that awesome station is progressing.
Eric
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Thanks to Eric (seusscaboose) for dropping down this evening for some track maintenance. We were able to reopen the mains again after a long period of closure due to the construction going on around Cumberland.
Heading back up now for some badly needed train running... and of course... wheel cleaning... :facepalm:
Lee
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it was a good time... and time sure goes by quick up in the train room...
i looked at the clock and thought it was time for me to hit the road... and only when i was heading out of town did i realize your trainroom clock is fast by one hour.... a TRUE fastclock... very nice.
I owe ya at least one more hour :)
the good news is, your runnin' trains... which is nice... the rails are cleaned and grinded and the engines painted black work splendidly... the same can't be said for the red white and black fleet... :)
the staging yards seem to have come through no worse for the wear, and i think a few passes of a few trains should have em nice and useable. same for the 2 helix areas.
electrically, all the tortises seem to work and there were no not any dead spots i could find. basic dirty track which is easily fixable.
the main yard didn't get worked on (only the run through tracks)... that will need to be cleared and cleaned.
otherwise, you seem to be on your way to shaking things down and watching train's again.
one question. Dispatch desk... where is it going to be? at the workbench or in the train room? me think's the answer is the dispatch desk.
EP
p.s. i need a billboard for the new lumberyard. got any good ideas? here is some inspiration
http://www.google.com/search?q=morningwood+lumber&hl=en&prmd=imvns&source=lnms&tbm=isch&ei=sLecT-GLBKTk0QHns-jzDg&sa=X&oi=mode_link&ct=mode&cd=2&ved=0CBwQ_AUoAQ&biw=1280&bih=664 (http://www.google.com/search?q=morningwood+lumber&hl=en&prmd=imvns&source=lnms&tbm=isch&ei=sLecT-GLBKTk0QHns-jzDg&sa=X&oi=mode_link&ct=mode&cd=2&ved=0CBwQ_AUoAQ&biw=1280&bih=664)
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In the current configuration, the dispatcher will be in the middle of the action, seated next to the yard boss and controlling the helix and west staging. Although if a communication system can be devised, out at the work bench is a good idea. Wireless technology and detection, along with the necessary signalling will be the key to that working out.
After you left, I was able to run 3-4 trains around the orbit with a modicum of difficulty. I put the track cleaning car behind the RS-3s, and it went a long way to getting the less accessible stuff tidied up. I did have a few issues down in West Staging, the most difficult track to reach (naturally) but most of that was user error (in through the out door etc.)
I'm having guests over for a BBQ this afternoon, and I'm sure there will be demands to see the railroad...I'm confident that I can "make it go" long enough to entertain the troops.
Thanks again, Eric... There will be plenty of opportunity to cash in that hour!
Lee
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I think we should all invest in a FRS walkie talkie - with earbud and microphone .. then do our dispatching that way
-
Diddled around with the beam bridge today, having scored the remaining bits required thanks to Phil and to the Moose Caboose in Sykesville.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-gzcyBU_oxbE/T6hh9gHqbiI/AAAAAAAAQ7I/VQ5uzGtpgFM/s733/cmbstawc5712+%281%29.jpg)
I used some strip styrene to make some sleepers to catch the rail. I stripped the ties from the middle of the flex track, glued down the left rail using CA, then used my MT track gauge/coupler height tool to set the opposite rail, gluing it in place a couple of inches at a time. Worked like a charm. Added some spacer blocks, and glued the guard rail right to the beams, making the c55 rail lower and looking like c40. Finally, I painted the whole mess.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-pK0WKdM-vN4/T6hiBhq3nrI/AAAAAAAAQ7Y/f95DPqA0szI/s733/cmbstawc5712+%283%29.jpg)
I used some Rustoleum texture paint for the piers and abutments, and some oxide red and flat black on the beams. I went back over them with some dark rust washes, then some lighter grime washes.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-aIetC9_gVhw/T6hiD4-dYCI/AAAAAAAAQ7g/nhTg6GQJpIw/s733/cmbstawc5712+%284%29.jpg)
While the beam arrangement isn't quite spot on compared to the prototype, I think I've got the flavor about right.
For now, the pier assembly can be slid out from under the beam system, which is suspended below the rails. Once I get a few critical bits done for the city scape, I'll be able to do a final installation.
Also, this installation signals the completion of the permanently installed main line circuit!
Lee
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Total coolness. Love that bridge--something I'd always wanted to build.
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Also, this installation signals the completion of the permanently installed main line circuit!
Golden Spike
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(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-CGpJHLE_rkA/T6iAtAykeDI/AAAAAAAAQ70/3oH99RYhF0Q/s733/cmbbmb5712+%285%29.jpg)
Started roughing in the foam between Cumberland and Thomas. I'm seeing lots of trees here... although I'm tinkering with the idea of a little residential stuff... not sure yet.
Trees will provide a break between the towns, which is probably important.
Oh, and dig this... the train with the RS3s there actually backed itself all the way up from the long siding under Cumberland... when I turned the system on, the throttle apparently reset to the last time I ran trains, so it was set at 035/128 in reverse no less, and it just quietly crawled around the Yough Valley, across Casselman Crossing, and around the papermill. I didn't notice it was moving until it needed a little goose to push it around the last curve. Short train (about 12 cars) but no defects reported!
Lee
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Oh, and dig this... the train with the RS3s there actually backed itself all the way up from the long siding under Cumberland... when I turned the system on, the throttle apparently reset to the last time I ran trains, so it was set at 035/128 in reverse no less, and it just quietly crawled around the Yough Valley, across Casselman Crossing, and around the papermill. I didn't notice it was moving until it needed a little goose to push it around the last curve. Short train (about 12 cars) but no defects reported!
Great stuff, Lee. I can only hope my trackwork is that bulletproof!
Cheers!
Marc - Riverside
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Jeez. Having my thread drop to page two is like getting sent to the minors...
Here's a peek behind the curtain:
http://wmrywesternlines.blogspot.com/2012/06/more-than-i-can-chew.html
Lee
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Jeez. Having my thread drop to page two is like getting sent to the minors...
Here's a peek behind the curtain:
http://wmrywesternlines.blogspot.com/2012/06/more-than-i-can-chew.html
Lee
Great blog Lee!
I'm kinda in the same boat, most of the people I run with are a couple hours south of me.
My layout started out a little different though, in that I never figured on anyone ever running the layout other than me. Back in 2008, I didn't have anyone to help me design it, build it or run it. Consequently I designed it for one person. And I did the KISS thing. No hidden track. Manually operated throws. Simple wiring.
It's easy to overcomplicate things.
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There seems to be some of that going around now. Hard for me to believe that a lifer like you will sit it out for too long though. Take a trip out to WM and go catch the new George's Creek units.
-gfh
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And Lee,
you might want to take a gander at Lance Mindheim's 26 May blog entry - lot's of good stuff there.
http://www.lancemindheim.com/blog.htm (http://www.lancemindheim.com/blog.htm)
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There seems to be some of that going around now. Hard for me to believe that a lifer like you will sit it out for too long though. Take a trip out to WM and go catch the new George's Creek units.
-gfh
Trying to complete even a medium sized layout is a daunting prospect, as I've found out.
You can blow through many tasks relatively quickly... Others are just tedious, no matter how you slice it. The other day I was headed down to one of the guy's layouts a couple hours from here for an operating session. On the way I had a chance to whine about the time it taking to "set" buildings so that they didn't look like they were simply dropped there from the sky, like Dorothy's house in the Wizard of Oz. Just a lot of futzing around that consumed far more time than one would think.
-
All things electrical are the bane of my existence. I really want the effect of signalling, but have no patience, knowledge or talent for it. I love putting lighting in structures, but I'm impatient, so getting to light up results in a spider web below decks that becomes a nightmare.
And of course, when electrical stuff goes kaput, it's harder to run the trains...
I'm just tired right now, work has been overwhelming the past couple weeks, not to mention all the other distractions of spring...
But now, I'm pushing back from the damn computer, and I'm going to wire a decoder into a gorgeous brass diesel. Wish me well!
Lee
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27 days since last post... WOW...
of course, there is a trip to carolina in there... as well as an article or two... plus real work...
you're foregiven.
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This thread needs an update!
:D
The S.
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Well, having been in the room on Wednesday, I can confirm it's still intact, and at least 2 trains can run simultaneously. And the effect of CUmberland is really well done, and improving every minute.
:facepalm:
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Thanks for your ongoing concern.
Things have been at a stand still for some time. Apart from it being all the little A/C unit can do to keep up with the 100+ heat, I've still got a house to paint, a porch to rebuild, plus some major repairs inside the house to tend to... Add to that a pretty substantial decoder work load, and you'll see my neglect of the layout is legit.
But there's some stuff in the pipeline that will hopefully be of interest.
-
Okay. Here's an update. The layout still exists in the attic at Mill Street, although I am no longer a permanent resident at that location. As many of you know, my wife and I have separated, and I expect before long we'll be divorcing.
I've been selling off much of my locomotive fleet (Thank you very much to those of you playing along at home!) and also thinned out some of the rolling stock. I've had several offers on the Cumberland Station building, but I'm not sure I'm going to part with that ... unless things really go south financially.
Anyway, the layout is safe for the moment, I've turned the keys over to my son Andy, whose room is just outside the train room. At some point, though, I expect to do some controlled demolition to salvage key parts of the track plan that can possibly re-deployed, such as the staging yards, the main yard and engine terminal, Elkins, and the helixes. Whatever's left will get stripped for parts, track components, bridges, structures and electronics etc. and either stockpiled for future use, or sold off.
I doubt I'll be hosting any more operating sessions, given the domestic situation, and the fact that much of the motive power and rolling stock is being liquidated.
My future plans are in flux, obviously. But I still have lots of ideas rattling around in my head, primarily focused on a layout based on the good old Laurel Valley, my freelance shortline.
If you've read through these pages, you know that I was feeling a little overwhelmed by the complexity of the layout, mostly from a maintenance standpoint. Operationally, it worked well, but it lacked the distance between switching areas that I would have preferred to have. I definitely want to salvage the yard intact, since it was so brilliantly designed by the Railwire collaborators who helped me with thinking it through. Hopefully I'll be able to re-use it as part of a future design, but worst case, I'll be happy if I can get a fair price for it.
So anyway, for now, I'll be tinkering with small projects to pass the time, and stepping up my visitations to other layouts to work on future articles for N Scale Magazine and perhaps other publications. In the meantime, thanks to all of you for your well-wishes and also for your participation in the design, construction and operation of the Western Maryland Western Lines. I've really enjoyed sharing it with you all, and getting your feedback, positive and otherwise. This truly is the world's greatest hobby, populated by some of the world's greatest people.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-tXATaQDznMs/T4eOHGYN9zI/AAAAAAAAQtc/NFtB9NWdkl0/s1543/socmb41212+%289%29.jpg)
Stay tuned for future developments.
Lee
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Sorry about the personal news Lee. And obviously not seeing WM updates will stink, but something better will come out of all this.
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Anyone know any witty women with a great deal of patience, unlimited funds and an unfinished basement? :ashat:
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That sucks Lee. Wish you all the best in the future!
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Anyone know any witty women with a great deal of patience, unlimited funds and an unfinished basement? :ashat:
There used to be one, just outside of Milwaukee, back in the late 70's. But I think she passed away in '93. :ashat:
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Damn. Really sorry to hear that Lee. Keep your chin up.
Best wishes, Dave
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Sorry to hear it, Lee.
Although we've never met, your kindness and generosity are evident in your writing -- especially in the few queries I've thrown your way. Nothing keeps a good man down. So ... here's to better days.
Jim
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Wow, that's not the kind of news anyone wants to hear. We're all pulling for you.
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Sorry to hear your news Lee. Take care.
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Best wishes Lee. I do hope you find a way to do some modeling again, and get back into the scrum here. This forum needs more Lee. :)
-gfh
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Sorry to hear of your situation, never a fun thing to deal with. Best of luck to you.
Like others I will miss the WM updates. :(
Allen...
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Lee,
So sorry to hear the latest news. Will be praying for you and your family.
michael
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Dang Lee, Sorry to hear that. I've got you in my prayers. Take care.
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There may be life after the attic afterall.
Last night after mucking out the den at my lady person friend's house, we started chatting about the possibility of running a shelf layout down one wall. I was thinking a 12" wide switching layout of some sort to just scratch the itch, then she chimed in that the garage is just on the other side of the wall, and that the part in the den could be something grand and scenic like this:
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-4SzMVw4r9Xo/UH2pqD_9AZI/AAAAAAAARss/bZlyaglB0ks/s1073/Field+Trip+002.jpg)
and this...
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-BgJlOb3HMJQ/UH2qCwAP18I/AAAAAAAARvM/mzHy9qxv1jg/s1073/Field+Trip+022.jpg)
and in the garage I could do all the ops and yards and such.
She said it would allow the fellows to shuffle their car cards and drink beer in the garage, while the ladies enjoy some music, wine and the occasional freight passing through some stunning scenery.
This one might be a keeper. Either that or she's just using me to clean out her garage... Yeesh!
Lee
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Hang in there Lee. Though we've never met I've enjoyed your reports and your advice to others with similiar railroading problems.
I've been through 2 divorces but the N scale has survived albiet in boxes for a few years. My now long term GF is very acceptant of my N scaling though I think I've reached her limit on train shows.
I now have my own place and just put on an addition with about 350sf dedicated to a train room. I may call it, "the Phoenix Risen sub-division."
I probably speak for most of the Railwire folks in saying, " if I can be of assistance just ask."
Keep in touch.
Charlie
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Measurements taken, preliminary room drawings underway. Stay tuned for further developments.
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Lee, I hate to be a buzz-kill, and I admit that I'm not intimately familiar with your situation, but how permanent is this arrangement liable to be? I would hate to see you put in a bunch of work into a stunning layout only to have access to it lost down the road.
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Lee, I hate to be a buzz-kill, and I admit that I'm not intimately familiar with your situation, but how permanent is this arrangement liable to be? I would hate to see you put in a bunch of work into a stunning layout only to have access to it lost down the road.
I was thinking the same thing. Which is why I have the show layout right now. In a year to a year and a half I will buy my own place and then the large one can start.
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Fear not fellow babies... modular construction is going to be a centerpiece of the plan!! Not due to any issues relating to the relationship... I've become quite attached to the idea of not being attached to a particular layout! I can scratch my "run all the trains" itch at John or Eric's...
Lee
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HCD... HCD... HCD... One of us... One of us... One of us...
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Here's the space that's available. Remember, I'm just looking at running a shelf along the wall that adjoins the garage.
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/Chief_Architect_10_08a_-_Full_Version_-_%5BArcadia_Shores_Floor_Plan%5D_1192012_65320_PM_bmp.jpg)
There's a possibility of poking through the wall into the garage, and doing a more ops oriented layout in there. Put as you can see, there's a lot of work that will need to be done in there before much gets done...
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/GarageDen.jpg)
Points to ponder. I'd like to keep the shelf in the den no more than 24" deep. It can run pretty much the full length of the wall between the book case and the fireplace, though. It should be up around eye level, to allow for desks and so forth beneath it.
On the garage side, the floor is about 18" lower. This would require a platform to be built to get to the same eye level as in the den, but it opens the possibility of a helix being included to drop one end down to a lower level.
In the garage side, it could either be a simple staging loop, or again, something more elaborate from an ops standpoint. The segment running through the den would be primarily scenery, although a small hamlet with a siding wouldn't be out of the question.
My objective would be to model a remote stretch of the Cumberland Extension of the WM in the den, basically green mountains, a winding river, and a couple of detailed bridges and tunnels.
The other side could be pretty much foobed, with a yard, or just a couple of staging loops high and low.
I'd like to be able to run continuous, although the segment in the den would have to be single tracked, with perhaps an optional 6-8' passing siding. The limiting factor on the siding would be the need for two long bridges and a couple of tunnels, all of which would be single tracked.
So what does the collective envision for this situation? HCDs are definitely an option for the main decks.
Lee
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Two questions. One, how much of that (currently very full-looking) garage will be available on a practical basis? Two, how do you feel about the awkwardness of a layout with one side you can't see or even get to easily?
I could envision all sorts of fun stuff, but being split in half, give or take, leads me to wonder if you might need some sort of traincam in the office to support any sort of ops scenario in the garage, even if it's simple.
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BIG PROBLEM. Your building inspector is going to hate you for cutting a hole or two between the garage with its associated noxious fumes (e.g., auto exhaust) and the living space. Not to mention the problems from opening up holes from heated to non-heated areas, but are you trying to kill everyone in the house?
Mike Holmes would not approve.
DFF
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I'm still saying go HCD for now.
Im in the exact same situation as you right now, and as much as I want a large home layout, I'm waiting until I get a house in my name this time next year.
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Hmmmmm... If it were my space I would seriously consider double decking the office side, the scene you described on top and maybe some urban modelling on the bottom or a yard... whatever blows your hair back. In the Garage, either the helix or a "nolix" running between the decks... Nothing more than that though
Maybe you could build a "Fire door" for the tracks to access the garage :facepalm:. That might keep Mr. Holmes quiet :P.
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Mike Holmes would not approve.
This.
I'm still saying go HCD for now.
And this.
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Forget about the garage. Too many hassles. The length you have inside would allow you to have 3+ HCDs laid end-to-end. What does that give you?
- A continuous loop.
- Large double-ended yard.
- 5-7 large industries
- Plenty of urban scenery possibilities
Best yet, it would be a 3-HCD "major city" module that can eventually be plugged right into a larger layout, someday.
That's the approach I've taken, anyway. I'm building a similar module ... modularly. I have two of the HCDs up, and plan to add the third next year.
Of course, it wouldn't have to be a yard/industrial/urban layout. You could take the same approach with a rural setting, since that seemed to be the original attraction for you. Either way, you'd have a hellofa start on a larger layout, if that becomes a desire or possibility.
Jim
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One option to consider, perhaps, that might pass the "Mike Holmes test" would be to use garage space only for a completely enclosed return loop. This way you could have continuous running but restrict the living space area used to a (wide-ish?) shelf, maybe 18-inch HCDs for convenience. It would also mean you get to operate your layout in a comfortable, heated and pleasant space.
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Leaning very much toward "keep it simple". It could be years before the garage is habitable. Like the original WM layout, it could be years of planning before anything actually gets built, and by then many things could change (recall that I'm a designer and she's a builder!)
This is probably more an exercise for you fellows than it is for me!
Lee
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http://wmrywesternlines.blogspot.com/
The latest.
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Lee,
You know, for sentimental purposes, I would really like to have a building or structure that you're willing to part with that I could use on my own layout. Since I feel like I have a personal investment in your layout, I would like to have some small piece to help keep the memories of the WM Western Lines alive for me. Feel free to PM me.
Dave
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I've acquired the 84 lumber .. its currently sitting on the M&O awaiting switching :)
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I've acquired the 84 lumber .. its currently sitting on the M&O awaiting switching :)
Heh, I saw that the last time I was at Eric's. You're lucky it's still there. :D
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Heh, I saw that the last time I was at Eric's. You're lucky it's still there. :D
It's not .. it's in my basement ..
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Heh, I saw that the last time I was at Eric's. You're lucky it's still there in your possession. :D
Fixed it.
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I'm glad I'll get to see some of this stuff in its new context one of these days... Thanks, guys!
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Any structures that would look good on the Simonds IT!?
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(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-zWgJcn3TZkk/T4EhZ3BhzYI/AAAAAAAAQqU/OiwmdyPU_38/s1073/cmblts41812+%289%29.jpg)
How about the Hoffman Manufacturing Company/Star Apologist complex for along the backdrop?
Lee
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How about the Hoffman Manufacturing Company/Star Apologist complex for along the backdrop?
. . . and the Green Monster hanging over it. :trollface:
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Go chase an ambulance, Dave. :ashat:
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All that work to get it right .... You should keep it as background for Cumberland...
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How about the Hoffman Manufacturing Company/Star Apologist complex for along the backdrop?
Did you ever get a chance to play with the lettering for that?
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The Hard Hat should be donated to the real Hard Hat at the next picnic.
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That one needs to stay in the family Bob.
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(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-zWgJcn3TZkk/T4EhZ3BhzYI/AAAAAAAAQqU/OiwmdyPU_38/s1073/cmblts41812+%289%29.jpg)
A quick question about your street lamps in the photo, Lee... Are those the same ones I keep seeing on ebay from "WeHonest" et al? If so, I've been considering getting some and would like to know what you think of them and the size you got (they look right)? Are they the 70mm ones?
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The Hard Hat should be donated to the real Hard Hat at the next picnic.
Nice idea. But it's already bought, paid for, and delivered.
(http://i415.photobucket.com/albums/pp233/eric220/DSC_0004-9.jpg)
Its final destination will be Morrow near the PRR/N&W interchange on the lower level.
Hopefully this counts as "staying in the family".
(http://i415.photobucket.com/albums/pp233/eric220/RailBQ2011062_zps62761506.jpg)
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Hopefully this counts as "staying in the family".
As long as I'm considered family, too. I was in the inaugural class of the Hard Hat, as evidenced by Dave Vollmer's picture in The Railwire header rotation.
DFF
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Eric,
You count as family. Sorry - hope there will be. 12 Step program developed shortly for you.
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Eric,
You count as family. Sorry - hope there will be. 12 Step program developed shortly for you.
Already done:
Step 1: Yuengling
Step 2: Yuengling
Step 3: Jameson
Step 4: Yuengling
Step 5: Restroom
Step 5: Yuengling
Step 6: Jameson
Step 7: Yuengling
Step 8: Restroom
Step 9: Yuengling
Step 10: Porcelain telephone
Step 11: Jameson
Step 12: Yuengling
*Water as needed.
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Rob,
I never did get a chance to fool with the lettering. At this point, I'm not even sure where it is. The building itself is on the block. If you're interested in taking a stab at putting the finishing touches on it, I'm open to sending it your way free of charge as compensation for the work you did on the station windows.
This is the best bunch of folk anyone could hope to be around.
Thanks to all.
Lee
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If you're interested in taking a stab at putting the finishing touches on it, I'm open to sending it your way free of charge as compensation for the work you did on the station windows.
Lee,
I appreciate the offer, but I don't have anywhere I could use it that would do it justice.
If you need a home for the building to save it from destruction, I'll gladly provide one, but if someone else can make better use of it then they should get it.
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Lee .. we can transplant that whole scene, less the WM station right onto the M&O .. lets talk
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Which scene? Cumberland?
The freight house has already been sold, and I'm planning to construct a onetrak module of the immediate station area, so I'll need the beam bridge, the station and the highway overpass.
But the Hoffman building, Cumberland Star Apologist and the background buildings, including Tweedales, are available. Just let me know what you have in mind.
Lee
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Today begins the end of the WMRY Western Lines. It's been a great run, but like all good things, it's time to bring it in for a landing.
This morning I'll be packing up the remaining structures, rolling stock and various other scenic elements that can be salvaged, and tomorrow, a couple of the crew will be on hand to help with the dismantling and hauling out of several main chunks of the railroad.
Some of it will survive as parts of a couple of other layouts, and some of it will not.
I expect I'll be building something again at some point, but for now I hope to stay in the operating loop that keeps trains running around the Baltimore DC metro area.
Thanks to everyone who had a hand in its design, construction and operation. On to the next thing!
Lee
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Here's some shots of the last trains to run on the layout. I ran a couple of extras over some very dirty track to clear all the rolling stock from the mains and branches and bring them all into the yard. Once done, I cut the mains and pulled a couple of key bridges where the first cuts will be made.
https://plus.google.com/u/0/photos/106978907148382696950/albums/5833140738369686257?authkey=CN3UmcnA97W2vgE
I'll post a couple of the highlights in Weekend Update.
Thanks again for playing along at home.
Lee
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Nice album Lee, thanks for posting it!
I'll be observing a moment of silence tomorrow.
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As will I.
Fellas, raise a glass to WM!
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*sniffle*
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While I can not say I have visited the WM Western Lines in person, two pieces of my equipment did.
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o120/mu26aeh/N%20Scale%20Layout%20Construction/Weeklies037.jpg)
#107 awaits orders at Westvaco
It will be missed by many....
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Fare thee well, good and faithful servant... :facepalm:
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Fair winds and following seas, WM Western Lines.
Bravo Zulu
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A sad day indeed. May she live on in photos forever.
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Lee, thanks for sharing that album. Sadly some of those shots I have not seen, but finally gave me a better understanding of the layout as a whole.
I helped a friend tear out a layout (his dream layout), after three years of hectic building. His wife was sick, and he knew he had to build it fast before they moved to a retirement community where he would not have space. It was a sad day indeed then, as is knowing this yours is coming down too.
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Yesterday was a surreal day for me. Back in 2006, I was following along on the progress here on the 'wire (still the only forum I read). I invited myself over to a guy named Lee's house after a fishing trip off of Tilghman Island. I wasn't sure how I was going to be received in that I had no operating layout of my own. I was a collector of n scale equipment, and to this day, I still am mostly. Lee invited me in to his humble abode and off to the attic we went. He didn't even cringe when I whipped out some Rock Island stuff (I wasn't sure if that was proper or not). From there, a friendship began and I consider myself part of the original operating crew (more so when I moved to the eastern shore).
Seeing the layout come down was devastating. I felt like somebody died and we were cleaning up the mess. Lee is alive and well, obviously, but knowing the WM is officially dead in the water hurts. Everybody that came in person to Lee's feels like it was theirs, and Lee is to thank for that.
A big thanks to Eric for housing the peninsula and to unknown others that may recreate the WM. Godspeed old friend.
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knowing the WM is officially dead in the water hurts.
Not dead. Salvaged as best as possible considering the circumstances. ;)
You will run your Rock over it again (partially).
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Not dead. Salvaged as best as possible considering the circumstances. ;)
You will run your Rock over it again (partially).
... and Philip will run his coffee grinder over it again, too (partially). :D
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HE he!
And Elkridge is slated to be reborn in Mount Rainier once I get back (and scratch build a KCS sanding tower).
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Thanks for the photos Lee. Sad day indeed but I hope the pieces that live on elsewhere do so for a long time,
Phil
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HE he!
And Elkridge is slated to be reborn in Mount Rainier once I get back (and scratch build a KCS sanding tower).
Do you mean Elkins? If so, you should know the history of the HCD upon which Elkins was built. It was one-half of a two-piece 24" bi-fold door (two 12" doors) that I bought several years ago. One piece was donated to Lee for Elkins. The other 12" HCD was the Yard-on-a-Shelf (staging yard) connected to the Virginia Central, and that layout (with the staging yard) resides at RockGp40's house.
DFF
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Sad day indeed. Can't believe it's been almost 3 years since I ran on it. Good to see parts are going to live on. Can't wait to see "WM Western Lines The Sequal" someday.
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Do you mean Elkins? If so, you should know the history of the HCD upon which Elkins was built. It was one-half of a two-piece 24" bi-fold door (two 12" doors) that I bought several years ago. One piece was donated to Lee for Elkins. The other 12" HCD was the Yard-on-a-Shelf (staging yard) connected to the Virginia Central, and that layout (with the staging yard) resides at RockGp40's house.
DFF
yes, Elkins . . . need more coffee . . . .
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Thanks for those kind words, Brian... I remember our first meeting well, and still have that shot of the Rock we took that day:
(http://www.wmrywesternlines.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/More_Train_Stuff_009.jpg)
Here's how it went down... We got started around 10:30 a.m. We dismantled North Junction to make room in the doorway, then the cutting began...
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-_ogMK8pIB7s/URlLKRYkV3I/AAAAAAAAS7k/P23Sn8jmX6k/s667/2013+Weeklies+002.jpg)
While I was hacking away at foam and sculptamold, Ed and Tim worked on boxing up the remaining rolling stock on the layout. The last car to officially turn a wheel on the railroad was a B&O bay window caboose of no fixed prototype.
Work on detaching the several layers of track and wiring went on for about an hour.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-5gzbyC0f2qE/URlLQEJa70I/AAAAAAAAS78/HgdY4ZaoK7M/s667/2013+Weeklies+006.jpg)
Brian (Rock GP40) showed up around 11, then we went to lunch to power up before attempting to move the behemoth down the steps. Plaza Tapatia was the weapon of choice, with ammunition provided by a couple of 32 oz Dos Equis Grandes.
Before the move, Ed inspects the cuts, and verifies that all of the electrical connections were severed.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/--UMFyjURVmI/URlLSdVnFbI/AAAAAAAAS8E/2jEuOhX3cKM/s667/2013+Weeklies+008.jpg)
There were no photos taken of the actual move. It was all hands on deck. We got it out of the room easily enough, and then turned it over to slide it down the steps, but the 64" wide bulbous end (Andy calls this the "Scrotum") simply wouldn't make it through the opening. We had to heft it back up the steps twice to trim portions off. Finally we removed the high bridge and the entire subroadbed that had supported the Shaw siding, and this allowed us to get Elvis out of the building.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-oiy5_gg3_Io/URlLUX_xGgI/AAAAAAAAS8M/zJEHNZ3R5kg/s667/2013+Weeklies+010.jpg)
We loaded the main section into my girlfriend's pick up, and all the remaining bits and pieces from the surgery into the cab, and headed across the great waters of the Chesapeake toward Eric's house near the airport.
Once at Eric's, we found the path to the basement to be relatively straight, but not without challenges. We had to move the picnic table over to the steps from the car port so we could gain enough height to heft it over the railing and into the house. We had to remove both the exterior door and basement door from their hinges to provide enough clearance. Again, there wasn't a stray set of hands to work the camera, so you'll have to take the word of the witnesses.
With only inches to spare, it fit over the railing, under the carport ceiling, through the two doors, and down the steps. Due to bad planning, Eric ended up at the bottom of the steps by himself as the full brunt of the peninsula went down the stairway. Imagine standing out in center field by yourself trying to field a fly ball that happens to be as big as a submarine.
Anyway, we recovered, got it down the narrow aisle next to Sunnyside, and spun into position at rest on a temporary table.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-Cpg1imeWKYs/URlLWkLE0GI/AAAAAAAAS8U/_PobVbExOMw/s667/2013+Weeklies+012.jpg)
The next challenge for Eric and the crew is to work out the elevation changes of the peninsula and marry them to the existing shelf layout along the wall in the background.
I appreciate the hard work and ingenuity that went into this move, and I'm now anxious to get the rest of the layout moved along to be stored or incorporated into another layout or three. I also appreciate Eric generously offering to make a home for this favorite piece of work. I'm looking forward to helping to tie in the scenery, and to running some Laurel Valley power up the Yough Valley once again.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-Xj16EYrVai8/URbcvkj2ghI/AAAAAAAAS4E/QQ5fwRSp_1o/s667/Last+Train+%2888%29.jpg)
Lee
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The final chunks of the Western Maryland Western Lines have been removed from the attic. There is quite a bit of it that has survived as portable, storable chunks, but these bits will be stripped of anything of value, cleaned of any foam and plastic, and tossed on the burn pile. The 24" x 30" helix is intact. It's 3.5 turns and rises 9" (or something like that... I can't remember). It's a single track twist good for raising a low traffic branchline up onto a shelf. If you're interested, give me a shout.
(https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/293014_10201283267189518_1043801124_n.jpg)
I also have the west staging yard fully intact on its frame. Measures about 42" x 8', with four through balloon tracks, each capable of holding 30 to 40 car trains.
If you're east of the Mississippi, I'll deliver it for gas money and beer.
Lee
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Another chunk of the layout is now slated for preservation. The big yard at Ridgeley was the last big piece of the Western Maryland Western Lines that I built, and it was a little tricky to dismantle and remove, but it came out cleanly in two sections, and is presently stored.
Ed K and I started talking about how it might live on as part of his Northern Central, we did a little measuring, and dang if it won't fit perfectly in his basement, exactly where he wants it.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/gR7X9yyryzzUXYs8_-bpU7-_la9_EYdcUGbqw2gpkfUF=w791-h573-no)
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/yZ629tlQRTpONPLHjfCMXoE_4vTXDdKxxxGJ0s2zqc_v=w764-h573-no)
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/56KqkuYt9RK3WB7oFdZwZmFqpAe5P2cBjMNnun3m8lZ3=w764-h573-no)
Hopefully the transition will be a smooth one, and I can say that I'm a Conrail modeler again!
Lee
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I kinda feel at this point the right thing for Ed to do is get his industrial jollies not with Baltimore but York, and tie in the negative space of the "shelf" with the yard for one cohesive layout. Make the lower stanging under the yard Baltimore, make the visible yard York, add some industrial trackage just beyond York, and then a nice peninsula representing the line between. Use the I-81 overpass to disguise the turnback on the center-of-the-room peninsula.
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Hopefully the transition will be a smooth one, and I can say that I'm a Conrail modeler again!
"We are Conrail modelers. Resistance is futile. Your life, as it has been, is over. From this time forward, you will service us. We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own."
Sincerely,
The Conrail Queens
:D :D :D
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"We are Conrail modelers. Resistance is futile. Your life, as it has been, is over. From this time forward, you will service us. We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own."
Sincerely,
The Conrail Queens
:D :D :D
It's a bit long, but I nominate this for the next CRHS tee shirt.
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Digging through the archives to clear up some hard drive space, and cobbled this together. Enjoy!
/>
Lee
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@wm3798
Video no go. :(
DFF
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@wm3798
Video no go. :(
DFF
same with me, saying it's unavailable...
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Apparently I need to find a source for public domain music. The jack booted thugs are going after my dad's scratchy 78s now...
Lee
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Probably Mr. Boh blocking transmission from his throne of lies on Brewers Hill...
Jeff
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Long time, no see.
It's nice to see chunks of the old layout surfacing here and there from their new homes. I wondered if I could impose upon those of you who have obtained structures, scenes, or even engines and rolling stock from me in the past few years to post pictures here of their current locations, and describe any modifications you've made, or how you're now using them.
It might be useful information for others thinking about dismantling things, or otherwise re-purposing all or part of your model railroad. It will also be a treat for me. :D
Lee
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Cool idea, Lee!
(http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc84/dff21901/20160326_205648.jpg)
This picture doesn't do it justice, but I'm not home to take a more current picture. Anyhow, here is the former WM commissary building repurposed on the Seaboard Central as some sort of railroad office-type structure thingie for the Seaboard System near Aberdeen, North Carolina.
DFF
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Well, I took a big chunk and built a layout around it...
http://conrail1285.com/moving-hagerstown-to-york-and-my-basement/
Here are all the articles on my site of it:
http://conrail1285.com/tag/ncr-windsor-st-yard-in-york-layout/
As of two weeks ago, things were running.
http://conrail1285.com/trains-now-run-around-all-of-the-windsor-street-yard-layout/
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The power plant and Westvaco warehouse ended up on the CSX Hanover Sub. Power plant and coal pit are suited in place where they will stay. Westvaco warehouse is currently on ex Ma & Pa trackage in Hanover. Only modifications were to the warehouse, as some of the glue joints did not survive the shipping process. In real life, there are some metal sided manufacturing buildings here without rail service, so I'm not sure it will stay here.
(https://c7.staticflickr.com/8/7284/27850737646_19d80b2c81_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/Jr5iZQ)20160624_191503 (https://flic.kr/p/Jr5iZQ) by Adam Henry (https://www.flickr.com/photos/130827720@N03/), on Flickr
(https://c8.staticflickr.com/8/7591/27808808991_77feae66f6_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/Jnnq4Z)20160624_191623 (https://flic.kr/p/Jnnq4Z) by Adam Henry (https://www.flickr.com/photos/130827720@N03/), on Flickr
After a visit to Ed K's layout to retrieve a throttle for an open house, I ended up with this too...
(https://c4.staticflickr.com/8/7578/27808819171_a6913a4c4b_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/Jnnt6v)20160624_191558 (https://flic.kr/p/Jnnt6v) by Adam Henry (https://www.flickr.com/photos/130827720@N03/), on Flickr
I am not sure what I will do with it. I used it for a teaching tool during said open house, showing visitors how foam board and plaster can be used for different landscaping techniques. Eventually I plan on redoing the back side with new landscaping once I figure out what I want to do with it. If I remember correctly, the area had an elevated rail line. Was thinking of putting that back in place, or possibly put in a highway with overpass over the road. And for your pleasure, I'm displaying my Western Maryland equipment in the shots :D
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Lee:
the video did not work for me either
your building on the CMMMD re-alocated as a furniture factory.
cleaned up the shipping damage and added LED's inside and the entrance little roof to hide the little LED for the front
glad i got the building, fits right in with my vision
thanks Lee !!!
Miguel
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And how's the new layout going, Lee?
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Glacially. I've got two old houses I'm trying to finish, an old car that needs more attention than it deserves, and more or less continual urge to eat and pay bills, which requires an enormous amount of time. I did recently get to visit an old friend, though... and raise a toast...
(https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/t31.0-8/13559008_10209977345136033_7216170744564235939_o.jpg)
Lee
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The power plant and Westvaco warehouse ended up on the CSX Hanover Sub. Power plant and coal pit are suited in place where they will stay. Westvaco warehouse is currently on ex Ma & Pa trackage in Hanover. Only modifications were to the warehouse, as some of the glue joints did not survive the shipping process. In real life, there are some metal sided manufacturing buildings here without rail service, so I'm not sure it will stay here.
(https://c7.staticflickr.com/8/7284/27850737646_19d80b2c81_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/Jr5iZQ)20160624_191503 (https://flic.kr/p/Jr5iZQ) by Adam Henry (https://www.flickr.com/photos/130827720@N03/), on Flickr
(https://c8.staticflickr.com/8/7591/27808808991_77feae66f6_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/Jnnq4Z)20160624_191623 (https://flic.kr/p/Jnnq4Z) by Adam Henry (https://www.flickr.com/photos/130827720@N03/), on Flickr
After a visit to Ed K's layout to retrieve a throttle for an open house, I ended up with this too...
(https://c4.staticflickr.com/8/7578/27808819171_a6913a4c4b_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/Jnnt6v)20160624_191558 (https://flic.kr/p/Jnnt6v) by Adam Henry (https://www.flickr.com/photos/130827720@N03/), on Flickr
I am not sure what I will do with it. I used it for a teaching tool during said open house, showing visitors how foam board and plaster can be used for different landscaping techniques. Eventually I plan on redoing the back side with new landscaping once I figure out what I want to do with it. If I remember correctly, the area had an elevated rail line. Was thinking of putting that back in place, or possibly put in a highway with overpass over the road. And for your pleasure, I'm displaying my Western Maryland equipment in the shots :D
In what I believe was the final salvage operation on this project, we were cleaning out the garage over the long holiday weekend, and I came across the last three bits of the old layout that needed to be dispatched. I finally removed the salvagable turnouts and track from the section that had housed the Cumberland station. Since that model now resides safely on a set of TTrak modules, I was able to let go of the idea that it would ever become useful again.
Also, the bit that ran behind Cumberland, the Thomas Sub from Hinshaw bridge to the helix, was denuded of scenery details, track and bridge abutments,
(https://www.therailwire.net/forum/gallery/24/9-060721113546.jpeg) (https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=24657)
It now resembles a stretch of the ROW circa 1976. Here it is in happier times, there with the billboard signs:
(https://www.therailwire.net/forum/gallery/24/9-060721120454.jpeg) (https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=24659)
Also, the section Adam photographed in the image above all those years ago, had been returned to me last year when I was working on designing his addition. I haven't decided what to do with it yet, it might make a fun photo diorama, although it might get reworked into another TTrak module.
(https://www.therailwire.net/forum/gallery/24/9-060721115415.jpeg) (https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=24658)
Another view from long ago and far away...
(https://www.therailwire.net/forum/gallery/24/9-060721120730.jpeg) (https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=24660)
The rest has been carted back to the fire pit.
On to the next thing!
Lee
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One final disposition report.
It's just a fond farewell to a friend... the fabled Western Maryland Roundhouse at Hagerstown is being transferred to a new owner, one who is in the process of building a beautiful series of modules based on WM scenes from the 1950s.
https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?topic=48816.0
Eric Henson is an extremely talented modeler, and I'm excited to see what he will do with my very rudimentary start.
Of course, it couldn't be sent off without one last visit from my fleet of vintage N Scale relics.
(https://www.therailwire.net/forum/gallery/31/9-311222201007.jpeg) (https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=31801)
Naturally the Home Boy, BL2 #81, had the place of honor front and center.
(https://www.therailwire.net/forum/gallery/31/9-311222201114.jpeg) (https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=31802)
For those of you unwilling to fish through the previous pages, here it is in its original scenery.
(https://www.therailwire.net/forum/gallery/31/9-311222201358.jpeg) (https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=31803)
So now the yard is in Gettysburg, and the roundhouse will soon be in South Carolina. Good to see the efforts are being enjoyed almost 10 years after the layout was dismantled.
Happy New Year!
Lee
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And off it goes!
(https://www.therailwire.net/forum/gallery/31/9-010123180435.jpeg) (https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=31819)
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Bittersweet is the only way I can describe it as one of your regular operators. I'm glad it's going to be used, but those were fun times in the attic.
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Current situation of the former Hagerstown yard. Transforming into G&W/YorkRail Lincoln Yard in York, PA
(https://www.therailwire.net/forum/gallery/31/medium_2695-010123195040.jpeg) (https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=31821)
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Holy ***** I can't believe it's been 10 years!!
If our layouts die twice, then yours is gonna live forever!
Also, I cannot THINK of a better home for that roundhouse. I'm looking forward to seeing it as part of a new empire.
Now, about that weedy PC branchline...
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Bittersweet is the only way I can describe it as one of your regular operators. I'm glad it's going to be used, but those were fun times in the attic.
Agreed.
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Safe and sound in SC! Holy smokes this thing is big! I’m thinking it will look great as part of a permanent yard that is freemoN height along the wall on the left.
I found Lee’s website when I was in grad school at the University of Maryland around 2008. I was into coal roads prior to that but that layout was a big part of why I decided to model the WM. I’m honored to have this piece, and will try to do it justice.
(https://www.therailwire.net/forum/gallery/31/2646-020123221440.jpeg) (https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=31840)
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Happy New Year Lee! So glad to see elements of your great WM layout living on in other layouts! Bob
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The good news is the actual module I had installed it on didn't fit in his trunk. I have another copy of the turntable kit, so I'm thinking I might build a simplified engine terminal and small yard scene with a 6 or 8 stall roundhouse. Seems silly since I have enough retro steam to fill that big guy twice over,but you know, a lightly used junction terminal could be just the thing to launch that branch line project...
Lee